saffrontiger

Please see link. Hopefully this will encourage other manufacturers to bring over their diesel lineup. Comments/dialogue encouraged under this thread.

http://www.autointell-news.com/News-...p-15-04-p8.htm

Green E-300 DT

Can we hear a loud Amen?

saffrontiger

Without the hysteria of global market stability, I do think we will hit $3/gal in the US sooner than anticipated. I realize that other countries, such as our European friends pay much higher rates but that is very much related with taxation. As for North Sea reserves, Gulf of Mexico exploration, reliable Saudi intel on reserves, middle east turmoil and disputed rights to the central asian reserves and exploration and geographics of pipelines we are in for one hell of a ride in the upcoming decade. Answer...Diesel. I dare say, hybrids as well. Clean diesel technology is here but needs to be marketed on a much grander scale. Engine longevity, engine power and of course fuel economy are all indicators that diesel's time has come. Now, lets see if auto mnfctr's will listen.

Oslo

Doesn't diesel come from the same sources? Your correct when you say that the high fuel costs here in Europe comes from taxation. The diesel is still below gas prices, but as soon as diesel become more common, I'm convinced that they will raise the taxes on diesel.

ps.: I'm already configuring my next MB (due in 9 months). And this will be a diesel!

saffrontiger

yes, diesel does come from the same source yet it's energy yield is much higher without extensive refining. In a 42 gallon barrel of crude oil that is comprised of a number of products, 9.2 gallons consist of distillate fuel. Of that, only a portion consists of diesel fuel as well as home heating oil.

BudC

Maybe it'll entice BMW to bring in some of their diesels.

Baby Jocko

Absolutely! There was a brief diesel craze back in the early 1980's. Diesel prices quickly soared above premium gas prices. And, it was still hard to find. I remember being caught roaming the area around Newark Airport in search for diesel fuel. It was a horrible feeling passing scores of gas stations while knowing that my car could stop at any moment. That convinced me (along with the sluggishness, vibration, and noise) to never buy a diesel-fueled car again.

I'm still wondering what motivates Americans to buy a diesel today? Mileage perhaps? Because, the comparatively low cost of diesel can be evanescent.

Green E-300 DT

Evanescent . . vanishing, or fading away. Had to go to Websters for that one!

Conversly, I would ask what motivates anyone to buy a gas powered MBZ?

Diesel is now plentiful, and there is not the problem we all encountered back when. I had my first diesel in 1966.

EPA ratings of 27 city/37 highway plus rather high useable torque of 369 ft/lb (30 ft/lb more than your E-500) at only 1800 up to 2600 are just two of the many reasons. The car is almost always within that rpm range, so there really is not any reason to have to kick it hard enough to cause the trans to downshift. Most people cannot tell when inside a new CDIs that they are indeed riding in a diesel, and when they drive one, they always comment on how responsive they are at any speed.

You seem interested in CDIs or you wouldn't be here commenting. Why not test drive one and perhaps discover what you have been missing?

They've come a long way baby and are Not your grandfathers' diesel any longer.

The differences between my original '61 190Db and the CDIs are greater than that of a Model "T" and any new Ford four banger. The only thing those two MBZs have in common is that they both use number diesel.

alewifebp

I think that all have made some good points here. All in the quest to get better gas mileage. But, we do have to ask ourselves, will the extra cost of the cars themselves over gas equivalents be enough to make it worthwhile, especially considering that a lot of luxury cars are leased.

I do feel, at least for the US, that a hybrid design makes much more sense. Excellent fuel economy, and in fact, better fuel economy in city driving, which given the traffic density of NJ and other metropolitan areas, is mainly the type of driving I encounter. After hearing that a hybrid Lexus LS may be available when my lease is up on the E may possibly give me an incentive to go to hybrid. I too do not want to be in the position of not being able to find a diesel gas station easily.

I wonder if anyone else has any data on this, but if I remember correctly, here in NJ, when gas prices were really low, I didn't see diesel being that low at all, and in fact seemed to be higher at some stations. I could be really off base here, so please, if anyone has any data to prove me wrong...

