SBC Failure STOP Warning.
Junior Member
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
From: SoCal, USA
95 s124 Estate, 69 911RS (tribute), 93 Toyota Pickup (DD)
I clearly have less conficence in the SBC E500 brakes failing on the street than I do my Corvette on the race track.
Last electronic brake system I will ever own. I planned to buy a new car this year, but the economy has not recovered enough to allow me the $$ to do it yet, but I have narrowed my selection down to 2 both, RWD, over 300 hp and conventional brake set up.
Last electronic brake system I will ever own. I planned to buy a new car this year, but the economy has not recovered enough to allow me the $$ to do it yet, but I have narrowed my selection down to 2 both, RWD, over 300 hp and conventional brake set up.
Super Member
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 612
Likes: 2
From: NY
'12 Mustang 5.0, '89 Supra Turbo, C55,
Super Member
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 724
Likes: 31
Car free at the moment
I clearly have less conficence in the SBC E500 brakes failing on the street than I do my Corvette on the race track.
Last electronic brake system I will ever own. I planned to buy a new car this year, but the economy has not recovered enough to allow me the $$ to do it yet, but I have narrowed my selection down to 2 both, RWD, over 300 hp and conventional brake set up.
Last electronic brake system I will ever own. I planned to buy a new car this year, but the economy has not recovered enough to allow me the $$ to do it yet, but I have narrowed my selection down to 2 both, RWD, over 300 hp and conventional brake set up.
Junior Member
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
From: SoCal, USA
95 s124 Estate, 69 911RS (tribute), 93 Toyota Pickup (DD)
While On I5 driving from Los Angeles to San Francisco big red flash on the dash Stop BRake Failure.!!! My brake failed as I was driving over 70MPH down the grapevine. I am amazed how fast it happened. My brake system are almost new and never a sign of bad brakes, in a second all lights came on saying the Brake Malfunction, stop the car. I tried to use the brake and nothing was there. The pedal went all the way down.. I'am glad no one got hurt . Thank God i have AAA premier to tow it 200 miles no charge. Can anyone confirm that SBC Pump Failure is still covered BY MBZ 10 year warranty. Thanks in advance
My car is about 8 months past MB warranty with only 56k miles on it. If I decide to keep my car (MY04) i would like to know what parts i need to purchase / replace so I can drive my car with confidence again.
@03E500AMG
Great post
Because of you and others on the forum I've learned alot about SBC that I wouldn't have given a second thought to 
Still can't decide if I'm going to keep my car or sell it. Currently looking into another MB without SBC.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,254
Likes: 15
From: Louisiana
03 E500 and Corvette
....My car is about 8 months past MB warranty with only 56k miles on it. If I decide to keep my car (MY04) i would like to know what parts i need to purchase / replace so I can drive my car with confidence again..............
.Still can't decide if I'm going to keep my car or sell it. Currently looking into another MB without SBC.
.Still can't decide if I'm going to keep my car or sell it. Currently looking into another MB without SBC.
Engine mounts
ball joints
Air springs
front struts
These should get you through the 100000 mile mark. At least they got my 03 pass the 100000 mile mark. Then the a/c went and the transmission hangs in 4th gear.
Junior Member
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
From: SoCal, USA
95 s124 Estate, 69 911RS (tribute), 93 Toyota Pickup (DD)
Thanks vettdvr!
Newbie
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
E500 4Matic; E320 Wagon; Ford Excursion
MB SBC unit
Interesting stories, thanks for sharing - here's mine.
I bought a '04 E500 4Matic with less than 30K on the clock.. Great car and in great shape / inside & out. I had an A/C issue (bad valve, blew hot are out the rear vents). Took it to MB to get that checked and they said the SBC was "near its limit".
Prior to this I had NO issues with braking. The unit ($2000+) was under warranty and replaced. Less than a month later I'm driving through town and the brakes go out - pedal to the floor, red lights, noise, et cetera. NOT a good time, if you've never experienced no breaks in traffic. Even the e-brake wouldn't work... (I always assume it was a separate system??!!)
