PUZZ1

With the new $3400 tax deduction combined with the increased fuel economy, would anyone consider a trade down from an '04 e500 to an '06 CDI?

cdiken

You mean trade up! OK a biased opinion.

You'll have more torque!

Unortunately, the bath you take on the 500 could buy a lot of fuel even after the tax break.

Consider Euro delivery to lower cost.

Also, don't forget your state sales tax if you have that on cars.

chenry

diesel is selling for more than premium (only 91 here in CA)...is that the case everywhere else?

BudC

I went to the Department of Energy's web site to check out the new energy bill and I don't know where they got that $3,400 from.

From what I can tell, it depends on how much your new vehicle (diesel or hybrid) improves on economy and I also get the impression it depends on how many miles you drive. I'd be interested in a new staged turbo V6 but I would make sure I knew just how the energy bill worked before I used that as a reason to change cars.

kort677

are you sure about that deduction? please tell me about it

rjm

Regular gas is $2.39.....Diesel is $3.19 in this area. That pretty much negates any advantage of the diesel in terms of fuel economy. It is predicted that gasoline will continue to drop to about the $2.00 level while the price of diesel will continue to stay high. Don't know why...that is just what our local automotive talk show expert is saying.

kort677

find another diesel station, right now diesel prices should be equal to premium

CE750

here in AZ, and the rest of the sane world.. it's about the price of regular 87 octane.

I would not call the E320 CDI a trade up.. as the interior of the E500 has the full leather, and the air suspension among other nice standard items.. but I will also say that I came in the the intention of buying an E500, as the only other car I liked at that time was the Audi A6 V8.. I never gave the diesel a thought..

The salesman told me that we could just drive it for fun... I was floored.. It was marginally slower than the E500, but got 37mpg on cheaper fuel? SOLD.

Now if you could find a CDI with full leather, and airmatic suspension, 17" wheels, Brembo front Brakes, I would suspect it would come close to the full price of the E500.. Diesel engines are said to be more expensive to make, which is why I am thinking MB went on the cheap with the rest of the car... to keep the price in the E350 range..

Had MB given the CDI, E500 trip, it would sell well north of $60,000 with standard options.

I added the 17" wheels, Xenon/LED lights, and a few after purchase OEM options that are hard to find on the CDI and love it.

If I had to do it again, I would special order a car with all of those items from Germany for a Euro delivery.

But hurry.. I don't think the '07 V6 aluminum engine will be half as durable and trouble free as the venerable I-6.

CE750

I believe it's a tax credit, not a deduction.. of UP TO $3400

CE750

Error, sorry wrong reply button.

CE750

I have one word for that: Usury

Diesel is $2.89/gal here as is Regular 87 octane.

That said, 30-35% better milage will allow it to soar to $4.20/gal and still break even for me.. not factoring in the FAR LESS costly maintenance schedule which doesn't require a tune-up, etc..

MB Fanatic

I say keep the E500. You will take a bath on trading in the E500 for a CDI right now anyways. So where is the cost difference?

klenbore

IMO it would be a down grade. I test drove a CDI this weekend last when my E500 was in for service. It was not appointed as well as the 500. As far as performance, impressive for and oil burner, inferior to the 500. Just my experience though. Price of fuel in my neck of the woods, Premium $2.88, Diesel $3.19.

CE750

Upgrade/Downgrade or otherwise... you'll loose a lot on your trade in.. I got lucky and discovered the CDI by accident before I dropped $58K on a 500, but I did it for practical reasons more than because the CDI appealed to me more (looks wise).

Performance wise, the 0-60 on the E500 is 5.9, and the CDI is 6.6... not worlds apart.. but nevertheless the E500 is notably quicker.

