Why isn't the C63s a $130K Car?
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2010 BMW E63 M6 Coupe 2023 AMG C63s Coupe 2005 YZF-R1
Why isn't the C63s a $130K Car?
I own a 2010 E63 M6 coupe, which back in its day was the flagship vehicle of the BMW M line. Its 5.0L V10 N/A motor cranks out 500hp, almost identical to the C63s. Which is why I feel this is an apples to apples comparison at least in terms of performance back then vs today. In 2021 dollars, a base M6 retailed for around $127K MSRP, a loaded one for around $135K as there were only a small handful of options that could be added. By comparison, a base 2021 C63s is around $79K MSRP and $90-95K well equipped... in 2021 dollars! In case you're wondering, that's only around $62K for a base C63s in 2010 dollars.
Look at how much more car you are getting for a $90K C63s in 2021, vs an M6 for $135K in 2010. The transmission, suspension, technology, and interior on the C63s are literally decades ahead of the M6, and rightfully so, as the E63 chassis is fast approaching 20 years since its debut. The C63s also puts out way more torque than the M6, 516 lbs vs only 383 lbs for the M6. The C63s is also way ahead of the M6 in steering, brakes, and 0-60 times. The list of advantages just goes on and on. With that said, the M6 is still an amazing car which is the last of its kind, and I don't plan on ever selling mine. I just think the C63s offers a much better value today than the M6 did back in its day for a lot less cost.
So what gives? Is it just cheaper today to produce a far superior vehicle than it was 10 years ago? That doesn't seem a plausible explanation, as material costs, chip costs, supply chain shortages and labor have drastically risen over the past few years. I'd love to hear other thoughts and opinions on this!
Look at how much more car you are getting for a $90K C63s in 2021, vs an M6 for $135K in 2010. The transmission, suspension, technology, and interior on the C63s are literally decades ahead of the M6, and rightfully so, as the E63 chassis is fast approaching 20 years since its debut. The C63s also puts out way more torque than the M6, 516 lbs vs only 383 lbs for the M6. The C63s is also way ahead of the M6 in steering, brakes, and 0-60 times. The list of advantages just goes on and on. With that said, the M6 is still an amazing car which is the last of its kind, and I don't plan on ever selling mine. I just think the C63s offers a much better value today than the M6 did back in its day for a lot less cost.
So what gives? Is it just cheaper today to produce a far superior vehicle than it was 10 years ago? That doesn't seem a plausible explanation, as material costs, chip costs, supply chain shortages and labor have drastically risen over the past few years. I'd love to hear other thoughts and opinions on this!
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2019 C63CS
Technology gets cheaper and smaller over time, so you naturally get more for the money. That's across the board. But the M5 is also one segment up from the C63. The M5 is in the E segment and the C63 is in the D segment. They are different size cars, and materials used are different. The dashboard of the C63 for example is man-made leather and there is more plastic used throughout the car. The high-revving V10 was also somewhat of a bespoke engine, only used in the M5/6, whereas AMG uses the V8 in all their models. Just different pistons and turbos essentially, and software tweaks to achieve the different power levels, but they can amortize the R&D of the engine over a larger volume. Many other parts are shared between the different AMG models. Transmission, rear locking diff etc. are the same on most AMG V8 models. The one off is the GT with its transaxle DCT, but the rear diff is the same, just integrated into the transaxle. The C63S in particular is definitely a lot of car for the money, I've said that for a while. Little details like the fact that it has the same 9-stage traction control as the GT R. Not even the GT C has it, and now that the GT R and Pro are discontinued, it's only found in the GT BS. On one hand, AMGs are a bit of the old different size sausages and I've long thought the higher models aren't really worth it as they are the same recipe, just different size and AWD vs RWD. On the other hand you get about 90 to 95% of a GT in the C63S for much less money. You have to go to the track to really get more from a GT.
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C63
But even with today's "like vehicles", the 63's are a better value. I wanted a 4 door sedan "sleeper" car that was fun to drive. A grandpa hotrod. I looked at Panamara's, Maserati Quattro's, and Ghibli Trofeo, BMW M5's, The Lexus and a few others. To get the same level of spec in the drive train, features and options, all the others were ~120K+. It was an easy decision for me, the C63 checked all my boxes and I felt like is one of the best looking options for ~30K less. The Maserati is pretty sweet though- And in comparison, go look at a fully loaded freakin jeep now, they are north of 60K for a damn jeep!
Last edited by I_love_ICE; Jul 16, 2021 at 12:53 PM.
