2012 E350 - Blown motor with less than 1000 miles! What are my options?
MBWorld Fanatic!
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1953 300 Adenauer, 1971 300 SEL 6.3, 1975 600, 1978 450 6.9
First of all, why don't you say why the advice is bad/wrong - that might actually help the OP and validate the point you're trying to make. Secondly, not all lemon lawyers are paid on a contingency, some are paid a flat fee, others have hourly rates - a quick google search will reveal this much. If you're position is that my previous advice was wrong because all lemon lawyers are paid on contingency, then you're point is moot.
While I agree that MBZ is at fault and should compensate the OP for his loss, my point is that they will probably fight it to the bitter end. If you knew anything about lawsuits, you'd know that they waste time and create a lot of needless stress. In my opinion, I'd prefer to have MBZ insure and warranty everything on the car for life, rather than give me a new one that I'll eventually have to spend considerable amounts of money on.
While I agree that MBZ is at fault and should compensate the OP for his loss, my point is that they will probably fight it to the bitter end. If you knew anything about lawsuits, you'd know that they waste time and create a lot of needless stress. In my opinion, I'd prefer to have MBZ insure and warranty everything on the car for life, rather than give me a new one that I'll eventually have to spend considerable amounts of money on.
Lemon lawyers have contacts within the industry and know when to take a case. This case will not result in anyone going to court. The lawyer will file suit but that is just proforma to "get this on the books."
While state laws vary, the basic lemon law is simple. If your car has been at the dealership for the same repair for over 30 days you fall within the protection of the law if the issue is safety related. another way of falling under the law is multiple (usually 3+) attempts at repairing the same problem.
The problem here is not Mercedes, but the dealership that doesn't care about customer service. A "free to the OP" lemon lawyer will fix this in no time.
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 10,557
Likes: 24
From: Earth
Porsche Macan S SportDesign / Ex M-B's: 11 & 10 & 06 E350's, 02 S500
Actually, Luxury Car sales are soaring this year, and M-B is having its best year in the U.S ever, I believe, not to mention, currently in the lead for Luxury Car manufacturers in the U.S (would be their first "Sales victory" in a long time here, after the quality disasters of the late 90's till mid-2000's gave market share to Lexus and BMW). As always, it's hard to gauge how the mass economy is doing as results in different sectors will always be mixed. It seems that Luxury items are doing very well right now (being that in times like these, the "rich" can still make money).
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From: USA
Multiple
Actually, Luxury Car sales are soaring this year, and M-B is having its best year in the U.S ever, I believe, not to mention, currently in the lead for Luxury Car manufacturers in the U.S (would be their first "Sales victory" in a long time here, after the quality disasters of the late 90's till mid-2000's gave market share to Lexus and BMW).
"BMW Projected to Beat Mercedes in U.S. 2011 Luxury Vehicle Sales
By Tim Higgins on January 06, 2012
Jan. 5 (Bloomberg) -- Bayerische Motoren Werke AG’s BMW brand may have outsold Daimler AG’s Mercedes-Benz last month to cement its victory as the top-selling luxury brand for the year, according to an estimate of their sales.
BMW’s U.S. sales rose 16 percent to 27,000 in December compared to a year earlier, Autodata Corp. estimated yesterday. BMW and Mercedes “are experiencing year-end sales reporting complications,” Autodata said in an e-mail yesterday. The results for those manufacturers were estimated using “credible industry sources,” Autodata said.
Both sides have delayed releasing their results as they wait for the other to report, said two people familiar with the situation.
BMW, with total U.S. 2011 sales estimated at 248,073, outsold Mercedes by 2,804 vehicles, according to Autodata estimates."
http://www.businessweek.com/news/201...cle-sales.html
Edited to add: And here's another update from June 1, 2012 in Automotive News:
"Mercedes pads luxury lead over BMW with 19% gain
June 1, 2012 - 3:57 pm ET
DETROIT (Bloomberg) -- Daimler AG's Mercedes-Benz held onto the U.S. luxury-vehicle sales lead for the year over BMW's namesake brand, as Mercedes deliveries in May jumped 19 percent.
