abhansali

I know a lot of posting is going on about people who already have cars and are getting new cars with Navi. drb, rayscar already have build dates in May and June.

Anyone here who is placing a new order and is able to order Navi? Is MB allowing that yet, or is all production now just for Navi replacements?

DKSNY

I've seen the order book for the 2004's and the Nav is listed, (as is 4matic) as orderable.

They've changed designations of options, Sport is now called appearance package (322), Heating package (seats,wheel) 323, Pano roof 413, COMMAND NAV 530, Keyless Go 889, Folding rear seat 325.

These are the codes on the order I've written up.

abhansali

Have you seen 2004 pricing listed or just the options?

NavNut

Great... Just talked to my Salesguy on the phone... I may just end up getting the Lexus after all this. These guys just don't get it.

I'll break this posting up into "Recap" for new readers, and "New Information" at the end for people who've been reading my ordeal from February... so I don't bore everyone... If you know what I'm talking about, skip down...


*** Recap ***

So to recap my situation: I went into a dealership wanting an E500 with Nav for European Delivery. I'm flexible on the delivery time, but wanted early July to end of July at the latest. I gotta be over there in August and want a car there...

I was told that getting on the schedule for European Delivery is dicey. Slots are taken up and we could be shut out of a July delivery. February was too early to put in a July Factory Order, but I should give them a deposit to guarentee a spot. (In retrospect, I believe this is just a boatload of hokum and they did nothing but cash the check.) I said, "Shouldn't we work up a PO?" They said no, that we can just reserve a slot, giving the factory a heads-up, and we'll work out the PO when we put in the factory order in April (3 month lead time - the MBUSA website of course says that they can work to accomodate shorter notice orders, but this is not what the dealer tells me.)

So they work up MSRP numbers on a worksheet, and I say, "Are you not selling these cars at under MSRP?" I get told by the salesguy, "Oh, I always take care of my internet customers, don't worry about it... we'll put in a discount later..." I also talk to the Euro-Delivery guy (not sure how this works, but for ED, MB always works through just one point of contact per dealership, and you sort of work out a deal with your sales guy and then hand it over to the ED guy who deals with setting up all the trip details...) The ED salesguy also says, "Don't worry, we'll take care of you..." At this time I give them a $2,000 deposit to reserve a spot for July Euro-delivery (this is probably bogus - I probably should never have done this - this is also $500 more than they usually ask because it's a European Delivery... yah... right...)

I go in at the beginning of April, and guess what? Factory is not accepting Nav orders. I tell them that Nav is a show stopper for me. No nav, no car. They flip flop from, "You gotta order an '04 if you want to be assured of nav" to "We can let it slide some and see if it becomes available in a few weeks." when I tell them, if I can't get Nav in Europe in August, it's a deal breaker. Ok... We'll play it by ear. I ask if we should do a PO... No... not yet.

We also approach the drop-dead date for ordering the last of the BMW 540i's coming off the line for a few months (was a plan B for me). They are changing over the assembly line for the new run, and I believe at this point, you can no longer get any orders for 540's in... new or old. I go in the weekend before the drop-dead date figuring we could negotiate an MB E500 price, and if it's a no-go, I'll just take my business down the street and order a 540 for ED... with the price breaks that BMW gives OUTRIGHT because ED is cheap and easy for them to do... (MB used to also give price breaks in the past for ED... I believed they stopped doing this a few years ago.)

I try to get them to negotiate a price and do a PO so I can make my decision... nope... they convince me to just wait... now's not the time. Fine.


*** New Information ***

Now, my salesguy has been calling me at the end of last week, and this week, chomping at the bit to put in the factory order. I asked him last week, if I should come in to work up the PO... He says, no, let him check with the European Delivery guy. Ok... He checks, and calls me wanting a week for delivery, saying we should put in the factory order with nav and see if they accept the order for the week I want it. I tell him I want it for either the next to the last week of July, or the last week of July at the very latest. He's like, great... I ask him when we are to work up a price and PO... He's says we've done that... I remind him that we never talked turkey on the price. He's only mentioned MSRP and talked about discounting it, but we never actually wrote up a PO.