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Joined: Jun 2021
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From: Houston, TX
2010 BMW E63 M6 Coupe 2023 AMG C63s Coupe 2005 YZF-R1
Technology gets cheaper and smaller over time, so you naturally get more for the money. That's across the board. But the M5 is also one segment up from the C63. The M5 is in the E segment and the C63 is in the D segment. They are different size cars, and materials used are different. The dashboard of the C63 for example is man-made leather and there is more plastic used throughout the car. The high-revving V10 was also somewhat of a bespoke engine, only used in the M5/6, whereas AMG uses the V8 in all their models. Just different pistons and turbos essentially, and software tweaks to achieve the different power levels, but they can amortize the R&D of the engine over a larger volume. Many other parts are shared between the different AMG models. Transmission, rear locking diff etc. are the same on most AMG V8 models. The one off is the GT with its transaxle DCT, but the rear diff is the same, just integrated into the transaxle. The C63S in particular is definitely a lot of car for the money, I've said that for a while. Little details like the fact that it has the same 9-stage traction control as the GT R. Not even the GT C has it, and now that the GT R and Pro are discontinued, it's only found in the GT BS. On one hand, AMGs are a bit of the old different size sausages and I've long thought the higher models aren't really worth it as they are the same recipe, just different size and AWD vs RWD. On the other hand you get about 90 to 95% of a GT in the C63S for much less money. You have to go to the track to really get more from a GT.
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Joined: Jun 2021
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From: Houston, TX
2010 BMW E63 M6 Coupe 2023 AMG C63s Coupe 2005 YZF-R1
But even with today's "like vehicles", the 63's are a better value. I wanted a 4 door sedan "sleeper" car that was fun to drive. A grandpa hotrod. I looked at Panamara's, Maserati Quattro's, and Ghibli Trofeo, BMW M5's, The Lexus and a few others. To get the same level of spec in the drive train, features and options, all the others were ~120K+. It was an easy decision for me, the C63 checked all my boxes and I felt like is one of the best looking options for ~30K less. The Maserati is pretty sweet though- And in comparison, go look at a fully loaded freakin jeep now, they are north of 60K for a damn jeep!
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2007 E350
um no. the body is heavily modified such as lots of chassis bracing and reinforcement, and some clever elasto-kinematics and for the c63s coupe the rear and front are completely different. For the interior, the little upgrades touches makes it much nicer than a base 30k c class, for examples nappa leather seats and on mid door panels. So is the c63s coupe a 30k car without the v8? Absolutely not. Now if they stick the m177 in a class without any chassis modification then absolutely yes. Comparing with cases like the last gen Audi rs7 and m6/m5. It's a bargain but if you were to travel back to 2010 with the current c63s coupe then imho it would still be worth the $130k. The standard for performance is much higher today versus 2010. Just look at the first gen Audi R8. The current c63 is much faster on the nurburing
Last edited by koifysh; Jul 16, 2021 at 04:15 PM.
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AMG GLC 63s Coupe
um no. the body is heavily modified such as lots of chassis bracing and reinforcement, and some clever elasto-kinematics and for the c63s coupe the rear and front are completely different. For the interior, the little upgrades touches makes it much nicer than a base 30k c class, for examples nappa leather seats and on mid door panels. So is the c63s coupe a 30k car without the v8? Absolutely not. Now if they stick the m177 in a class without any chassis modification then absolutely yes. Comparing with cases like the last gen Audi rs7 and m6/m5. It's a bargain but if you were to travel back to 2010 with the current c63s coupe then imho it would still be worth the $130k. The standard for performance is much higher today versus 2010. Just look at the first gen Audi R8. The current c63 is much faster on the nurburing
I have a E series AMG and a C series AMG and they are night in day in form and fit but I still like my C series the best.
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2007 E350
I have a gt63s and an e350 feels pretty similar to fit and finish of the c class. the E still creaks and rattles but the leather dash and design really helps with overall perception of quality.
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2019 C63CS
That's obviously at best cynical given where the base price starts. Yes, it runs into the $70k if you ever need a new engine, but that includes a ton of labor. W/o the insane OE parts only margin, the cost of the engine is probably around $30k, so the base model is more like a $40k car with a $30k motor, and then you add $20k in options for a fully loaded one and you are looking at a $60k-$70k with a $30k engine.
I hate to say it, but you have a GLC and you lowered it. The SUVs are money makers for Benz and others and are not always put together as well. The GLE for example has lots of quality issues from what I'm hearing. Between an E63 and a C63 there are many shared interior parts, especially those that you touch constantly. Steering wheel, seats, switches, pedals the electronics are all pretty much the same. The AMG Performance Seats are the same in all AMGs. The E has more real leather than the C, and perhaps they paid a bit more attention to the fit, but much of these cars these days is put together by robots and standardize procedures/processes anyway. I've driven the E63S, and my C63S coupe doesn't feel any less solid. The difference is perhaps more in the air suspension vs steel suspension, with the former feeling a bit more luxuries and the latter more connected to the road, but letting in more noise and vibration.