Toyota Motor Corp.'s Lexus brand, rebounding from inventory shortages after last year's earthquake and tsunami in Japan, soared 74 percent to 21,463.
U.S. sales of Mercedes vehicles rose to 22,515 last month while BMW deliveries increased 7.3 percent to 22,168, according to statements today from the companies. Lexus and Mercedes-Benz increased incentives 37 percent and 23 percent compared to BMW's 0.8 percent gain, according to researcher TrueCar.com.
"In a lot of the key markets, leasing can make up three-quarters of sales," Jesse Toprak, a TrueCar analyst, said in an interview. Luxury-vehicle incentives often take the form of lease offers.
BMW and Mercedes both overtook Lexus last year, with BMW emerging as the top U.S. auto luxury brand. BMW finished the first quarter of 2012 with 36 more deliveries than Mercedes."
Read more: http://www.autonews.com/article/2012...#ixzz20RO4AlnX
Last edited by rjm; Jul 12, 2012 at 04:18 PM.
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 10,557
Likes: 24
From: Earth
Porsche Macan S SportDesign / Ex M-B's: 11 & 10 & 06 E350's, 02 S500
Yes, in 2011, BMW beat M-B very slightly in sales, it literally came down to sales figures in the last month, as I think M-B was in the lead in November, or about tied.
However, I'm talking about 2012 so far, M-B is in the lead from what I understand (not helped that the F30 3-Series is weirdly selling drastically less than the E90 did last year, as 3 sales figures are down quite a bit), which would give them their first sales "win" since they got overtook by Lexus over a decade or so ago (Lexus' first "loss" was last year to both BMW and M-B).
I for one want BMW to sell more volume, as more M-B's on the roads doesn't make them more desirable (the opposite for me).
EDIT: Yep, M-B pulled ahead to "lead" so far this year (look at M-B *Brand* VS BMW Brand, as Mini sales and Sprinter sales don't count. M-B is at 128K and BMW at 126K)
However, I'm talking about 2012 so far, M-B is in the lead from what I understand (not helped that the F30 3-Series is weirdly selling drastically less than the E90 did last year, as 3 sales figures are down quite a bit), which would give them their first sales "win" since they got overtook by Lexus over a decade or so ago (Lexus' first "loss" was last year to both BMW and M-B).
I for one want BMW to sell more volume, as more M-B's on the roads doesn't make them more desirable (the opposite for me).
EDIT: Yep, M-B pulled ahead to "lead" so far this year (look at M-B *Brand* VS BMW Brand, as Mini sales and Sprinter sales don't count. M-B is at 128K and BMW at 126K)
Last edited by K-A; Jul 12, 2012 at 06:24 PM.
Super Member
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 764
Likes: 10
From: North Carolina
2010 E350, 2015 S550
Exactly what does your post have to do with the problem the OP has expressed?
Last edited by mnje350; Jul 12, 2012 at 08:42 PM.
Junior Member
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 23
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SL550, E350 Coupe
While you can always find a lawyer that will take your money, good lemon lawyers work on contingency. Why? Because they can make more money. During their initial discussion they will evaluate the case and decide if they will work with you. In the OPs case this is a no-brainer and most first year law students can get the OP a new car out of this.
Lemon lawyers have contacts within the industry and know when to take a case. This case will not result in anyone going to court. The lawyer will file suit but that is just proforma to "get this on the books."
While state laws vary, the basic lemon law is simple. If your car has been at the dealership for the same repair for over 30 days you fall within the protection of the law if the issue is safety related. another way of falling under the law is multiple (usually 3+) attempts at repairing the same problem.
The problem here is not Mercedes, but the dealership that doesn't care about customer service. A "free to the OP" lemon lawyer will fix this in no time.
Lemon lawyers have contacts within the industry and know when to take a case. This case will not result in anyone going to court. The lawyer will file suit but that is just proforma to "get this on the books."
While state laws vary, the basic lemon law is simple. If your car has been at the dealership for the same repair for over 30 days you fall within the protection of the law if the issue is safety related. another way of falling under the law is multiple (usually 3+) attempts at repairing the same problem.
