user z478747

Yes, if you're going to call into question my character this is going to get confrontational.

I have been up front with my motives regarding my price all along. I can ask any price I want or raise my price anytime I want and I don't have to justify anything to you! I too have an opinion of what these cars are worth. Granted it's different from yours b/c I'm a seller and you're a buyer. I have one and you DON'T! You don't want my car pay the money for my car? Fine, go try to steal somebody elses! Just be clear here that you are a buyer thus providing the basis for your posts about value.

To that point, let's talk about telling the whole story and what motivates you to post what you do about prices. You are/were in the market for a BS! Would anyone expect you to post anything that agrees with decent prices on a BS? Well, not at least until you have one anyway! The $90k number you just quoted above was NEVER a part of our discussions..... (BTW, my car has only 1300 miles not 1700......) Further, the prices of solds you quote are heresy and nothing more...

user z478747

......so why don't you buy the Brumos car? Is it b/c there is another story behind that car or that they appear to be desperate at least making you think there's something up with it?

Nice rounding of the numbers to get the 90k....

Doctodd33

im sorry you took this personally.....this all came about cuz YOU gave misinformation to a seller to benefit you and other sellers. Maybe a PM would have worked out better in retrospect. So im sorry i called you out....but it was based on you not telling the whole truth.

Again you are being less than honest about something else..... you forgot to mention i offered 5K more for your car AFTER you clarified how many miles it had. I did not haggle by offering 5k more. I thought it had a few thousand more miles, which puts my offer at 10% less than what market price is(your car is market valued at about $90K even if it is white). I have been consistent and i didnt haggle with you which is what you tried to represent.

You put your character in this position....not me.

user z478747

Damn right I take this personal and you didn't call me out! Like you, I gave my opinion but my character comes into question by YOU; but when you have a differing opinion (b/c you're a BUYER) it should be taken as a valid statement? I call Bull***** on that!

Get your facts straight, I DID NOT forget to mention your most generous offer......

Who says? You? Please!

selynn

Guy, Guys,
All this bickering should maybe be kept private with a PM instead of on the forum. I am fairly new to this forum but "holy cow". As far as the Brumos car, just let me say this. I bought the BS that was at Kansas City MB dealer on Dec. 30th after having looked at a number of cars. I can only speak to the Silver/Black because that is the color I wanted but I flew down and looked at the Brumos BS. I know that dealership pretty well as I use to race in Grand-Am and have driven with some of thier drivers, and Bob Snodgrass the Brumos owner was a person friend. I also know that the car was sold new by Brumos and I know the sales person who sold and knows the owner that traded it back to them. I had the car inspected (independently) and found no issues. The main reason I did not buy it from Brumos is that I had an SL55 AMG I wanted to trade and they were just not interested (reflected by the trade in value that offered) {had it been a purely cash deal I would have bought it} - I also flew to Texas to look at the BS in Sugarland. Again- no issues but lousy trade in offer. - I did not look at the one in California - too far for me to fly my own plane to many save 5K. So- I ended up gong back to KC and drove their BS, made and offer they countered, I countered,-- SOLD ! -- Please remember the ole saying- "it is only worth what someone is willing to pay" all this bickering over price listing, market value, personal attacks does nothing but create hard feeling. So PLEASE - let's stick to what made us join this forum to begin with 'THE BLACK"

clkwork

10% under market is most certainly a lowball but I don't why anyone should be offended, the seller will either take it or send you on your way. What I hate is when people get online and try to justify why they think the value someone's car is less than what the seller is asking. If the buyer doesn't like the price then find another car and leave it at that!

The black is an amazing car and still worth every penny at full retail if you ask me.

user z478747

I am glad to know this. Perhaps it's all the 3 day auctions they ran, dropping the price what seemed like daily and the crappy pictures? They set an expectationn that there was always a lower number.

user z478747

Don't get me wrong, I didn't take his low ball offer personally and it was more like 15-20% below retail. We actually parted on good terms. What offended me was his accusations given he is/was doing EXACTLY the same thing he accused me of doing but from a buyer's perspective.... Yet it's a character issue with me. I am really P!SSED off about that!

wolfturbo

Guys, whatever you do don't take this offline!!! I am having waaaaaay too much fun reading the banter!!

