moayes

E320 - 1998 - 70k mileage - Dealer maintained.
Few weeks ago I started noticing a weak groaning sound from the sterring wheel - well, you can notice it at low speed - under 20 mph and if it's very quite, however, you can notice a feeling of rubbing under your palms on the wheel. No leak, no thing else.
And since few days ago I notice a funny smell whenever I turn off the engine and get off. It goes away in few second. I don't know where it comes from - nothing under the hood, not from the exhaust or back part, not from front wheels. But it can be smelled only on the driver side.
It smells like burning oil. No other sign.

Any idea? How serious can it be?

Thanks in advance for your replies.

ohlord

power steering.
You need to clean the engine and examine for leaks both topside and remove the belly pan and examine the underside.
If you diy great ,if you are still going to the dealer,don't.
Have a good indie shop inspect it if you don't do your own work on the car.

moayes

I checked it again. No leak - neither on top, neither on the bottom.
However, the engine oil lever (the wire thing with a red-orange plastic at the end), shows there is almost half - a little bit lower than half - engine oil.
Shouldn't be that low!!! right? That last oil change was 5-6 month ago.
I ran the engine - without driving - for about 10 minutes. Couldn't smell it again.. no smell ... I wonder may it's the gearbox oil leaking, so I wasn't driving, mean the gearbox oil didn't leak - while on the other hand - when I drive, the gearbox oil leaks, hit the hot surface and burns, causing the smell.

Still, I wonder why would the engine oil be so low - almost half, after 6 month, and 7,000 mile driving.

Bottom-line : I guess, I have to take it to the dealer. Any idea what would be wrong? How much would it cost?

RichardM98

Hi and Welcome to the forum -

The measuring portion of the dipstick -- the red plastic tip with marks only measures about 2 liters near the top of the oil level in the oil pan. Your engine holds about 8 liters so you are not down 1/2 (4 liters) but about 1/8 (1 liter). If you were down 4 liters you would have been getting low oil warning messages on the instrument cluster for some time. I suspect many E320 V6's are down a liter after 7K miles.

As already suggested it is probably a oil, PS fluid or transmission fluid leak which is dripping on a hot exhaust pipe which results in some smoke and smell. Pretty common.

If you're not inclined to look yourself then a good independent MB mechanic will be cheaper than the dealer. The cost of repair can be as simple as tightening a couple of bolts on the valve cover to replacing an engine or transmission seal. You really can't say until you determine what's causing the leak. Since the PS was mentioned you should check that level. There is a dipstick built into the cap on the reservoir. It is on the opposite of the engine as the oil dipstick in about the same place. There is also a large tube running across the car called the steering rack. It is what actually turns the wheels in response to turning the steering wheel. It can develop a leak also.

Good luck and post if you have more questions.

ohlord

going to the dealer.
and why are you not checking your oil at least every other gas tank full?

sensors fail,engines use oil,don't depend on sensors look at your own oil level,check your brake fluid,look at your belt,be one with the machine
You look out for it ,it looks out for you
Far less costly than going to the shop

moayes

Thanks guys for your comments.
I haven't had a chance since yesterday to look at it again. I'll check the PS fluid ASAP. However, starting today, I can smell it in the cabine after 15-20 minutes of driving inter-city @ 20-30 mph.

moayes

Guys,
Here is the fact: I don't have necessary tools and appropriate space to break down the car and change anything myself - wish I had, though - if that's the case. So I have to take the car to a mechanic. However, out of my enthusiasm I would like to know what's going on.

So, here is my new update: remember that I said, it might be trans oil leakage, since without driving the car, there is no smell!!! I was checking the web and found out the trans oil has to be changed every 100k under normal condition. Well, this car has 70k, and has been bought in NY, taken to Florida for some time and back to NY. Does it make sense to change the trans oil by now? And does it make sense to ask for a check/change of all - engine, PS and trans - together if I take the car to the dealer today?!!?

