FS: Stage II+ 2002 C32 AMG - super clean, stock parts included, all TSBs addressed
07-10-2007, 05:24 PM
#1
FS: Stage II+ 2002 C32 AMG - super clean, stock parts included, all TSBs addressed
Hi all,
I'm ready for the next project, so I'm throwing this out there to see what happens. Possibly for sale is my ~435HP/420TQ Stage 2+ 2002 (W203) Mercedes-Benz C32 AMG, VIN #WDBRF65JX2F265758. I searched for a long time to find one in this condition and color/interior combination. I purchased this car two years ago from the original owner with 54,285 miles and have only put ~14K on it in two years. It is my summer ride (a winter daily-driver is a necessity in MI for people who really love their cars), and is always garaged, always meticulously maintained with Mobil 1 in the crankcase, Redline in the diff and OEM PH-correct MB coolant (the orange stuff) in the radiator. The car has never been in an accident or re-painted, tracked or auto-crossed - clear title, clean Carfax, of course. During my ownership of the car, I systematically went through it to upgrade components with proven and well-supported mods to reduce weight and increase performance. While I was at it I preemptively addressed any known shortcomings of the W203 chassis (most detailed in TSBs). Basically, the buyer of this car will be getting a used Benz without used Benz problems. All upgrades are extremely clean and tasteful, and all performed within the last few thousand miles. I've also been an active participant on MBWorld and other forums, so it won't be hard to find people who can vouch for the condition of the car and my high standards of care. This is the kind of car that would be a CPO car if you paid the upcharge to purchase it from a dealer.
Car Specifications:
____________________________________
Year: 2002
Color: Brilliant Silver Metallic (a $1200 option!)
Interior: AMG perforated graphite nappa leather with dark blue inserts
Engine: 3.2 liter supercharged V6
Transmission: SpeedShift 5-speed auto-manual (left flick to downshift, right flick to upshift)
Miles: ~68,800 as of writing this post
Non-smoker
Always garaged
No winters while in my ownership - rarely even sees rain as I have a separate poor weather/daily driver car.
Standard: You guys know all this stuff.
Options:I think mine has all U.S. options, except phone (hands-free integration w/ nav and emergency roadside is present, just not the phone itself - you need a Motorola)
Here is a list of a few features off the top of my head:
a) Navigation (COMAND) with voice stereo integration - will include the couple of discs I have as well.
b) Xenon High Intensity Discharge headlights
c) Front and rear side airbags
d) Power rear sunshade
e) Dual-stage heated seats
f) 6 disc Compact Disc Changer (OEM Alpine unit in glove box) - I've been told they have an aux input for iPod but I don't own one so I never looked.
g) Headlight cleaners (high pressure water, hidden in front bumper)
h) Metallic paint
i) Blue glass w/rain sensing windshield wipers
j) Integrated gate & garage-door opener (HomeLink in MB-speak).
k) Rear ski bag / pass-through
Mechanical Modifications:
____________________________________
$7,100 = Evosport Stage II + Installation
- 7" Crankshaft overdrive pulley
- Aluminum water pump pulley
- Aluminum alternator pulley
- Aluminum power steering pulley
- Two (2) belt tensioners w/ belt
- Ceramic Coated Performance Headers (these are $1500 + installation alone!)
- Denso Iridium IK16 Plugs (set of 12)
- Magnecor 8mm plug wires
- SL55 intake splitter and hose
- Green filters (2)
- Powerchip/evosport custom-tuned evolution 2 software
Power Gains (CA 91 Octane)*:
- +3 lbs Boost (0.2 bar)
- Improved air flow
- 435 HP (75-85 RWHP)
- 420 FT-LB (70-80 RWTQ)
*Note: this is Evosport's results on a Dynojet 248 dynamometer in Huntington Beach CA. for the same model car, same mods, assuming ~18% drivetrain loss.
$3,200 = Quaife ATB differential + Installation - the stock C32 does not come with an LSD, and it desperately needs one!
