jimmydagreek

I posted this in the 55 forum as well. I've never heard of anyone using these springs? What do you guys know about them and how would you compare them to H&R? Thanks...

FlatlineEF9

The w124 guys use them a lot. I hear they are kinda on the stiff side.

ZedStyle

i've had them on two cars, an acura legend and my w124, and i think they're excelent. made in germany, and been around a lot longer than h&r, eibach, etc...
i think they actually supply nascar now. if nothing else, they look the best.. violet springs!

Tweel

where can you buy these springs anyway?

vraa

I had a set of Intrax's for my LS400, they were purple

uberwgn

X2. Could be an issue depending on local road conditions.

jimmydagreek

Thanks guys. The H&R's are stiff too depending on opinion but I like the ride. I keep seeing the Vogtlands on ebay and also a local shop has them as well and made in Germany, I had to ask...

raymond g-

so guys, are you kind of saying that lowering springs can be ranked as follows....

Vogtland (stiffest)
H&R
Eibacht
Koni adj (softest)

I just installed Vogtland, believing they were progressive wound but
when recd found they were single wound. What is tough to determine
prior to purchase with *any* of the above is that they don't print the
spring rates which allow consumers to compare relative rates....and if
progressive wound, when does it stiffen up (to).

When I was racing motorcycles it was damn clear what the specs were,
how one can adjust the preload, and when adjusting the dampening rate,
how much is adjustable for compression vs rebound. With pax cars, this
info seems quite difficult to come by....making it a challenge for one to
purchase intelligently.

Tweel

man...just look at ebay...this stuff is expensive...

The Springs - http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Vogtl...89705047QQrdZ1

Coilovers -
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Vogtl...93151970QQrdZ1

and these are the stiffest?...well it would be a good choice for the track...

TruE320Ridah14

Don't forget KLEEMANN and Renntech makes springs too.

JamE55

My setup up are pink.

jimmydagreek

JamE55

But rides on rail!

jimmydagreek

Know of any place to get a good deal on a set of KLEEMANN or Renntech???

jimmydagreek

so raymond, what do you think of your Vogtlands???

raymond g-

the front is firm...on #3 pad

the rear is too firm...on #1 pad so I'm going to try raising it with two pads,
making it something like #4+ (ie combining pads) and seeing how it feels.
with the #1 pad, expansion joints were felt as if hardwired to my spine

another unknown is whether the HDs I have affects the harshness of the
ride, say....versus Sport Bilsteins. I purposely opted to change one component
at a time, rather than doing multiple changes. since i had the ability to perform
my own spring/shock swap, i wasn't as concerned with the labor costs.
I could experiment incrementally and progressively.

so will try the combo spring pads trick and if it is still too jolting, i'll try
diff springs and/or shocks (Koni adj)

I would have preferred a progressive wound with something similar to initial
rate of 5+% over OEM, with the secondary rate kicking in at 10%. but as
I indicated, we dont get to see technical specs....rather subj word of mouth
descriptions from other MB folks who have swapped out.

one thing is clear though....it's much improved in terms of tracking laterally.
the rolling sensation (OEM suspension) is all but eliminated

uberwgn

The Eibachs are progressive, the others don't appear to be.

The mfrs will share the spring rate info if you ask...you also need to know the OE numbers to get a full comparo.

You're going to stack pads? I need to hear more about this.

raymond g-

you weren't thinking i had the gonadal capacity to do this on my own, did
you? LOL. I read of other folks trying this. Once caveat is not to get carried
away. Remember that it is important the top perch safely cradle the hybrid-jumbo
pad w/o over exposing the stack/top of the spring.


yes, i was still using HDs since the manuf recommendation didn't call for a
short shock if the spring lowering was < 1". that's why i just made few
component changes first...then spending more if needed and to attain my
target ride height and preferred ride.

everyone else on MBWorld seems to be rolling in dough except me, so i need
to be more cautious in my expenditures.

jimmydagreek

I don't know about everyone "rolling in dough" but I am one of those that is more conscious of where I spend my money instead of just blowing it away.

Anyway, I too have never heard about the double spring pad use before. I think I'm going to go on a hunt for the H&R cupkit. The Doc (Mikey) had this on his previous W210 and I loved the ride. It was a bit less jolting than my H&R/Bilstein set up which I loved anyway.

KLEEMANN discontinued the production of their W210 suspension systems I just found out and that sucks. Some dealers might still have some of the misc. parts like springs and such laying around but their not being produced any longer.

Thanks for the info. guys...

Btw raymond, do you own a spring compressor to remove the front springs? If so is it difficult to do because the rear springs are simple?

CDP

I've had Vogtland springs on both of my W124 and I wouldn't say they are the stiffest springs out there. I would lean more towards H&R's.

Vogtlands are in between Eibach & H&R when it comes to riding/comfort. Which is why they are my favorite company with it comes to springs.

I highly recommend them. Very aggressive drop and great ride quality. You can't beat that!

Air Marshall Eldritch

Jimmy, I put Vogtlands on a year ago. If you make it to Jersey anytime, you can take a drive and feel it firsthand. As Jame55 said, rides on rails. No need to slow down for turns now. Just leave the cruise set and turn the wheel (this move is good for scaring the crap out of unsuspecting passengers).

I do get a lot of CD skipping on rough roads however.

raymond g-

uber and i have combined for a total of a dozen swaps. we have swapped
info and experiences back and forth. each purchased the Klann clone spring
compressor for about $200. it's more tedious but not difficult for basic W210
as long as it's not 4matic.

bottom line is to have.....

- good socket set
- floor jack
- 2 jack stands
- good lighting

count it a 'given' that you'll need to lower the control arm....then thank
the Lord if you dont. (details if needed).

i purchased the spring compressor knowing that this was not a simple install
and voila operation. suspension tuning can be pretty straight forward, but
once you factor in the intangible such as ride comfort, that can be a pretty
gray area (ie individual thresholds). as such, the rental fees would have far
exceeded the cost of the Klann clone.

blah blah blah....i forgot to answer your question: how difficult? front was
actually easier than rear, right, Uber? whereas the front was handled by
releasing sway bar (allowing LCA more downward travel to ease spring in/egress)
the rear may require LCA drop, which adds another 45 mins or so.

pics of what i did up front. Uber gave me the big clue how to handle
the front and then...hah.....it was a breeze.

uberwgn

Indeed. We've swapped swapping stories over and over !!

Yeah, the front is the easy part on the W210 cars...it's also safe compared to the rear end swap.

FWIW, an OE spring broke (at the base) on our '02 wagon...so I was swapping again this past weekend The OE springs require quite a bit less energy to compress. However, I had a weird glitch on both L & R sides when finishing up. For some reason the spring and compressor would c o c k slightly just when I was getting ready to release it from the car. Don't know why. It happened on both sides. It's a real PIA to get those plates and the tool out when that happens

I'm essentially all wrapped up. Gonna fit some thicker pads (#4) to the rear...that should just about level things out or give a slight rake.

jimmydagreek

ray, great write up and now I'm going to look for the spring compressor. If you don't mind in a couple of weeks, I will be hitting you up if/when I get stuck. Thanks man...

raymond g-

hey, j...since you're just down the street, want to rent my spring compressor
for a $1 a day? or are you thinking you need to go back and forth with it for
longer period? i'm not rushing so i can give it up for a month-ish. just sign
a waiver that you'll not sue my *** off if the spring boings you in the head or
sumting....