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2017 Mercedes-Benz AMG C63 Cabriolet, 2014 Ducati Multistrada 1200 S
Driving in the rain
Not sure what all the fuss is about quite frankly. This car feels bolted to the road with those big meaty tires. I even put it in Sport+ mode. Just don’t romp on it too hard.
I agree. Swapped to Michelin PS4S's and while I havent had the opportunity to drive too much in the wet, its fine. Though I will have to admit, snow scares me... and yes, I am a wuss...
While PS4S's are pretty good in the rain, other tires ... not so much. The OEM Dunlop (aka Dumb-slop) Sport Maxx RT tires on my C63 S sedan were _really_ bad in the wet. Sudden WOT on a wet paved highway at speeds up to 120 kph/75 mph would normally result in immediate wheel-spin. The PS4S's cut that down to about 90 kph/55 mph.
The issue is that the torque comes on _so_ fast that one has to learn to always slowly "squeeze on" the throttle, when driving in the rain (or around curves, or when RPM is above 2500 RPM, or ... OK, so the saying _is_ true, "a C63/S always wants to kill you!). $;-)
While PS4S's are pretty good in the rain, other tires ... not so much. The OEM Dunlop (aka Dumb-slop) Sport Maxx RT tires on my C63 S sedan were _really_ bad in the wet. Sudden WOT on a wet paved highway at speeds up to 120 kph/75 mph would normally result in immediate wheel-spin. The PS4S's cut that down to about 90 kph/55 mph.
Good god the Dumplop's are awful. Friend had those on his car. Better made for drifting
So yesterday was my first experience driving my AMG in the rain...first let me note that even though I have been living in Scottsdale Arizona (where it hardly rains) for 3 years...I grew up in south Florida where it rains almost everyday and people in Florida drive like crap in the rain...even with all that experience.
Anyway the car did great on Mich SS tires. I actually got bored and threw it into S+ mode and a few times felt her break loose but it wasn't anything you could not control. I also owned a Hellcat for a while so I know all about losing traction and how to handle it...LOL
Just don't drive like an idiot and you'll be fine... unless you have the Sport Cups
From my experience in the rain, Cup 2's are not quite as good as the PS4S's ... but on dry roads, a significant improvement in traction (as long as it's above about 15 deg C/60 deg F or you've managed to work some heat into them, which pretty much requires a track). Of course, the Cup 2's will also wear more rapidly than the PS4S's.
While PS4S's are pretty good in the rain, other tires ... not so much. The OEM Dunlop (aka Dumb-slop) Sport Maxx RT tires on my C63 S sedan were _really_ bad in the wet. Sudden WOT on a wet paved highway at speeds up to 120 kph/75 mph would normally result in immediate wheel-spin. The PS4S's cut that down to about 90 kph/55 mph.
The issue is that the torque comes on _so_ fast that one has to learn to always slowly "squeeze on" the throttle, when driving in the rain (or around curves, or when RPM is above 2500 RPM, or ... OK, so the saying _is_ true, "a C63/S always wants to kill you!). $;-)
Yes, the tires are pretty much the most important part of a car. It always boggles my mind how very little attention many folks give them. It's the only thing between the car and the road. My coupe came with 19/20 Michelin Pilot Super Sport. While not quite at the level of the PS4S, they are still very good. I don't think I'll ever do anything other than Michelin performance tires anymore. I was initially planning on replacing them with PS4S fairly quickly, but now I'm probably gonna keep them until the rears are worn enough. I've had PSS in the past on other cars, and they do very well in the wet. During my European Delivery trip earlier this year, it was raining pretty much most of May, and the car does indeed very well in the rain. Not sure what year your car is, but the new traction control in the 2019 S handles the wet pavement pretty well. I was expecting to use Slippery mode, but Comfort was perfectly fine. A little bit of wheel spin here and there was fun. Have to watch a little bit when trying to quickly pull into traffic, because it might not have the traction to make it. Having had an RS5 before, I definitely miss the AWD traction in those situations. With the RS5 I never had to think about gunning it in the wet to merge quickly, but with the C63S I have to think about it now. That's probably the only thing I could complain about.
same as with standard pilots , I didn't notice any difference . The handle really well and the stick pretty good . If you look at online testing between the stock pilot and the AS 3+ they are very close to the same on the skidpad which is why I bought them and you can use them in the snow and they are slightly cheaper
I agree. Swapped to Michelin PS4S's and while I havent had the opportunity to drive too much in the wet, its fine. Though I will have to admit, snow scares me... and yes, I am a wuss...