$700 = Renntech springs (Renntech Products PDF) + installation - a popular way to get a nice 1.5" to 2" drop and dial out some understeer, without making the C32 too hard for the streets. Better than the H&R springs too, because they match the OEM shock damping rates. These are considered the best aftermarket spring for the C32, only beat by full coilovers.
$180 = Evosport pre-fabbed stainless resonator replacement pipe + installation - just recently did this, and I love it. Nice, throaty sound but no drone. CARB legal, not emissions related. Resonator included.
$100 = Ford Lightning Intercooler pump upgrade, (installed on own) including new OEM connector to allow easy r&r of future units of same type if necessary.
Performance:
____________________________________
This vehicle has not been tracked. However, similarly equipped C32s run around 4.3-4.5 second 0-60mph, 12.6-12.7 second 1/4 miles @ around 113-116mph, top speed 185-190 (search YouTube for "C32 Autobahn" for videos of Germans who did top speed runs with theirs).
Cosmetic Modifications:
____________________________________
I wanted a sleeper so the cosmetic mods are very minimal. I was going to tint darker than the factory blue glass (see Moleskin below) but decided to leave that to the next owner as it is such a personal decision.
- OEM 2004+ C32 AMG aluminum foot pedal set.
- Clear front corner markers (original ambers included).
- Moleskin kit for window tint (brand new, uninstalled since the car has only factory/OEM blue glass tint so far) - this is an absolute necessity of you want aftermarket tint such as 3M film, because the C32 window trim tolerances are so tight.
Recent Maintenance / Other New Parts:
____________________________________
- Brand new $1100 set of Yokohama ADVAN S.4. ultra high performance all-season tires (less than 400 miles), Y-rated to in excess of 186 MPH but can still handle rain/light snow - the ultimate touring tire for this car (NOTE: Mercedes-Benz has a TSB out specifically listing the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S as not suitable for this chassis due to road noise).
- New OEM windshield - original was cracked by a rock from a truck on the highway.
- New driver's side door seal - I was detecting a slight increase in wind noise and this took care of it.
- Front sway bar end links, bushings, etc rebuilt with OEM parts (starting to squeak and wanted to tighten up the handling). This is common to the W203 chassis - watch those eBay cars!
- OEM Valeo radiator replaced/upgraded to Behr + new fluids as a preventative measure since the stock unit is a known failure point on this chassis.
- Included: almost all parts to return to stock if desired.
The Bad (see pics):
____________________________________
- There are the usual paint chips from highway travel on the front fascia/bumper that I elected not to have re-sprayed because I thought it more valuable to be able to demonstrate with a paint gauge that this car has never had any body work of any kind. Small enough that pics don't show them well but they are there. Nothing below the top paint layers/down to metal.
- Once or twice within the last few months, I noticed the fuel gauge deliver what I thought was an incorrect reading. This may be nothing, but I'm disclosing it for clarity. The dealer could not find anything wrong when they saw it for spring maintenance.
- Shifter knob "C32" decal plate is bubbled. I planned to buy a lighted aftermarket shift knob (a popular mod), so never addressed this.
- Clear coat chipped approx. 2.5" on left front rim.
Enough already, get to the pictures!
____________________________________
Asking Price?
____________________________________
Start with base car value as of now (just looked while writing this post):
----------------------
............. Trade-In ... Private Party ... Dealer Retail
Edmunds: $24,081 .... $26,213 ......... $28,389
KBB: ...... $19,300 .... $22,290 ......... $25,390
NADA: ... $22,275 .... N/A ............... $25,875
NADA is a dealer-centric site that doesn't publish private-party values.
Averaging private-party for the other two yields: $24,252
Add mods:
----------------------
Mechanical + cosmetic - $11,480
Total to recreate a C32 in this condition and trim:
----------------------
$24,252 base private-party + $11,480 mods = $35,732
As far as mods go, generally you simply never get all the money back for mods, but on the forums and other online sales venues, tastefully modded cars do get some adjustment upwards from stock. I've heard people say "you're lucky to get half the money back you put into mods", so to be fair and facilitate a quick sale or trade, I think I should skip that altogether and give the mods away for free! Well, all but one of them that is
I'm only asking the buyer to pay for half what I paid for the Quaife LSD & installation, for two big reasons:
1) No C32 with 349 HP (stock), much less 435 HP has any business without an LSD - and if you drove a RWD car this powerful you would immediately start looking to get a Quaife. I refuse to sell this car without my favorite mod of all time; the thing it should have had in stock form.