The problem here is not Mercedes, but the dealership that doesn't care about customer service. A "free to the OP" lemon lawyer will fix this in no time.
Secondly, lawyer's don't earn more on a contingency basis unless the case is relates to personal injuries or a class action - this is neither.
OP, how is your case progressing?
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1953 300 Adenauer, 1971 300 SEL 6.3, 1975 600, 1978 450 6.9
You are wrong as a matter of fact and law. While lemon laws may appear to be relatively simple, there are specific procedures - one being that you must send a certified letter to the manufacturer saying "this is your last chance to fix the car" before the 30 day/3 attempt rule applies. If it was so simple, why would the dealer object to replacing the car to begin with? If the dealer knows he's going to lose the case, why would he spend extra money on a lawyer, when in the end he'll have to replace the car? Probably because it's more complex than the case you're making it out to be.
Secondly, lawyer's don't earn more on a contingency basis unless the case is relates to personal injuries or a class action - this is neither.
OP, how is your case progressing?
Secondly, lawyer's don't earn more on a contingency basis unless the case is relates to personal injuries or a class action - this is neither.
OP, how is your case progressing?
Your interpretation of the requirement to send a letter to the manufacturer before the lemon laws kick in is incorrect. You are correct that a part of the process includes a notification to the manufacturer but that is a procedural issue which I didn't address.
In regards to payment, I think it should be obvious that the manufacturers have deeper pockets than an individual and the attorney is more likely to get more money from the manufacturer than an invidual is willing to pay up front.
It is really quite simple - a lemon lawyer can spend ten minutes reviewing a case and can determine if he or she has a good chance at prevailing. A court filing and a few letters later and they pocket several thousand dollars - more than most consumers are willing to front to the attorney.
Of course I have simplified the process intentionally for the average consumer but the OP's case clearly seems to fit under the lemon laws.
You should also know that the OP won't be reporting back here about the outcome. Most likely, he'll just come back here with his new car.
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Newbie
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 2
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MB E350 coupe
Rebuilt the engine at 10,000 miles
I just had the engine in my 2012 E350 coupe rebuilt at 10,000 miles! Dealerinformed me about a new service bulletin when I brought the car in for the10,000 mile service. Short story is that a bad lot of wrist pins installed inthe engine will need replacement. So, three weeks later I had the car back witha rebuilt engine! They replaced the pistons, connecting rods and wrist pinsalong with every other engine gasket, seal and screw. I tryed to get MB to replace or buy back the car, but here is the letter I received:
Subject: Model: 2012 E350C
VIN: WDDKJ5
Dear Mr. Div
Please be assured that Mercedes-Benz USA, LLC (MBUSA)has reviewed your contact with our Customer Assistance Center concerning the2012 E350C bearing Vehicle Identification Number WDDKJ5.
After a thorough review of the request it was confirmedthat this vehicle doesn't qualify for refund or replacement. In additionwarranty history does not constitute a substantial impairment, nor does it reflectan unreasonable or excessive number of repair attempts. While the vehicle hashad a number of warranty repairs, it is the purpose of a warranty to allowreasonable repairs of the vehicle at no cost to the customer.
MBUSA will continue to honor all of the terms of anyremaining New Vehicle Limited Warranty.
Sincerely,
Brandon Newman
Case Manager
Not even a extention of the warranty! MB USA sucks!
Subject: Model: 2012 E350C
VIN: WDDKJ5
Dear Mr. Div
Please be assured that Mercedes-Benz USA, LLC (MBUSA)has reviewed your contact with our Customer Assistance Center concerning the2012 E350C bearing Vehicle Identification Number WDDKJ5.
After a thorough review of the request it was confirmedthat this vehicle doesn't qualify for refund or replacement. In additionwarranty history does not constitute a substantial impairment, nor does it reflectan unreasonable or excessive number of repair attempts. While the vehicle hashad a number of warranty repairs, it is the purpose of a warranty to allowreasonable repairs of the vehicle at no cost to the customer.
MBUSA will continue to honor all of the terms of anyremaining New Vehicle Limited Warranty.
