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W210: Engine stall when engine cold

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W210: Engine stall when engine cold

 
Old 11-12-2007, 02:45 PM
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2001 E320 Wagon
W210: Engine stall when engine cold

2001 E320 Wagon (2WD)

Hello,

When engine is cold, my E320 stalls when putting the vehicle into gear. I am forced to let the engine run for at least 5 minutes before I am able to put the car into gear w/o stalling. The car has just been serviced (spent a small fortune) & I have replaced the MAFS with a new OEM part.

Any ideas what this might be? I've got the car into my mechanic to look at it.

Thank you for any suggestions.
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Old 11-12-2007, 07:04 PM
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300E a couple 1994 w124wagon E320 Wagon/,1971MGB Track/Rally, MG Midget Autocross ,2000 E320 wagon.
Scan for codes

Check all vacuum lines.Check pressure at fuel rails.Check cam sensor.Is it in the shop?They will find it quickly,just a matter of how much they are going to bill you for finding it
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Old 11-14-2007, 04:19 PM
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I just hear back from my mechanic today. They hooked the computer up to it, checked for codes, and didn't find anything. They also checked fuel mixture and vacuum lines; nothing there either. $98 down the drain. They said the next "step" was to replace the MAFS. It's got a brand new one; I doubt it is faulty. I like this car, but I'm seriously thinking it might have to go.
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Old 11-14-2007, 07:42 PM
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Source of MAS...?

Just wondering if the MAS was acquired from a reliable/legitimate source, as there are a lot of "knock-offs" out there [read eBay and other places] that are not the real deal.

Inquiring minds want to know...

JR
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Old 11-15-2007, 12:08 AM
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300E a couple 1994 w124wagon E320 Wagon/,1971MGB Track/Rally, MG Midget Autocross ,2000 E320 wagon.
If they are

a good shop they can test the maf values and tell you if it is the maf by reading voltage from the unit.Sounds like a shop that does not know the workings of the mb system and has been taking you for a ride.01 wagon should not be having so many problems that you are ready to leave the make,they are lovely cars when maintained properly.Get to another indie shop,post a shout out here or on benzworld.org w210 section for shops in your area.This guy is going to throw in a maf instead of scoping the engine for the proper values,he is raping you.
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Old 11-15-2007, 12:57 PM
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Thanks for the input ohlord. I'll be picking up the car today. In regards to the previous question about the MAFS being purchased on ebay, I purchased a Bosch new OEM MAFS from autopartswarehouse.com.
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Old 11-15-2007, 02:16 PM
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300E a couple 1994 w124wagon E320 Wagon/,1971MGB Track/Rally, MG Midget Autocross ,2000 E320 wagon.
next time

get the bosch insert from www.germanstar.net for $127.
Please find a good shop and be happy with the make,like I said great cars when done right and sorted out properly.
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Old 11-17-2007, 01:33 PM
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Definitely not the MAFS

The car is back from the mechanic, with a new OEM MAFS. They haven't charged me for it yet. They asked that I test it for a week. First thing this morning, temp ~30 F, I started the car and put it into gear. It stalled immediately. There are no error codes after this happens. Any ideas on what "I" can look at first?
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Old 11-17-2007, 09:45 PM
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300E a couple 1994 w124wagon E320 Wagon/,1971MGB Track/Rally, MG Midget Autocross ,2000 E320 wagon.
like I said in

post 5 above ,get to another shop they are guessing with a solution.This is the kind of shop that installs new plugs well before 100000 miles,then if that dosent work they put in all new coils then wires then injectors
seen it to many times.......
get away from them
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Old 11-17-2007, 10:18 PM
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Cool Hmmm... Could it be the battery?

The car runs perfect and restarts fine once it has been warmed up. I noticed something interesting when taking the car out to dinner this evening. I had parked in front of a large storefront window. When we came out after dinner, I started the car and put it into gear. It didn't stall, but I did notice RPMs dipped really low and the lights dimmed a bit.

