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I'm pretty sure this is a replacement roof panel as we talking about weight savings. This isn't an at home job, it will require a competent bodyshop. This isn't a particularly hard job for a good bodyshop but won't be cheap.
I never use a sunroof and have very close access to a great bodyshop, so it's a no brainer for me.
Those in the NYC area I have a great headliner person that is affordable and can redo a base model C coupe headliner in Alcantara or whatever we wish. My bodyshop can also do your roof replacement the right way with the proper foam on the roof bows, structural adhesives and prep work to ensure no corrosion issues.
Remember taking this kind of weight off the top of the car will make a good difference, and glass is much heavier then you think, we will definitely save a good amount of weight
who do you go to for the headliner work @2015_507?
A workroom in Mount Vernon, nice older guy, but I have to go there in person to talk to him. He's done 3 headliners for me / my friends they came out great.
Originally Posted by blind69
starlight headliner 👀, I am close to the city
He wouldn't know anything about this, he's an old school upholsterer. I suppose if you found the kit he might do it.
If we proceed with the GB I'll get a headliner bring it to him and get a price for redoing them in Alcantara.
we need 30+ people to be apart of the pre order process in order for this to take place. The price is yet to be determined. we are looking at about $2500-$3000 per person
All the details on the development of the product is cool and all, but this should be elaborated more - HOW do people become a part of the pre order process? by just saying "+1" in this thread? or is there any monetary deposit needed to be made/collected, from all 30+ participants?
it's always easy to say "+1", but more than half of the prospects will bail when it's time to put $ down where they keyboard stroke.
i also understand as a business, this modern age "pre-order method" is the most risk-free mindset, but it's also easy for the prospects to see where and how deep a vendor's commitment, even how deep they're able to bankroll their biz if sh*t hit the fan, when the biz doesn't put any $ up-front, ie. not having one finished sample/product before commencing a sale.
i'm guessing a good portion of the community is also being more cautious seeing how things went down with Mode Carbon recently, so i do hope this pull through for all that are devoted into this.
2012 P31 C63 Coupe Trackrat, 2019 GLE63S Coupe Beast
I don’t think there’s any possible way this gets to 30 unless you have some of the larger tuners/retailers place an order. Groups like EC or Weistec are going to have to get involved otherwise this is totally DOA. Unless you have some sort of marketing plan and I haven’t seen any evidence of that on this project whatsoever other than on this forum.
Plus you have coupes and sedans requiring totally different molds. So is it 30 combined or 30 each?
I know I’m likely to do it myself at this point. I can’t keep waiting a year here and a year there for these to eventually fall apart. Good luck.
2000 Acura NSX, 2012 C63 P31 (gone and not forgotten), 2015 C63 507
Originally Posted by Zane@Zefer
Hey sir,
Sorry. just to be completely clear those would be separate molds. So if we get more coupe than sedan. Best thing to do would be do coupe. If we get enough interest in sedan then go for that next. If we get both at once even better. but 1 mold at a time for the coupe / sedan customers.
So what we need to do is flip a coin heads everyone with a sedan sells and buys a coupe tails coupes buy sedans... I'll do the coin flip font question the results.
would be nice if someone produced these I wonder why evosport or whoever it was stopped, I even reached out to them a few years ago about producing one but they no longer had the mold
2012 P31 C63 Coupe Trackrat, 2019 GLE63S Coupe Beast
Wonder why? Have you looked around at the forum lately? There are exceedingly few of us left that want to build something cool anymore. Most of the new owners are buying these all banged up and putting the bare minimum into them to keep running for donuts, burnout competitions, street takeovers, or driving like morons and wrapping them around trees. It’s over. Nobody is going to make anything nice for this ever shrinking community anymore, there’s no profit in it. We missed our window.
Wonder why? Have you looked around at the forum lately? There are exceedingly few of us left that want to build something cool anymore. Most of the new owners are buying these all banged up and putting the bare minimum into them to keep running for donuts, burnout competitions, street takeovers, or driving like morons and wrapping them around trees. It’s over. Nobody is going to make anything nice for this ever shrinking community anymore, there’s no profit in it. We missed our window.
+1 to that, and all these "middle-men", self proclaimed "entrepreneurs" with push-down responsibilities like a drop-shippers; what happened to reputation-by-example? taking $120k cash from 30 coupe & 30 sedan owners before even producing one working sample is one ballsy ask, no absolute guaranteed timeline, "lets see how it goes" type of work ethic. lol.
Someone should reach out to AJ https://ajhartmanaero.com/ and see if he'd be interested. Once he has the mold he could start selling merc products which may be lucrative for him.
Bette yet, if we can identify MB part numbers used for EU cars carbon roof then I don't see us not being able to order them through US based dealership parts department or get them shipped out to us directly from Europe.
2012 P31 C63 Coupe Trackrat, 2019 GLE63S Coupe Beast
Originally Posted by Jasonoff
Someone should reach out to AJ https://ajhartmanaero.com/ and see if he'd be interested. Once he has the mold he could start selling merc products which may be lucrative for him.