Sincerely,
Brandon Newman
Case Manager
Not even a extention of the warranty! MB USA sucks!
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 345
Likes: 0
From: So Cal
2010 C300 & 2014 E350
I just had the engine in my 2012 E350 coupe rebuilt at 10,000 miles! Dealerinformed me about a new service bulletin when I brought the car in for the10,000 mile service. Short story is that a bad lot of wrist pins installed inthe engine will need replacement. So, three weeks later I had the car back witha rebuilt engine! They replaced the pistons, connecting rods and wrist pinsalong with every other engine gasket, seal and screw. I tryed to get MB to replace or buy back the car, but here is the letter I received:
Subject: Model: 2012 E350C
VIN: WDDKJ5
Dear Mr. Div
Please be assured that Mercedes-Benz USA, LLC (MBUSA)has reviewed your contact with our Customer Assistance Center concerning the2012 E350C bearing Vehicle Identification Number WDDKJ5.
After a thorough review of the request it was confirmedthat this vehicle doesn't qualify for refund or replacement. In additionwarranty history does not constitute a substantial impairment, nor does it reflectan unreasonable or excessive number of repair attempts. While the vehicle hashad a number of warranty repairs, it is the purpose of a warranty to allowreasonable repairs of the vehicle at no cost to the customer.
MBUSA will continue to honor all of the terms of anyremaining New Vehicle Limited Warranty.
Sincerely,
Brandon Newman
Case Manager
Not even a extention of the warranty! MB USA sucks!
Subject: Model: 2012 E350C
VIN: WDDKJ5
Dear Mr. Div
Please be assured that Mercedes-Benz USA, LLC (MBUSA)has reviewed your contact with our Customer Assistance Center concerning the2012 E350C bearing Vehicle Identification Number WDDKJ5.
After a thorough review of the request it was confirmedthat this vehicle doesn't qualify for refund or replacement. In additionwarranty history does not constitute a substantial impairment, nor does it reflectan unreasonable or excessive number of repair attempts. While the vehicle hashad a number of warranty repairs, it is the purpose of a warranty to allowreasonable repairs of the vehicle at no cost to the customer.
MBUSA will continue to honor all of the terms of anyremaining New Vehicle Limited Warranty.
Sincerely,
Brandon Newman
Case Manager
Not even a extention of the warranty! MB USA sucks!
Wow, I wonder if they fixed this problem with the 2013 E350?
Were you experiencing any problems with the car before they did the TSB work on it?
Newbie
Joined: Jun 2013
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MB E350 coupe
The engine was loud and sounded like the old chevy "tap". Orginally the dealer said all new 350 motors have a loud fuel injectors. The third time the dealer said the engine had a bulliten that indicated the engine was built with a bad lot of wrist pins. So, it's not a continuing problem to them - just me.
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 379
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From: middle o' ma
15 AMG S63 4-matic coupe
Actually, the reason why you keep hearing stories about people dumping MB's and going to Hyundai is because the American dream is pretty much over. The U.S economy sucks right now and people no longer can afford a brand new Mercedes. You can thank Hank Paulson and George W. Bush for that.
Now take the first flight to Hong Kong and see if you are going to find any MB at a Hyundai dealer... You won't.
Now take the first flight to Hong Kong and see if you are going to find any MB at a Hyundai dealer... You won't.
An acquaintance over in S2000 land had just bought a new Hyundai Genesis Coupe 3.8.
At 1400 miles the engine gave up the ghost.
http://www.s2ki.com/s2000/topic/9612...t__p__21846603
To make a long story short, Hyundai bellied up to the bar and made him whole. The replaced the car in it's entirety with a new one.
A repair simply fixes the vehicle but in this day of carfax where every repair gets reported, an engine swap or rebuild certainly results in significantly diminished value of the vehicle.
Really ask yourself, 2 identical vehicles are on the lot side by side, one has flawless carfax, the other has had an engine swap or rebuild. How much cheaper would the rebuild vehicle have to be before you would consider it as a better deal? or if you would be willing to buy it at all.