I wonder if this has all been a symptom of the battery going bad. I suppose the next thing to look at might be the alternator, but I would expect this to show up on the diagnostics.

I'm tempted to throw another battery in there just for grins.
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Old 11-19-2007, 01:01 PM
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It's not the battery...

I replaced it this weekend. It still had the original so it was time. My next step is to replace the Temp Coolant Sensor. I have ordered the part, can anyone provide a diagram or picture of where this part is located on the engine. It is my understanding that this is a fairly easy DIY replacement.
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Old 11-29-2007, 09:21 PM
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2002 E320 4Matic Wagon
Stalls when cold (temperature) or stalls after prolonged "off"

Hi Lime,

I recently bought a 2002 E320 4Matic wagon and have on two occasions noticed the same behavior - the car stalls when put in gear. I can't yet say if it's correlated to the colder temperatures or to the fact that the car had been not run for days (I was on travel for a week). The car starts fine and idles okay in park or in neutral. I've observed start idle ~1000RPM and can exceed that if I step on the gas - basically saying there appears to be no hard ceiling. In my most recent case I had to wait almost 8 minutes before successfully moving (at engine temp indicator around 60DegC). When I use the car daily I don't see this problem.

A call to my mechanic warned of potential for a stuck throttle actuator - a pricey part I'm told. As I'm <60 days from purchase, I'll be taking it back to the dealer to get their opinion. Will keep you posted.

Last edited by ri_bedrock; 11-29-2007 at 09:24 PM.
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Old 11-30-2007, 10:21 PM
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ri_bedrock,

Thank you for the feedback. I'm looking forward to what your mechanic has to say. I replaced the Coolant Temp Sensor this afternoon. I'm anxious to try it out in the morning.

Update:

New Coolant Temp Sensor DID NOT solve the problem. Arrrrrg!!!

-Lime

Last edited by LIME; 12-01-2007 at 11:34 AM.
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Old 12-02-2007, 11:08 PM
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2002 E320 4Matic Wagon
Temp not Time

It happened again - car stalled when placed in reverse. I'm confident now it's temperature related not time as this occurrence happened only 24 hours after a previous drive but during a cold (< 32 degrees) overnight/day. As before, I had to wait ~8 minutes or the engine temp to reach 60C before it wouldn't stall. Guess I'll just have to allow time for warm up. I'll be taking it to the mechanic later this week when they can get me a loaner car.
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Old 12-03-2007, 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted by ri_bedrock View Post
It happened again - car stalled when placed in reverse. I'm confident now it's temperature related not time as this occurrence happened only 24 hours after a previous drive but during a cold (< 32 degrees) overnight/day. As before, I had to wait ~8 minutes or the engine temp to reach 60C before it wouldn't stall. Guess I'll just have to allow time for warm up. I'll be taking it to the mechanic later this week when they can get me a loaner car.
Well... mine is going into the dealer tomorrow to have a look at it. In the past, I've had the car serviced by an independent Mercedes mechanic. I will post the results.
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Old 12-04-2007, 11:00 PM
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Crank Sensor

Well I never made it through the week waiting for the loaner car. Instead of bringing the car to the dealer for the stall problem when cold as anticipated, I ran into another - the car would not start when warm!

Symptoms: After a 40 minute drive I attempted to start the car and it click-click-clicked but wouldn't turn over. After a 15 minute wait it did but with a (new) yellow 'check engine' light. My local mechanic diagnosed the code as faulty crank sensor and replaced the part. Thankfully, the out of state dealer whom I had bought the car from 3 weeks earlier okayed the service and is re-imbursing me the $200 for parts/installation. The car is working fine now...albeit only 6 hours post-repair.

