Tires cupping on 2005 E500
03-06-2007, 10:06 AM
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Tires cupping on 2005 E500
Has anyone successfully used the Michelin warranty to get tires replaced (or at least offset the cost) for when your tires cup?
I have about 18k miles on my car and the tires are cupped bad but tread depth on the rest of the tire(s) is good.
Dealer says it's normal for these cars to do that.
My car has the appearance package.
I have about 18k miles on my car and the tires are cupped bad but tread depth on the rest of the tire(s) is good.
Dealer says it's normal for these cars to do that.
My car has the appearance package.
03-06-2007, 11:15 AM
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03 E500 and Corvette
1)
Has anyone successfully used the Michelin warranty to get tires replaced (or at least offset the cost) for when your tires cup?
I have about 18k miles on my car and the tires are cupped bad but tread depth on the rest of the tire(s) is good.
2) Dealer says it's normal for these cars to do that.
My car has the appearance package.
Has anyone successfully used the Michelin warranty to get tires replaced (or at least offset the cost) for when your tires cup?
I have about 18k miles on my car and the tires are cupped bad but tread depth on the rest of the tire(s) is good.
2) Dealer says it's normal for these cars to do that.
My car has the appearance package.
Answer 2 NO
Tire companies won't warranty uneven wear from alignment.
It is not normal for cupping on an E500. Mine doesn't cup anymore.
It did when new and I also lost the first set of tires due to cupping. I wrote extensively on this board on the solution. The Mercedes is setting the alignment for 150 mph high speed driving. My guess is you don't approach this. I had to find an independant dealer (Firestone) that would work with me on the alignment. We had to buy from "Mercedes" special bolts for the front end that they sell to correct this problem. UMHHH wonder why they make them if they know this is an issue.. why not just install them on every new car.
.Basically you have too much toe in and too much negative camber. Do a search in the tech section on cupping and you will find the numbers.
Jim
03-06-2007, 11:29 AM
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So what your saying basically it's MB's fault my tires are cupped.
I drive the car regularly at 80-95 MPH for about 38 miles each time I leave.
Also, Michelin is going to say the vehicle's alignment must be out of spec for the tires to cup and MB is going to say the alignment is within MB spec.
If so.. that's plain BS.
You mentioned it's not common for the tires to cup, but also said yours did.
The tech at the dealership said 95% of the E's like mine he sees come in with 15K or more miles on them have cupped front tires.
I've had this car in 4 times now for vibration in steering wheel, harsh upshifts/downshifts and other stuff. Always "Normal". After I really *****ed about the tranny, they changed out some clip, but said there was nothing wrong with it. Seems to shift identical as it did before.
Maybe it's lemon law time for it.
I drive the car regularly at 80-95 MPH for about 38 miles each time I leave.
Also, Michelin is going to say the vehicle's alignment must be out of spec for the tires to cup and MB is going to say the alignment is within MB spec.
If so.. that's plain BS.
You mentioned it's not common for the tires to cup, but also said yours did.
The tech at the dealership said 95% of the E's like mine he sees come in with 15K or more miles on them have cupped front tires.
I've had this car in 4 times now for vibration in steering wheel, harsh upshifts/downshifts and other stuff. Always "Normal". After I really *****ed about the tranny, they changed out some clip, but said there was nothing wrong with it. Seems to shift identical as it did before.
Maybe it's lemon law time for it.
03-06-2007, 01:17 PM
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'05 E500
Michelin Warranty
When my front tire had a nail in it that was close enough to the side wall, Discount Tires couldn't/wouldn't repair it. But, they did get Michelin to pay for half of it. I know it's not directly related to your question, but maybe Discount Tires can do something for you.
03-06-2007, 03:27 PM
#5
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So what your saying basically it's MB's fault my tires are cupped.
I drive the car regularly at 80-95 MPH for about 38 miles each time I leave.
Also, Michelin is going to say the vehicle's alignment must be out of spec for the tires to cup and MB is going to say the alignment is within MB spec.
If so.. that's plain BS.
You mentioned it's not common for the tires to cup, but also said yours did.
The tech at the dealership said 95% of the E's like mine he sees come in with 15K or more miles on them have cupped front tires.
I've had this car in 4 times now for vibration in steering wheel, harsh upshifts/downshifts and other stuff. Always "Normal". After I really *****ed about the tranny, they changed out some clip, but said there was nothing wrong with it. Seems to shift identical as it did before.
Maybe it's lemon law time for it.
I drive the car regularly at 80-95 MPH for about 38 miles each time I leave.
Also, Michelin is going to say the vehicle's alignment must be out of spec for the tires to cup and MB is going to say the alignment is within MB spec.
If so.. that's plain BS.
You mentioned it's not common for the tires to cup, but also said yours did.
The tech at the dealership said 95% of the E's like mine he sees come in with 15K or more miles on them have cupped front tires.
I've had this car in 4 times now for vibration in steering wheel, harsh upshifts/downshifts and other stuff. Always "Normal". After I really *****ed about the tranny, they changed out some clip, but said there was nothing wrong with it. Seems to shift identical as it did before.
Maybe it's lemon law time for it.
You should be more specific about what you mean when you say cupped. That term gets thrown around a lot with tire shops and allignment guys but many have no idea what they are talking about.
I have had 4 W211's and none were cuped in the true sense of the word. All of them and premature wear on the outer trad blocks due to driving style, tire designs, and allignment specs.
MB does have a good amount of toe in the car stock. Toe in and more caster make for a very stable car at speed and this is why these cars have a very solid feel at speed.
