airmatic?
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,254
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From: Louisiana
03 E500 and Corvette
That's an interesting issue you've raised........I never had the Suspension Malfunction on the display prior to taking my car into the MB Dealer Service Dept this week and they replaced the pump because I said it was very noisy and annoying. Maybe the old pump was overworked if the air spring has been leaking and causing the thumping noise. The new pump is definitely quieter.....no more thumping noise......but either the pump is not working properly or the air spring(s) leaking. When I get the malfunction message, I push the button to raise the car and the Display then says Vehicle Raising....something like that......and the malfunction message disappears. I'm taking my car back to the MB Dealer on Monday and let them solve it............still got my CPO Warranty for eight more months!
Granted this is my theory. But I have rebuilt many Lincoln's with air suspension ride control height using an air compressor and air springs. I fought one for 4 months doing the work my self before I disassembled one of the air springs by cutting it up. Only then did I find that the rubber had a fold during normal operations where the rubber was wearing. Then a tiny crack formed allowing the leak. As long as the compressor could put in more air than leaked out the car would ride at nomal height. But the Lincoln did not have an alarm for the pump running too long, so you would not know it was running. Only when the car was parked and the air cooled in the air spring the leak would open and the rear of the car would sit on the mechanical stops. This is what I am experiencing in my E500. However as we both know the "dealer" must be the one to find the problem because the customers don't know anything about machines and engineering.!
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 470
Likes: 3
From: McLean, VA
2003 E500 Benz & 2015 BMW M235ix
Here's what I think is happening in your case. When the car raises it changes the tiny hole in the rubber on the air spring. This allows it to seal and the pump shuts off. When the car is normal ride height where the most wear occurs it leaks a small amount allowing the pump to run more than normal which triggers the alarm.
Granted this is my theory. But I have rebuilt many Lincoln's with air suspension ride control height using an air compressor and air springs. I fought one for 4 months doing the work my self before I disassembled one of the air springs by cutting it up. Only then did I find that the rubber had a fold during normal operations where the rubber was wearing. Then a tiny crack formed allowing the leak. As long as the compressor could put in more air than leaked out the car would ride at nomal height. But the Lincoln did not have an alarm for the pump running too long, so you would not know it was running. Only when the car was parked and the air cooled in the air spring the leak would open and the rear of the car would sit on the mechanical stops. This is what I am experiencing in my E500. However as we both know the "dealer" must be the one to find the problem because the customers don't know anything about machines and engineering.!
Granted this is my theory. But I have rebuilt many Lincoln's with air suspension ride control height using an air compressor and air springs. I fought one for 4 months doing the work my self before I disassembled one of the air springs by cutting it up. Only then did I find that the rubber had a fold during normal operations where the rubber was wearing. Then a tiny crack formed allowing the leak. As long as the compressor could put in more air than leaked out the car would ride at nomal height. But the Lincoln did not have an alarm for the pump running too long, so you would not know it was running. Only when the car was parked and the air cooled in the air spring the leak would open and the rear of the car would sit on the mechanical stops. This is what I am experiencing in my E500. However as we both know the "dealer" must be the one to find the problem because the customers don't know anything about machines and engineering.!
By the way, I had an 84 Lincoln Continental for 21 years.......I kept it going as my primary work car until finally bought the Benz in 2005.......my wife did have a 1989 Volvo 740 wagon that we used for long distance travel. I had MotorDr. put in a rebuilt engine at about 250k miles and then put another 150k on that motor and it also had a rebult tranny. As I recall, I only had to get the front air shocks replaced once, maybe twice. It was starting to be a challenge to get parts, even used ones, during the last five plus years but I did find a salvage yard in PA that had lots of wrecked Lincolns for parts. Finally sold it in 2006 for $1100 to a young guy who wanted one of these Lincolns and mine was the only one he had seen that still was running with no major problems.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,254
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From: Louisiana
03 E500 and Corvette
Interesting. I had an 84, 89, 92, and 99 lincoln and 3 had air suspension.
They were all sound cars. This E500 is our first MB and the list of warranty repairs is almost endless. Starting with total SBC failure, suspension,ignition key,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, and on. Somehow I thought with MB I would spend less time in the shop but this e500 really hasn't worked out that way.
