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Anybody actively tracking or autocrossing their C63?

 
Old 05-30-2019, 04:21 PM
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Anybody actively tracking or autocrossing their C63?

I have the itch to get a C63 with the performance package and LSD. It'll be a commuter that also hits the occasional track day and autocross 2-3 times a month. I want the optional 471 LSD, and it seems easier to find it in the P030 package cars. I have a few questions on how to set one up and the reliability of it though. I plan on upgrading very basic things, such as squeezing 265 tires all around, front sway bar and then brake fluid/pads. It's going to be SCCA F Street legal for autocross, which is why I'm asking these questions.

How is the 7G trans holding up in 2019?

Does the 7G trans hold gears at redline? For instance, can I bang limiter in 2nd and not have it shift to 3rd?

Is the MCT much better that I should find a P031 and 471 car? Note: I don't plan to do many drag starts, but may want to do an SCCA Pro Solo on a whim.

How much front camber can I get out of the car? I cannot change the springs or add aftermarket camber kits, my allowance is only factory camber bolts.

Can I even stuff 265 wide RE71's under the front fenders? Not going with a wider wheel for class limits, so squeezing a 265 on an 8" wheel is what I'm comfortable with. Max of a 7mm spacer is allowed, so does this clear both the strut and the fender w/o rolling?

Last edited by MINIz guy; 05-30-2019 at 09:03 PM.
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Old 05-30-2019, 04:40 PM
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BLKROKT, please be gentle...
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Old 05-30-2019, 05:54 PM
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Originally Posted by MINIz guy View Post
I have the itch to get a C63 with the performance package and LSD. It'll be a commuter that also hits the occasional track day and autocross 2-3 times a month. I want the optional 471 LSD, and it seems easier to find it in the P030 package cars. I have a few questions on how to set one up and the reliability of it though. I plan on upgrading very basic things, such as squeezing 265 tires all around, front sway bar and then brake fluid/pads.

How is the 7G trans holding up in 2019?

Is the MCT much better that I should find a P031 and 471 car? Note: I don't plan to do many drag starts, but may want to do an SCCA Pro Solo on a whim.

How much front camber can I get out of the car?

Can I even stuff 265 wide tires under the front fenders?
Meow you did zero searching huh
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Old 05-30-2019, 06:22 PM
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Originally Posted by BITRBO View Post
BLKROKT, please be gentle...
Or don't. I'm in the mood for some vintage BLKROKT schooling.
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Old 05-30-2019, 08:52 PM
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Originally Posted by BITRBO View Post
BLKROKT, please be gentle...
Originally Posted by AMGonFire View Post
Meow you did zero searching huh
Originally Posted by Crya View Post
Or don't. I'm in the mood for some vintage BLKROKT schooling.
Ok, so it looks like this has been covered before, but I couldn't find it in my search. I edited my initial post to include some more information and class limits, and I don't believe it has been discussed.

I saw plenty of posts regarding camber, but I'm asking specifically for max camber attained with factory camber bolts. Sure, -1.9° is factory but can I get more, for a 3900lb car?
And for the front tire, what does the strut clearance look like with a 265 on a 8" wheel? The max spacer I can put on us 7mm, and since the factory tire is a 235, I'm wondering about room.

I'm sure I definitely missed the transmission discussions. I'll read about that in the drag racing threads, wasn't thinking about those when I posted.
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Old 05-30-2019, 11:08 PM
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A 265 on an 8” front wheel is asking for trouble. With 4000lbs pushing on the sidewall you’re likely to either fold it or rip it if you know how to drive. You need at least a 9” rim. Also, without BS front fenders or rolling the stock ones, the limiting factor is clearance to the strut. I got a 265 on as an emergency spare to get home from WGI - coincidentally after I shredded a 255 sidewall on my 8.5” fronts after a day of 1.5g turning - but it rubbed the strut a bit and I have an aggressive offset. Stick with 245’s unless you get wider rims, I wouldn’t even try a 255.

Plenty of solutions for camber. KMAC bushings are the easiest (think you can get -3), you could also go for their camber strut tops (go to -4 with some modification to the tower opening). You can get the OE MB “crash bolts” for the front which should get you to around -2.5 maybe.

Lot of info here if you search.

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Old 05-31-2019, 09:48 AM
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Originally Posted by BLKROKT View Post
A 265 on an 8” front wheel is asking for trouble. With 4000lbs pushing on the sidewall you’re likely to either fold it or rip it if you know how to drive. You need at least a 9” rim. Also, without BS front fenders or rolling the stock ones, the limiting factor is clearance to the strut. I got a 265 on as an emergency spare to get home from WGI - coincidentally after I shredded a 255 sidewall on my 8.5” fronts after a day of 1.5g turning - but it rubbed the strut a bit and I have an aggressive offset. Stick with 245’s unless you get wider rims, I wouldn’t even try a 255.