It is back in the shop right now for the new SBC... another interesting thing, it was locked in park and unlike my other MB there is NO bypass or unlock, so (it's a 4Matic, remember?) it had to be pulled up onto the tow truck with 4 locked wheels, really screwed up the passenger side tires rubbing on the truck bed.... !
I bought a '04 E500 4Matic with less than 30K on the clock.. Great car and in great shape / inside & out. I had an A/C issue (bad valve, blew hot are out the rear vents). Took it to MB to get that checked and they said the SBC was "near its limit".
Prior to this I had NO issues with braking. The unit ($2000+) was under warranty and replaced. Less than a month later I'm driving through town and the brakes go out - pedal to the floor, red lights, noise, et cetera. NOT a good time, if you've never experienced no breaks in traffic. Even the e-brake wouldn't work... (I always assume it was a separate system??!!)
It is back in the shop right now for the new SBC... another interesting thing, it was locked in park and unlike my other MB there is NO bypass or unlock, so (it's a 4Matic, remember?) it had to be pulled up onto the tow truck with 4 locked wheels, really screwed up the passenger side tires rubbing on the truck bed.... !
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MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,254
Likes: 15
From: Louisiana
03 E500 and Corvette
Interesting stories, thanks for sharing - here's mine.
I bought a '04 E500 4Matic with less than 30K on the clock.. Great car and in great shape / inside & out. I had an A/C issue (bad valve, blew hot are out the rear vents). Took it to MB to get that checked and they said the SBC was "near its limit".
Prior to this I had NO issues with braking. The unit ($2000+) was under warranty and replaced. Less than a month later I'm driving through town and the brakes go out - pedal to the floor, red lights, noise, et cetera. NOT a good time, if you've never experienced no breaks in traffic. Even the e-brake wouldn't work... (I always assume it was a separate system??!!)
It is back in the shop right now for the new SBC... another interesting thing, it was locked in park and unlike my other MB there is NO bypass or unlock, so (it's a 4Matic, remember?) it had to be pulled up onto the tow truck with 4 locked wheels, really screwed up the passenger side tires rubbing on the truck bed.... !
I bought a '04 E500 4Matic with less than 30K on the clock.. Great car and in great shape / inside & out. I had an A/C issue (bad valve, blew hot are out the rear vents). Took it to MB to get that checked and they said the SBC was "near its limit".
Prior to this I had NO issues with braking. The unit ($2000+) was under warranty and replaced. Less than a month later I'm driving through town and the brakes go out - pedal to the floor, red lights, noise, et cetera. NOT a good time, if you've never experienced no breaks in traffic. Even the e-brake wouldn't work... (I always assume it was a separate system??!!)
It is back in the shop right now for the new SBC... another interesting thing, it was locked in park and unlike my other MB there is NO bypass or unlock, so (it's a 4Matic, remember?) it had to be pulled up onto the tow truck with 4 locked wheels, really screwed up the passenger side tires rubbing on the truck bed.... !
Newbie
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
E350 4Matic Wagon (S211.287)
Hi everyone:
I had an complete brake system shut down in the middle of NYC two weeks ago. And yes, you can forget the "emergency" function of the now only on the front brakes working pedal without any booster. Almost nothing...
SBC unit has been replaced (free of charge). Same failure comes still on when I hit the brake pedal fast. Otherwise normal responses. The workshop diagnosed and bled the system 3 times and is now suggesting to change the master cylinder for close to $2K. It took them 2 weeks to believe the failure is repeatable and now that.
Has anyone ever had something like this?
I had an complete brake system shut down in the middle of NYC two weeks ago. And yes, you can forget the "emergency" function of the now only on the front brakes working pedal without any booster. Almost nothing...
SBC unit has been replaced (free of charge). Same failure comes still on when I hit the brake pedal fast. Otherwise normal responses. The workshop diagnosed and bled the system 3 times and is now suggesting to change the master cylinder for close to $2K. It took them 2 weeks to believe the failure is repeatable and now that.