2) The Quaife LSD is a high-demand part in the MB crowd, and used ones are sought after because they don't turn up often and they cost too much new. If I had to I could readily sell it to make some money back, but that would be a real shame. If you buy the car and think you don't need it (ridiculous), you can sell it and make this money back easily. Besides, it is warranteed for life (transferrable to new owner), even if you choose to track the car!
So, my asking price is: $24,252 base private-party + $1,600 for 1/2 the cost of the Quaife LSD & install with lifetime warranty => $25,852.
Plus, I'm throwing in the OEM parts to return the car to stock, if the new owner wishes to do so. They could sell them or the mods and get $$ back if they want, ending up with a stock C32 in fantastic condition for way less than KBB/Edmunds.
All reasonable offers will be considered; please don't bother if you intend to lowball because I'm in no hurry to sell and I know this is a great starting price for a great car. I would like to point out that what I'm looking to get after mods and stock parts included is still less than dealers are trying to get for used C32s that aren't any cleaner, with similar mileage, unknown histories and no mods. Please, no tire kickers or joyriders - this is a serious car!
Need/want a quick four-door? Consider:
____________________________________
Having owned and loved multiple BMWs, when I needed a sedan with an automatic (but still wanted a stick shift) I basically wanted an E46 M3/4 with SMG, but there is no such animal. The 330i ZHP was not powerful enough to fit the bill, and I also wanted a car that was easily modded without loss of long-term reliability and driveability. The only car that fit such a bill and still remained affordable was the C32. This remains true today, for those of you looking for a truly quick four-door sedan with modern looks and features. You have to double the price of a C32 to get close elsewhere. For example, the B6/B7 Audi S4 is naturally aspirated and high compression (expensive to mod), and an E60 M5 is ridiculously expensive out of the gate. You could buy a B7 RS4, but they are harder to find, low on torque and the price tag is no joke on them either (a Stage 2 C32 happens to be as fast or faster anyway, at least in a straight line). SRT-8 Charger/300H? Also not fast enough (seriously overweight). You could get an E92 BMW 335i and talk to Vishnu, but you'd be spending $50 large and possibly voiding your warranty. This car also positively embarrasses pure sports cars:
Faster than a Mustang Shelby GT500 : http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...lby-gt500.html
Faster than or as fast as a C6 Vette? See above link.
Faster than or as fast as a late-model Porsche 911 (non-turbo).
Already eats E46 M3 and E39 M5 for breakfast. Oh, and don't think that the track will be much different - A similarly prepped, daily-driver C32 driven by a non-professional (smg32 we'll miss you) recently ran 1:35 at Willow Springs
The best part is that you can still drive your mom to church on Sunday in comfort (I do) and she'll never know.
Oh, and I almost forgot: this car is less expensive to full-coverage insure than an E36 BMW 328is - I know because that was my last car and my driving record and age bracket are unchanged. The AAA agent told me it's because the Benz has so many safety features (front/side airbags including rear sides, crumple zones, etc.) and human damage is way more expensive than car damage.
Geez, this got long - sorry! I guess full disclosure is better than not enough information.
I'm ready for the next project, so I'm throwing this out there to see what happens. Possibly for sale is my ~435HP/420TQ Stage 2+ 2002 (W203) Mercedes-Benz C32 AMG, VIN #WDBRF65JX2F265758. I searched for a long time to find one in this condition and color/interior combination. I purchased this car two years ago from the original owner with 54,285 miles and have only put ~14K on it in two years. It is my summer ride (a winter daily-driver is a necessity in MI for people who really love their cars), and is always garaged, always meticulously maintained with Mobil 1 in the crankcase, Redline in the diff and OEM PH-correct MB coolant (the orange stuff) in the radiator. The car has never been in an accident or re-painted, tracked or auto-crossed - clear title, clean Carfax, of course. During my ownership of the car, I systematically went through it to upgrade components with proven and well-supported mods to reduce weight and increase performance. While I was at it I preemptively addressed any known shortcomings of the W203 chassis (most detailed in TSBs). Basically, the buyer of this car will be getting a used Benz without used Benz problems. All upgrades are extremely clean and tasteful, and all performed within the last few thousand miles. I've also been an active participant on MBWorld and other forums, so it won't be hard to find people who can vouch for the condition of the car and my high standards of care. This is the kind of car that would be a CPO car if you paid the upcharge to purchase it from a dealer.
