Is there a such thing as a cl with NO abc issues?
09-14-2012, 06:52 PM
#26
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04 CL55 (sold), 2012 CLS550 (sold), 2014 S550 (sold), 2015 ES300H (DAILY)
Oh, this has nothing to do with you or me or anybody. It is just that when somebody puts together "cl" or "sl" and "reliability" in the same sentence- makes me suspect of that persons real experience with said cars.
They are not reliable, not maintenance and repair friendly and they do have an awful track record for dealer dependency to stay running.
If younare telling me that your car is reliable despite high mileage and hard driving- I just don't believe you. That's all. Hope you don't take this the negative way.
They are not reliable, not maintenance and repair friendly and they do have an awful track record for dealer dependency to stay running.
If younare telling me that your car is reliable despite high mileage and hard driving- I just don't believe you. That's all. Hope you don't take this the negative way.
My car has been in the shop 3 times so far in the past 2 years. 4th including my most recent for ABC pump failure.
My 98 Camry or the LS400 that I had a couple years back = 0 over 5-6 years hard driving. (with the exception of wear and tear items or oil changes etc)
09-15-2012, 11:50 PM
#27
Senior Member
"My 98 Camry or the LS400 or (insert Honda, Hyundai, etc here) that I had a couple years back = 0 over 5-6 years hard driving...."
I hear this from time to time from first time BMW and Mercedes customers. The problem is of course that the Japanese and Korean vehicles, even Lexus, are fundamentally simpler machines.
If you want to the most reliable refrigerator, buy a G.E. If you want one with the most features and made to the highest build standard, buy a Sub-Zero.
And so it goes, you want the most reliable car on the road today, buy a Toyota or Hyundai. But if you seek the latest in safety, performance, and comfort innovations, created with the highest quality components and to the highest build standard..........need I say more?
And yes, a vehicle that originally cost $120,000, will ultimately cost more to operate and maintain than one that cost $60,000. Regardless of what price it was purchased for on the secondary market.
There are three choices- buy a warranty with the vehicle, suck it up and self-insure, or buy the lesser car!!!
I hear this from time to time from first time BMW and Mercedes customers. The problem is of course that the Japanese and Korean vehicles, even Lexus, are fundamentally simpler machines.
If you want to the most reliable refrigerator, buy a G.E. If you want one with the most features and made to the highest build standard, buy a Sub-Zero.
And so it goes, you want the most reliable car on the road today, buy a Toyota or Hyundai. But if you seek the latest in safety, performance, and comfort innovations, created with the highest quality components and to the highest build standard..........need I say more?
And yes, a vehicle that originally cost $120,000, will ultimately cost more to operate and maintain than one that cost $60,000. Regardless of what price it was purchased for on the secondary market.
There are three choices- buy a warranty with the vehicle, suck it up and self-insure, or buy the lesser car!!!
Last edited by GermanCars; 09-16-2012 at 12:07 AM.
09-16-2012, 11:24 AM
#28
MBWorld Fanatic!
"My 98 Camry or the LS400 or (insert Honda, Hyundai, etc here) that I had a couple years back = 0 over 5-6 years hard driving...."
I hear this from time to time from first time BMW and Mercedes customers. The problem is of course that the Japanese and Korean vehicles, even Lexus, are fundamentally simpler machines.
If you want to the most reliable refrigerator, buy a G.E. If you want one with the most features and made to the highest build standard, buy a Sub-Zero.
And so it goes, you want the most reliable car on the road today, buy a Toyota or Hyundai. But if you seek the latest in safety, performance, and comfort innovations, created with the highest quality components and to the highest build standard..........need I say more?
And yes, a vehicle that originally cost $120,000, will ultimately cost more to operate and maintain than one that cost $60,000. Regardless of what price it was purchased for on the secondary market.
There are three choices- buy a warranty with the vehicle, suck it up and self-insure, or buy the lesser car!!!
I hear this from time to time from first time BMW and Mercedes customers. The problem is of course that the Japanese and Korean vehicles, even Lexus, are fundamentally simpler machines.