I found similar behavior/remedy on another thread: http://cardealerforums.com/alt-auto-...nk-sensor.html

The mechanic mentioned this *might* address my cold stall problem as well. Time will tell. Fingers crossed.
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Old 12-04-2007, 11:28 PM
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300E a couple 1994 w124wagon E320 Wagon/,1971MGB Track/Rally, MG Midget Autocross ,2000 E320 wagon.
diy

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w210...ghlight=sensor
70 bucks or so ,car stalls or when stopped hot does not start and will start after cooled for 20 minutes.easy diy
the cold stall may be related but most times it is the cam sensor that is bad or the coolant temp sensor.
Both of you keep us posted,odd set of symptoms
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Old 12-09-2007, 10:54 PM
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2002 E320 4Matic Wagon
Still Stalling

Alas, while the new CPS has resolved my 'non-start when warm' problem, my 'stall when cold' issue persists. It only seems to happen once per day - at 1st start in the morning. Same behavior: starts/idles fine until I put it in drive or reverse then the RPM dips to ~500rpm and it cuts out. It won't remain running in 'D' or 'R' unless engine temp >= 60degC.

Going to contact the dealer tomorrow.

Lime . . . any luck on your vehicle?
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Old 12-10-2007, 12:08 AM
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Check ohms at coolant temp sensor,

cold start problem,Also that cam sensor another culprit.
Those no code problems can be tough to track down.
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Old 12-10-2007, 09:58 AM
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Waiting for a cold morning....

The car is back from the shop. My mechanic de-carbonized the intake. His theory is that the butterfly may be getting stuck open/closed when the vehicle is cold. The car has not shown any symptoms the last couple of days, but we have not had any cold mornings below 50. I will keep all posted.

BTW... I have already replaced the Coolant Temp Sensor. It's an east DIY, just be careful not to drop the retaining pin... took me 10 min to find it
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Old 01-02-2008, 05:39 PM
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Update...

Car still stalls when cold after sitting overnight. I have to let it warm up for about 10 minutes. Outside temp is ~30F. It appears to only happen under 2 conditions: 1) Car has been sitting for overnight + 2) Outside temp is below 50F.
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Old 01-02-2008, 10:47 PM
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Ditto

Mine too continues to require ~10 mins of warmup essentially for the identical reasons you describe. I live in RI and the weather is consistently below 50 deg all day yet only after an overnight of ~10-12 hours do I have a problem. If I let it sit outside all workday in the cold, it starts and goes into drive/reverse no problem. Don't know what the remedy is Lime, you've tried more attempted fixes than I have. Even though I supposed to have a 60 day initial warranty, my dealer is dragging their feet. When the extended warranty I purchased kicks in after expiration of that 60 days, I'll likely leave the car with my local (aka trusted) mechanic during my next business trip.
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Old 01-30-2008, 01:34 PM
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I've got almost the exact same symptons. Once I get it rolling in gear, no problems all day. I've found if I park facing down hill to let it roll a little and goose it a little bit while engaging drive, it will stumble but not stall. Once engaged, I can stop immediately and she idles in drive like a champ. Is it possible the transmission is at fault? Any particular vacuum lines or sensors I should check?

Local independent service tech tried a new MAS, didn't help. No error codes. He thought it might be the throttle actuator, but that is a very expensive part - $1K or so for a rebuilt. And it's not something you can "try" and take off if it doesn't fix. He recommended I take it to the dealer and have them run diagnostics with their system, which apparently can gather more info than he can. I suppose this means they can tell if it's the TA or not. He thought a diagnostic charge at the dealer would run around $100.

Any counsel?
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Old 04-20-2008, 01:09 PM
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Has anyone notice a different behavior when the car is in "W" or "S"? With the warmer temps, a resent B service and engaging drive or reverse while in "S" I haven't seen my stall problem. I understand "W" makes the car start off in 2nd gear. I had ignorantly left "W" selected all winter. Other than that, no identifyable cause/fix for my cold stall (it remained a problem all winter).
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Old 12-03-2008, 06:03 PM
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Cooler temps are back - stalling back.

Lime - did you ever get yours resolved?
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