RichardM98

OK, fasten your chin strap! When these cars were new, MB declared that the transmissions were 'sealed for life'. Meaning that transmission fluid changes were not needed. They eliminated the transmission dipstick and sealed the tube with a tamper resistant cap.

Over time there has been much debate about whether this is a good idea. Proponents of changing the fluid vary in recommending anything from every 30K to 100K or more. For some reason people get pretty emotional about this issue.

BTW, the leak/smoke/smell is an issue unrelated to changing the fluids/filters.

For service cycles you should use the FSS built into your car. After performing a Schedule A service the technician should reset the FSS to 10K miles. It will then count down and adjust itself to your driving style. It will display a message when you are close to needing service. Which will now be Schedule B (Schedule A + other). This is explained in a booklet with your owners manual titled Maintenance Booklet. If you don't get this work done at the dealer or qualified MB independent then make sure they use a MB approved oil (Spec. 229.3 or 229.5) and a fleece (polyester) media filter. Unless you use the specific oil and filter do not rely on FSS or you may develop sludge in the engine.

Transmission and PS service is not covered by FSS or the Maintenance Booklet. Ultimately, its a risk-benefit decision. Some people are more comfortable with waiting and some are nervous. As far as the transmission goes it can't hurt to change it every 100K but in my opinion changing it every 30K is over doing it. And I'm positive some will disagree with that.

Good luck.

moayes

Thanks! what a comprehensive explanation. I liked it.
About the oil change issue, my real point was: as you know, dealers charge often times ridiculously. I was wondering if it is good idea - or does it make sense - when I take the car for repair - as it seems, it needs to be repair, can't be left un-noticed - I ask also to change the oil, since it has been 6 month from its last change, it's a liter short, and has run 7k so far.

Or you may say that it is not a big deal and I can run with it as it is for next 3K and when I take it for oil change, do the repair too. However, I should say that these days I am not running much with it - about 300 miles a month!!! - I live close to work! So... that means 10 month from now!!!!!!!!!!

RichardM98

The minimums on the oil change are 1 year or 10K whichever comes first so with at 300 mpm that would be 1 year. Dealers prices tend to be the highest but in large metro areas where there is competition they sometimes use it as a 'lost leader' to get you in for a inspection. You just have to be determined and say no unless it sounds serious. Those oil changes are often less than $100.

When you live that close to work its a good idea to make sure you drive until the engine reaches it full operating temp. Usually a little above 80C on the gauge. That way any moisture sucked in during the last cool down will be evaporated. If I have to make a short trip I try to drive the 'long' way to accomplish that.

BTW, you're asking the right questions and that's half the battle. Good luck.

moayes

Well I took the car to the dealer but they didn't have time to put me in. So I have to make an appointment for a later time.
Now, at this point, I would be very happy if someone can tell me, with assuming that the smell is due to trans oil leakage, and the groaning noise for a malfunctioing part, does it require "very" special tools to do it? or any mechanic has the "right" tools and can do it?

The reason I'm asking it is, for alinging MB wheels, I took the car to some mufflers and they didn't have "right" tools to aling Mercedes. Andthey warned me it is better to take it to the dealer, because using wrong tools causes more damages.

Does anybosy have any idea whether fixing the trans oil leakage and fixing the groaning noise of PS requries such "special" tools- that only "authorized" MB mechanics (incl. dealers) have it?

Thanks

210fan

As for the growning noise in the steering wheel (and no where else), it is a very common comp. on the 210s. It is usualy to lubricate the boot at the base of the steering column at the fire wall on the interior side, or a seal inside the steering rack. The cost and labor to rebuild the rack and replace the seal or have a rebuilt one installed is about the same. I would go with the rebuilt one.

If you think you have a trans leak. The most common leak is the pilot bushing on the front right corner of the trans cheap to fix( <$200) or the shift detent seals at the back left corner of the trans.(expensive >$300)
Hope this helps

RichardM98

Yes, I had forgot. There is an issue (and a special MB fix) for the steering column boot making a noise. IIRC, the repair is made on the engine side of the firewall.