If you want to the most reliable refrigerator, buy a G.E. If you want one with the most features and made to the highest build standard, buy a Sub-Zero.
And so it goes, you want the most reliable car on the road today, buy a Toyota or Hyundai. But if you seek the latest in safety, performance, and comfort innovations, created with the highest quality components and to the highest build standard..........need I say more?
And yes, a vehicle that originally cost $120,000, will ultimately cost more to operate and maintain than one that cost $60,000. Regardless of what price it was purchased for on the secondary market.
There are three choices- buy a warranty with the vehicle, suck it up and self-insure, or buy the lesser car!!!
Excellent post and I agree 100%.
R.K.
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DeutscheBenz726 (04-07-2020)
09-16-2012, 02:05 PM
#29
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04 CL55 (sold), 2012 CLS550 (sold), 2014 S550 (sold), 2015 ES300H (DAILY)
"My 98 Camry or the LS400 or (insert Honda, Hyundai, etc here) that I had a couple years back = 0 over 5-6 years hard driving...."
I hear this from time to time from first time BMW and Mercedes customers. The problem is of course that the Japanese and Korean vehicles, even Lexus, are fundamentally simpler machines.
If you want to the most reliable refrigerator, buy a G.E. If you want one with the most features and made to the highest build standard, buy a Sub-Zero.
And so it goes, you want the most reliable car on the road today, buy a Toyota or Hyundai. But if you seek the latest in safety, performance, and comfort innovations, created with the highest quality components and to the highest build standard..........need I say more?
And yes, a vehicle that originally cost $120,000, will ultimately cost more to operate and maintain than one that cost $60,000. Regardless of what price it was purchased for on the secondary market.
There are three choices- buy a warranty with the vehicle, suck it up and self-insure, or buy the lesser car!!!
I hear this from time to time from first time BMW and Mercedes customers. The problem is of course that the Japanese and Korean vehicles, even Lexus, are fundamentally simpler machines.
If you want to the most reliable refrigerator, buy a G.E. If you want one with the most features and made to the highest build standard, buy a Sub-Zero.
And so it goes, you want the most reliable car on the road today, buy a Toyota or Hyundai. But if you seek the latest in safety, performance, and comfort innovations, created with the highest quality components and to the highest build standard..........need I say more?
And yes, a vehicle that originally cost $120,000, will ultimately cost more to operate and maintain than one that cost $60,000. Regardless of what price it was purchased for on the secondary market.
There are three choices- buy a warranty with the vehicle, suck it up and self-insure, or buy the lesser car!!!
09-16-2012, 02:40 PM
#30
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MB; 55KCL AMG, SL550 SLS AMG G500 Cabrio 280SL ML350 CLS550 ML500 E55 AMG CL500 S600 SLK32 AMG
"My 98 Camry or the LS400 or (insert Honda, Hyundai, etc here) that I had a couple years back = 0 over 5-6 years hard driving...."
I hear this from time to time from first time BMW and Mercedes customers. The problem is of course that the Japanese and Korean vehicles, even Lexus, are fundamentally simpler machines.
If you want to the most reliable refrigerator, buy a G.E. If you want one with the most features and made to the highest build standard, buy a Sub-Zero.
And so it goes, you want the most reliable car on the road today, buy a Toyota or Hyundai. But if you seek the latest in safety, performance, and comfort innovations, created with the highest quality components and to the highest build standard..........need I say more?
And yes, a vehicle that originally cost $120,000, will ultimately cost more to operate and maintain than one that cost $60,000. Regardless of what price it was purchased for on the secondary market.
There are three choices- buy a warranty with the vehicle, suck it up and self-insure, or buy the lesser car!!!
I hear this from time to time from first time BMW and Mercedes customers. The problem is of course that the Japanese and Korean vehicles, even Lexus, are fundamentally simpler machines.
If you want to the most reliable refrigerator, buy a G.E. If you want one with the most features and made to the highest build standard, buy a Sub-Zero.