I have an E55k that I have alligned for performance driving and I will say its no where near as stable at high speed as it used to be. I left the caster alone but added a bunch of negative camber and took out most of the toe. I run around 2 degrees negative camber and about 1/32nd or less toe in per side. When I took the toe out of the car it suddenly because a hand full under full throttle and it may wonder more over 100 but thats expected. I wanted it to turn, grip and not kill the outer tread blocks if I attack on-ramps the way they were designed to be driven! The car drives FAR better than before but its still a 4000 lb car.
So if you want to make the tires wear very evenly for very straight driving you dont need much negative camber and you will want to keep a decent amount of toe in the car.
Factory spec really is there for even tire wear on a OEM non AMG W211. I cant imagine putting less negative camber in the car but that is my take. They do spend a good deal of time getting the settings right for the car at teh factory so unless you want to drive HARDER I would go with OEM since they know pretty well what the average W211 driver is looking for and you seem like a pretty average W211 driver -- not to fast around corners, enjoys a decent fast blast on the open road and wants a stable car. So if that is you go for OEM settings. Get the cars allignment checked but dont do any adjustment until you get some new tires. It will first make the wheel off center AND it will be useless for tire wear since once the wear pattern starts you cant really reverse it.
Which tires to you have? Are they H rated or W rated tires? I know the H rated Michelin tires are MXM4's or Pilot HX tires and some of the cars came with W rated Pilot Primacy tires as well. The Primacy tires dont last long and around 18k - 25k miles they are due for replacement. The MXM4 tires could last up to 30k of easy driving.
So as it goes check the allignment on the car but dont go off changing the specs for less negative camber unless you really never enjoy a corner at ALL. Having less camber up front will quickly cause outside tread block wear. I know from having seen many MB's that were camber challenged have tires bald on the corners and new everywhere else. W203's suffer from this problem even when driven by little old Grandma.
Good luck
03-06-2007, 07:02 PM
#7
Very true. I see cupping as a term that is seen most with the rear tires on a front wheel drive cars. What you may have is a feather or scrubing of the front tires. Scrubing is more from taking turns really fast. While feathering is from a incorrect toe condition. Is the ride height changed on this car because that by itself will change the toe settings as well as other settings if done to a extreme.
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03-06-2007, 07:47 PM
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If you run your hand along the tire, you can feel a scalloped or oscillating wear pattern to the tread. VERY noticeable.
End result is a howling and woomp woomp woomp and vibration in the steering and the car when driving it. Starts as soon as the car reaches about 2MPH (yes two MPH) and you can both feel and hear it). Get it up to 80 MPH and it sounds like a wheel is going to fall off. My wife refuses to drive the car.
Yes I have the Pilot Primacy's.
I normally drive with the car in Sport 2 (wish there was a sport 5) unless the roads are bumpy then I go to Comfort.
I don't beat on the car as it's really not fast enough for me to beat on.. I have other cars for that.
I flog the living hell out of the CTS-V and it has more miles on it and zero issues with tires.. so what gives?
These tires are not worn to where the tread depth says it's time to replace them.. far from it. There is probably less than 20% wear from new tire tread depth.
There is just something wrong somewhere that has caused them to cup, scallop,feather, whatever you want to call it and so far everyone has said (to a point) it's normal. It's a defect weather that's MB's alignment specs, using the cars air suspension or who knows.
I did a search.. sure is alot of others with the same problem.. wonder why?
End result is a howling and woomp woomp woomp and vibration in the steering and the car when driving it. Starts as soon as the car reaches about 2MPH (yes two MPH) and you can both feel and hear it). Get it up to 80 MPH and it sounds like a wheel is going to fall off. My wife refuses to drive the car.
Yes I have the Pilot Primacy's.
I normally drive with the car in Sport 2 (wish there was a sport 5) unless the roads are bumpy then I go to Comfort.
I don't beat on the car as it's really not fast enough for me to beat on.. I have other cars for that.
I flog the living hell out of the CTS-V and it has more miles on it and zero issues with tires.. so what gives?
These tires are not worn to where the tread depth says it's time to replace them.. far from it. There is probably less than 20% wear from new tire tread depth.
There is just something wrong somewhere that has caused them to cup, scallop,feather, whatever you want to call it and so far everyone has said (to a point) it's normal. It's a defect weather that's MB's alignment specs, using the cars air suspension or who knows.
I did a search.. sure is alot of others with the same problem.. wonder why?
03-06-2007, 08:35 PM
#9
I know the condition you are talking about. I notice certain tires also tend not to feather as easily. The Continentals I had wanted to do that but after I put the PS2 they stopped but wear fast.
Put the tires on the rear and do a nice smokey burnout or until the feather goes away!
Actually I don't know if that will work.
I can't really add any more info as Mercedes only will warranty your alignment for so long and you are way past that point. I’ve worked at a dealership as a shop foreman for 14 years and can count on one hand how many times we replaced tires for a customers in that time for tire wear. Those times were for unusual circumstances where there was a valid complaint, had very little mileage on their cars, and the customers complained to the point we just wanted them to leave. Even then we had a hard time getting the manufacter to pay for the tires. We just gave the customer some take offs from a new car to make things happen.
See if you can complain to the DSM, sometimes that will work. But you need to be good at whinning as thats all DSMs hear all the time. The ones that cause the most stink and stand out get help.
Put the tires on the rear and do a nice smokey burnout or until the feather goes away!
Actually I don't know if that will work.
I can't really add any more info as Mercedes only will warranty your alignment for so long and you are way past that point. I’ve worked at a dealership as a shop foreman for 14 years and can count on one hand how many times we replaced tires for a customers in that time for tire wear. Those times were for unusual circumstances where there was a valid complaint, had very little mileage on their cars, and the customers complained to the point we just wanted them to leave. Even then we had a hard time getting the manufacter to pay for the tires. We just gave the customer some take offs from a new car to make things happen.
See if you can complain to the DSM, sometimes that will work. But you need to be good at whinning as thats all DSMs hear all the time. The ones that cause the most stink and stand out get help.