Plenty of solutions for camber. KMAC bushings are the easiest (think you can get -3), you could also go for their camber strut tops (go to -4 with some modification to the tower opening). You can get the OE MB “crash bolts” for the front which should get you to around -2.5 maybe.

Lot of info here if you search.
Ok, that's good info here and I didn't get flamed yet. Now I'm going to ask a few more stupid questions, still fully prepared to be flamed.

-2.5° camber with crash bolts sounds great. I can't do any KMAC parts as class rules dictate that only OEM components for camber adjustment are legal. I guess the strut tower opening isn't slotted at all, which is a bummer.

Based on your tire thread, you shredded the sidewall of a PSC2 with -3.5° of camber? That's a little unnerving, but I don't know too much about PSC2's. I know guys with E90's that squeeze 275 RE71's on an 8.5" (one that runs 275 on an 8" which I think is crazy, and amazing that his tire guy did it) without issue. That is a 400lb lighter car, but with less camber (-1.8° max) though.

I did more searching and found an older thread stating 265's may fit with stock strut clearance (link) but no mention of fender clearance. This is 5mm further inboard and on a 9" wheel, so it's making more use of section width than if I squeezed on an 8". From what I recall, AD08's run wide too, but not sure how wide compared to current crop 200TW tires. I'm guessing your 265's rubbed because of your coilovers? Do you think that thread has any validity with fitment as it's been dead since 2014?
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Old 05-31-2019, 12:16 PM
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I’m gonna be participating in an autoX event this weekend. It’ll be my first time doing this in my C63, hopefully it’s not a super short course. Tight turns with high HP & RWD, traction is a concern since IMO sport doesn’t let you swing out enough, before it comes on, so it’ll most likely be ***** OUT with only myself acting as the traction control.
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Old 05-31-2019, 02:22 PM
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Originally Posted by MINIz guy View Post
I have the itch to get a C63 with the performance package and LSD. It'll be a commuter that also hits the occasional track day and autocross 2-3 times a month. I want the optional 471 LSD, and it seems easier to find it in the P030 package cars. I have a few questions on how to set one up and the reliability of it though. I plan on upgrading very basic things, such as squeezing 265 tires all around, front sway bar and then brake fluid/pads. It's going to be SCCA F Street legal for autocross, which is why I'm asking these questions.

How is the 7G trans holding up in 2019?

Does the 7G trans hold gears at redline? For instance, can I bang limiter in 2nd and not have it shift to 3rd?

Is the MCT much better that I should find a P031 and 471 car? Note: I don't plan to do many drag starts, but may want to do an SCCA Pro Solo on a whim.

How much front camber can I get out of the car? I cannot change the springs or add aftermarket camber kits, my allowance is only factory camber bolts.

Can I even stuff 265 wide RE71's under the front fenders? Not going with a wider wheel for class limits, so squeezing a 265 on an 8" wheel is what I'm comfortable with. Max of a 7mm spacer is allowed, so does this clear both the strut and the fender w/o rolling?
I autocross my '10 a few times a year. I'd prioritize getting one with (or budgeting for adding) an LSD over anything else.

The 7G transmission is completely fine and will hold gears as long as you're in manual (not sure why you wouldn't). Depending on the course, you'll probably never need to shift past 2nd anyway.

I run on coil-overs and have the performance package brakes. Even running on my Michelin PS A/S-3's, there's no reason to go wider than 245s on the front.

The car is a bit of a tank for autocross, but a ton of fun and can hang surprisingly well.
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Old 05-31-2019, 02:23 PM
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Originally Posted by 12C63 View Post
I’m gonna be participating in an autoX event this weekend. It’ll be my first time doing this in my C63, hopefully it’s not a super short course. Tight turns with high HP & RWD, traction is a concern since IMO sport doesn’t let you swing out enough, before it comes on, so it’ll most likely be ***** OUT with only myself acting as the traction control.
Yeah, this car is just too big/heavy for solo.... Really needs a road course to stretch it's legs, and even then, you can still feel the weight when trying to toss her around.
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Old 05-31-2019, 04:20 PM
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Originally Posted by TPete19 View Post
I autocross my '10 a few times a year. I'd prioritize getting one with (or budgeting for adding) an LSD over anything else.

The 7G transmission is completely fine and will hold gears as long as you're in manual (not sure why you wouldn't). Depending on the course, you'll probably never need to shift past 2nd anyway.