Chuck, don't you yearn for the good ol' days of just having to deal with the Prince of Darkness???

I have been laying low on this discussion, but I will finally chime in....

I think the original poster is dreaming (no disrespect intended) if he is hoping to sell this car for a # starting with a 9. Our economy is in the ****ter and MBZ new car sales have made successive 25 year lows EACH of the last 3 months. Simply google "December 2008 U.S. Mercedes Benz new car sales" if you wish to confirm how abysmal business is for the dealers. And trust me when I say they are barfing up high-end 2008 models that are gathering dust on their showroom floors. The BS has an edge due to scarcity, but there's still a reason that MBZ USA has put on $15K of trunk money for dealers on new unsold Black Series.

I have been able to ferret out some nice low mileage (sub 2K) BS's for the mid $80's out here on the West Coast.

I have dragged my feet on the purchase of a BS because the MARKET IS FALLING and nothing is going to reverse that at this point guys. Don't stampede to the buffet table - these are contemporary cars, not Daytona Spiders. The trend is not going to reverse in the midst of an economy where buyers aren't buying, dealers are losing their flooring lines of credit and banks won't finance anybody with decent money unless they have at least a 720 FICO. If sellers want to sell, get ahead of the market and price aggressively because they aren't going to be worth more next month.

This means buyers who want to own today need to be close to market; buyers who want to be patient will have no difficulties flushing out a motivated seller at their price. It's only amount of time and how much (if at all) prospective buyers value having one NOW.

While I love the BS, I'm struggling with the fact that I believe it will soon be possible to buy another Stradale for $150K or less. On a relative value basis, that has become a very tempting alternative to a BS at $80K.

I welcome thoughts from all, although I know my good buddy Jeffrey will tell me to simply sack up and buy both!!!

At the end of the day I'm one of those sick *******s who enjoys the chase more than the kill. Good luck to all.

user z478747

Yes, at least he had some class...... Welcome back!

Tipo815

Buy both you tight wad!

Doctodd33

sry chuck.......again im not at all personally offended(the class statement). I wont muck up the forum with anymore discussion. I called it like i saw it and anyone can feel free to disagree. I feel like Chuck had a hidden agenda(to increase the value of his car by having another car listed higher) and i dont feel sorry for bringing it to light. He continued to misrepresent things and i called him out on every one i noticed. I dont fault him for asking for 104....109.....112 next week. I dont have any problem with that and i never said i did.

Im very happy if Chuck sells his car....i dont wish anything bad on him or hateful on him.....If i really wanted to be hateful i would place an ad for a white CLK BS and describe what he is doing for all to see. And it would run until it sells for very little money.

As for simple math....correct me if im wrong, but i offered 80K on a car i thought market value worth 90K. Around 10% difference? Or am i wrong? I bought a boat instead so like i said im not a buyer.

allenjdmb

in that is that a fair price is one that makes both buyer and seller happy--that's going to be hard for some folks to swallow with a 138 msrp. Also, I love the BS and also tried to buy the Brumos car (I'm in the industry), but was told they weren't in the mood to lose any (more) money....oh well, OK with me. I don't have to have it, and bought an SL55 030 instead (those cars are such a value right now). I think we all get our heads clouded sometimes by thinking that there are so many of us that have an interest in these unique expensive toys (others as well as the BS). Really though, the BS is a fantastic car with a very,very limited audience. No roof, no back seat (not that I care) and a price that approaches 6 figures used--and you've got a good recipe for a car that may sit--for a while. One poster thought that he might have to wait "2 or 3 weeks" to get a better number. In this marketplace, I think that may be 2 or 3 months--and I don't think it's going to get any better. Thing is, folks with the real ability to buy toys like this are few and far between--especially at this moment--and do have lots of leverage if they can write a check. In any event, great car, but I tend to agree that she's still on the downhill.Good luck--still want to own one!

user z478747

Hidden agenda my A$$! ~10% if you buy your $90k estimate of current value.... A 1300 mile BS is still worth more than $90k thus my estimate of 15 - 20% below the market. Check eBay, low mileage cars are even drawing higher bids than $90k. I have been up front with you and every other person I discussed my car with. I have posted here what my intentions were in other threads and even suggested others do the same..... It is still my opinion that this car should be priced at $99k b/c he is going to get low ball offers from market experts anyway. He can always go down but not up? As for my car, what is it to you if I raise my price to $120k? Perhaps I just really don't care if it sells or not. If I help to raise the value of a few other cars along the way what is it to YOU????? Isn't that good for all sellers, perhaps not buyers but I'm not buying you are/were (stating a lower value in hopes of driving the market down to your number? - didn't you even agree with that thought in an earlier post?) Pot meet kettle.

