Leak between Engine and Transmission
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 11
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Leak between Engine and Transmission
I drive 1997 E-420 and have 132K miles on it. Very happy with car till recently.
I found 1-2 drops of ATF on my garage yesterday. I lift the car and found that between Transmission and torque converter/engine there is sipping/wipping leak of ATF.
My local shop is giving me $500 estimate to put new seal in.
Please note I did ATF change at stealer around 112K miles.
Transmission runnig great, I don't have any problem with it.
I am just worry of this leak.
Please see attached photos.
Any suggestion guys. Zam2000 any feed back from you also will be appreciated.
Overall I have learn that MB's are not reliable like my good old Lexus and Toyota. Quality of MB delear service is very poor.
Some time I have to teach and explain to SA (Service Adviser) at MB dealer ship what is the problem and what I want him to install or do with my MB. MB service advisers are very GREEN, very little experience.
Never I have to do this with my Lexus/Toyota dealer.
I found 1-2 drops of ATF on my garage yesterday. I lift the car and found that between Transmission and torque converter/engine there is sipping/wipping leak of ATF.
My local shop is giving me $500 estimate to put new seal in.
Please note I did ATF change at stealer around 112K miles.
Transmission runnig great, I don't have any problem with it.
I am just worry of this leak.
Please see attached photos.
Any suggestion guys. Zam2000 any feed back from you also will be appreciated.
Overall I have learn that MB's are not reliable like my good old Lexus and Toyota. Quality of MB delear service is very poor.
Some time I have to teach and explain to SA (Service Adviser) at MB dealer ship what is the problem and what I want him to install or do with my MB. MB service advisers are very GREEN, very little experience.
Never I have to do this with my Lexus/Toyota dealer.
Senior Member
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 270
Likes: 1
From: Western Michigan
2003 E320 4Matic Wagon & 1997 E320
It looks like it is on the passenger side. It could very well be that electric connector leak. It is called a "spacer" with O-rings. The list price is below $8 but the dealer would probably want to replace the TCU for $1000.
Senior Member
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 355
Likes: 3
2007 S-550, 2001 E-430 & 1997 E-420
Typical Transmission under look
I don't think you need to go to Stealer.
1997 E-420 with 132K miles worth may be $7500. There are so many W210 now out to sell, the price of W210 is keep droping.
Same happing with W220, since the arrival of W221 the pricing on W220 is keep coming down significantly.
So paying stealer $1000 is useless.
The option for you to use your independent shop.
$500 is good deal to do this leak fixing.
1997 E-420 with 132K miles worth may be $7500. There are so many W210 now out to sell, the price of W210 is keep droping.
Same happing with W220, since the arrival of W221 the pricing on W220 is keep coming down significantly.
So paying stealer $1000 is useless.
The option for you to use your independent shop.
$500 is good deal to do this leak fixing.
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
MB part number for Dip stick for transmission
Can any one tell me MB part number for Dip stick for transmission?
I am going to get one to check the ATF level.
Can some one tell me how you check if the temperature is 80 deg C or 80 deg F ??
I changed my ATF around 112K miles at MB Dealer ship. Is it possible that tech at dealer ship did not put torque converter drain plug properly? Any feed back will be appreciated.
I am going to get one to check the ATF level.
Can some one tell me how you check if the temperature is 80 deg C or 80 deg F ??
I changed my ATF around 112K miles at MB Dealer ship. Is it possible that tech at dealer ship did not put torque converter drain plug properly? Any feed back will be appreciated.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,627
Likes: 5
From: West Virginia
2001 E320 RWD - Brilliant Silver/Ash: 100,000+
Regarding the TC drain plug, anything is possible, but I hate to think a trained M-B technician would make such a simple mistake. Maybe while you're at it, you should find out what torque is supposed to be applied to that plug and check that too.
Last edited by Musikmann; Mar 21, 2007 at 04:38 PM. Reason: adding to message
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,627
Likes: 5
From: West Virginia
2001 E320 RWD - Brilliant Silver/Ash: 100,000+
Question for Star420 please
Thanks in advance,
Musikmann
Last edited by Musikmann; Mar 21, 2007 at 05:16 PM. Reason: grammar
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MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 3,860
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From: Jacksonville Florida
209/W210 Estate /W211 modded by MBENZNL
What Color is the fluid?..If Red then its trans fluid
If Brown (Engine OIL)Then It could be the Rear main on the Engine..then the trans Must be removed to replace it
Looks Like a Tech forgot to replace the torque converter drain plug seal ..as its a crush washer..and its a one time use seal
If the leak is still there then the trans must be removed to inspect for the leak...Seen SEVERAL front pump / Input seals do this..But I Would have them recheck the torque converter crush washer First!
If Brown (Engine OIL)Then It could be the Rear main on the Engine..then the trans Must be removed to replace it
Looks Like a Tech forgot to replace the torque converter drain plug seal ..as its a crush washer..and its a one time use seal
If the leak is still there then the trans must be removed to inspect for the leak...Seen SEVERAL front pump / Input seals do this..But I Would have them recheck the torque converter crush washer First!
Super Member
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 809
Likes: 74
From: Dallas, TX
2008 E63 wagon (1 of 62)
my guess is the rear main seal like what others are saying, but it is also possible that the torque converter drain plug crush washer was tightened too far and is now leaking. I have seen it before and it's better to check a $0.35 part and replace it rather than replacing a rear main seal for $1000.00
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: Mar 2007
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Transmission was service in May 2005
Thanks for all your feed back.
The transmission service was done at 112K on May 2005.
following parts were change.