Thanks for volunteering. Let us know what he says.
2012 P31 C63 Coupe Trackrat, 2019 GLE63S Coupe Beast
Originally Posted by SEAMG
Bette yet, if we can identify MB part numbers used for EU cars carbon roof then I don't see us not being able to order them through US based dealership parts department or get them shipped out to us directly from Europe.
There are no EU cars with carbon roofs.
There are EU and Japan cars that came non-pano and without sun/moon roofs, maybe that’s what you meant?
People have checked out those part numbers. The parts are no longer produced.
There are EU and Japan cars that came non-pano and without sun/moon roofs, maybe that’s what you meant?
People have checked out those part numbers. The parts are no longer produced.
I know I had researched the part numbers in the past.
I thought that non AMG cars had the part numbers. I would be surprised if Mercedes decided to not make body parts anymore for all those cabs and for all those diesel coupes floating around in EU. It's not that they can't sell them..
Maybe whoever4 checked, checked during Covid, where nothing was being made anymore.
Also, I don't see why there was such a rush for dry carbon roof.
The roof is a part of the structure of the car. If you're building a track car, think bout convertibles. You want to chop the roof, you have to reinforce the side panels. Of course my example is extreme, but SOME reinforcement may be necessary if you're replacing the roof with "paper".
I mean, don't the "factory specials" that come with some form of "carbon" roof, also come with a half cage in the back? I'm sure there's a reason for that.
Also, those rally cars that use dry carbon, don't try to run for 150K miles. Their total life is in terms of XX hours. The roof is heavily exposed to UV. Dry carbon may have a reduced UV life.
When compared with the factory steel roof, I'm sure the savings won't be much different than running at the track 1 gallon less fuel in the tank.
all of the C63BS in North America have panoramic glass roof... except one.
Is yours grey market?
If it is, why wouldn't there also be other Black Series grey market cars?
If it is grey market, would be epic to know the weight.
Because it wouldn't be the same as the EU Black series.
Those 5 MPH bumpers and other Big-Three-protectionist-lobbied-DOT-Mandated regulations add usually 100-200 lb to any import.
I was looking into the Alfa ROmeo 4C at one point. It took 1 year for Alfa to announce the weight for the US. They tried EVRYTHING to "forget" to "omit" to "postponed to next week". In the end they had to release the number and the 4C is everything about weight. My recollection, it had gained 300lb for the US.
The structure is a subframe. The roof itself is a thin piece of sheet metal with zero structural support. The steel subframe is what protects you in a crash. Changing the skin doesn't affect the subframe. The main weight savings is from the glass and sunroof tracks/motor.
The structure is a unibody, a subassembly of a reinforcement and sheet steel.
While the reinforcement is structural, the steel panel provides additional rigidity.
For a Carbon panel, I would investigate with a source of parts diagrams what BMW did for their carbon roof. There could be additional bracing underneath.
On the BMW E46, by example, after removing the sunroof with the panel, there is ... nothing left, and they have to reinforce it with a body piece that BMW provides for this purpose. for Carbon roof, there could be for instance some X-bracing underneath.
2012 P31 C63 Coupe Trackrat, 2019 GLE63S Coupe Beast
For what it’s worth, we are absolutely adding bars to tie at least the B and probably A and C pillars together. They will then be tied into the cage as well for increased rigidity, everything welded to frame rails. I totally agree that the pano (and associated hardware, tracks, etc), while not actually structural, adds rigidity. Will know more once we start tearing it apart and see how it’s all secured/connected.
I'm pretty sure there is already a middle cross over brace on the w204. Been a while since I've taken any interiors apart, but judging from the one dads c63 did it appears as it does as well.
Is yours grey market?
If it is, why wouldn't there also be other Black Series grey market cars?
If it is grey market, would be epic to know the weight.
Because it wouldn't be the same as the EU Black series.
Those 5 MPH bumpers and other Big-Three-protectionist-lobbied-DOT-Mandated regulations add usually 100-200 lb to any import.
weight saving is minimal on having no reflectors & probably cancels out with the traffic-warning-triangle that's on the bottom side of the trunk lid (lol)
ok jokes aside, weight saving is definitely huge on the combination of OEM bucket seats by Recaro and the solid roof; for the latter, i'd assume the biggest difference isn't just weight saving, but also changing the driving dynamic due to having lower center gravity.
good to know that the bumpers (i assume you mean the lack of the same crash beam behind it) are also what makes my car lighter, maybe thats why i can feel the difference right away from a road-driving comparison in the past.
are you in SoCal? you're more than welcomed to bring an American spec C63BS, and i can arrange a measurement-session; as well as coordination with other Euro Spec C63BS outside of the states (through the network of BS owners group), to show you the weight of the same-spec car in EU being no different than mine.
for now, let's just leave the other questions with the RHD GTR community...
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