Car Specifications:
____________________________________
Year: 2002
Color: Brilliant Silver Metallic (a $1200 option!)
Interior: AMG perforated graphite nappa leather with dark blue inserts
Engine: 3.2 liter supercharged V6
Transmission: SpeedShift 5-speed auto-manual (left flick to downshift, right flick to upshift)
Miles: ~68,800 as of writing this post
Non-smoker
Always garaged
No winters while in my ownership - rarely even sees rain as I have a separate poor weather/daily driver car.
Standard: You guys know all this stuff.
Options:I think mine has all U.S. options, except phone (hands-free integration w/ nav and emergency roadside is present, just not the phone itself - you need a Motorola)
Here is a list of a few features off the top of my head:
a) Navigation (COMAND) with voice stereo integration - will include the couple of discs I have as well.
b) Xenon High Intensity Discharge headlights
c) Front and rear side airbags
d) Power rear sunshade
e) Dual-stage heated seats
f) 6 disc Compact Disc Changer (OEM Alpine unit in glove box) - I've been told they have an aux input for iPod but I don't own one so I never looked.
g) Headlight cleaners (high pressure water, hidden in front bumper)
h) Metallic paint
i) Blue glass w/rain sensing windshield wipers
j) Integrated gate & garage-door opener (HomeLink in MB-speak).
k) Rear ski bag / pass-through
Mechanical Modifications:
____________________________________
$7,100 = Evosport Stage II + Installation
- 7" Crankshaft overdrive pulley
- Aluminum water pump pulley
- Aluminum alternator pulley
- Aluminum power steering pulley
- Two (2) belt tensioners w/ belt
- Ceramic Coated Performance Headers (these are $1500 + installation alone!)
- Denso Iridium IK16 Plugs (set of 12)
- Magnecor 8mm plug wires
- SL55 intake splitter and hose
- Green filters (2)
- Powerchip/evosport custom-tuned evolution 2 software
Power Gains (CA 91 Octane)*:
- +3 lbs Boost (0.2 bar)
- Improved air flow
- 435 HP (75-85 RWHP)
- 420 FT-LB (70-80 RWTQ)
*Note: this is Evosport's results on a Dynojet 248 dynamometer in Huntington Beach CA. for the same model car, same mods, assuming ~18% drivetrain loss.
$3,200 = Quaife ATB differential + Installation - the stock C32 does not come with an LSD, and it desperately needs one!
$700 = Renntech springs (Renntech Products PDF) + installation - a popular way to get a nice 1.5" to 2" drop and dial out some understeer, without making the C32 too hard for the streets. Better than the H&R springs too, because they match the OEM shock damping rates. These are considered the best aftermarket spring for the C32, only beat by full coilovers.
$180 = Evosport pre-fabbed stainless resonator replacement pipe + installation - just recently did this, and I love it. Nice, throaty sound but no drone. CARB legal, not emissions related. Resonator included.
$100 = Ford Lightning Intercooler pump upgrade, (installed on own) including new OEM connector to allow easy r&r of future units of same type if necessary.
Performance:
____________________________________
This vehicle has not been tracked. However, similarly equipped C32s run around 4.3-4.5 second 0-60mph, 12.6-12.7 second 1/4 miles @ around 113-116mph, top speed 185-190 (search YouTube for "C32 Autobahn" for videos of Germans who did top speed runs with theirs).
