driveability

driveability

Here is a picture of my old mount, not so good. As you might expect my other mount was flattened and the transmission mount was torn. The lack vibration after the replacement is clearly noticeable. Replacing them is a pain but it had to be done.
I was under the impression the engine had to be raised up much more, read on-line (ya on-line) the job entailed the disconnection of attached sub systems to get the engine high enough to replace these baby's.

Anyone know the going cost of this at a dealer or shop ???

Welwynnick

Congratulations! This is an absolute breakthrough in V12TT maintenance.

The engine mounts have always been one of the big problems. I've been speculating for some time that you dont really need to remove the engine, but it counts for everything if you've actually done it for yourself.

How high did you jack the engine?
How long do you think it would take the second time?

This has been discussed a lot; believe the labour alone would be more than 1000 bucks.

Nick

NISMO240SSX

Did all 4 enginer mounts under CPO, dealer paperwork was around 2200$ of which 800 was parts.

driveability

Nick,
The jack points were at the engine pans front corners, one at a time.
I jacked the pan up to just below the bottom of the engine cradle, about 1/4 inch below. I don't think it was more than 2 inches.


First time took me all day and night with 1 to 2 hour brakes. Maybe 7 to 9 hours of working, thinking, moving things around, ******** tools etc.
A second time would likely be in the 5 hour range, but no way do I wish to do it again ! At 58 with a messed up back only on my car !!!!

Tips,
I glued the rubber heat shields on the engine mounts, to keep them in place along with the heat shield and engine plates together. That way things stayed lined up in the small working area. I have a great head light which is far better than any single trouble light. Got it at REI, its a tool worth its weight in gold.

Welwynnick

Many thanks.
Apart from the O2 sensor and the exhaust (and presumably the battery) did you drain or disconnect anything?
Cheers, Nick

driveability

Good question,
I did the normal under plastic, unbolted the front accumulator and let it swing down.That is for the driver side mount and again you don't have to remove the exhaust on that side, unbolting the accumulator opened up room to remove that mount. I didn't drain any fluids. I was able to loosen the 2 bolts inverse torques using metric swivel sockets, the non impact design seemed to work ( slow as hell ) better. They were 8 mm and 10 mm. 8 mm for the driver side exhaust "C" type clamp and 10 mm for the bolts which held the engine mounts to the block. I did however grease up the rubber heat shields / covers on the engine mounts. It made it easier to move the combination around. The rubber covers are likely a silicone of some kind and would bind up every where within the small area you get to work.
I did find removing the O2 sensor must be done after you unbolt the exhaust. Then you can turn the pipe a bit to get a tool on them. Same for reinstalling, put the exhaust back up in the area, install the sensors and then install the "C" clamp to the exhaust / turbo housing. I didn't replace any gaskets at all. The exhaust gaskets are durable and worked without any leaks after assembled.

I've been a tech for 40 years and I'm sure there are many subtle things which go unmentioned.

Welwynnick

40 years ? That may explain a few things; you must really know what you're doing.

The other key question is how did you raise and support the car? Pit? Ramp? Stands?

I'm just trying to guage whether its a realistic DIY job.

Nick

driveability

I used a lift but really only lifted it 2 1/2 feet off the ground. It would have been easier not using my lift. I have a single post type lift that braces across the center of the car, which was covering the center exhaust connections and was a pain in the *ss. The link below is just like my lift. I don't trust lifts and always have back up jack-stands, even when it's up high i have 4 six foot stands holding the 4500 pound 65 as back up.

http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/53...showimage.html

Crissus

This is even on the 55K cars a paint in the butt job.
Did this myself some months ago, had to remove the steering box and all kind of heatshields around some other parts down there, which you can only see with a dentists mirror.
Really a ****ty Job. I think its more than 1000€ in germany at the dealer including all 3 mounts.

And while one of my two engine bearings were broken and leaked terrible smelling oil everywhere during removal, i still have slight vibrations (that got better after i changed feul filter some weeks ago). Next up im gonna replace front O2 sensors and IAT+Intake air pressure sensor just to make sure...

Hopefully i can get that "no vibration" luxury CL-Class feeling in my 55AMG too.