Last edited by health services; 03-06-2007 at 08:38 PM.
03-07-2007, 02:49 AM
#10
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If you run your hand along the tire, you can feel a scalloped or oscillating wear pattern to the tread. VERY noticeable.
End result is a howling and woomp woomp woomp and vibration in the steering and the car when driving it. Starts as soon as the car reaches about 2MPH (yes two MPH) and you can both feel and hear it). Get it up to 80 MPH and it sounds like a wheel is going to fall off. My wife refuses to drive the car.
Yes I have the Pilot Primacy's.
I normally drive with the car in Sport 2 (wish there was a sport 5) unless the roads are bumpy then I go to Comfort.
I don't beat on the car as it's really not fast enough for me to beat on.. I have other cars for that.
I flog the living hell out of the CTS-V and it has more miles on it and zero issues with tires.. so what gives?
These tires are not worn to where the tread depth says it's time to replace them.. far from it. There is probably less than 20% wear from new tire tread depth.
There is just something wrong somewhere that has caused them to cup, scallop,feather, whatever you want to call it and so far everyone has said (to a point) it's normal. It's a defect weather that's MB's alignment specs, using the cars air suspension or who knows.
I did a search.. sure is alot of others with the same problem.. wonder why?
End result is a howling and woomp woomp woomp and vibration in the steering and the car when driving it. Starts as soon as the car reaches about 2MPH (yes two MPH) and you can both feel and hear it). Get it up to 80 MPH and it sounds like a wheel is going to fall off. My wife refuses to drive the car.
Yes I have the Pilot Primacy's.
I normally drive with the car in Sport 2 (wish there was a sport 5) unless the roads are bumpy then I go to Comfort.
I don't beat on the car as it's really not fast enough for me to beat on.. I have other cars for that.
I flog the living hell out of the CTS-V and it has more miles on it and zero issues with tires.. so what gives?
These tires are not worn to where the tread depth says it's time to replace them.. far from it. There is probably less than 20% wear from new tire tread depth.
There is just something wrong somewhere that has caused them to cup, scallop,feather, whatever you want to call it and so far everyone has said (to a point) it's normal. It's a defect weather that's MB's alignment specs, using the cars air suspension or who knows.
I did a search.. sure is alot of others with the same problem.. wonder why?
I have seen many W211's and I have had a bunch and never once have I had this happen. Some of the cars I drive the living p*ss out of and others I just lump along in like granny. Never once has a tire had that issue. I dont know the cause but I also dont envision MB giving out new tires. I hate to say it but these situations lead to finger pointing games between MB and Michelin and it just gets annoying. There are so many variables to what caused this that its very difficult to pin point the cause and a guilty party if any.
03-07-2007, 12:25 PM
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I talked to 3 different lawyers.. all said my car is perfect candidate for lemon law (Michigan).
Transmission and steering vibration/shake.
It's been in 4 times for each (among numerous other things wrong with it) with either of those main issues ever being resolved. 1st visit was within 3k miles.
Last night I about wrecked the car again due to the harsh trans downshifts. Both times.. same scenario. One was before they supposedly fixed it 2 weeks ago.
Snowing out.. coming up to a light.. foot off the gas and lightly braking. Trans downshifts into 1st and it hits hard enough that it kicks the car sideways almost hitting the vehicle next to you. All the blinking dash lights in the world can't keep the car straight.
So I guess the junk tires are a moot point.
Out of the 80 or so vehicles I have owned so far.. this E500 has got to be the worst as far as quality/defects go.
I'm hoping its just THIS car as I have my eyes on a AMG SL55 but I am going to do some reading on the quality of that model 1st.
Transmission and steering vibration/shake.
It's been in 4 times for each (among numerous other things wrong with it) with either of those main issues ever being resolved. 1st visit was within 3k miles.
Last night I about wrecked the car again due to the harsh trans downshifts. Both times.. same scenario. One was before they supposedly fixed it 2 weeks ago.
Snowing out.. coming up to a light.. foot off the gas and lightly braking. Trans downshifts into 1st and it hits hard enough that it kicks the car sideways almost hitting the vehicle next to you. All the blinking dash lights in the world can't keep the car straight.
So I guess the junk tires are a moot point.
Out of the 80 or so vehicles I have owned so far.. this E500 has got to be the worst as far as quality/defects go.
I'm hoping its just THIS car as I have my eyes on a AMG SL55 but I am going to do some reading on the quality of that model 1st.
03-07-2007, 12:48 PM
#12
MBWorld Fanatic!
I talked to 3 different lawyers.. all said my car is perfect candidate for lemon law (Michigan).
Transmission and steering vibration/shake.
It's been in 4 times for each (among numerous other things wrong with it) with either of those main issues ever being resolved. 1st visit was within 3k miles.
Last night I about wrecked the car again due to the harsh trans downshifts. Both times.. same scenario. One was before they supposedly fixed it 2 weeks ago.
Snowing out.. coming up to a light.. foot off the gas and lightly braking. Trans downshifts into 1st and it hits hard enough that it kicks the car sideways almost hitting the vehicle next to you. All the blinking dash lights in the world can't keep the car straight.
So I guess the junk tires are a moot point.
Out of the 80 or so vehicles I have owned so far.. this E500 has got to be the worst as far as quality/defects go.
I'm hoping its just THIS car as I have my eyes on a AMG SL55 but I am going to do some reading on the quality of that model 1st.
Transmission and steering vibration/shake.
It's been in 4 times for each (among numerous other things wrong with it) with either of those main issues ever being resolved. 1st visit was within 3k miles.
Last night I about wrecked the car again due to the harsh trans downshifts. Both times.. same scenario. One was before they supposedly fixed it 2 weeks ago.
