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if you don't have a 104 octane tune at the very least you are running slower and burning more fuel with straight e85. straight e78 was super slow on my 100 octane tune.
if you don't have a 104 octane tune at the very least you are running slower and burning more fuel with straight e85. straight e78 was super slow on my 100 octane tune.
e85 is 108-109 octane.
Hmmm. So I just want to be clear on what you’re saying/implying. So Advanced Fuel Dynamics and Eurocharged have at best misunderstood and at worst misrepresented the gains and/or improvements on running E85 with their kit?? This is the first I’m hearing that their kit isn’t doing what it claims. To be clear I’m talking about a non LTH car.
Ive been meaning to comparison dyno so maybe this is the spark I need to finally do it.
The way the Bosch ecu works is it adjust automatically to better octane. Within a certain threshold (even when tuned) the car does make power on e85. That’s not the only benefit. It has the ability to cool and keep timing consistent. Run after run. The car runs best at e40 on stock size injectors. The bigger injectors on n/a car are overkill and result in odd running car, if your not running full e85. And, obviously the car doesn’t run right with full e85.
You can run stock injectors and have headers or primary car delete. You just can’t run more than a e40 blend or you’ll max out the duty bias.
I would get an afr guage and monitor your cars with e85.
Alcohol when phase changing from liquid to gas will inherently drop temperatures. When you lower intake charge temperatures you gain power. So, you are gaining power but not utilizing octane correctly and essentially wasting money with unused octane and additional fuel being burnt. If you have a tune specifically matched for your octane you'll make more power and use less fuel.
you may be happy with what you have but I tune standalones as a side job and don't really enjoy the feeling of the engine with I'm running too high of an octane. the engine feel sluggish and performance isn't ideal to my standards.
This thread is soo dumb. Been running e85 since the first kit came out. Runs amazing. Pulls hard. I have only noticed my car being faster the higher the ethanol content. Unless you have a dyno for your claims Don’t make them. Also if your worried about gas mileage why do you have this car.
This thread is soo dumb. Been running e85 since the first kit came out. Runs amazing. Pulls hard. I have only noticed my car being faster the higher the ethanol content. Unless you have a dyno for your claims Don’t make them. Also if your worried about gas mileage why do you have this car.
I think people are talking about there is no gains after e60 on our na car.
Like I said I paid 86 bucks for 5 gallons of vp c85 and I had about a 1/4 tank of 93, I put about a gallon of c85 and it felt great and then added another gallon and it felt even better and after getting the car almost out of gas I ran straight c85 and the car didn't pick up any more power.
Have any of you guys needed to replace the stock fuel pump yet due to prolonged E85 usage? I imagine high ethanol content isn't too good for our stock fuel pumps is that correct?
I bought the EC kit last July, running the OE Tuning 91 map with stock headers & stock injectors. Only have about 6k miles on the kit..however less than 20 tanks on full E85.
also have included a few test case documents produced by Delphi and published to SAE.org . it would seem mixtures between e50-e60 will deliver the optimal performance per dollar per fuel consumption on an engine with compression ratio of 11.85:1. beyond e50-e60 without static compression of over 12.78 to 1 the added octane is wasted. boosted cars are a different topic as boost and octane work together.
Long story short...e50 has the same knock resistance as e85. e50 produces great power at 11.85 compression ratio while fuel consumption is less than e85.
Have any of you guys needed to replace the stock fuel pump yet due to prolonged E85 usage? I imagine high ethanol content isn't too good for our stock fuel pumps is that correct?
I bought the EC kit last July, running the OE Tuning 91 map with stock headers & stock injectors. Only have about 6k miles on the kit..however less than 20 tanks on full E85.
you won't have issues. the fuel pumps that have issues are HPFP (High Pressure Fuel Pumps) of newer direct injection vehicles. at e50-e60 a HPFP shouldn't have any issue.
also have included a few test case documents produced by Delphi and published to SAE.org . it would seem mixtures between e50-e60 will deliver the optimal performance per dollar per fuel consumption on an engine with compression ratio of 11.85:1. beyond e50-e60 without static compression of over 12.78 to 1 the added octane is wasted. boosted cars are a different topic as boost and octane work together.
Long story short...e50 has the same knock resistance as e85. e50 produces great power at 11.85 compression ratio while fuel consumption is less than e85.
You do realize e85 is just a name right. All e85 pumps by me contain anywhere from 51 percent to 83 percent ethanol. It varies you would only know exactly if you had the app. Pretty sure the lower ethanol percentages are the winter blend so to speak. I have yet to see one that actually had 85 percent ethanol. Also e85 as you like to put it, octane rating is 105 give or take. You will never see 108 octane out of true 85 percent ethanol at least by me you won’t. e50 or e60 would not be as high of an octane. Thus not providing the same knock resistance as you stated.
eXX means the sensor reading of ethanol content when we're discussing it.
when you say never ...that is incorrect...someone once has recorded e89. not here but on other forums. if someone becomes lazy when mixing then you'll get what you get. in area's that see sub zero temperatures, their winter blend becomes closer to e60 to allow for cold starting. in brazil they have e98 or e100 at the pump. MBWORLD is a Worldwide forum.
as far as knock resistance...please refer to the 2 documents produced by DELPHI which auto manufactures purchase TECHNOLOGY from. these are published to SAE which is the most well known automotive standard. do you think your traction control or engine ECU was software coded by Mercedes? no...they were purchased from a company who licenses this technology to them.