Cosmetic Modifications:
____________________________________
I wanted a sleeper so the cosmetic mods are very minimal. I was going to tint darker than the factory blue glass (see Moleskin below) but decided to leave that to the next owner as it is such a personal decision.
- OEM 2004+ C32 AMG aluminum foot pedal set.
- Clear front corner markers (original ambers included).
- Moleskin kit for window tint (brand new, uninstalled since the car has only factory/OEM blue glass tint so far) - this is an absolute necessity of you want aftermarket tint such as 3M film, because the C32 window trim tolerances are so tight.
Recent Maintenance / Other New Parts:
____________________________________
- Brand new $1100 set of Yokohama ADVAN S.4. ultra high performance all-season tires (less than 400 miles), Y-rated to in excess of 186 MPH but can still handle rain/light snow - the ultimate touring tire for this car (NOTE: Mercedes-Benz has a TSB out specifically listing the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S as not suitable for this chassis due to road noise).
- New OEM windshield - original was cracked by a rock from a truck on the highway.
- New driver's side door seal - I was detecting a slight increase in wind noise and this took care of it.
- Front sway bar end links, bushings, etc rebuilt with OEM parts (starting to squeak and wanted to tighten up the handling). This is common to the W203 chassis - watch those eBay cars!
- OEM Valeo radiator replaced/upgraded to Behr + new fluids as a preventative measure since the stock unit is a known failure point on this chassis.
- Included: almost all parts to return to stock if desired.
The Bad (see pics):
____________________________________
- There are the usual paint chips from highway travel on the front fascia/bumper that I elected not to have re-sprayed because I thought it more valuable to be able to demonstrate with a paint gauge that this car has never had any body work of any kind. Small enough that pics don't show them well but they are there. Nothing below the top paint layers/down to metal.
- Once or twice within the last few months, I noticed the fuel gauge deliver what I thought was an incorrect reading. This may be nothing, but I'm disclosing it for clarity. The dealer could not find anything wrong when they saw it for spring maintenance.
- Shifter knob "C32" decal plate is bubbled. I planned to buy a lighted aftermarket shift knob (a popular mod), so never addressed this.
- Clear coat chipped approx. 2.5" on left front rim.
Enough already, get to the pictures!
____________________________________
Asking Price?
____________________________________
Start with base car value as of now (just looked while writing this post):
----------------------
............. Trade-In ... Private Party ... Dealer Retail
Edmunds: $24,081 .... $26,213 ......... $28,389
KBB: ...... $19,300 .... $22,290 ......... $25,390
NADA: ... $22,275 .... N/A ............... $25,875
NADA is a dealer-centric site that doesn't publish private-party values.
Averaging private-party for the other two yields: $24,252
Add mods:
----------------------
Mechanical + cosmetic - $11,480
Total to recreate a C32 in this condition and trim:
----------------------
$24,252 base private-party + $11,480 mods = $35,732
As far as mods go, generally you simply never get all the money back for mods, but on the forums and other online sales venues, tastefully modded cars do get some adjustment upwards from stock. I've heard people say "you're lucky to get half the money back you put into mods", so to be fair and facilitate a quick sale or trade, I think I should skip that altogether and give the mods away for free! Well, all but one of them that is
I'm only asking the buyer to pay for half what I paid for the Quaife LSD & installation, for two big reasons:1) No C32 with 349 HP (stock), much less 435 HP has any business without an LSD - and if you drove a RWD car this powerful you would immediately start looking to get a Quaife. I refuse to sell this car without my favorite mod of all time; the thing it should have had in stock form.
2) The Quaife LSD is a high-demand part in the MB crowd, and used ones are sought after because they don't turn up often and they cost too much new. If I had to I could readily sell it to make some money back, but that would be a real shame. If you buy the car and think you don't need it (ridiculous), you can sell it and make this money back easily. Besides, it is warranteed for life (transferrable to new owner), even if you choose to track the car!
So, my asking price is: $24,252 base private-party + $1,600 for 1/2 the cost of the Quaife LSD & install with lifetime warranty => $25,852.
Plus, I'm throwing in the OEM parts to return the car to stock, if the new owner wishes to do so. They could sell them or the mods and get $$ back if they want, ending up with a stock C32 in fantastic condition for way less than KBB/Edmunds.