Snowing out.. coming up to a light.. foot off the gas and lightly braking. Trans downshifts into 1st and it hits hard enough that it kicks the car sideways almost hitting the vehicle next to you. All the blinking dash lights in the world can't keep the car straight.
So I guess the junk tires are a moot point.
Out of the 80 or so vehicles I have owned so far.. this E500 has got to be the worst as far as quality/defects go.
I'm hoping its just THIS car as I have my eyes on a AMG SL55 but I am going to do some reading on the quality of that model 1st.
Having said that I just used that 04 E500 to transport a friend and my self to a cycling century 4 hrs away in Death Valley California and I must say that drive made me respect and appreciate the strengths of that car. Yes the brakes are so hard to modulate (fixed for 07), the trans can be herkey jerky around town, and the quality might be suspect at some times, but the way it flew through cross winds with two bikes strapped to the roof, the way it blasted down very challenging canyon roads (again with bikes strapped to the roof), and the way the brakes felt so much better late braking for corners make me see that it is a good car below the nagging issues. The engine was so smooth and the gearbox was always able to keep the car flowing up steep grades; even when overtaking 2-3 cars at a time at speeds up to 120 mph. Having a 7g gear box is great for over taking since the spacing on gears 2-5 is fairly close letting the car always stay in peak power.
I just replaced a daily driver C230k with a E350 (2007) and I can say that car is light years better as far as quality is concerned. MB did fix the issues and I can now call the 7g transmission the BEST I have ever seen. The gear box in the my 07 is flawless and it really makes you respect MB for its ability to engineer some great items.
My SL55 (2004) has been fairly trouble free. It was just in for an issue with the navi system losing connection with the GPS antenna but that was solved very easily and quickly. Other than some small items like dripping tranny control plugs (revised part solved that) and a slight oil leak that SL55 has been great. I think the SL55 is one of the best almost super cars that you can drive daily and love. Dont let your E500 sway you away from that SL55 for it really is an amazing car. But then again I have had pretty good luck with my 2004 E55 as well.
Good luck with your car.
Last edited by CynCarvin32; 03-07-2007 at 01:25 PM.
03-07-2007, 01:36 PM
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No.. the tires are a big part of what pisses me off.
My wife refuses to drive the car as it is VERY loud and she thinks a wheel is going to fall off. 9 out of the last 10 people who have been in my car ask me what is wrong with my car.. what is all that noise within 5 minutes of being in the car. It's embarassing to drive the thing around. The 10th guy drives a rusted out old Chevy S10 so he's just in awe he's actually sitting in a MB. It could have been pink with a purple interior and he'd still love it.
While the car was in the shop last, they gave me a AWD C. I thought I was in a Lexus compared to my E. Even though the C has a irritatingly buzzy sounding engine, it was quiet at speed, stable and was actually pretty nice to drive around. I personally wouldn't buy one myself but it wasn't a bad car. I drop that off and see my E roll up.. DAMN that is a sweet looking car. I'm all happy again. Get in it.. few hundred feet.. noisy/shaking..DAMN this car is a POS!
This car has had steering wheel shake since day 1 and the reply I always get is it's normal.. or the tires flat spot from sitting. I can see if it sat for a month or so.. but a few hours? C'mon.
The rough shifting tranny is also normal. Dealer advised me to just keep it in C mode.
The issues I have with the climate controls are normal also. Turn the dial so the arrow is pointed at the icon with the arrow at the guys feet and you get hot air in your face. Funny thing was the C's climate control blew air at exactly where the dial was pointed. In the wintertime my wife brings a blanket with her to put on her feet so they stay warm.
Front tweeters blew and I can tell they are going to blow again.
Loud thump in trunk when going over some bumps.. I see alot of others have that.. guess its normal too. Dealer found nothing wrong.
COMAND has frozen/locked up on me 5 times now. Once it had a buzz at full volume.
I also have some gripes about the car in general but they are liveable.
E's navigation is a joke. The $350 TomTom I have in one of my other vehicles blows the E's system in the dirt. Wish I would have never installed it. $1000+ lesson I guess.
Audio volume is low on anything but radio. AUX input is escpecially low. I thought about pulling the audio electronics out and going through it to see if I could tweak anything.. but I really don't have time for it.
Seats squeak even after that put the 'felt strip' fix on the buckle.
Theres a few more little things.. but no big deal.
Kinda wish I had the 04 E you were driving. This car has always been unstable at speed. Wanders all over the road. If I'm doing 70 in the slow lane for some unknown reason and a minivan passes me.. my car moves around. Imagine when a semi goes by. By the sounds of it.. I need a 07 7G in this thing since whatever is in mine now is junk.
My wife refuses to drive the car as it is VERY loud and she thinks a wheel is going to fall off. 9 out of the last 10 people who have been in my car ask me what is wrong with my car.. what is all that noise within 5 minutes of being in the car. It's embarassing to drive the thing around. The 10th guy drives a rusted out old Chevy S10 so he's just in awe he's actually sitting in a MB. It could have been pink with a purple interior and he'd still love it.
While the car was in the shop last, they gave me a AWD C. I thought I was in a Lexus compared to my E. Even though the C has a irritatingly buzzy sounding engine, it was quiet at speed, stable and was actually pretty nice to drive around. I personally wouldn't buy one myself but it wasn't a bad car. I drop that off and see my E roll up.. DAMN that is a sweet looking car. I'm all happy again. Get in it.. few hundred feet.. noisy/shaking..DAMN this car is a POS!
This car has had steering wheel shake since day 1 and the reply I always get is it's normal.. or the tires flat spot from sitting. I can see if it sat for a month or so.. but a few hours? C'mon.
The rough shifting tranny is also normal. Dealer advised me to just keep it in C mode.