I really would have love to have seen the outcome but I wonder if mercedes put a gag order agreement in place as a condition of replacement.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 5,141
Likes: 1,293
From: Southern US
2010 E550, 273 Engine: 2012 S550, 278 Engine
I wish I had caught this thread last year.
An acquaintance over in S2000 land had just bought a new Hyundai Genesis Coupe 3.8.
At 1400 miles the engine gave up the ghost.
http://www.s2ki.com/s2000/topic/9612...t__p__21846603
To make a long story short, Hyundai bellied up to the bar and made him whole. The replaced the car in it's entirety with a new one.
A repair simply fixes the vehicle but in this day of carfax where every repair gets reported, an engine swap or rebuild certainly results in significantly diminished value of the vehicle.
Really ask yourself, 2 identical vehicles are on the lot side by side, one has flawless carfax, the other has had an engine swap or rebuild. How much cheaper would the rebuild vehicle have to be before you would consider it as a better deal? or if you would be willing to buy it at all.
I really would have love to have seen the outcome but I wonder if mercedes put a gag order agreement in place as a condition of replacement.
An acquaintance over in S2000 land had just bought a new Hyundai Genesis Coupe 3.8.
At 1400 miles the engine gave up the ghost.
http://www.s2ki.com/s2000/topic/9612...t__p__21846603
To make a long story short, Hyundai bellied up to the bar and made him whole. The replaced the car in it's entirety with a new one.
A repair simply fixes the vehicle but in this day of carfax where every repair gets reported, an engine swap or rebuild certainly results in significantly diminished value of the vehicle.
Really ask yourself, 2 identical vehicles are on the lot side by side, one has flawless carfax, the other has had an engine swap or rebuild. How much cheaper would the rebuild vehicle have to be before you would consider it as a better deal? or if you would be willing to buy it at all.
I really would have love to have seen the outcome but I wonder if mercedes put a gag order agreement in place as a condition of replacement.
Full engine replacement would not be a problem for me but rebuilt engine would.
Member
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 76
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None
I just spent the majority of last night and early this morning reading this thread.....but was there any conclusion from the OP as to the result? Did I miss something? I feel like I just read a fantastic novel, only to find out the last couple pages were torn out of the last chapter.....
Junior Member
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 41
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2011 E350 Arctic White
CEB - you are absolutely correct in your comment.
Any competent practitioner will give the case a quick review to determine if the case is winnable.
There are state and federal laws that allow for attorney fees with these kinds of cases. More incentive to take up such a case.
Like most on this thread, I too would like to know the end result. However, if this matter was negotiated, I wouldn't be surprised if MBUSA included a non-disclosure clause. Usually those clauses pertain to specifics of a case.
I'm sure most of us would sleep happy just knowing there was a favorable outcome for both parties?
Any competent practitioner will give the case a quick review to determine if the case is winnable.
There are state and federal laws that allow for attorney fees with these kinds of cases. More incentive to take up such a case.
Like most on this thread, I too would like to know the end result. However, if this matter was negotiated, I wouldn't be surprised if MBUSA included a non-disclosure clause. Usually those clauses pertain to specifics of a case.
I'm sure most of us would sleep happy just knowing there was a favorable outcome for both parties?
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 470
Likes: 8
From: Southern California, Orange County
2012 E350
I don't think you should be judging on your decision based just off this post. This is one of the extreme rare cases that unfortunately happened to someone. The W212 has great reliability (still being tested as its a newer gen car, but so far not bad!). Now I'm not saying that you cannot do whatever you want, but I would hate it to see someone not buy a car because of a post like this because this happens to every brand.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 2,677
Likes: 3
From: California
i535
I also thought about GS, but after getting close look I decided to do not drive. My 2010 E class had no any major mechanical problems. It has only malfunctioning in dynamic seat, and was fixed quickly. Another problem was battery gone, but it was replaced by road side assistance in matter of 15 minutes, although I waited more than an hour while they arrived. My W210 had much more serious problems. So from reliability point view I think E class is good. I owned W211 as well without any major issue as well, it had noisy fan, but I believe they dropped something in vent at time of the car preparation, It was fixed as well.