Apparently, he was just going to start the order as if it's for MSRP... cute... but this is absurd. Has anyone EVER heard of this? They have no signed PO from me. What? They figured they'd just start everything up for an MSRP car and I'll just sign anything whenever they want? Maybe, I'll just bring in all the money and more in cash in a wheel barrow to the guys garage? I don't get this... is this the "soft sell?" A Zen way of buying a car? Negotiate a price, by NOT negotiating a price. This was annoying. (I am sure the salesguy is equally annoyed, but that's too bad.)

So I tell him that there is no way I am going to take the car for MSRP... I gotta have Nav. I gotta have it in Europe in August, and I'm not going to pay MSRP for it.

He starts going into a song and dance about how he doesn't really make any money on Euro-delivery cars... Yeah, right... He has NO inventory interest payments on this car. It doesn't come out of his allocation. It is simple paperwork and dealer prep when it shows up. It's sold before it hits his lot. Euro-Delivery is a SWEET deal for dealerships and he's making like they LOSE money on these cars. Give me a break!

I told him there was no way I was going to buy this car in this economy for MSRP, and if this is the case, then I'll just come down to pick up my deposit and either find an MB dealer who will deal with me or I'll buy another marque altogether.

He tells me that there may be dealers in the LA area who are discounting... and there may be dealers discounting their inventory cars, (and their dealership is discounting E320's because they have a bunch - but they're not dropping more than $500 or $1k from MSRP on those...) So he wanted to know what I was expecting... I told him I wasn't sure, but it had better be closer to dealer invoice than MSRP... So now he says he needs to talk to the general manager... bad sign. I should just tell him to get a check ready.

He claims E500's are in short supply (he only has 3 on the lot... gee... to me, 3 unsold cars is not short supply... I've bought cars in short supply before... that's when there are ZERO on the lot, and I put in an order in January, and get the car in MAY... that's "short supply." Not, gee, I only have three unsold cars on the lot.)

This just leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I'm not sure I can recover from this... especially since I just know he's going to come back with this dumb... "I really went to bat for you... and argued with the gm for hours for you... and got you a price of MSRP minus $2k..." I'm just not in the mood for this.


*** Relevant Thread Content ***

So he also said in a message that if I wanted an August Euro-delivery date, that would be better. It is sounding like July builds are booking up with replacement cars for the pre-ordered nav guys, and new orders might start coming off the assembly line in Germany in July, but it'll be close...

So do people out there think I'm out of my mind? I just don't think I'm unreasonable... Not making money on this car... Geesh... He said there's only about $4200 bucks in profit on this car (between MSRP and Invoice) and that's about right... then there's another 5% dealer holdback, that they get just for having a nice smile... So that's another $3500 or so... yeah... they're losing money on this car if they sell it for less than a grand under MSRP. Unbelieveable... It's a pure bonus car for the dealership. I think I just hate sales guys... there's no getting around it... they are all animals.

-NavNut

nyca

what else do you know about the 2004s? will there be an E350?

abhansali

NavNut,

In July, won't they start building 2004s. I'm confused, does this mean they won't build 2004s until August for delivery in late Sept?

NavNut

I believe it takes somewhere between 4 and 8 weeks to go from factory to our shores... I don't know if they are starting 2004 builds in August, but I am sure that they are doing 2003's in July, and certainly part of August...

-NavNut

DKSNY

Haven't seen pricing yet, I was told they release that about 3-4 weeks before the introduction. I was also told that they will key in the orders about 12 weeks before expected delivery. So since I'm looking for the car in Sept, they should be able to enter the order by the end of May. Several dealers said they expect pricing to by within 1% of current pricing.

There is also one new color, I didn't get a close enough look, but I will this weekend.

abhansali

How will you see the new color? I'm assuming it is not out yet...have you seen a brochure?

mtmnet

Will there be an E350??!!!! I'm ready to place my order!

Thanks,
Mike

northbenz

D--NY Please check your Private messages. Thanks