All reasonable offers will be considered; please don't bother if you intend to lowball because I'm in no hurry to sell and I know this is a great starting price for a great car. I would like to point out that what I'm looking to get after mods and stock parts included is still less than dealers are trying to get for used C32s that aren't any cleaner, with similar mileage, unknown histories and no mods. Please, no tire kickers or joyriders - this is a serious car!
Need/want a quick four-door? Consider:
____________________________________
Having owned and loved multiple BMWs, when I needed a sedan with an automatic (but still wanted a stick shift) I basically wanted an E46 M3/4 with SMG, but there is no such animal. The 330i ZHP was not powerful enough to fit the bill, and I also wanted a car that was easily modded without loss of long-term reliability and driveability. The only car that fit such a bill and still remained affordable was the C32. This remains true today, for those of you looking for a truly quick four-door sedan with modern looks and features. You have to double the price of a C32 to get close elsewhere. For example, the B6/B7 Audi S4 is naturally aspirated and high compression (expensive to mod), and an E60 M5 is ridiculously expensive out of the gate. You could buy a B7 RS4, but they are harder to find, low on torque and the price tag is no joke on them either (a Stage 2 C32 happens to be as fast or faster anyway, at least in a straight line). SRT-8 Charger/300H? Also not fast enough (seriously overweight). You could get an E92 BMW 335i and talk to Vishnu, but you'd be spending $50 large and possibly voiding your warranty. This car also positively embarrasses pure sports cars:
Faster than a Mustang Shelby GT500 : http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...lby-gt500.html
Faster than or as fast as a C6 Vette? See above link.
Faster than or as fast as a late-model Porsche 911 (non-turbo).
Already eats E46 M3 and E39 M5 for breakfast. Oh, and don't think that the track will be much different - A similarly prepped, daily-driver C32 driven by a non-professional (smg32 we'll miss you) recently ran 1:35 at Willow Springs
The best part is that you can still drive your mom to church on Sunday in comfort (I do) and she'll never know.
Oh, and I almost forgot: this car is less expensive to full-coverage insure than an E36 BMW 328is - I know because that was my last car and my driving record and age bracket are unchanged. The AAA agent told me it's because the Benz has so many safety features (front/side airbags including rear sides, crumple zones, etc.) and human damage is way more expensive than car damage.
Geez, this got long - sorry! I guess full disclosure is better than not enough information.
:
Trending Topics
07-11-2007, 09:08 PM
#10
Wow, thanks for all the kind words about my whip! Sorry rlee02135, no parting out. Any other questions from anyone?
BTW, I'll check here regularly (lots of PMs coming in already
) - but being a busy guy (aren't we all), the best/fastest way to reach me is via email:
myc32forsale AT yahoo DOT com
BTW, I'll check here regularly (lots of PMs coming in already
) - but being a busy guy (aren't we all), the best/fastest way to reach me is via email:myc32forsale AT yahoo DOT com
07-13-2007, 12:43 PM
#11
MBWorld Fanatic!
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I hope you get a good owner for it...
all that car needs is a nice set of 18' AMG wheels and bi-xenons.. and you have a full package!!! looks and power.
I would not pass up this deal... if anybody is "on the fence"
all that car needs is a nice set of 18' AMG wheels and bi-xenons.. and you have a full package!!! looks and power.
I would not pass up this deal... if anybody is "on the fence"
07-19-2007, 03:46 PM
#14
07-24-2007, 04:02 PM
#15
Bump still for sale.
Interest has been pretty high, but frankly I'm surprised that it did not sell the first weekend at this low of a price *shrug*. Well, I'm in no hurry. If it doesn't sell soon, I'll just keep it another year - it's nice not to owe anything on a car
Interest has been pretty high, but frankly I'm surprised that it did not sell the first weekend at this low of a price *shrug*. Well, I'm in no hurry. If it doesn't sell soon, I'll just keep it another year - it's nice not to owe anything on a car
Last edited by m3_eater; 07-24-2007 at 04:20 PM.