Has anyone ever had something like this?
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,254
Likes: 15
From: Louisiana
03 E500 and Corvette
Hi everyone:
I had an complete brake system shut down in the middle of NYC two weeks ago. And yes, you can forget the "emergency" function of the now only on the front brakes working pedal without any booster. Almost nothing...
SBC unit has been replaced (free of charge). Same failure comes still on when I hit the brake pedal fast. Otherwise normal responses. The workshop diagnosed and bled the system 3 times and is now suggesting to change the master cylinder for close to $2K. It took them 2 weeks to believe the failure is repeatable and now that.
Has anyone ever had something like this?
I had an complete brake system shut down in the middle of NYC two weeks ago. And yes, you can forget the "emergency" function of the now only on the front brakes working pedal without any booster. Almost nothing...
SBC unit has been replaced (free of charge). Same failure comes still on when I hit the brake pedal fast. Otherwise normal responses. The workshop diagnosed and bled the system 3 times and is now suggesting to change the master cylinder for close to $2K. It took them 2 weeks to believe the failure is repeatable and now that.
Has anyone ever had something like this?
By reporting you have the opportunity to prevent someone else from being injured or worse.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,085
Likes: 59
From: Los Angeles
2009 SL550 Roadster Diamond White, 2008 CLK550 Coupe Obsidian Black
E550 sounds nice but the shallow side of me says it's the same car (and people will think that), but the logical/reasonable side of me says NO IT DEFINITELY IS NOT lol
but then again, there's airmatic again. Not a big fan of the CLS in all honesty. SL550 would be really great but not really reasonable right now and again SBC. S class would be too big and we already own an 02 CL500. The C and SLK would not be quick enough and I don't want to up to the AMG. Which pretty much leaves the CLK550 which is not a bad choice imo and the price range is not bad but idk.but ya i've really always wanted a white e46 M3 coupe
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,254
Likes: 15
From: Louisiana
03 E500 and Corvette
same here idk if i really wanna stick with MB. the SBC and airmatic worries scare me the most. and this car has become really unreliable in the past year.
E550 sounds nice but the shallow side of me says it's the same car (and people will think that), but the logical/reasonable side of me says NO IT DEFINITELY IS NOT lol but then again, there's airmatic again. Not a big fan of the CLS in all honesty. SL550 would be really great but not really reasonable right now and again SBC. S class would be too big and we already own an 02 CL500. The C and SLK would not be quick enough and I don't want to up to the AMG. Which pretty much leaves the CLK550 which is not a bad choice imo and the price range is not bad but idk.
but ya i've really always wanted a white e46 M3 coupe
E550 sounds nice but the shallow side of me says it's the same car (and people will think that), but the logical/reasonable side of me says NO IT DEFINITELY IS NOT lol
but then again, there's airmatic again. Not a big fan of the CLS in all honesty. SL550 would be really great but not really reasonable right now and again SBC. S class would be too big and we already own an 02 CL500. The C and SLK would not be quick enough and I don't want to up to the AMG. Which pretty much leaves the CLK550 which is not a bad choice imo and the price range is not bad but idk.but ya i've really always wanted a white e46 M3 coupe
I bought a 79 Cadillac Eldo once. It was junk. Later I worked with (not for ) Cadillac motor division and told them about my car. This was around 87. They told me they were great cars in 87 to buy another. I told them to give me one and if after 5 yrs it lived up to the advertising claim I would pay for it. I never drove another Caddy.