Given I paid almost 2x what a new lincoln cost I would expect more. What I can say for the most part the dealer has been exceptional and probably the best dealer in 40+ years of car buying.
So would I buy another MB? don't know I would have to check more reliability data.
Would I buy another Lincoln based on reliability YES!.
They were all sound cars. This E500 is our first MB and the list of warranty repairs is almost endless. Starting with total SBC failure, suspension,ignition key,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, and on. Somehow I thought with MB I would spend less time in the shop but this e500 really hasn't worked out that way.
Given I paid almost 2x what a new lincoln cost I would expect more. What I can say for the most part the dealer has been exceptional and probably the best dealer in 40+ years of car buying.
So would I buy another MB? don't know I would have to check more reliability data.
Would I buy another Lincoln based on reliability YES!.
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 470
Likes: 3
From: McLean, VA
2003 E500 Benz & 2015 BMW M235ix
Well, I picked up my car from the MB Dealer this afternoon and the problem was the AirMatic airpump........the one they installed last week was defective and they installed another one. They found no leaks........however, before my warranty expires in 1/2010, I plan to have them do a check on the air springs to be sure they are not leaking so I can get them replaced on the warranty, if necessary.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,254
Likes: 15
From: Louisiana
03 E500 and Corvette
Well, I picked up my car from the MB Dealer this afternoon and the problem was the AirMatic airpump........the one they installed last week was defective and they installed another one. They found no leaks........however, before my warranty expires in 1/2010, I plan to have them do a check on the air springs to be sure they are not leaking so I can get them replaced on the warranty, if necessary.
They replaced the air pump last week and it still collapsed on the rear. Yesterday they replaced the rear air springs both sides. today they are leak checking. Read $$$$$$Remember if the pump can put out more than leaks out of the air spring it will stay level and give a warning. When the air spring leaks faster or long enough you will burn out the pump and or get the suspension too low warning.
I would be really watching to see if the car height changes much after parking a couple of days.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,254
Likes: 15
From: Louisiana
03 E500 and Corvette
Update. The car is level again. 8 days in the shop and the rear air springs were replaced with the air compressor. Wow would this be expensive w/o warranty. My guess would be around $2500 to $3000 for this repair.
The service dept does a great job and probably the best service dept I have ever used in 40 yrs of buying cars and having them serviced.
What I would not expect for a $70G car is spring failure, ball joint, sbc brakes, ignition key, door locks and the list goes on.
My Corvette bought new at the same time with the same mileage driven on the race track has had ZERO failures.
SO dealer gets Gold Star
E500 gets Red Star
Parts used.
Airmatic compressor 2113200304
Airmatic relay 0025427219
Lines for air suspension 2113270245
Left Rear Air Spring 2113200725
Right Rear Air Spring 2113200825
Seal Holder 2113280058
Screw 19903003
The service dept does a great job and probably the best service dept I have ever used in 40 yrs of buying cars and having them serviced.
What I would not expect for a $70G car is spring failure, ball joint, sbc brakes, ignition key, door locks and the list goes on.
My Corvette bought new at the same time with the same mileage driven on the race track has had ZERO failures.
SO dealer gets Gold Star
E500 gets Red Star
Parts used.
Airmatic compressor 2113200304
Airmatic relay 0025427219
Lines for air suspension 2113270245
Left Rear Air Spring 2113200725
Right Rear Air Spring 2113200825
Seal Holder 2113280058
Screw 19903003
Newbie
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
From: Tennnessee
E500
Proper Ride Height?
What is the proper ride height for a 2003 E500 Sport with Airmatic? I had a leak in both rear air suspension air bags, but before it was diagnosed correctly, the dealer replaced the rear shocks. In attempting to recalibrate the ride height with the leaky air springs, the dealer adjusted the ride height both electronically (with the control unit) and mechanically. After replacing the air springs, the ride height in the rear is unequal. What is the correct ride height? My current measurements, from wheel center to fender, is as follows: Left Front and Right Front 14 3/4 inches (37.5 cm); Left Rear 13 3/4 inches (34.9 cm); Right Rear 14 inches (35.6 cm). Any information would be greatly appreciated.