I hope you stole the boat b/c its probably a worse spend than a BS.

ET550

You just described every exotic performance car in the marketplace which isn't a convertible.

user z478747

I would like to apologize to Todd (Doctodd33) and to this list for my behavior today. I lost my cool and responded out of anger to what I feel are/were unjust accusations against my character/integrity which I hold as the highest measure of a man no matter what the topic.

Todd, I understand how you could construe what I said in my original post responding to the question about value as a hidden agenda based on knowledge that only you (and anyone else who inquired about my car) knew after conversations you and I had about my car. Also, subsequent posts regarding the eBay info I posted were not nearly as detailed as perhaps it should have been to make my point. I have in the past tried to be very transparent on this board about my intentions for my car and any impact I might have on the value of the 2008 CLK63 Black Series market overall. Having said that, I don’t believe any one single individual has that much influence. No, I do not. I hope you’ll accept my apology.

To the group: Please let me be clear about my intentions regarding the sale of my car. Yes, it is listed for sale and it will remain listed for sale. I would sell it but only for something close to my asking price. Will it sell? Maybe, maybe not but that is really okay with me either way. It is my hope that the value of these cars will not continue on their current slide although I think the economy will have much say in that for the foreseeable future. I hope that values stabilize for ALL current owners and future owners.

This is all I have to say on this topic. Carry on. Out.

transferred

But the BS isn't an "exotic."

Doctodd33

chuck.....It must be karma..... Im still working at the hospital but wanted to take the time to log on and apologize to you....and i just read your apology. Let me second that.....i see no purpose to me carrying on like this as the market will do whatever it wants. As much as i dont agree with what i THOUGHT you were doing, i feel like i ruined someone else's day and i had no real reason too. I really shouldnt have gone to the extent that i did and i did not improve this planet one bit. I also reread the whole post and i now see some things differently. Funny how that happens.

im very sorry and hope we can all get along.......ive been blessed these past few months despite the current economy, so maybe i will be an owner one day. But i wont pay above market ;-)

user z478747

We can. Thank you.

LZH

I dunno about that. Depends on your definition of "exotic". I've had this debate many times over the years. Some people feel that the main attribute that makes a car exotic is that it appreciates in value. If that is the side of the fence you are on then sure, the BS is clearly not worth more now. But if you look at production numbers and performance, it's right up there with many other "exotic" cars.

ET550

substitute any word you want. the bottom line is most nonconvertible limited production sport cars over $100k are 2 seat coupes without sunroofs. I don't know what makes an Aston Martin vantage, audi r8, corvette zr1, Ford Gt40, etc. any more or less exotic than the BS. Exotics aren't limited to italian sport cars. The point being in reference to the post I quoted is that 2 seats and fixed roof are not limiting factors to the performance enthusiast. And when you look at how the BS is equipped from the factory in terms of materials used, suspension, differential and oil coolers and the like, its not a stretch to refer to it as an exotic.

Stiggs

God I love this economy. I love seeing these high priced cars tank! Makes me feel good if I ever wanted to buy one.

Keep on dropping baby!

LZH

So you like seeing lives destroyed, peoples careers gone, unemployment numbers getting scary high and the wealth of our nation receeding like the tide ? Pretty selfish statement IMO and from your current list of vehicles I doubt you will be able to afford a Black Series anytime soon - becasue if you could, you would have already. Sorry to sound like a jerk, but saying you love the current economy and want it to continue to drop just so you can afford something is a pretty crappy thing to say.

Doctodd33

i agree......with that hateful statement and attitude Stiggs, you probably arent going to change your tax bracket anytime soon.

T

SMP

In other words, you wish misery onto an entire nation for your own selfish desires? Only someone with a limited thought process would make such a statement.