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 15,901
Likes: 4,632
From: North Scottsdale, AZ
'71 Pinto
Had a ’79 Coupe Deville purchased new until I replaced it with a ’89 Continental. Coupe was a nice car, no problems to speak of but absolutely no comparison to my dad’s ’68 Sedan Deville at the time. BTW the Continental was loaded – every option, air suspension was standard, had auto headlights that dimmed the high beams for oncoming traffic, even had a deicing windshield – had one air strut replaced early on under warranty that was it. Sold in ’92 when I relocated from NY to AZ.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,254
Likes: 15
From: Louisiana
03 E500 and Corvette
Had a ’79 Coupe Deville purchased new until I replaced it with a ’89 Continental. Coupe was a nice car, no problems to speak of but absolutely no comparison to my dad’s ’68 Sedan Deville at the time. BTW the Continental was loaded – every option, air suspension was standard, had auto headlights that dimmed the high beams for oncoming traffic, even had a deicing windshield – had one air strut replaced early on under warranty that was it. Sold in ’92 when I relocated from NY to AZ.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,085
Likes: 59
From: Los Angeles
2009 SL550 Roadster Diamond White, 2008 CLK550 Coupe Obsidian Black
lol ya they r a real pain in the a** these cars. but seriously, your right, other make options r the way to go right now. like i said i've always wanted an e46 m3 but my friend has one and he had a lot of problems with it too. Actually, I think he even recently sold his. lol pretty much every other week we both would be complaining about something else that went wrong or needed taking care of or just even the overly priced regular service.
Newbie
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 8
Likes: 0
From: Orlando, FL
E500
Hi everyone:
I had an complete brake system shut down in the middle of NYC two weeks ago. And yes, you can forget the "emergency" function of the now only on the front brakes working pedal without any booster. Almost nothing...
SBC unit has been replaced (free of charge). Same failure comes still on when I hit the brake pedal fast. Otherwise normal responses. The workshop diagnosed and bled the system 3 times and is now suggesting to change the master cylinder for close to $2K. It took them 2 weeks to believe the failure is repeatable and now that.
Has anyone ever had something like this?
I had an complete brake system shut down in the middle of NYC two weeks ago. And yes, you can forget the "emergency" function of the now only on the front brakes working pedal without any booster. Almost nothing...
SBC unit has been replaced (free of charge). Same failure comes still on when I hit the brake pedal fast. Otherwise normal responses. The workshop diagnosed and bled the system 3 times and is now suggesting to change the master cylinder for close to $2K. It took them 2 weeks to believe the failure is repeatable and now that.
Has anyone ever had something like this?
Took the car to the dealer and they are telling me it's not the SBC unit it's BOU (Master cylinder) I have never heard of a master cylinder failing one minute to a point where you have no stopping power and then after a restart it's working fine again. I believe if a master cylinder is bad it's bad, period and will still not work after a restart.
Any thoughts on this anyone?
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,254
Likes: 15
From: Louisiana
03 E500 and Corvette
I am having that same experience right now, COMPLETE BRAKE FAILURE red lights, chimes, the works, very scary, thank God I was only going about 20 mph and did not hurt anyone. After turning the car off and on again all error lights went away and the brakes seem to working fine again.
Took the car to the dealer and they are telling me it's not the SBC unit it's BOU (Master cylinder) I have never heard of a master cylinder failing one minute to a point where you have no stopping power and then after a restart it's working fine again. I believe if a master cylinder is bad it's bad, period and will still not work after a restart.
Any thoughts on this anyone?
Took the car to the dealer and they are telling me it's not the SBC unit it's BOU (Master cylinder) I have never heard of a master cylinder failing one minute to a point where you have no stopping power and then after a restart it's working fine again. I believe if a master cylinder is bad it's bad, period and will still not work after a restart.
Any thoughts on this anyone?
Newbie
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 8
Likes: 0
From: Orlando, FL
E500
Getting a second opinion from a different dealer tomorrow.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,254
Likes: 15
From: Louisiana
03 E500 and Corvette
I highly recommend filing a report with NTSB for this failure. There are lots of them and only by providing this data will the NTSB know how to respond.
Newbie
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 8
Likes: 0
From: Orlando, FL
E500
Error code "C261E" 'Hydraulic fault or brake light switch faulty'
The service director at the first dealership called me and with his concern gave me a number to MB corporate customer service and said I should express my concerns with them, I did, and just received a follow up call from MB stating their position. They said -
"The vehicle is out of warranty and the component that has failed (BOU Master Cylinder) is not covered under the extended warranty provided to the SBC The repair is the owner's responsibility and MB will not provide any assistance in this matter".