The issues I have with the climate controls are normal also. Turn the dial so the arrow is pointed at the icon with the arrow at the guys feet and you get hot air in your face. Funny thing was the C's climate control blew air at exactly where the dial was pointed. In the wintertime my wife brings a blanket with her to put on her feet so they stay warm.
Front tweeters blew and I can tell they are going to blow again.
Loud thump in trunk when going over some bumps.. I see alot of others have that.. guess its normal too. Dealer found nothing wrong.
COMAND has frozen/locked up on me 5 times now. Once it had a buzz at full volume.
I also have some gripes about the car in general but they are liveable.
E's navigation is a joke. The $350 TomTom I have in one of my other vehicles blows the E's system in the dirt. Wish I would have never installed it. $1000+ lesson I guess.
Audio volume is low on anything but radio. AUX input is escpecially low. I thought about pulling the audio electronics out and going through it to see if I could tweak anything.. but I really don't have time for it.
Seats squeak even after that put the 'felt strip' fix on the buckle.
Theres a few more little things.. but no big deal.
Kinda wish I had the 04 E you were driving. This car has always been unstable at speed. Wanders all over the road. If I'm doing 70 in the slow lane for some unknown reason and a minivan passes me.. my car moves around. Imagine when a semi goes by. By the sounds of it.. I need a 07 7G in this thing since whatever is in mine now is junk.
03-07-2007, 02:29 PM
#14
MBWorld Fanatic!
No.. the tires are a big part of what pisses me off.
My wife refuses to drive the car as it is VERY loud and she thinks a wheel is going to fall off. 9 out of the last 10 people who have been in my car ask me what is wrong with my car.. what is all that noise within 5 minutes of being in the car. It's embarassing to drive the thing around. The 10th guy drives a rusted out old Chevy S10 so he's just in awe he's actually sitting in a MB. It could have been pink with a purple interior and he'd still love it.
While the car was in the shop last, they gave me a AWD C. I thought I was in a Lexus compared to my E. Even though the C has a irritatingly buzzy sounding engine, it was quiet at speed, stable and was actually pretty nice to drive around. I personally wouldn't buy one myself but it wasn't a bad car. I drop that off and see my E roll up.. DAMN that is a sweet looking car. I'm all happy again. Get in it.. few hundred feet.. noisy/shaking..DAMN this car is a POS!
This car has had steering wheel shake since day 1 and the reply I always get is it's normal.. or the tires flat spot from sitting. I can see if it sat for a month or so.. but a few hours? C'mon.
The rough shifting tranny is also normal. Dealer advised me to just keep it in C mode.
The issues I have with the climate controls are normal also. Turn the dial so the arrow is pointed at the icon with the arrow at the guys feet and you get hot air in your face. Funny thing was the C's climate control blew air at exactly where the dial was pointed. In the wintertime my wife brings a blanket with her to put on her feet so they stay warm.
Front tweeters blew and I can tell they are going to blow again.
Loud thump in trunk when going over some bumps.. I see alot of others have that.. guess its normal too. Dealer found nothing wrong.
COMAND has frozen/locked up on me 5 times now. Once it had a buzz at full volume.
I also have some gripes about the car in general but they are liveable.
E's navigation is a joke. The $350 TomTom I have in one of my other vehicles blows the E's system in the dirt. Wish I would have never installed it. $1000+ lesson I guess.
Audio volume is low on anything but radio. AUX input is escpecially low. I thought about pulling the audio electronics out and going through it to see if I could tweak anything.. but I really don't have time for it.
Seats squeak even after that put the 'felt strip' fix on the buckle.
Theres a few more little things.. but no big deal.
Kinda wish I had the 04 E you were driving. This car has always been unstable at speed. Wanders all over the road. If I'm doing 70 in the slow lane for some unknown reason and a minivan passes me.. my car moves around. Imagine when a semi goes by. By the sounds of it.. I need a 07 7G in this thing since whatever is in mine now is junk.
My wife refuses to drive the car as it is VERY loud and she thinks a wheel is going to fall off. 9 out of the last 10 people who have been in my car ask me what is wrong with my car.. what is all that noise within 5 minutes of being in the car. It's embarassing to drive the thing around. The 10th guy drives a rusted out old Chevy S10 so he's just in awe he's actually sitting in a MB. It could have been pink with a purple interior and he'd still love it.
While the car was in the shop last, they gave me a AWD C. I thought I was in a Lexus compared to my E. Even though the C has a irritatingly buzzy sounding engine, it was quiet at speed, stable and was actually pretty nice to drive around. I personally wouldn't buy one myself but it wasn't a bad car. I drop that off and see my E roll up.. DAMN that is a sweet looking car. I'm all happy again. Get in it.. few hundred feet.. noisy/shaking..DAMN this car is a POS!
This car has had steering wheel shake since day 1 and the reply I always get is it's normal.. or the tires flat spot from sitting. I can see if it sat for a month or so.. but a few hours? C'mon.
The rough shifting tranny is also normal. Dealer advised me to just keep it in C mode.
The issues I have with the climate controls are normal also. Turn the dial so the arrow is pointed at the icon with the arrow at the guys feet and you get hot air in your face. Funny thing was the C's climate control blew air at exactly where the dial was pointed. In the wintertime my wife brings a blanket with her to put on her feet so they stay warm.
Front tweeters blew and I can tell they are going to blow again.
Loud thump in trunk when going over some bumps.. I see alot of others have that.. guess its normal too. Dealer found nothing wrong.
COMAND has frozen/locked up on me 5 times now. Once it had a buzz at full volume.
I also have some gripes about the car in general but they are liveable.
E's navigation is a joke. The $350 TomTom I have in one of my other vehicles blows the E's system in the dirt. Wish I would have never installed it. $1000+ lesson I guess.