Resale value wise, there is no Mercedes Benz with a better residual out today than the CDI.. AMG, or otherwise..

saffrontiger

Would that be Ed Wallace because that man knows his stuff. Love hius show "Wheels".

rjm

Just quoting the prices for the past 48 hours in the Dallas-Ft. Worth area of North Texas:

Regular ranges from $2.36 - $2.47
Diesel ranges from $3.16 - $3.49

http://www.fortworthgasprices.com/in...s&tme_limit=48

As I said, that pretty much negates ANY advantage of the diesel...and regular gasoline prices are still dropping while diesel remains high. And anyone who thinks their diesel will outlast a gasoline engine is dreaming....that is NOT a Cumins Diesel you have in your Mercedes. According to my MB Service Writer, maintenance costs will be CONSIDERABLY higher on the diesel than on the gasoline engine. Even the A and B Service visits are about 30% higher at my MB dealership. The initial excitement of 37 MPG might result in a big disappointment down the road. I'll stick with gasoline.

rjm

Yes it is...and he knows his stuff. He is on KVIL (570 AM) every Saturday from 9 AM to 1 PM. Wouldn't miss it. He has had some interesting comments on Mercedes quality that have been right on the money.

CE750

The MB Diesel is as robust or more than a Cumins.. many a 300D is still driving on the road with 500,000 miles on the original engine.. Some are still selling for $5000+ if well maintained and low miles.. so you can dream on.. the NADA Residuals on the CDI tell the whole tail.. are you going to debate with NADA?

As for maintenance costs: over the next 5 years, my CDI will cost $1600 in scheduled maintenance, or $1200 less than a E350, so tell your dealer to drop the crack-pipe and re-check his prices.. (Schumacher is not a cheap place, and they're telling me $289 for a B and $199 for an A)

As for diesel prices... Diesel is ALWAYS more expensive in winter due to the demand on Heating Oil out of the *** backwards east where they heat their houses with ancient technology.. This places a high demand on refineries as they switch production for heating oil..

Your radio friend is looking at the short term... Diesel is far cheaper to refine, and contains no mandated additives, so it's a lot cheaper.. if a Gas station is charging more, it's because the local demand is low..

If you have Regular at: 2.47 gal out there.. then we can safely assume super is 2.67/gal.. if diesel is indeed 3.19, that still makes a LOT of savings.. Diesel would have to sell for 3.55/gal to break-even with gas in YOUR MARKET.. in mine, it's a no brainer! $2.89 for Shell Diesel just yesterday... while Super was at $3.29

FlintCDI

I'll throw my .02 in.

The CDI is NOT a Cummins. Is it a solid platform for a high mileage engine? Yes. Is it capable of running half a million miles. Yes, but without the rest of the car around it. The complexity in these cars, the VGT, HPCR, and all the technology will be the limiting factor for the endurance; with the extra components there is a higher propensity for catastrophic failure. These cars are not the bulletproof, mechanical pump-driven diesel of the past decades. I'm not sure if MB has produced diesels for the OTR trucks overseas, but the CDI and ANY Cummins in anything are APPLES and ORANGES.

Those Cummins drag 18,000# for 500K. It's a purebred workhorse!

Now, if someone could find a way to shoehorn a 5.9L CTD into a w211…600hp / 900ft/lbs in a 3900 lb car

klenbore

May I kindly chime in here. My first Mercedes was a 1984 190D 2.2. I put 120K miles on it and sold in 1991 to the Game Warden in Red Lodge, Montana. We keep in touch, and last I talked to him, about 6 months ago, the little 190 had over 270K miles on it and still the only major engine repair was a valve job. Red Lodge is not a mild climate during the winter months. 5900' elevation, average low temp from January to April is 10˚F and average snowfall 11 inches per month for the same period. Quite a testimony for that little 190 2.2 diesel!

BudC

Some time back the Mercedes Club had a High Mileage contest. Someone in Ohio had two 190D 2.2's. One had over 300K and one was approaching 500K.

Our 190D was 17 years old when we sold it in 2001. I suspect it's still trucking along.

All we ever did was replace the voltage regulator (pre-mature brush wear) and glow plugs.

Of course CDI's are far more complicated and are not likely to last the way the old ones did. The 190D had a cast iron block with steel cylinder liners and valve seats.

klenbore

...............and the body was built like a Sherman Tank!!!

BudC

And REAL MB-TEX

konigstiger

Well that’s not saying much because the only thing the Sherman had going for it was sheer numbers. Did you know the tank was so poorly planned that they installed an aircraft engine in it that’s why the body sat so high? …Konigstiger baby, built like a Konigstiger (King Tiger) hence my tag name.

klenbore

And don't forget the state-of-the-art becker radio!