Last week at MB Dealership had set of Pirelli winter Sottozero 3 installed. I drove home (45 minute drive) in raw 41 degree rain soaked roads and felt very safe. my 2019 C63S coupe handled much better than if I had the Summer tires on.
'17 AMG S63 Convertible, '17 AMG C63S Edition 1 Coupe
So am I the outlier? I've got decades of experience driving in inclement weather, and find that the C63's traction in heavy (FL) rains is pretty poor. I find myself having to slow down considerably (60s-70s mph on the highway) as compared to everyone else around me (80+ mph, passing me with authority) due to poor traction and hydroplaning. I've actually suddenly had the car go sideways on me twice on the highway, not through a puddle, but just a sweeping curve. Thank God, I was able to lift, countersteer, and recover, but I was fortunate both times to have been in the center lane, and be able to use all 3 lanes of the highway to recover.
Tires are PS4S, less than 5,000 miles. Alignment is correct. Granted, when I went sideways, both times it was in comfort mode, while using adaptive cruise control (long highway drive to and from work). But even that aside, the rear end definitely doesn't seem as planted as other cars I own/have driven in the heavy rain. Maybe its the weight vs the downforce of the other vehicles?
Wondering if I'm the only one who feels this way about the C63S being not too confidence inspiring in heavy rain? (By comparison, I can do 90+ mph in heavy downpour on high performance tires in other vehicles that are either much heavier or have rear spoilers, and the vehicle feels much more planted).
So am I the outlier? I've got decades of experience driving in inclement weather, and find that the C63's traction in heavy (FL) rains is pretty poor. I find myself having to slow down considerably (60s-70s mph on the highway) as compared to everyone else around me (80+ mph, passing me with authority) due to poor traction and hydroplaning. I've actually suddenly had the car go sideways on me twice on the highway, not through a puddle, but just a sweeping curve. Thank God, I was able to lift, countersteer, and recover, but I was fortunate both times to have been in the center lane, and be able to use all 3 lanes of the highway to recover.
Tires are PS4S, less than 5,000 miles. Alignment is correct. Granted, when I went sideways, both times it was in comfort mode, while using adaptive cruise control (long highway drive to and from work). But even that aside, the rear end definitely doesn't seem as planted as other cars I own/have driven in the heavy rain. Maybe its the weight vs the downforce of the other vehicles?
Wondering if I'm the only one who feels this way about the C63S being not too confidence inspiring in heavy rain? (By comparison, I can do 90+ mph in heavy downpour on high performance tires in other vehicles that are either much heavier or have rear spoilers, and the vehicle feels much more planted).
What tire pressure are you using? It sounds like your tires may not have a full contact patch. The pressure on the door sticker is way too high, and you'll be riding on the center of the tires unless you have it loaded to its gross weight. I know some people are afraid of bending their wheels but running higher pressures than what's recommended for the given load results in less than optimal contact patch of the tires. I run 33f/32r in my '19 coupe and it sticks in the dry and wet with the PS4S. I certainly can break traction by gunning it, but going sideways unprovoked is not something I've experienced.
Last edited by superswiss; Nov 6, 2021 at 11:45 PM.