Audio volume is low on anything but radio. AUX input is escpecially low. I thought about pulling the audio electronics out and going through it to see if I could tweak anything.. but I really don't have time for it.
Seats squeak even after that put the 'felt strip' fix on the buckle.
Theres a few more little things.. but no big deal.
Kinda wish I had the 04 E you were driving. This car has always been unstable at speed. Wanders all over the road. If I'm doing 70 in the slow lane for some unknown reason and a minivan passes me.. my car moves around. Imagine when a semi goes by. By the sounds of it.. I need a 07 7G in this thing since whatever is in mine now is junk.
MB cant be held responsible if the tires are worn funny and the car is tracking poorly and very loud. I can say I had those issues and tires fixed it all. That was 15k miles ago and my current set of PS2's on the E500 have been fantastic.
A test could be to have the dealership put a set of take of wheels and tires on the car and see how it drives then. It sounds like your tires are bad and with 18k miles (if I remember from your past post) Primacy tires are about done anyhow. That tire has no warranty at that age for its a performance tire that is only expected to last 10-15k miles.
PS. The thump in the rear IS normal. The AirMatic shocks make that sound when the compress and de-compress over larger bumps. I have that on my E500, E55 and R350 right now and my now gone S500 (2000) had it as well. That sound is purely a characteristic of an air bladder replacing the spring. Also, the head rests on all MB's without power rear head rests are known to thump up and down over large bumps. That sound does not exist on non airmatic W211 cars and it does not exist on cars with ABC.
Last edited by CynCarvin32; 03-07-2007 at 02:40 PM.
03-07-2007, 04:14 PM
#15
Do you have staggered wheel tire combo? Is there a reason you don't rotate the bad tires to the rear for time being? At least you won't have the funky front end feel until the tires go to poop.
03-07-2007, 04:52 PM
#16
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Nope. It's a standard E500 with the appearance package and 17" wheels.
MB has been aware of the issue on my car since the 1st time I took it in. Which was 1000 or 3000 miles.. don't remember. It's the free checkup one. Then again at the 6000 mile service where they rotate the tires for free. then again, then again... they just tell me the "N" word.. NORMAL.
It's been there all along, and they knew about it. Whatever it is that causes the front end shake has destroyed the tires. Now it's just annoying as hell to drive it around. I was going to get some new wheels and tires but is it going to do it again on whatever else I get?
I went out and measured the tread depth with a dial indicator at 20 places across each tire. Average tread depth is 7/32's. New tread depth (per Michelin) is 10/32's. The tires are not worn that much.
I'm not asking for free tires since I'm past the free tire point anyway, just offset to the cost of putting new ones on since there is obviously something wrong with my car that MB refuses to acknowledge (or at least my dealer). And reading the Michelin warranty over and over again.. that should happen.
I read a TON of posts about issues with these cars (and MB in general) and I saw alot of brand loyalty blinding people to reality. This E is a nice car.. but it's not that nice I should have to deal with the problems it has.
MB has been aware of the issue on my car since the 1st time I took it in. Which was 1000 or 3000 miles.. don't remember. It's the free checkup one. Then again at the 6000 mile service where they rotate the tires for free. then again, then again... they just tell me the "N" word.. NORMAL.
It's been there all along, and they knew about it. Whatever it is that causes the front end shake has destroyed the tires. Now it's just annoying as hell to drive it around. I was going to get some new wheels and tires but is it going to do it again on whatever else I get?
I went out and measured the tread depth with a dial indicator at 20 places across each tire. Average tread depth is 7/32's. New tread depth (per Michelin) is 10/32's. The tires are not worn that much.
I'm not asking for free tires since I'm past the free tire point anyway, just offset to the cost of putting new ones on since there is obviously something wrong with my car that MB refuses to acknowledge (or at least my dealer). And reading the Michelin warranty over and over again.. that should happen.
I read a TON of posts about issues with these cars (and MB in general) and I saw alot of brand loyalty blinding people to reality. This E is a nice car.. but it's not that nice I should have to deal with the problems it has.
03-07-2007, 04:58 PM
#17
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Oh.. forgot to mention about the thump in rear.
Good point about the headrests.. didn't think of that one. Maybe some hidden velcro will help if that's the cause.
As for the air bags.. I also own a new twin turbo Chevy Trailblazer SS that has airbags in the rear from the factory. Doesn't make any loud noises over bumps. Now this truck is a friggin blast to drive. AWD and 700+ HP. Watch for it in a rather large automotive magazine this summer.
Good point about the headrests.. didn't think of that one. Maybe some hidden velcro will help if that's the cause.
As for the air bags.. I also own a new twin turbo Chevy Trailblazer SS that has airbags in the rear from the factory. Doesn't make any loud noises over bumps. Now this truck is a friggin blast to drive. AWD and 700+ HP. Watch for it in a rather large automotive magazine this summer.
03-07-2007, 05:42 PM
#18
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Oh.. forgot to mention about the thump in rear.
Good point about the headrests.. didn't think of that one. Maybe some hidden velcro will help if that's the cause.
As for the air bags.. I also own a new twin turbo Chevy Trailblazer SS that has airbags in the rear from the factory. Doesn't make any loud noises over bumps. Now this truck is a friggin blast to drive. AWD and 700+ HP. Watch for it in a rather large automotive magazine this summer.
Good point about the headrests.. didn't think of that one. Maybe some hidden velcro will help if that's the cause.
As for the air bags.. I also own a new twin turbo Chevy Trailblazer SS that has airbags in the rear from the factory. Doesn't make any loud noises over bumps. Now this truck is a friggin blast to drive. AWD and 700+ HP. Watch for it in a rather large automotive magazine this summer.
