CDIJeff

Thanks to Russell Ormerod helped figured out got the wrong part number, eeuroparts was helpful just need to wait for it to exchange my old one for the new one. Will post updates when I get it.

jhorandc

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Local MB dealer service manager in Northern VA stated on the phone that my 2003 E320 with BRAKE Visit Workshop SBC issue might be a programming issue or other. If Mercedes supports extending the life of the SBC that is OK with me. Are these metrics for the SBC life posted anywhere by Mercedes? Did you have this done to one of your cars? Thanks in advance. (Somewhat new to this so excuse if this isn't the right way to post this).

kajtek1

Unfortunately I have not seen official document disclosing those things.
Judging from the fact that dealers don't read SBC count, looks that even most of dealer technicians are still learning about the system.
I am collecting all available info - some here, some there, so the above is what I found.
If the 1/2 million pushes is correct, I will know that in about a year

CDIJeff

Yes you are right there is no official, after it is broken its broken. I have seen plenty of reports online saying that you can reset the counter once and once only then if the light comes on again for the counter to replace it (city driving) that mean you will have clost to a million presses or stops. Otherwise the only two other errors you can get are pressure reserve failure such as mine, or the actually motor pump goes (Red error). If the pump was half the price or lasted twice as long this would not be brought up as much as it is. Just that paying the dealer $1500-2400 for a fix a unfix-able fix to most people is well just unacceptable. I am just waiting for my part should be here soon. Will post updates. Also if you plan to do this yourself the line size is m10-1.0 thread that screws into the SBC. I suggest getting a small break line to help thread. I got mine from a local autoparts store and from the extra bin cost me less then $3.

jhorandc

Where are people finding this part online? I have looked at some of the common online parts stores but cannot find it. Can you share a link? BTW, my indy mechanic's shop quoted me $1000 for the SBC part. Also, my module fault was a C249F, "Check operating time of component A 7/3 (SBC hydraulic unit)." This would leave me to believe it has exceeded some count limit.

kajtek1

"broken" is not the right word here.
To date I recorded 5 SBC failures on all sites I visit and when 2 reports say they could drive the car with adequate safety, the 3 were passengers or people who could not technically explain what really happen.
So coming back to "end of usable life" - hoping I still have another year and plan to keep the wagon "forever" - I already know a technician who will help me reset the computer.
DIY SBC replacement and resetting will take some time, so extra vehicle will be needed in the mean time. Last time I heard rebuild SBC runs about $700 and prices drop monthly , so chances are in a year I can get one even cheaper.
Anyway, $700 for 10-years safety maintenance on vehicle where set of tires can run you $1500 is cheap IMHO
To jhorandc the "Check operating time of component A 7/3" does not sound like end of SBC life. I think you need to find better qualify technician to diagnose the issue.

Russell Ormerod

All the SBC units I have checked with operating time issues have had around 600000 brake applications. But there are other variables used in calculating the life. Not all faults can be fixed through software these pumps do mechanically fail.

CDIJeff

I got mine from eeuroparts, otherwise they only come re-manufactured, I have not found one place that sells them new. However the remand ones are up to date with the newest software and certified by Mercedes and Bosch. Still not sure if the insides were made with a better quality metal or not can't answer that. I can say a couple people on this forum have said the brakes are different with the new pump ill let you know. Otherwise depending on internet sales, which county, model you own and last after core return, the prices have seemed to stay around $700-$1000 USD. Otherwise $1000 for the part after everything is not a bad deal if it guaranteed to fit and you can get it right away. Just do not buy a used from ebay.

hangit06

http://huskerparts.com/catalog.php?h...htaccess=parts

kajtek1

Funny you punch 009431251288 on google and you will get all kind of prices.
From $850 to $1250 for the same rebuild.
Chances are all those rebuilds come from single rebuild shop.
I know in Eastern Europe you can get them for about $250