So am I the outlier? I've got decades of experience driving in inclement weather, and find that the C63's traction in heavy (FL) rains is pretty poor. I find myself having to slow down considerably (60s-70s mph on the highway) as compared to everyone else around me (80+ mph, passing me with authority) due to poor traction and hydroplaning. I've actually suddenly had the car go sideways on me twice on the highway, not through a puddle, but just a sweeping curve. Thank God, I was able to lift, countersteer, and recover, but I was fortunate both times to have been in the center lane, and be able to use all 3 lanes of the highway to recover.
It's the tires......... never had this problem with OEM Super Sports or Cup 2 mo1
ps4s can be twitchy in rain depending on tire pressure
if it wasn't for their good dry grip I'd go back to super sports
just don't turn off the traction in the rain or you'll end up like this fella
What tire pressure are you using? It sounds like your tires may not have a full contact patch. The pressure on the door sticker is way too high, and you'll be riding on the center of the tires unless you have it loaded to its gross weight. I know some people are afraid of bending their wheels but running higher pressures than what's recommended for the given load results in less than optimal contact patch of the tires. I run 33f/32r in my '19 coupe and it sticks in the dry and wet with the PS4S. I certainly can break traction by gunning it, but going sideways unprovoked is not something I've experienced.
I had the same experience with the stock PSS’ and my current PS4S’. I just put it in slippery mode in the rain.
As a data point, on both a 2017 C43 and a 2016 C63 S riding on PS4S tires with proper tire pressure, I've measured a consistent 0.9G lateral grip on auto-cross and road track running. At slightly over 0.9G in a sweeping curve (with just maintenance throttle), I'd start to get a (nice?) consistent 4-wheel slide. My experience is with wet but not flooded surfaces (i.e., no hydroplaning).
By comparison, Cup 2 MO tires are terrible, yielding only about 0.6G lateral grip (C63 S and GTR) before sliding on wet tracks ... but, of course, their dry performance significantly outperforms the PS4S.
If you want more rear traction on a C63 S, you can use an old winter-driving "trick" ... add extra weight to the rear. In my C63 S, I added about 60 lb of weight to the rear by filling zip-lock bags with play-sand from a hardware store to create 3 lb and 5 lb weights and stuffing them down underneath (as low as possible) in various voids under the trunk area. While the extra weight is a disadvantage for some aspects of handling, the increased traction on a track having many slow/sharp corners got me better lap times. Since I often purchase fuel across the border, I did always worry about being selected to participate in one of the random vehicle searches ... "no, no, those baggies are not drugs ... just play-sand for weight" trying to avoid being slammed against the wall and told to "spread 'em." #;-)
'17 AMG S63 Convertible, '17 AMG C63S Edition 1 Coupe
Originally Posted by superswiss
What tire pressure are you using? It sounds like your tires may not have a full contact patch. The pressure on the door sticker is way too high, and you'll be riding on the center of the tires unless you have it loaded to its gross weight. I know some people are afraid of bending their wheels but running higher pressures than what's recommended for the given load results in less than optimal contact patch of the tires. I run 33f/32r in my '19 coupe and it sticks in the dry and wet with the PS4S. I certainly can break traction by gunning it, but going sideways unprovoked is not something I've experienced.
Stealership typically inflates them to the door sticker pressures.
Checking the app right now (been at work all day so tires are cold), LF 35, RF 36, LR 34 RR 34. I'll bring them down to 33F and 32R and try that. I have 19/20" OEM staggered setup FYI.
Originally Posted by Encore818
I had the same experience with the stock PSS’ and my current PS4S’. I just put it in slippery mode in the rain.
As in your traction also sucks in heavy rain? Never thought about it. I don't think I even realized I have a Slippery mode lol. Will check that out and give it a try.
Stealership typically inflates them to the door sticker pressures.
Checking the app right now (been at work all day so tires are cold), LF 35, RF 36, LR 34 RR 34. I'll bring them down to 33F and 32R and try that. I have 19/20" OEM staggered setup FYI.
FYI...the app doesn't show the current tire pressure as the car has to be driving for the tire pressure sensors to send data, so you only see what the tire pressure was last and the tires were warm. I know the dealerships etc. do it all wrong, but really need to blame the useless door sticker in the USA which only lists the max load tire pressure. Detailed information can be found on the sticker inside of the fuel door.