I hate to say it, but you have a GLC and you lowered it. The SUVs are money makers for Benz and others and are not always put together as well. The GLE for example has lots of quality issues from what I'm hearing. Between an E63 and a C63 there are many shared interior parts, especially those that you touch constantly. Steering wheel, seats, switches, pedals the electronics are all pretty much the same. The AMG Performance Seats are the same in all AMGs. The E has more real leather than the C, and perhaps they paid a bit more attention to the fit, but much of these cars these days is put together by robots and standardize procedures/processes anyway. I've driven the E63S, and my C63S coupe doesn't feel any less solid. The difference is perhaps more in the air suspension vs steel suspension, with the former feeling a bit more luxuries and the latter more connected to the road, but letting in more noise and vibration.
Last edited by superswiss; Jul 16, 2021 at 04:48 PM.
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AMG GLC 63s Coupe
That's obviously at best cynical given where the base price starts. Yes, it runs into the $70k if you ever need a new engine, but that includes a ton of labor. W/o the insane OE parts only margin, the cost of the engine is probably around $30k, so the base model is more like a $40k car with a $30k motor, and then you add $20k in options for a fully loaded one and you are looking at a $60k-$70k with a $30k engine.
I hate to say it, but you have a GLC and you lowered it. The SUVs are money makers for Benz and others and are not always put together as well. The GLE for example has lots of quality issues from what I'm hearing. Between an E63 and a C63 there are many shared interior parts, especially those that you touch constantly. Steering wheel, seats, switches, pedals the electronics are all pretty much the same. The AMG Performance Seats are the same in all AMGs. The E has more real leather than the C, and perhaps they paid a bit more attention to the fit, but much of these cars these days is put together by robots and standardize procedures/processes anyway. I've driven the E63S, and my C63S coupe doesn't feel any less solid. The difference is perhaps more in the air suspension vs steel suspension, with the former feeling a bit more luxuries and the latter more connected to the road, but letting in more noise and vibration.
I hate to say it, but you have a GLC and you lowered it. The SUVs are money makers for Benz and others and are not always put together as well. The GLE for example has lots of quality issues from what I'm hearing. Between an E63 and a C63 there are many shared interior parts, especially those that you touch constantly. Steering wheel, seats, switches, pedals the electronics are all pretty much the same. The AMG Performance Seats are the same in all AMGs. The E has more real leather than the C, and perhaps they paid a bit more attention to the fit, but much of these cars these days is put together by robots and standardize procedures/processes anyway. I've driven the E63S, and my C63S coupe doesn't feel any less solid. The difference is perhaps more in the air suspension vs steel suspension, with the former feeling a bit more luxuries and the latter more connected to the road, but letting in more noise and vibration.
Why would you hate to say that I have a GLC? The SUVs are put together as well as all the other cars, it is silly to think they cut corners on a certain type.
I get what you are saying and it is tongue in cheek when I say a 30k car with a 70k motor. I love the C series AMGs, best bang for your buck by a long shot and they look so good.
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2019 C63CS
I can show you 3 guys that would love to buy a 177 for $30k. Go ahead and call, they want $110,000 installed and that is more than the car costs. They will sell you a block for $15,000....and a short block for 25,000.
Why would you hate to say that I have a GLC? The SUVs are put together as well as all the other cars, it is silly to think they cut corners on a certain type.
I get what you are saying and it is tongue in cheek when I say a 30k car with a 70k motor. I love the C series AMGs, best bang for your buck by a long shot and they look so good.
Why would you hate to say that I have a GLC? The SUVs are put together as well as all the other cars, it is silly to think they cut corners on a certain type.
I get what you are saying and it is tongue in cheek when I say a 30k car with a 70k motor. I love the C series AMGs, best bang for your buck by a long shot and they look so good.
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From: Los Angeles, CA
2019 C63S Coupe, 2020 G550
I love my c63s but I agree with some of the comments above that it feels very cheap at times.
Two other cars I rotate between are a 2019 s560 and 2020 g550. While it may not be fair to make comparisons between the c and two much higher models, it does remind you that the c63s is just a beefed up entry level mercedes. The fact that my car is 100k sticker makes it feel worse lol.
I had a w204 c250 8 years ago and the fit & finish is the same as my c63 today.