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 470
Likes: 3
From: McLean, VA
2003 E500 Benz & 2015 BMW M235ix
Update. The car is level again. 8 days in the shop and the rear air springs were replaced with the air compressor. Wow would this be expensive w/o warranty. My guess would be around $2500 to $3000 for this repair.
The service dept does a great job and probably the best service dept I have ever used in 40 yrs of buying cars and having them serviced.
What I would not expect for a $70G car is spring failure, ball joint, sbc brakes, ignition key, door locks and the list goes on.
My Corvette bought new at the same time with the same mileage driven on the race track has had ZERO failures.
SO dealer gets Gold Star
E500 gets Red Star
Parts used.
Airmatic compressor 2113200304
Airmatic relay 0025427219
Lines for air suspension 2113270245
Left Rear Air Spring 2113200725
Right Rear Air Spring 2113200825
Seal Holder 2113280058
Screw 19903003
The service dept does a great job and probably the best service dept I have ever used in 40 yrs of buying cars and having them serviced.
What I would not expect for a $70G car is spring failure, ball joint, sbc brakes, ignition key, door locks and the list goes on.
My Corvette bought new at the same time with the same mileage driven on the race track has had ZERO failures.
SO dealer gets Gold Star
E500 gets Red Star
Parts used.
Airmatic compressor 2113200304
Airmatic relay 0025427219
Lines for air suspension 2113270245
Left Rear Air Spring 2113200725
Right Rear Air Spring 2113200825
Seal Holder 2113280058
Screw 19903003
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MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,254
Likes: 15
From: Louisiana
03 E500 and Corvette
Do you still have your MB warranty or is it an after-market one? I plan to acquire an aftermarket warranty after my existing MB CPO extended warranty expires in Jan 2010 especially as insurance for these potential expensive repairs. Someone on another posting here mentioned he has Paragon MotorClub warranty and seems happy with it and I just sent in a request for a quote. There are so many out there now hocking their plans.
I have the 100000 mile CPO warranty. I looked into aftermarket warranty and they want $2500/yr
. The would not cover the airmatic suspension with less. I just decided to rough it as I won't pay $2500/yr for a warranty to anyone. I would rather put 2500/yr in another car.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,254
Likes: 15
From: Louisiana
03 E500 and Corvette
What is the proper ride height for a 2003 E500 Sport with Airmatic? I had a leak in both rear air suspension air bags, but before it was diagnosed correctly, the dealer replaced the rear shocks. In attempting to recalibrate the ride height with the leaky air springs, the dealer adjusted the ride height both electronically (with the control unit) and mechanically. After replacing the air springs, the ride height in the rear is unequal. What is the correct ride height? My current measurements, from wheel center to fender, is as follows: Left Front and Right Front 14 3/4 inches (37.5 cm); Left Rear 13 3/4 inches (34.9 cm); Right Rear 14 inches (35.6 cm). Any information would be greatly appreciated.
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 470
Likes: 3
From: McLean, VA
2003 E500 Benz & 2015 BMW M235ix
vettdrv.......have you ever removed the lower black plastic bumper grills from your vehicle? I posted a thread asking how to remove these so I can better clean them and/or re-paint them but no one has responded yet. I'm doing spring cleaning of my vehicle and preparing for our local section of Mercedes Club of America car show on May 3rd and want to get these things fixed up. The two smaller side ones look like they just snap in and out but not sure about the long one in the middle?
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,254
Likes: 15
From: Louisiana
03 E500 and Corvette
No I haven't pulled that cover. I pulled a lot down to get the the fog light lense. I found that to be SIMPLE. Well engineered and implemented.
I am now thinking of trading the E500 for a new one in about 18 to 24 months given the economy.
I am now thinking of trading the E500 for a new one in about 18 to 24 months given the economy.
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 421
Likes: 14
From: Bay Area
2004 E500 CLK320
STOP, CAR TOO LOW!
I have the same problem happened to my 04 E500. Message is "STOP, CAR TOO LOW!". Sure enough, the passenger side (both front and rearwheels) is sitting at least an inch lower than normal. Is there a recall for this issue? Airmatic suspension failing at 64k mi seems way too early. Does anyone know the actual cost in fixing this problem? After reading this thread, the problem could be the air pump, airmatic suspension (strut & sping?), and the rubber boot. It seems odd to me that both the front and rear suspension on the passenger failed at the same time.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,254
Likes: 15
From: Louisiana
03 E500 and Corvette
[QUOTE=SZMB;3766605] Airmatic suspension failing at 64k mi seems way too early. Does anyone know the actual cost in fixing this problem? QUOTE]
Nope,, not too early but I would consider NORMAL.