140 277-00-95 Trans Oil Filter $11.35
140-271-00-80-64 Gasket $14.09
001-989-21-03-10 trans fluid 8 $16 each total $128
140-991-00-55 Lock Pin $1.56
201-990-05-36 Screw $3.60
001-994-98-45 Lock plate $1.90
I will take car back to check to see if torqe converter drain plug/washer is leaking.
As of today, transmission working great, ATF level is good also. So I am not loosing ATF fluid in big time leak. It is some kind of minor leak.
I open the TCU box and all dry, no sign of any ATF getting into the TCU unit, which is a good news.
If you guys have any more comments, please post it. Any help will be greatly appreciated.
The transmission service was done at 112K on May 2005.
following parts were change.
140 277-00-95 Trans Oil Filter $11.35
140-271-00-80-64 Gasket $14.09
001-989-21-03-10 trans fluid 8 $16 each total $128
140-991-00-55 Lock Pin $1.56
201-990-05-36 Screw $3.60
001-994-98-45 Lock plate $1.90
I will take car back to check to see if torqe converter drain plug/washer is leaking.
As of today, transmission working great, ATF level is good also. So I am not loosing ATF fluid in big time leak. It is some kind of minor leak.
I open the TCU box and all dry, no sign of any ATF getting into the TCU unit, which is a good news.
If you guys have any more comments, please post it. Any help will be greatly appreciated.
Super Member
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 809
Likes: 74
From: Dallas, TX
2008 E63 wagon (1 of 62)
One thing you might check since you have the car up in the air already is to grab a small mirror and a flashlight. Look at the bottom side of the bell housing for the transmission and you will see those 2 rectangular black plugs. Take those out for the time being. Also, just infront of those on the back of the oil pan you will see an oddly shaped black plug. Remove that also for the time being. Take the flashlight and see if you can see through the flex plate up towards the rear main seal at the rear of the crankshaft where it mounts to the flex plate. If you can't see anything besides the flex plate or torque converter, try rotating the torque converter with a small screwdriver or something. Try to see if you can find an area to look up there and see any evidence of oil leaking down. Also, you can use the mirror from the front access cover and look up at the bottom of the rear main seal and see if you can spot anything there. It is possible that the upper seal of the oil pan between it and the bottom of the engine block is just leaking down causing this big mess.
Senior Member
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 270
Likes: 1
From: Western Michigan
2003 E320 4Matic Wagon & 1997 E320
<<
201-990-05-36 Screw $3.60
001-994-98-45 Lock plate $1.90
>>
These two items do not seem to be related to the transmission.
I did not see the two (different) washers in the parts list, one for the drain plug on the pan and the other for the plug on the TC. They are very cheap so the dealer probably just gave them to you without listing.
201-990-05-36 Screw $3.60
001-994-98-45 Lock plate $1.90
>>
These two items do not seem to be related to the transmission.
I did not see the two (different) washers in the parts list, one for the drain plug on the pan and the other for the plug on the TC. They are very cheap so the dealer probably just gave them to you without listing.
Member
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 100
Likes: 0
I have the same problem for about 3 years now since my last TF change. My mechanic mentioned that it was the tranny front seal - However, if it was engine oil it'd be rear main seal. So maybe you want to make sure the color of the fluid.
Mine is not leaking quite as much as yours (as shown in the picture so) I kept an eye on it checking every other week and so far I have added about 1/4 of a quart.
They sell drip pan at autopart for about $10 so you can try to monitor the leak. If you can live with it - spending $500-600 to r & r the tranny to fix a minor leak seems expensive.
Mine is not leaking quite as much as yours (as shown in the picture so) I kept an eye on it checking every other week and so far I have added about 1/4 of a quart.
They sell drip pan at autopart for about $10 so you can try to monitor the leak. If you can live with it - spending $500-600 to r & r the tranny to fix a minor leak seems expensive.
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 11
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Found Lower Oil Pan Also Leaking Engine Oil
Guys, thanks for all the good feed back, I do greatly appreciate all the support.
I lift the car again and removed the oil pan under cover and found engine oil leak from lower oil pan (Small pan on lower end of engine).
Lower oil pan gasket leak is easy to fix, I will do it this weekend.
I will also rotate the Torque converter and check with light to see where is exactly the leak coming from.
I am suspecting it is engine oil leak that I am seeing between the TC and Engine.
I did go from dinosaur oil to Mobil 1 0-w40 full synthetic around 120K miles. I believe the full synthetic engine oil is opening the leaks in my engine around gaskets and making engine oil to leak.
Please review the new photos of lower oil pan leaks. Any more feed back?
I still love this car, but may be it is time to let it go and get 2000 E55. I can get 00 E55 for around $16K.
I lift the car again and removed the oil pan under cover and found engine oil leak from lower oil pan (Small pan on lower end of engine).
Lower oil pan gasket leak is easy to fix, I will do it this weekend.
I will also rotate the Torque converter and check with light to see where is exactly the leak coming from.
I am suspecting it is engine oil leak that I am seeing between the TC and Engine.
I did go from dinosaur oil to Mobil 1 0-w40 full synthetic around 120K miles. I believe the full synthetic engine oil is opening the leaks in my engine around gaskets and making engine oil to leak.
Please review the new photos of lower oil pan leaks. Any more feed back?
I still love this car, but may be it is time to let it go and get 2000 E55. I can get 00 E55 for around $16K.
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From: New England
2000 E 320S4 210.282 4Matic Estate
Cheers.
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2022 CLS450 AMG 4Matic