Two other cars I rotate between are a 2019 s560 and 2020 g550. While it may not be fair to make comparisons between the c and two much higher models, it does remind you that the c63s is just a beefed up entry level mercedes. The fact that my car is 100k sticker makes it feel worse lol.
I had a w204 c250 8 years ago and the fit & finish is the same as my c63 today.
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From: San Francisco Bay Area
2019 C63CS
I love my c63s but I agree with some of the comments above that it feels very cheap at times.
Two other cars I rotate between are a 2019 s560 and 2020 g550. While it may not be fair to make comparisons between the c and two much higher models, it does remind you that the c63s is just a beefed up entry level mercedes. The fact that my car is 100k sticker makes it feel worse lol.
I had a w204 c250 8 years ago and the fit & finish is the same as my c63 today.
Two other cars I rotate between are a 2019 s560 and 2020 g550. While it may not be fair to make comparisons between the c and two much higher models, it does remind you that the c63s is just a beefed up entry level mercedes. The fact that my car is 100k sticker makes it feel worse lol.
I had a w204 c250 8 years ago and the fit & finish is the same as my c63 today.
Last edited by superswiss; Jul 19, 2021 at 01:57 PM.
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2019 C63S Coupe, 2020 G550
I think the cheap feel too some extent is mistaken with the lack of isolation that higher models such as the S Class provides. The S class has much different NVH requirements. Their objective is to isolate the driver from what's going on with the vehicle and the road. To some that's what they are looking for, but to me it's boring and numb. You will have more vibration and noise in a C, but to some extent that's intentional, especially in an AMG. There are far more expensive cars that have all kinds of rattles and noises. Ever driven a McLaren with the rocks bouncing of the carbon tub, and the car creaking and cracking because of how stiff they are? It's just kind of the nature of the beast. Classifying a C as entry level is also rather undeserving. There's the A and B class for that. The C really isn't entry level anymore.
And I know what you mean by sound and vibration, and I've accepted that thats just part of the intention to give it a more raw feeling. I even drop the rear seats to hear more. I really can't tell you why, but overall, to me it 'feels' like a cheaper car than the cost would have you expect.
You also get horrible loaners!
And no I haven't driven a mclaren but you are correct they are also supposed to be very 'raw'. I have driven a 458 and FF and obviously there is no comparison to be made there lol
Last edited by Encore818; Jul 19, 2021 at 02:07 PM.
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2007 E350
I think the cheap feeling when driving this gen c63s is a combination of road noise, the rough ride and and sometimes squeak and rattles. This is an amg first and mercedes second. People that are complaining most likely come from cars such as s class and gls. The c class interior is better/nicer then an e class from the 2010 era imo as I own a 2011 e350. Back to OP questions. Is it a $130k car in today world? a big no. but back in 2010 this current c63s would absolutely be worth the $130k for me at least
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From: Los Angeles, CA
2019 C63S Coupe, 2020 G550
I think the cheap feeling when driving this gen c63s is a combination of road noise, the rough ride and and sometimes squeak and rattles. This is an amg first and mercedes second. People that are complaining most likely come from cars such as s class and gls. The c class interior is better/nicer then an e class from the 2010 era imo as I own a 2011 e350. Back to OP questions. Is it a $130k car in today world? a big no. but back in 2010 this current c63s would absolutely be worth the $130k for me at least
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Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 46
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From: Dallas, TX
'18 AMG C63S coupe
I think the cheap feeling when driving this gen c63s is a combination of road noise, the rough ride and and sometimes squeak and rattles. This is an amg first and mercedes second. People that are complaining most likely come from cars such as s class and gls. The c class interior is better/nicer then an e class from the 2010 era imo as I own a 2011 e350. Back to OP questions. Is it a $130k car in today world? a big no. but back in 2010 this current c63s would absolutely be worth the $130k for me at least
I think the key thing here is that people just keep wanting for more. You have a nice package of power, exhaust sound, handling and looks starting from $80k, which is still an incredible deal today. But then you want NVH, that comfort, and maybe a more prestige badge at the back.
I had my moments of wanting to have more in my C63S, but seriously for the same amount of money in the current market, I would still choose C63S all the day.
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 63
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From: Charlotte, NC
'21 C63S Cabrio, '21 Corvette C8, '18 BMW X5
I just picked up a C8 earlier this month and I can say that it is a car that is worth more than it costs at MSRP.
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From: Leesburg, VA
2017 C63S
Even better when you pick one up a few years old for $50k :-). Like, who would buy one of those Civic SI. Sports for 50k when they could have a C63S with under 36k miles for similar.....