O jeez. Yea sounds great right. The difference between race fuel and e85 you don’t need increased fueling for race gas. A tune is not going to account for this.
You have no idea what you are talking about. Majority of race fuels need an enrichment of fuel.
Also, the tuner has complete control of every function in the vehicle. I use HPTuners and I can increase the duty cycle of injectors without the flex fuel kits. The afd Kit pulses the injector with skewed readings.
The only thing you need to worry about is the exact ethanol content you advance timing for.
None of these flex fuel kits advance timing. There’s literally zero point in running a 2k Kit and e85 with 93 pump gas timing targets.
The only way I see e85 helping is if your tune sucks (aka EC tunes) since they run stock timing above 6k rpms and barely open the TB’s to 80% until the last 400 rpms.
O jeez. Yea sounds great right. The difference between race fuel and e85 you don’t need increased fueling for race gas.
Not following you here, a tuner can make an e85 file without needing a flex fuel kit. They will just tune for e60 and leave some safety in there with air fuel but it can easily be done.
You have no idea what you are talking about. Majority of race fuels need an enrichment of fuel.
Also, the tuner has complete control of every function in the vehicle. I use HPTuners and I can increase the duty cycle of injectors without the flex fuel kits. The afd Kit pulses the injector with skewed readings.
The only thing you need to worry about is the exact ethanol content you advance timing for.
None of these flex fuel kits advance timing. There’s literally zero point in running a 2k Kit and e85 with 93 pump gas timing targets.
The only way I see e85 helping is if your tune sucks (aka EC tunes) since they run stock timing above 6k rpms and barely open the TB’s to 80% until the last 400 rpms.
Umm I do. A stock c63 you can put race gas in and it will run fine. The ecu will adjust. Add e85 and it’s a whole other story your car will not run fine without a kit. Well aware how tuning works as well.
That's what I plan on doing also. Oe can tune an e85 file without a piggy back. Just need to load it like a race map.
I have a E85 tune from OE. I've had it for almost 2 years and no problems. No issues with fuel pumps. Car does pull harder with full E85 and as other members have stated, wastes more gas. I was told you don't need a e85 tune but I had OE do it for me anyway.
c63 coupe p31weistec stg3 SOLD,2013 C63 BLACK SERIES.
Originally Posted by w204nyc
I have a E85 tune from OE. I've had it for almost 2 years and no problems. No issues with fuel pumps. Car does pull harder with full E85 and as other members have stated, wastes more gas. I was told you don't need a e85 tune but I had OE do it for me anyway.
YOU HAVE A DEDICATED E85 TUNE WITH THE FLEX KIT OR WITH IT?THE PROBLEM HAVING IT WITHOUT THE FLEX KIT IS THAT YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE YOU RUN THE TANK DRY AND ALWAYS HAVE THE CONTENT YOUR FLASHED FOR.
Umm I do. A stock c63 you can put race gas in and it will run fine. The ecu will adjust. Add e85 and it’s a whole other story your car will not run fine without a kit. Well aware how tuning works as well.
If you understood how tuning works, you would understand you don’t need the afd kit. All you need is an ethanol sensor to read e content. Certain race gas needs a little more enrichment than others. Enjoy your 2k afd Kit lol
YOU HAVE A DEDICATED E85 TUNE WITH THE FLEX KIT OR WITH IT?THE PROBLEM HAVING IT WITHOUT THE FLEX KIT IS THAT YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE YOU RUN THE TANK DRY AND ALWAYS HAVE THE CONTENT YOUR FLASHED FOR.
Needs an ethanol sensor. Jeremy’s e85 tune is for e40, when I had it. That was back in 2012 before these kits were out. He also stated he didn’t see much more gains past that content on his car. There’s also far more better ways to make power than these kits... hard to feel 15-20 whp on 3900lb car... to each there own I guess
YOU HAVE A DEDICATED E85 TUNE WITH THE FLEX KIT OR WITH IT?THE PROBLEM HAVING IT WITHOUT THE FLEX KIT IS THAT YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE YOU RUN THE TANK DRY AND ALWAYS HAVE THE CONTENT YOUR FLASHED FOR.
Yes Gzim its a dedicated E85 tune from Jeremy. I do have the flexfuel kit with the upgraded injectors. I try to only use E85 when Im running on a empty tank. I don't ever mix with 93.
Giz: some of us are in Australia are running dedicated e85 tunes. No flex sensor. I’ve been using for 4 months now, I daily my car, no issues at all. Tuned on pump e85
06-22-2019 | 03:42 PM