Welwynnick

https://mbworld.org/forums/sl55-amg-...sl-models.html

There's a superb thread in the AMG R230 forum by nick 55 about how he replaced his engine mountings by removing the engine. Last year I posted (short version here) about how it might be possible to replace the mounts without moving the engine - entirely conjecture, unlike Drivability's account. My idea was that you need to get the engine away from the subframe in order to access the mountings of the engine mounting arms. Therefore why not remove the subframe instead of the engine?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Welwynnick

This is one of the best threads I’ve read, and I hope my namesake still visits here and realises how appreciated this is.

Engine mounts have joined the most discussed V12TT topics – like coil packs, ABC, and IC pumps, and I wonder if/when I’ll have face up to replacing them in my 151k mile car. I wanted to scope the job – see if I understand it right.

My understanding is that the turbos block access to the top of the mounts, so you have to remove the engine. Aside from the sheer scale of the task, it sounds like removing the engine is similar to other cars, except that it’s complicated by the ABC, charge cooling, alternator cooling, aux radiator, and space available.

The procedure described in the first post is very concise, and could only be written by someone who knows what they’re doing. If I could paraphrase it further though (and tweak the order for clarity) I think it boils down to this:

• Remove covers & disconnect battery
• Disconnect suspension arms and steering rack
• Remove bulkhead and cooling fan
• De-pressurize and drain all the fluids
• Disconnect all wiring and pipes to engine
• Remove exhaust & propshaft
• Support subframe and transmission, and unbolt from chassis
• Lower the engine/subframe assy
• Unbolt engine mounts from subframe & lift engine
• The key task – unbolt engine mount arms from the block
• Replace engine mounts

The lines in bold are just used in this procedure.

The end result is to access the engine mount arms, but look at all the things that have to be removed or disconnected:

• Fan
• Bulkhead
• Wiring
• Cooling
• Heating
• Air con
• Oil cooling
• Charge cooling
• Transmission cooling
• Alternator cooling
• ABC
• Exhaust
• Propshaft
• Transmission
• Engine

Without wishing to sound lazy, all that represents a lot of work, and a lot of risk of something going wrong. Ever dropped a nut or socket in a V12TT engine compartment? Looking at what removing the engine achieves – getting access to the engine mount arms – are there any other methods? Notice that when you remove the engine, the turbos still block access to the mounts – but with the engine out you can access the engine mount arms. So it’s not the access to the mounts that matters, but access to the mount arms.

Maybe there are other ways to do that, so all the fluid systems aren’t disturbed and the engine can stay in place? Couldn’t the subframe be dropped without removing the engine? In this case, the abbreviated procedure might be:

• Remove covers & disconnect battery
• Disconnect suspension arms and steering rack
• Unbolt engine mounts from subframe
• Support engine & subframe independently
• Lower subframe from chassis
• The key task – unbolt engine mount arms from the block
• Replace engine mounts

The lines in bold are unique to this procedure.

Maybe the optimum way is to tackle one side at a time, tilt the engine up slightly, and tilt the subframe down slightly. That way it might not be necessary to disconnect the steering and suspension.

What do you think?

Nick

driveability

[QUOTE=Welwynnick;5759593]https://mbworld.org/forums/sl55-amg-...sl-models.html

There's a superb thread in the AMG R230 forum by nick 55 about how he replaced his engine mountings by removing the engine. Last year I posted (short version here) about how it might be possible to replace the mounts without moving the engine - entirely conjecture, unlike Drivability's account. My idea was that you need to get the engine away from the subframe in order to access the mountings of the engine mounting arms. Therefore why not remove the subframe instead of the engine?

Maybe the optimum way is to tackle one side at a time, tilt the engine up slightly, and tilt the subframe down slightly. That way it might not be necessary to disconnect the steering and suspension.

What do you think?




I own a 2005 Cl65 AMG and did replace all three of my mounts, both engine, one transmission just as described in my thread. The top bolts (2) point downward and aren't hard to get with a 6 point 10mm 3/8 swivel socket. I didn't bend, hammer or discombobulate any of my car while doing the mount replacement.
**************** I did it so can anyone else. **************