And so it goes, you want the most reliable car on the road today, buy a Toyota or Hyundai. But if you seek the latest in safety, performance, and comfort innovations, created with the highest quality components and to the highest build standard..........need I say more?
And yes, a vehicle that originally cost $120,000, will ultimately cost more to operate and maintain than one that cost $60,000. Regardless of what price it was purchased for on the secondary market.
There are three choices- buy a warranty with the vehicle, suck it up and self-insure, or buy the lesser car!!!
I wonder in 20 years what these cars are going to go for and how many of them in great working order will still be around. With these cars needing a lot of money for repairs and them getting totaled/in accidents, this car, I don't know if it will be a "collectible" in the future, but I know as rare as they are today, they will be much more rarer. Seeing a well maintained CL55/65 in 2032 is going to be cool
09-17-2019, 08:00 PM
#31
Newbie
"My 98 Camry or the LS400 or (insert Honda, Hyundai, etc here) that I had a couple years back = 0 over 5-6 years hard driving...."
I hear this from time to time from first time BMW and Mercedes customers. The problem is of course that the Japanese and Korean vehicles, even Lexus, are fundamentally simpler machines.
If you want to the most reliable refrigerator, buy a G.E. If you want one with the most features and made to the highest build standard, buy a Sub-Zero.
And so it goes, you want the most reliable car on the road today, buy a Toyota or Hyundai. But if you seek the latest in safety, performance, and comfort innovations, created with the highest quality components and to the highest build standard..........need I say more?
And yes, a vehicle that originally cost $120,000, will ultimately cost more to operate and maintain than one that cost $60,000. Regardless of what price it was purchased for on the secondary market.
There are three choices- buy a warranty with the vehicle, suck it up and self-insure, or buy the lesser car!!!
I hear this from time to time from first time BMW and Mercedes customers. The problem is of course that the Japanese and Korean vehicles, even Lexus, are fundamentally simpler machines.
If you want to the most reliable refrigerator, buy a G.E. If you want one with the most features and made to the highest build standard, buy a Sub-Zero.
And so it goes, you want the most reliable car on the road today, buy a Toyota or Hyundai. But if you seek the latest in safety, performance, and comfort innovations, created with the highest quality components and to the highest build standard..........need I say more?
And yes, a vehicle that originally cost $120,000, will ultimately cost more to operate and maintain than one that cost $60,000. Regardless of what price it was purchased for on the secondary market.
There are three choices- buy a warranty with the vehicle, suck it up and self-insure, or buy the lesser car!!!
Last edited by manitouharbor; 09-17-2019 at 11:02 PM. Reason: Attributes
09-25-2019, 01:22 PM
#33
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MB’s
No ABC issues as long as I have owned my 2006 CL600. Lord knows its more of a when not an if it goes but when it goes I will replace it with coilovers.
09-29-2019, 02:41 PM
#35
'07 with 89K - just lost a portion of ABC
Seems my accumulator gave up front left, bringing it into shop this week to hear damages.
This was a prior 1 owner car with all bills and no prior ABC issues.
I replaced pulsation dampener 2 years ago for vibration $800, alls been been fine until now.
So all in all 12 year old car with complex system like ABC seems to have held upp well and I only paid $22K for it with 67K miles..cars mint!
I am in SoCal so weather treats the car well also.
This was a prior 1 owner car with all bills and no prior ABC issues.
I replaced pulsation dampener 2 years ago for vibration $800, alls been been fine until now.
So all in all 12 year old car with complex system like ABC seems to have held upp well and I only paid $22K for it with 67K miles..cars mint!
I am in SoCal so weather treats the car well also.
09-29-2019, 03:08 PM
#36
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E55, GLS450, GL63, GLE350
While in the shop, you may want them to replace all the hydraulic hoses and flush the system with new Pentosin CHF 11s. You are one hydraulic hose away from needed some huge repairs. If you flush the system and proactively change the hoses, you could be good for another 12 years. Might as well replace the other accumulators not yet replaced.