About the tires that is some very deep tread and that must be annoying. Here is a list of issues that your dealership should look at to fix this. Brake rotors being warped, broken front lower control arm bushings, alignment, slop in the steering rack (worn gears), dented wheel, bubbled tire, slipped belt in the tire, an issue with a vibrating drive shaft (sounds odd but ive had it happen, motor mounts, trans mounts, and more to list but this is a good start.
If it has shaken since day one something is wrong. But it could be the tires and tires alone. Thats something that was not yet tested as a possible solution. I know you have a fear that if you go to change the tires and it comes back you are just out the door $$$ for no benefit. Testing with other tires could solve it only to have it come back with time and wear again.
Tough spot. I say work with the dealership. Go out with the shop foreman and demonstrate the issue. He will likely work with you if you take the time to get to know him and show the issues first hand.
If you dont believe a single thing I have written just take my word that the thumping in the rear suspension wont ever go away. They all do it for some reason and I agree its kind of odd for a luxury car. Its just how they work. The bosch suspension is likely much different than the trailblazer since it uses an air shock and then a normal semi adjustable shock. The shock is made by bilstein and the air spring is made by bosch.
03-07-2007, 06:07 PM
#19
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The TBSS is insane 
Total street sleeper. Even stock the thing is pretty impressive.
The Jeep is a bit quicker in the 1/4 mile stock, but the TBSS outhandles it easily.
My next one will probably be a twin turbo 300 SRT-8 or a Charger SRT-8.
I'm also trying to get a new Challenger out of DCX before they actually release them.
One of the reason I got this E in the 1st place was to reverse engineer the PCM/TCM and all that to make tuning products for them. What has turned me off to that is the price I HAVE to charge in order for people to buy it. I am a somewhat value minded person and it makes me sick how you MUST tack on a "MB Markup" to a product for a MB car before owners THINK it's worth it.
I think about how I could soak a MB owner for $1000+ for a 'chip' but my morales get in the way and I just can't get myself to do that.
Anyway,
The brakes seem fine. But with SBC you really don't get much feedback in the pedal so hard to say.
I did get the head tech to go for a ride. He was the one who said it was the tires after we only drove a few feet. He was also the one who said he's seen it many many times. He took he car back in and did something allthough I wasn't back there. Came back about 20 min later and said it is the tires. Then he talked to the service manager and he said I have 2 choices. Buy new tires ($1200) or they could rotate them and balance them for $185. No way was I going to spend $1200 on a set of tires there when I get a huge discount at Tire Rack, nor was I going to pay for rotate/balance on bad tires.. that's like putting makeup on a ugly girl.. she's still ugly.
As for the rest of the possible causes.. I found another MB dealership I may take the car to and have them inspect it. Maybe they will also fix the 7G and the climate control system and the other little issues.
Total street sleeper. Even stock the thing is pretty impressive.
The Jeep is a bit quicker in the 1/4 mile stock, but the TBSS outhandles it easily.
My next one will probably be a twin turbo 300 SRT-8 or a Charger SRT-8.
I'm also trying to get a new Challenger out of DCX before they actually release them.
One of the reason I got this E in the 1st place was to reverse engineer the PCM/TCM and all that to make tuning products for them. What has turned me off to that is the price I HAVE to charge in order for people to buy it. I am a somewhat value minded person and it makes me sick how you MUST tack on a "MB Markup" to a product for a MB car before owners THINK it's worth it.
I think about how I could soak a MB owner for $1000+ for a 'chip' but my morales get in the way and I just can't get myself to do that.
Anyway,
The brakes seem fine. But with SBC you really don't get much feedback in the pedal so hard to say.
I did get the head tech to go for a ride. He was the one who said it was the tires after we only drove a few feet. He was also the one who said he's seen it many many times. He took he car back in and did something allthough I wasn't back there. Came back about 20 min later and said it is the tires. Then he talked to the service manager and he said I have 2 choices. Buy new tires ($1200) or they could rotate them and balance them for $185. No way was I going to spend $1200 on a set of tires there when I get a huge discount at Tire Rack, nor was I going to pay for rotate/balance on bad tires.. that's like putting makeup on a ugly girl.. she's still ugly.
As for the rest of the possible causes.. I found another MB dealership I may take the car to and have them inspect it. Maybe they will also fix the 7G and the climate control system and the other little issues.
03-07-2007, 07:45 PM
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RE: Cupping
My 05 also had front tire cupping when new.
I had the dealer check the alignment at the 1st service. The repair order said "adjusted front and rear toe", and the problem is 95% gone. The car tracks perfectly well into triple digit speeds (better than from the factory) and corners fine...for a W211 anyway. I have the Michelin Pilot HXMXM4 tires. They will last a long time based on wear to date, and I don't baby my car at all.
I'd say your alignment is the culprit, probably nothing more than agressive toe settings.
I had the dealer check the alignment at the 1st service. The repair order said "adjusted front and rear toe", and the problem is 95% gone. The car tracks perfectly well into triple digit speeds (better than from the factory) and corners fine...for a W211 anyway. I have the Michelin Pilot HXMXM4 tires. They will last a long time based on wear to date, and I don't baby my car at all.
I'd say your alignment is the culprit, probably nothing more than agressive toe settings.
03-09-2007, 02:20 AM
#21
MBWorld Fanatic!
The TBSS is insane
Total street sleeper. Even stock the thing is pretty impressive.
The Jeep is a bit quicker in the 1/4 mile stock, but the TBSS outhandles it easily.
My next one will probably be a twin turbo 300 SRT-8 or a Charger SRT-8.
I'm also trying to get a new Challenger out of DCX before they actually release them.
One of the reason I got this E in the 1st place was to reverse engineer the PCM/TCM and all that to make tuning products for them. What has turned me off to that is the price I HAVE to charge in order for people to buy it. I am a somewhat value minded person and it makes me sick how you MUST tack on a "MB Markup" to a product for a MB car before owners THINK it's worth it.