DDScott72

This SBC issues is only going to go away when someone driving one of these cars with this technology plows into a crowd of people and kill a few of them. Then all the slimmy Lawyers will be on television soliciting everyone who owns one of these harbinger's of death. Don't believe this CRAP about normal wear and tear and buying one of these cars and not being able to afford the maintenance. There are plenty of people who get there car serviced regularly and this still happened. Its nothing but MB mole talk. Don't forget that most of the people on this forum offering advice work for MB, so its in there best interest to tell you to rely totallly on MB diagnostics and work. These are defective parts that have killed people and are going to continue to kill people. Its going to take the right person to die and then all hell is going to (brake loose) and everyone will be saying I told you so. I just came back from the stealership after receiving the Red screen of death. Mercedes informed me that my pump had failed and even though it was still under the 10yr warranty, the part of my pump that failed was not. Something about it not displaying the right fault code. They did a very poor job at attempting to explain to me that although the pump was bad and needed to be replaced they were not liable for the replacement and quoted me 1800.00 to do the job. I have contacted the BBB in my state to see if they can assist. From all the post it doesn't look like I'm going to get anywhere. MB is a big powerful corporation. MB cars that have this high end technology were really designed for ultra rich people who don't care about how much something cost. It's not a middle class or lower class car and this why they could care less when a peasant complains or dies. Its life. Get over it!

kajtek1

Can you post copy of work order here with your name removed?
Would be interesting to see what exactly they found.
BBB is a puppet that will not get you anything.
I would call MBUSA and ask them for assistance.

jhorandc

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Is it fair to state that at some limit of x brake applications, all SBC's will give the BRAKE warning? Or are there MB cars with high mileage, heavy use that never have their SBC's go bad? Should one look at this in the same manner as a timing belt replacement i.e. many car manufacturer's strongly advise replacment after 7 to 10 years?

kajtek1

SBC is giving a long warning.
One member admit to really test it and after about a month of driving with white warning, he's got red warning.
Another month of driving and computer put car in limp mode.
Is 2 months enough warning for you?
I think what is misleading is the "Brake - visit workshop" message that scares drivers.
Would it be " you have a month to service your brake pump" that would make totally different perception.

Russell Ormerod

There are no better diagnostics than mercedes diagnostics period! Don't blame the car or the diagnostics because the person operating it does not know what they doing. Correct they are very complex systems and many people think you can just buy a diagnosis machine and diy everthing. Good luck to you! People complain about SBC and say how it's going to kill someone. Yet they looking for ways to extend the counter to get more life out of a system that was tested to be safe until the warning is displayed and for a period of time after that. You want reliable brakes renew SBC when the warning is displayed. When your brakes fail and you sue MB the first thing they going to look at is the SBC data. They will soon see if counters have been extended.

Russell Ormerod

I would say yes after x amount of brake applications you would be getting close to end of life. But because other factors are involved this number varies between 5 and 600000 applications

jhorandc

===============
Is the code C249F the indie gave me an MB STAR code or other? Is there a service code the dealer uses to determine whether they just upload new software or replace? I have an appt tomorrow at a local MB dealer.

cmriv

You sound like a moron man. I'm not saying that in a douchey way at all, but you do. "most of the people advising on here work for mb" this may be true, but isn't it in our interest to advise you facts about a repair procedure that HAVE/HAS to be done with MB diagnostic equipment? You make it seem like people are trying to steer others in the wrong direction. It's not like you can use a MODUS or SOLUS edge and properly replace the unit, so MB employee or not facts are facts (MB diag equipment is needed to replace sbc unit properly)

Can you find a article or a scenario where somone has actually died from sbc failing? There's alot of he say she say i can't have my way in this thread, and like you said, get over it, it's life! If you stood behind that i'm sure i wouldn't since some haterade coming from your tone, mostly due to the fact your situation is not replaceable under warranty which is justifiable but still, chill. Mercedes isn't geared for the rich or poor, you can purchase a 30K$ cla or you can get a 245k$ v12 s coupe, the choice is yours. Keep in mind your e class brand new was 55-70K dollars. It isn't a civic.

MB mole talk? How exactly is a mechanical/electronic/hydraulic powered part that gets used every time vehicle is driven or "can" is woken up not a "wear and tear" item? Couple that with the fact that people are tripping about a 1800$ repair almost 10+ years later on a part that gave you a fair freaking warning that it is or will fail soon?

As for your Stealership scenario, the dealership you went to is retarded, dealerships make money when doing warranty repairs so why they claim the part that failed on your unit doesn't constitute for replacement is beyond me. When the fault code is processed what exactly did the sds say? It typically says program unit or replace unit... There's no in between and there also aren't any criterias that have to be met if the daig equipment states to replace the unit, you just replace it.