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ctravis595 (10-03-2019),
Titan1969 (09-29-2019)
10-03-2019, 10:24 PM
#38
MBWorld Fanatic!
I already had a leaking shock , so when my abc pump finally failed I decided to document the first coilover swap. Keeping my abc equipment in case I decided to change my mind
however, I firmly believe such as blownv8 has said, that you are “one blown hose away from an abc system meltdown”.
If you blow a hose, your pump can run dry, don’t expect to avoid a full system rebuild in this situation. If you blow an abc pump, don’t expect to avoid some problems arising with your accumulators or shocks... otherwise you are gambling with your reliability
in regards to posts from 2012 on this thread, yes the w215 can be very reliable but you need to be very smart about how you handle your maintenance. W215 is a car that needs PREVENTATIVE maintenance, it is not a Honda in the way that you wait for problems to arise, and THEN handle them. Too many people maintain cars like this these days..
this means preventatively replacing weak abc pumps, shocks and accumulators. This means constant hydraulic filter and fluid changes. This means replacing hydraulic hoses immediately when you witness weeping and leaks. And yes I think the abc CAN be reliable.
One of the big big problems was Mercedes never implemented much of a service schedule for this system. we all remember the “sealed for life/lifetime fluid” crap with the 722.6? I’m not sure how you can sleep at night telling people they should never change transmission fluid
So yes I believe the abc system CAN be reliable, but are there any w215’s out there that have been maintained to the point they are still considered reliable? You have better luck playing the lottery
A lot of crusty old guys will claim they maintained their Mercedes very well, however I’m not sure many people know what it means to maintain these cars perfectly. Just because your mechanic charges you a ton of money for service does not equate to perfect maintainence
the abc system wasn’t much different from the 722.6 “lifetime fluid”from what I understand. There should have been a service schedule meant to be religiously followed regarding abc system upkeep and I’m not sure why they used to pull this crap, like the 722.6 “lifetime transmission” fluid
Last edited by ctravis595; 10-03-2019 at 10:30 PM.
10-04-2019, 09:31 AM
#39
Newbie
Your equating quality to price. Just because it costs Mercedes more to build a car than Toyota does not make it better. It's a mistake women make because they don't know any better. Over engineering is a trait of ALL engineers, designers, architects, etc. As someone who has spent years in manufacturing I know that at some point to take the product away from the engineering people or it just tends to become more imaginative than practical. The Mercedes ABC system is just that. The difference in handling is miniscule. Like the 722.6 transmission. If anyone really wanted to do something in that area, they would build a transmission that had a canister filter, a dipstick & a drain system that allowed the unit to be flushed regularly. Not difficult or expensive. Doing what they did was the same as Boeing calling for no training when they released the 737 Max. Mercedes built great cars when no one else was. The problem today is the EVERYONE builds great cars and Mercedes cost to do it and ingrained "Over Engineering" hurts the brand.
10-04-2019, 11:21 PM
#40
SOLVED - Bang Noise Drivers Side Left Front on startup
Diagnosed issue as a collapsed driver side front accumulator.
When the accumulator collapsed it releases the nitrogen charge into the fluid line thus pushing fluid out the reservoir fill cap.
Repair shop ( not dealership ) recommended I replace all 3 accumulators since they were the originals ( Already replaced pulsation dampener previously )
$1631 later rides like a magic carpet again.
Been a rough year for repairs approaching $4000, but still love the car and often get car enthusiast asking questions about the car, as I understand few CL600s V12's were sold in North America.
When the accumulator collapsed it releases the nitrogen charge into the fluid line thus pushing fluid out the reservoir fill cap.
Repair shop ( not dealership ) recommended I replace all 3 accumulators since they were the originals ( Already replaced pulsation dampener previously )
$1631 later rides like a magic carpet again.
Been a rough year for repairs approaching $4000, but still love the car and often get car enthusiast asking questions about the car, as I understand few CL600s V12's were sold in North America.