I think about how I could soak a MB owner for $1000+ for a 'chip' but my morales get in the way and I just can't get myself to do that.
Anyway,
The brakes seem fine. But with SBC you really don't get much feedback in the pedal so hard to say.
I did get the head tech to go for a ride. He was the one who said it was the tires after we only drove a few feet. He was also the one who said he's seen it many many times. He took he car back in and did something allthough I wasn't back there. Came back about 20 min later and said it is the tires. Then he talked to the service manager and he said I have 2 choices. Buy new tires ($1200) or they could rotate them and balance them for $185. No way was I going to spend $1200 on a set of tires there when I get a huge discount at Tire Rack, nor was I going to pay for rotate/balance on bad tires.. that's like putting makeup on a ugly girl.. she's still ugly.
As for the rest of the possible causes.. I found another MB dealership I may take the car to and have them inspect it. Maybe they will also fix the 7G and the climate control system and the other little issues.
Total street sleeper. Even stock the thing is pretty impressive.
The Jeep is a bit quicker in the 1/4 mile stock, but the TBSS outhandles it easily.
My next one will probably be a twin turbo 300 SRT-8 or a Charger SRT-8.
I'm also trying to get a new Challenger out of DCX before they actually release them.
One of the reason I got this E in the 1st place was to reverse engineer the PCM/TCM and all that to make tuning products for them. What has turned me off to that is the price I HAVE to charge in order for people to buy it. I am a somewhat value minded person and it makes me sick how you MUST tack on a "MB Markup" to a product for a MB car before owners THINK it's worth it.
I think about how I could soak a MB owner for $1000+ for a 'chip' but my morales get in the way and I just can't get myself to do that.
Anyway,
The brakes seem fine. But with SBC you really don't get much feedback in the pedal so hard to say.
I did get the head tech to go for a ride. He was the one who said it was the tires after we only drove a few feet. He was also the one who said he's seen it many many times. He took he car back in and did something allthough I wasn't back there. Came back about 20 min later and said it is the tires. Then he talked to the service manager and he said I have 2 choices. Buy new tires ($1200) or they could rotate them and balance them for $185. No way was I going to spend $1200 on a set of tires there when I get a huge discount at Tire Rack, nor was I going to pay for rotate/balance on bad tires.. that's like putting makeup on a ugly girl.. she's still ugly.
As for the rest of the possible causes.. I found another MB dealership I may take the car to and have them inspect it. Maybe they will also fix the 7G and the climate control system and the other little issues.
1200 for tires on a car with 245/45/17's is crazy. Maybe if it were my SL55 1200 would not be that bad but your E500 could get a set of fantastic RE050A Polepositions for 144 a piece or so. I forget the exact price but its very reasonable. You can always go for a set of take off wheels from a 2007 car or maybe some non sport CLS500 take off wheels as well. Those tend to go for maybe 1100 or so but those come with WHEELS and tires for the same price. If the car is as bad as you say I cant believe that they keep telling you to go away. I did have a car bought back for a front end vibration but it took 2 years of polite repairs to get them to finally just replace the car. I was very polite and they kept trying to solve the issue and maybe thats why I keep posting! My car was a W203 which was bought back not a W211.
I have found the W211 to be pretty solid suspension wise so I am shocked you are having these issues.
If you talk to the regional rep for MB and tell them that you will buy tires for the car and if the same issue comes back you would like some real action taken to resolve the issue. If it fixes the car you get your car back to being a nice vehicle and if it comes back they really cant say oh its 2 bad sets of tires in a row. But talk to the regional rep before doing that so you are all on the same page.
03-15-2007, 11:00 AM
#22
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Welp.. took the car to an independent shop for them to look at it.
Tires are shot (cupped) but tread wear is very good.
So the process started with finger pointing as I suspected it would.
Michelin says something is wrong with the car.. so the alignment was checked.. it's within MB's specs albeit the specs do contribute to the problem with the tires. Not my fault.
End result is they are going to warranty them.. as they should.
Now my question is.. what OTHER tires should I get?
These Pilot Primacy's suck *** in the rain, are noisy and very very bad in the snow. They handle decent on dry pavement though. Really have to push them before they start crying uncle.
I'm looking for low noise, better wet performance, not too concerned about snow, but like dry traction.
If I end up keeping this car (it still has the other list of issues) I may put a set of 19" HRE's on it as I get those at cost.
Tires are shot (cupped) but tread wear is very good.
So the process started with finger pointing as I suspected it would.
Michelin says something is wrong with the car.. so the alignment was checked.. it's within MB's specs albeit the specs do contribute to the problem with the tires. Not my fault.
End result is they are going to warranty them.. as they should.
Now my question is.. what OTHER tires should I get?
These Pilot Primacy's suck *** in the rain, are noisy and very very bad in the snow. They handle decent on dry pavement though. Really have to push them before they start crying uncle.
I'm looking for low noise, better wet performance, not too concerned about snow, but like dry traction.
If I end up keeping this car (it still has the other list of issues) I may put a set of 19" HRE's on it as I get those at cost.
03-15-2007, 05:59 PM
#23
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'71 Pinto
Agree with CynCarvin32. Ask your dealership (i.e.: Service Manager) to put you in touch with your area MBUSA Service Parts & Operations Manager (SPOM) to make him aware and document. This may also prove beneficial is working out your other problems. BTW, didn’t I already suggest this for your other issues?
03-16-2007, 01:45 AM
#25
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Glad they are replacing the tires. I say if you want wet traction still get some bridgestone RE050A pole positions as they really do ride well and they are half the cost of PS2's. They are quiet and perform well in the wet. I would say if you like wet grip get some GS-D3's BUT I know that after each of my 3 sets of those tires became half warn they turned into the most nosy and annoying tires around.