Cost,, Dealer front shocks $1,100 each,, rear air springs my guess $2500
Compressor,, guess $800.
All of this work was done under my extended CPO warranty for me.
My service mgr told me this was 'normal' failures as German rubber doesn't apparently hold up well in this application. Or so I was told.
I will not buy another car with airmatic suspension for this reason. Too expensive and poor reliability IMO.
Nope,, not too early but I would consider NORMAL.
Cost,, Dealer front shocks $1,100 each,, rear air springs my guess $2500
Compressor,, guess $800.
All of this work was done under my extended CPO warranty for me.
My service mgr told me this was 'normal' failures as German rubber doesn't apparently hold up well in this application. Or so I was told.
I will not buy another car with airmatic suspension for this reason. Too expensive and poor reliability IMO.
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 421
Likes: 14
From: Bay Area
2004 E500 CLK320
Update. I drove the car slowly (avoid hitting any pot holes or going over bumps) into the MB dealer's shop Friday. Today, I got a call from the service rep. He said the left front strut is leaking. The rear shocks are ok although they seem sitting low because the lowering of the front strut causes the rear to look low as well. Parts & labor is $1500 for the front strut. I asked him for a good will repair since the car is just out of CPO warranty. After talking to his manager, he'll give me a 30% discount, totalling to $1150. It should be done in a day or two. That's one expensive repair for just one shock. I'll avoid buying another car w/ air suspension. Imagine all four go bad, which I expect them to sometime in the near future, that'll be $6000!!!
While they were inspecting the car, the mechanic also noticed there's a leak in the rear main seal, which separates the engine and the transmission, and the engine oil could leak into the transmission. The repair cost is $1500 and the tranny needs to be taken out for this repair. The rep says I should get this fixed within the next 1000 mi.
I'm thinking of selling this car, although I really enjoy driving this car. I can only imagine that my repair bill will exceed $6000 within the next 12 months, and I expect the other 3 shocks to go bad very soon. And the car is only worth $20k.
While they were inspecting the car, the mechanic also noticed there's a leak in the rear main seal, which separates the engine and the transmission, and the engine oil could leak into the transmission. The repair cost is $1500 and the tranny needs to be taken out for this repair. The rep says I should get this fixed within the next 1000 mi.
I'm thinking of selling this car, although I really enjoy driving this car. I can only imagine that my repair bill will exceed $6000 within the next 12 months, and I expect the other 3 shocks to go bad very soon. And the car is only worth $20k.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,254
Likes: 15
From: Louisiana
03 E500 and Corvette
....... That's one expensive repair for just one shock. I'll avoid buying another car w/ air suspension. ............I'm thinking of selling this car, although I really enjoy driving this car. I can only imagine that my repair bill will exceed $6000 within the next 12 months, and I expect the other 3 shocks to go bad very soon. And the car is only worth $20k.
I don't know if you can sell the car but values are in the tank due to the poor reliability and the economy. You can do a shock yourself for about $500 if it fails again.
Best of luck with your lemon. With yours and mine we could probably keep one running for a year or so.. Ok,, now I am too critical.
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 421
Likes: 14
From: Bay Area
2004 E500 CLK320
Got the car back yesterday. As good as new again. But definitely i'll learn to replace the shocks ($400 for rebuilt ones) myself if the other three shocks fail. The tech showed me the damaged front shock -- the air bag and the hydralic failed, and the whole lower shock was covered in oil. Yeah, I'll keep driving for a year or two and see. Great car, but when it's out of warranty you're screwed. Resale value is very bad. It lost 72% of its original value in just 5 yrs, assuming $70k when new. People with money don't buy used ones, and people who don't have money don't buy used ones either not because of price but because of the extremely high maintenance cost.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,254
Likes: 15
From: Louisiana
03 E500 and Corvette
If you can afford the luxury you want new. If not most can't afford to repair them.