In order for diesel cars to be successful in the US, mainstream manufacturers need to step up and offer them in large quantities. Only then can we guarantee that the majority of gas stations would have diesel fuel, and it won't be considered a novelty.

saffrontiger

Well said Green! As for the current 05 CDI, Baby Jocko, I would invite you to take one for a test drive. Absolutley stunning. Barely any noise, or clatter. No detectable diesel smell. No cabin vibration. What it does have is torque, lots of it, great fuel economy and engine longevity. I am planning to pass this on to my kids after 15 years. Diesel in the 80's possibly was the biggest detriment to emerging clean diesel technology and current applications. Let me knwo what you think after you have taken it for a spin.
Jay

glojo

I realise that you are solely refering to the US market, but perhaps they might choose the 320CDI because it is just TWO decibels louder than the 320 petrol engine when at tick over. From then on the CDI is quieter. Perhaps they choose the CDI because it out accelerates the petrol 320. Also when you get low sulphur diesel you might then start getting the service intervals that we have in Europe, 20,000 plus miles.

It is strange that the US has 'marked up' the diesel engined vehicles. Most of Europe offer the diesel engine as a cheaper option over its petrol equivalent, and with the same specifications.

Hopefully when the quality of the fuel improves you will see every forecourt offering diesel. The CDI over here certainly does NOT smell of diesel in fact in has a 'sweet smelling' odour. Even Jaguar now offer a diesel powered vehicle and someone once pointed out that in some countries Mercedes-Benz sell a C class AMG diesel!!!!

Jensen Button and Tiffiney Dell once raced against each other in 3ltr BMW's. Button had the petrol whilst Dell had the diesel. Sadly Button got to the front at the first bend and from then on blocked the diesel. Wake up sir, and join the rest of the world in the diesel 21st century.

Are you a vertically challenged, ginger haired 'Jock' by any chance (Bar-room English humour coming to the fore) Sorry Fastbuck

Regards
From dusk at Torquay
John

Green E-300 DT

Jay, I agree 100 percent!

My '99 has only 244 ft/lb torque, and it is a powerhouse. Can't count how many times people have tried to pass me on the right side on the interstate, and knowing that they plan on cutting me off, I will just tickle it a little, and because it can jump so quickly at highway speeds, all of a sudden, they don't have enough room to make that unsafe move. Simply amazing how responsive mine is at any rpm, and I know the newer CDIs are even more so because of the extra 125 ft/lb the later CDI engine has.

Can't wait until I can order one ED.

BTW Jay, who is giving the best deals over and above the ED price?
I know I can order from any dealer anywhere, take care of all the paperwork via Fed-Ex, and then after taking ED delivery, have it shipped to any dealer for US delivery. Correct me if I am wrong!

DWP

Since when does not having enough room to make that unsafe move (cutting back into the left lane) stop those folks? The fact that I've accelerated so that I'm riding the bumper of the car ahead at 10' distance, at 60 mph, doesn't stop those clowns from trying to stuff their car into the 10' gap. It's like, "let me in or we'll both be in a multi-car accident, your call."

Now, back to our previously-scheduled diesel praisefest programming.

khaug

Alas, a national news story this weekend highlighted the fact that diesel fuel demand has risen faster than gasoline demand, and prices have followed suit.

Since we ordered our CDI in late June, I've watched diesel prices creep upwards toward parity with regular gasoline. As I write this, the corner Shell station is getting $1.879 for diesel and $1.889 for regular gasoline. I'm confident that by the time our CDI gets here (~early November), diesel fuel will be more expensive.

I'll try to console myself with the fact that prices in the USA are still hugely lower than in Europe, but that only does so much good :-(

BudC

Just be thankful you don't live on the west coast!

shoes

I pay $2.15 for diesel in CA and when I fill my CL with premium, I pay $2.39.

Green E-300 DT

By having the ability (torque) to be able to easily accerate or jump guickly enough to close that gap so that the car that is attempting to pass me on the right and cut in front of me before rear-ending the car he is rapidly closing on in that lane, the right lane, without having to make my car downshift which I think isn't all that good for the tranny, is the point I was trying to make.

Down here on the I-215 in Riverside County where the speed limit is 70 mph, you have these clowns that, even though the flow will be in the 75 - 80 mph range, want to drive 90 mph or even faster by weaving in and out of all lanes unsafely, and these are the types I simply love to make brake with the outstanding torque available with my diesel. Because they don't expect it, it is all the more enjoyable to me. It is worth the p'd off look on their faces when they discover they've been had by an old man in a six year old plain-Jane white four door E-300DT.

Green E-300 DT

Thanks for pointing out the excuse that Big Oil is using this time around.

There are stations here in Southern California that are already charging more for diesel than they do for premimum gasoline. I've seen the difference be as much as 20 cents per gallon. I felt lucky lately to find good Unifuel for $2.099.

TPAbnz

Thanks for a thorough reply, glojo.