As for the alignment. Use the dealer. Your car requires that all 4 wheels be aligned at one time. Very few 3rd party alignment shops have the correct tools to do it right. Besides do you want it done by someone who does 2 a year or someone who does 4 a day? I had mine done at the local dealer last year for $169 with about 1 1/2hrs wait. Car tracks straight as an arrow! And I enjoyed the pastries, good coffee and free wash.

But I think you have a fluid (engine oil, PS fluid, trans fluid,?) leaking and dripping onto a hot surface. It then evaporates producing an odor. Unfortunately, there's not much money in finding a leak. And it's difficult because the origin and where it hits the ground is often a long distance as it runs along hoses, etc. But as the last poster pointed out, there are common leaks in older W210's so that's the place to start. Once the source of the leak is identified, any competent MB mechanic (independent) can make the necessary repairs.

To save money on maintaining your car, find a good independent MB mechanic. If he's honest he'll tell you when to go to the dealer and when he can take care of you.

moayes

Thank you all for your comments and time.
Although I would like to go to a honest, independent MB mechanic, I looked for and couldn't find. As you said, there is big difference between working on MB 2x a year or 4x a day. But where I live, Albany, NY, there is only and only one MB mechanic / dealer within reasonable distabnce to go to. Honestly, they haven't done anything wrong or dishonest so far; but dealer are somehow pricier and MB is expensice itself - no complain - this is the car I love and it's the price I am OK to pay to ride this car.
Anyway, I eventually took it to the dealer. This is what happened: they didn't find any leakage, but it seamed that something like a plastic bag was probably stuck to the exhaust pipe - now it's been all burnt up and the smell is gone!!! ..... oh well...
And regarding the PS, I was told the same thing as some you mentioned, the noise may go by lubricating the steering column, however, it is not a serious issue; if it persists and gets worse it is recommended to replace bearings[? : I don't remember exactly what was the name of the part]. The bottom line, the PS is fine for now.

And about the alignment, I took the car for alignment about 6 month ago to the dealer; I don't think it needs alignment by now. In this period of time, I changed tires - not at the dealer - and the muffler offered free alignment. I told him about the special tools required for MB alignment; he didn't agree with me at first, but after changing tires and looking for himself he agreed and didn't touch it.

Well, that's it for now.
Thank you all.... enjoy driving your MB.. it's a fun car

RichardM98

BTW, this is why I thought you had a question about alignment.

Glad everything worked out.

saintz

Here's a mechanic near you: http://www.mikesmercedes.com/ 349 Anthony Street, Schenectady, NY‎ - (518) 377-2268‎

I don't know him in any way and I just found him on a google search. But just looking at his webpage, I would take my car and talk things over with him before I would go to a Mercedes dealer.

Generally everything you've mentioned (power steering work, transmission fluid/leak) can be done by your average joe using basic tools. The only Mercedes specific things needed are Mercedes approved oil and a simple $30 dipstick for checking the transmission oil. While electrical issues on a Benz can require expensive tools to diagnose, most work is mechanical or service related and can be done with standard tools.

Here's a story of my local dealer which sells and services Mercedes, Porsche, Maserati... you would think they would be a good, high end dealer. I've seen half million dollar Mercedes SLRs up on the lifts in the service bay. I had a problem with an error code, so I called the dealer and the service writer said they didn't know how to fix it. I printed out instructions (from this forum) and brought it in. The service writer said that even with step by step directions they couldn't guarantee they could fix the problem, but they would still charge me $120 regardless if they fixed it or not. I feel bad for the guy getting his half million dollar SLR worked on. This is why I would try to avoid dealers, regardless of how fancy they look, unless you personally know the staff there.

And yes, you should change your transmission filter and fluid if you plan on keeping the car for more than a year.

moayes

This is great!! I'll definitely give it a try, and thanks for your comments. Yes, I'm gonna keep this car at least for next few years.