With that said, I tried explaining to the rep that I don't have a problem having my car repaired, I know it's out off warranty, but there seems to be a major safety issue with the entire brake system on the vehicle and it seems as in my case according MB diagnostic results the electronics on the BOU (Master Cylinder) can fail suddenly, without warning, same as the SBC and it's not covered. The rep then repeated MB's position and the conversation was over.
It happens fast folks, as in my case you are driving comfortably as you get ready to stop and depress the brake pedal there is nothing there, no resistance, the pedal goes to the floor, then the bright red "STOP ME IF YOU CAN" light comes on and you pray that you stop safely without killing someone.
And it's like windows restart the car and it's fine again. mmmm
Be careful with these models as they age.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,359
Likes: 6
ML550
I know it's of little consolation to those who have already suffered SBC related brake difficulties, but I've attached an official MB document describing the emergency function of the SBC system. If this can be believed, one ought to be able to stop the car in the event of a control unit failure. I think we become so accustomed to the boost of the power assist, that when it's not there it feels like no brakes at all. So far, my car's SBC unit has been trouble-free (85k miles so far).
Best thing to do is make sure your brake system is inspected regularly by a competent mechanic familiar with the Mercedes SBC system, keep your brake fluid renewed at the specified intervals using only the correct DOT 4+ fluid, and if you're planning to keep your SBC equipped car for the distance, be prepared to spend money to replace components as needed. If you're a W211 fanboy, you can always trade up to an '07 - '09 model year where MB ditched the SBC system.
Best thing to do is make sure your brake system is inspected regularly by a competent mechanic familiar with the Mercedes SBC system, keep your brake fluid renewed at the specified intervals using only the correct DOT 4+ fluid, and if you're planning to keep your SBC equipped car for the distance, be prepared to spend money to replace components as needed. If you're a W211 fanboy, you can always trade up to an '07 - '09 model year where MB ditched the SBC system.
Last edited by komp55; Feb 19, 2013 at 04:36 PM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,254
Likes: 15
From: Louisiana
03 E500 and Corvette
I know it's of little consolation to those who have already suffered SBC related brake difficulties, but I've attached an official MB document describing the emergency function of the SBC system. If this can be believed, one ought to be able to stop the car in the event of a control unit failure. I think we become so accustomed to the boost of the power assist, that when it's not there it feels like no brakes at all. So far, my car's SBC unit has been trouble-free (85k miles so far).
Best thing to do is make sure your brake system is inspected regularly by a competent mechanic familiar with the Mercedes SBC system, keep your brake fluid renewed at the specified intervals using only the correct DOT 4+ fluid, and if you're planning to keep your SBC equipped car for the distance, be prepared to spend money to replace components as needed. If you're a W211 fanboy, you can always trade up to an '07 - '09 model year where MB ditched the SBC system.
Best thing to do is make sure your brake system is inspected regularly by a competent mechanic familiar with the Mercedes SBC system, keep your brake fluid renewed at the specified intervals using only the correct DOT 4+ fluid, and if you're planning to keep your SBC equipped car for the distance, be prepared to spend money to replace components as needed. If you're a W211 fanboy, you can always trade up to an '07 - '09 model year where MB ditched the SBC system.
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 615
Likes: 0
2017 991.2 Turbo PDK 2017 C63S Coupe Ceramic Brakes 2015 CLS63S AMG Full House
Not great hearing all these problematic stories on the 211 SBC brake system. I would just replace(every 6/8 months) or install a juiced up, good amperage Aux battery for the braking. My 211 takes some beating now & then. So far all is good.
BTW : The next S-Class(W222) gets SBC II with intelligent/intuitive control?
So say the engineers from Stuttgart.
BTW : The next S-Class(W222) gets SBC II with intelligent/intuitive control?
So say the engineers from Stuttgart.