Alot of people have irrelevant facts and stories about sbc, simply read this thread. The morale of the story is, if you drive a car with sbc expect to have to replace the unit, you aren't special and don't get special treatment, it's going to need to be replaced, no one said buy this sbc equipped vehicle or die. 1. instrument cluster states reduce brake/visit workshop ect. 2. go to dealership, either get it flashed or see if warranty can foot the bill. If not, find one rebuilt and get it installed by someone who has the mb software/diag equipment to do so. This talk about punches and life span is like eating a bag of d!cks. I've seen units replaced with 45000 miles on the clock and some units get replaced at 13 years 185000 miles.

I'm not sure what consumers want. They wan't the Mb lifestyle and the nice looking car but when it comes down to pulling greenbacks out everyone throws a hissey fit. Like damned if you do, sbc needs update flash unit, damned if you don't, buy a used E class with sbc. The writing is on the wall with this product, has been ever since the first automobile was built. There are alot of poser consumers out here who praise MB all day when everything is going right and they have no issues but the second something isn't right they are the same ones rolling the product under the bus and this thread is a prime example.

Props to the OP, who i spoke with and gave insight to, and the people chiming in getting there unit repaired correctly and not complaining or trying to find a loophole and asking questions in a non condescending manner, seriously those are good consumers. It's the bitter ones who bought the car and are upset because they have to put money into it, like wait what did you expect? tisk tisk, choices

kajtek1

IMHO when somebody has commercial interest on the forum, yet he pose as fellow MB enthusiast, he is the moron.
Professional repairman will always have different principals and different tools to work with.
I don't work in car repair, but in home repair and I am not taking chances with substandard materials becouse it makes no economical sense to me.
Car DIY on other hand is totally different story. I don't mind redo the job 2-3 times to avoid spending $500 for OEM part.
Doubt even cheap indy would go for that.
At least your teacher has a foot note spamming with his DAS system. You pose for someone who you are not at all.

DDScott72

Here are the exact fault codes from MB C2131, C26BB, C26DE, C25D4. Thanks in advance...

kajtek1

DDScott. You can google those codes and you will find that most of them indicate low hydraulic pressure.
Most likely your SBC motor has wear out brushes, but even brushes are 99 cent item, the application is not something anybody would consider DIY.
So at this point our commercial spammers are right >> this is the item you will need SD at least for reset.
I posted how I am planning to deal with issue above, but my way is not something that has to work for everybody.
Your choice is to study the subject in topic above, or pay up at stealers.
Good luck.

DDScott72

My used SBC pump came in today. I am going to replace it myself. Its a pretty easy job. There was a company that started to post the DIY repair on youtube but MB got to them and bought them out and they did not finish the repair video. No way they are going to allow someone to put up a free video of a repair that they charge thousands of dollars for and still might no fix the problem. Its no different than then the bogust replacement video for the rear airmatic shocks. Breaking down the entire rear end when it was really only a few bolts and a 45 minute job at best. Once I complete the job and have everything working properly I'm going to finish where the youtube video left off. Ignorance can be fixed....Thanks for the help. I'll keep everyone posted. Morons are people too

Russell Ormerod

Don't believe everything you see on youtube!

DDScott72

I don't, but I have common sense and I am very familiar with car repair. MB is a little different but fundamentally the same. Those technicians they have working there don't attend MIT and barely have HS diplomas. Not that there is anything wrong with that, but I'm starting to realize MB services are overkill. I can tear up my own car. Its paid for. Its all trial and error no different than at the stealership. They misdiagnose cars all the time with there fancy equipment. I'm going to give it a try. My brakes are already hazardous as a result of defective craftsmanship, so what do I have to lose. MB allows people to drive off there lot daily because they cant afford to have repairs done. You dont see them offering free repairs. People have to do whats best for them. I dont have any confidence in MB doing right by me. They just care about making the sale and getting that commission.

Russell Ormerod

You right! the right equipment means nothing with the wrong technician behind it. Give me the fanciest heart machine I still would not be able to diagnose your heart condition ! Mercedes is not an easy car to diagnose without great understanding of the systems. Good luck in replacing your SBC unit I am sure you will suceed. I hope you have DAS nearby because you going to need it to activate SBC.