10-05-2019, 04:10 AM
#41
Diagnosed issue as a collapsed driver side front accumulator.
When the accumulator collapsed it releases the nitrogen charge into the fluid line thus pushing fluid out the reservoir fill cap.
Repair shop ( not dealership ) recommended I replace all 3 accumulators since they were the originals ( Already replaced pulsation dampener previously )
$1631 later rides like a magic carpet again.
Been a rough year for repairs approaching $4000, but still love the car and often get car enthusiast asking questions about the car, as I understand few CL600s V12's were sold in North America.
When the accumulator collapsed it releases the nitrogen charge into the fluid line thus pushing fluid out the reservoir fill cap.
Repair shop ( not dealership ) recommended I replace all 3 accumulators since they were the originals ( Already replaced pulsation dampener previously )
$1631 later rides like a magic carpet again.
Been a rough year for repairs approaching $4000, but still love the car and often get car enthusiast asking questions about the car, as I understand few CL600s V12's were sold in North America.
I understand few CL600s V12's were sold in North America not really, lot's of them, tons
10-22-2019, 12:57 AM
#42
Junior Member
I have/had lots of ABC equipped vehicles. Never a problem with any of them. It’s a hydraulic system, it’s actually very basic at its core. I’ve never had a single issue with ABC. I’m also a preventative guy. I replace the fluid every year, with filters. I replace the accumulators every 3 years. I replace the hoses every 4 years with 5000 psi stuff. Same type of maintenance a crane gets. This tech has been around for a very long time.
11-15-2019, 12:12 AM
#43
Junior Member
Mine has no ABC issues at all.
I sent my shocks to Arnott for cores and then took my ABC pump, valves, lines, accumulators and regulators and put them in the rubbish bin.
Yellowspeed coil overs and the Strutmasters ABC delete light for me.
Along with a standard Power Steering pump, that is.
Best car move I ever made.
Now I don't worry about those long drives any more.
I sent my shocks to Arnott for cores and then took my ABC pump, valves, lines, accumulators and regulators and put them in the rubbish bin.
Yellowspeed coil overs and the Strutmasters ABC delete light for me.
Along with a standard Power Steering pump, that is.
Best car move I ever made.
Now I don't worry about those long drives any more.
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Al Schafer (12-17-2019)
03-04-2020, 02:11 PM
#45
Newbie
03 cl55 owned for 5 years. 156000 miles and never had a problem with the abc. Never changed the filter or the fluid and as far as I know they could still be all original. Its my daily driver and hopefully will continue to be for many more years.
06-04-2020, 10:04 AM
#46
I have 2 CLs , a 06 CL 55 and a 05 CL 65. My wife has daily driven her 55 for the last 5 years to the month. I have changed out in that time 1 small pressure line that failed because of hitting a pot hole that blew the wheel apart. Cost was 50 bucks to replace with a 5000 psi upgraded 3 wire hose. The accumulators have all been changed as normal maintenance items and I flush and change fluid every 30000 miles in my driveway (costs about 250 dollars). I have monitored fluid pressure on pump since we purchased the car and haven't seen 2 bar of pressure drop in that time (original pump with no leaks and 196 bar of pressure). The only ABC warnings I have seen is the white alert to take to the shop. That only happens when the right rear tire is low on pressure or low on tread. Scanner shows it is a ride height error. The 06 models have a completely different pressure dampening line. They don't have the dead end line that my 05 has that always blow. I replaced that line on my 05 CL65 with a 5000 psi custom line with an attached pulsation dampener tucked up under the front end. No problems to date with the 65 abc other then all new accumulators (maintenance) and the pulsation line ,car has 112000 miles on it, flush and filters. The design of the dead end pulsation line sucks bad. It uses a nylon liner that has an air cavity around it to dampen the system pulsation. That and it has no stainless braid in it. Recipe for problems. So IMO if you monitor and flush system and don't hit big pot holes they are great daily drivers. Not replacing the accumulators will deadhead the system and cause all kinds of problems. Super easy to change in the drive way and cost around 500 in parts. All comes down to maintenance. My wife and I both daily drive our CLs to the tune of 100000 miles in 5 years and the biggest cost is roasting the tires..