I don't think I even realized I have a Slippery mode lol. Will check that out and give it a try.
Only FL models (2019+) have the Slippery mode. BTW, all Slippery mode is, is a reduced engine mode setting that retards throttle response and engine torque to make getting off the line easier in slippery conditions. The rest is essentially the same as Comfort. It largely exists because the 9-speed MCT no longer starts in 2nd gear in Comfort to ease moving off the line.
Last edited by superswiss; Nov 10, 2021 at 07:37 PM.
'17 AMG S63 Convertible, '17 AMG C63S Edition 1 Coupe
Originally Posted by superswiss
FYI...the app doesn't show the current tire pressure as the car has to be driving for the tire pressure sensors to send data, so you only see what the tire pressure was last and the tires were warm. I know the dealerships etc. do it all wrong, but really need to blame the useless door sticker in the USA which only lists the max load tire pressure. Detailed information can be found on the sticker inside of the fuel door.
I checked the pressures once available after driving for a few seconds. 33 all around.
Originally Posted by superswiss
Only FL models (2019+) have the Slippery mode. BTW, all Slippery mode is, is a reduced engine mode setting that retards throttle response and engine torque to make getting off the line easier in slippery conditions. The rest is essentially the same as Comfort. It largely exists because the 9-speed MCT no longer starts in 2nd gear in Comfort to ease moving off the line.
Ahhhh. Cuz yesterday after reading the post about Slippery mode, I spent 5 min trying to find it in every mode or individualized option...and no luck (2018). I know the GLE we used to have and the GLS we currently have has it. But not my C63.
It really sucks feeling so unconfident in the car's traction when it rains...and FL is notorious for sudden heavy downpours...
I checked the pressures once available after driving for a few seconds. 33 all around.
Use a proper tire gauge and check the pressure. The car's TPMS system is at best informational. In my experience it's not very accurate. Mine consistently shows 1 psi high, so I typically see 34f/33r shortly after driving off, when I know the actual pressure is 33f/32r. Also, its resolution is only 1 psi, that's not very accurate. A good digital tire gauge has a 0.1 psi resolution. It doesn't really have to be an exact science, but given your issues, I would make sure the tire pressures are really correct by using a tire gauge and not rely on the TPMS.
Originally Posted by FDNewbie
It really sucks feeling so unconfident in the car's traction when it rains...and FL is notorious for sudden heavy downpours...
Yeah, not really sure what to tell you assuming your tire pressures are good. Now if you have standing water and puddles where you drive, then you are likely aquaplaning which all comes down to the tires. The one thing to know is that wider tires aquaplane much quicker than skinnier tires. The only car I ever aquaplaned with was my 2013 RS5, which had 275 shoes on the front and one day they started to float after a heavy downpour. The tires were Pirelli P Zero (not the best in the wet) and somewhat worn, so it was the perfect storm. Luckily I was going mostly straight and after letting off the throttle they regained traction. The rear tires on the coupe are fat and they handle all the propulsion, so a bit too much throttle and there may not be enough lateral grip left in the wet, or they simply reach their limit of how much water they can evacuate in heavy rain.
Last edited by superswiss; Nov 11, 2021 at 01:58 PM.
FYI...the app doesn't show the current tire pressure as the car has to be driving for the tire pressure sensors to send data, so you only see what the tire pressure was last and the tires were warm. I know the dealerships etc. do it all wrong, but really need to blame the useless door sticker in the USA which only lists the max load tire pressure. Detailed information can be found on the sticker inside of the fuel door.
So can you clarify what is a good range to be in for the 19/20 coupe wheels? I have a sedan but run the 19/20s. I run pressures significantly higher from some of the feedback I hear on here about bending wheels. I run 44F/39R and notice I spin pretty easily at WOT unless I'm 50+ mph. Do you think I can drop the tire pressures a bit? Thanks for your suggestions.
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