I run on coil-overs and have the performance package brakes. Even running on my Michelin PS A/S-3's, there's no reason to go wider than 245s on the front.

The car is a bit of a tank for autocross, but a ton of fun and can hang surprisingly well.
Perfect, so no worries of banging redline as shifts are not "free" with the 7G auto.

I don't believe a 245 is enough for how heavy this car is. I run a 245 on my E36 that weighs 2900lbs. I'll have to check out a car at a dealer to see clearance I guess, as it's 50/50 whether anything bigger than a 245 can fit.

I'm very curious how the suspension is tuned on a P030 car too. Lots of reviews saying it is too harsh over bumps (compression, spring rate or sway bars?). I wonder how much compression there is in the shocks and if it does a good job controlling the body too. Looks like MCS has a set of dampers for the CLK63 so with a big enough wallet, one can run doubles with stock springs.
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Old 06-02-2019, 10:30 PM
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9.5" section width on a 235 and going up to 10.7" for a 265 (RE71 measurements). Needs .6" of each side of the wheel, and that looks very possible. May need to sell a car to make room for a C63.
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Old 06-05-2019, 11:46 PM
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Don't know if SCCA SOLO rules will let you swap OEM wheels from other Mercedes, but the 18" E63 wheels from a W212 are a perfect fit. They are 9x18 ET37 up front and 9.5x18 ET52 in back. That allowed me to run 255 up front and a 275 in the back. Pics are at https://mbworld.org/forums/c63-amg-w...tment-c63.html

265 on stock front rims is way too much. You may have a little more grip with the wider tire, but the sidewalls will be rolling and flexing all over. Steering response will be terrible - not a good thing for the rapidly changing dynamics of an autocross course.

Last edited by zcct04; 06-05-2019 at 11:54 PM.
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Old 06-25-2019, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by BITRBO View Post
Yeah, this car is just too big/heavy for solo.... Really needs a road course to stretch it's legs, and even then, you can still feel the weight when trying to toss her around.
At the end of August there is going to be a road course, on a track though, that I want to be a part of.
She does great on some decent driving roads where I am, so It'll be really nice to see what she can do somewhere I don't have to mind on-coming traffic.
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Old 06-25-2019, 04:00 PM
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On a reconnaissance lap at Sonoma Raceway the other weekend. I didn’t run as fast as I’d hoped but she had plenty of grip around the Carrousel! E63 wheels and Nittos for sale in signature!
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Old 06-25-2019, 04:09 PM
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^WTF, they let you on track w/o a helmet?? I'm guessing that was a parade lap...

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Old 06-25-2019, 04:19 PM
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Originally Posted by BITRBO View Post
^WTF, they let you on track w/o a helmet?? I'm guessing that was a parade lap...
Yeaah buddy. HPDE1, recon laps (very first laps of first session) with assigned instructor. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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Old 06-25-2019, 04:23 PM
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Ahh, ok... Makes sense
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Old 06-30-2019, 10:48 PM
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9 track days at VIR so far with a few days in the low 100°f. No Limp Modes! 👍🏼
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Goal this year 2019 - 1000+ laps at VIR and 60 Days flagging!

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Old 07-01-2019, 06:32 PM
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Flaggers wear cool suits? Very nice!

How have you managed to avoid limp modes in that heat?
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Old 07-02-2019, 06:27 PM
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I track a 2015 c63 507.... the black series hood helps pull hot air out of the engine compartment.... I added a carbon fiber plate behind the grill(didn’t help much!)... run in s+ mode.. traction control set to sport... have over 8,000 miles on the track! When I tried running in manual mode temps were higher!... there only two places on the track I need to downshift, if the computer hasn’t made the downshift(most times it downshifts itself)... and yes I do wear a coolshirt.....







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Old 07-12-2019, 01:53 PM
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How "trick" is the factory LSD in these cars?

Looking at the E90/92 M3's, the M-variable diff can ramp up lock to 100%. It makes the car dance on-throttle that a car of it's weight and size shouldn't be capable of. Can a C63 dance like this?

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Old 07-12-2019, 02:51 PM
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Never autocrossed the 507... but on a road course like VIR a stock e90/e92 stands no chance against the Benz!
Been tried/raced many times - always the same outcome... 507 wins!

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Old 07-12-2019, 03:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Duffer4126 View Post
Never autocrossed the 507... but on a road course like VIR a stock e90/e92 stands no chance against the Benz!
Been tried/raced many times - always the same outcome... 507 wins!
But what about the diff? Just a basic clutch pack in the C63? Dare I ask about ramp angles?

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