Enjoy your cars all!
Enjoy your cars all!
06-04-2020, 10:40 AM
#47
MBWorld Fanatic!
I have 2 CLs , a 06 CL 55 and a 05 CL 65. My wife has daily driven her 55 for the last 5 years to the month. I have changed out in that time 1 small pressure line that failed because of hitting a pot hole that blew the wheel apart. Cost was 50 bucks to replace with a 5000 psi upgraded 3 wire hose. The accumulators have all been changed as normal maintenance items and I flush and change fluid every 30000 miles in my driveway (costs about 250 dollars). I have monitored fluid pressure on pump since we purchased the car and haven't seen 2 bar of pressure drop in that time (original pump with no leaks and 196 bar of pressure). The only ABC warnings I have seen is the white alert to take to the shop. That only happens when the right rear tire is low on pressure or low on tread. Scanner shows it is a ride height error. The 06 models have a completely different pressure dampening line. They don't have the dead end line that my 05 has that always blow. I replaced that line on my 05 CL65 with a 5000 psi custom line with an attached pulsation dampener tucked up under the front end. No problems to date with the 65 abc other then all new accumulators (maintenance) and the pulsation line ,car has 112000 miles on it, flush and filters. The design of the dead end pulsation line sucks bad. It uses a nylon liner that has an air cavity around it to dampen the system pulsation. That and it has no stainless braid in it. Recipe for problems. So IMO if you monitor and flush system and don't hit big pot holes they are great daily drivers. Not replacing the accumulators will deadhead the system and cause all kinds of problems. Super easy to change in the drive way and cost around 500 in parts. All comes down to maintenance. My wife and I both daily drive our CLs to the tune of 100000 miles in 5 years and the biggest cost is roasting the tires..
Enjoy your cars all!
Enjoy your cars all!
I never knew the 2006 systems were that much improved, perhaps I’ll keep an eye out for a 2006 model then
06-04-2020, 10:41 AM
#48
MBWorld Fanatic!
06-04-2020, 02:51 PM
#49
MBWorld Fanatic!
I have 2 CLs , a 06 CL 55 and a 05 CL 65. My wife has daily driven her 55 for the last 5 years to the month. I have changed out in that time 1 small pressure line that failed because of hitting a pot hole that blew the wheel apart. Cost was 50 bucks to replace with a 5000 psi upgraded 3 wire hose. The accumulators have all been changed as normal maintenance items and I flush and change fluid every 30000 miles in my driveway (costs about 250 dollars). I have monitored fluid pressure on pump since we purchased the car and haven't seen 2 bar of pressure drop in that time (original pump with no leaks and 196 bar of pressure). The only ABC warnings I have seen is the white alert to take to the shop. That only happens when the right rear tire is low on pressure or low on tread. Scanner shows it is a ride height error. The 06 models have a completely different pressure dampening line. They don't have the dead end line that my 05 has that always blow. I replaced that line on my 05 CL65 with a 5000 psi custom line with an attached pulsation dampener tucked up under the front end. No problems to date with the 65 abc other then all new accumulators (maintenance) and the pulsation line ,car has 112000 miles on it, flush and filters. The design of the dead end pulsation line sucks bad. It uses a nylon liner that has an air cavity around it to dampen the system pulsation. That and it has no stainless braid in it. Recipe for problems. So IMO if you monitor and flush system and don't hit big pot holes they are great daily drivers. Not replacing the accumulators will deadhead the system and cause all kinds of problems. Super easy to change in the drive way and cost around 500 in parts. All comes down to maintenance. My wife and I both daily drive our CLs to the tune of 100000 miles in 5 years and the biggest cost is roasting the tires..
Enjoy your cars all!
Enjoy your cars all!
Can I take you up on this?
06-04-2020, 05:19 PM
#50
Newbie
