Difference between staggered and non staggared wheels??
09-22-2012, 10:48 PM
#51
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The point was that you failed in not sounding like a braggart, and for all of your self-professed knowledge and experience, you think wider rear tires are just for looks.
Your question of what I'd be more concerned with confounds the issue. Typical. I don't do burnouts in my Mercedes, btw.
I do however occasionally punch the gas to get out of the way of what seems like a dangerous situation. If I have more traction at my drive tires in the rear, it would help keep the traction/stability control from nannying me into staying in place for perhaps a bit too long while another car is about to hit me.
Your question of what I'd be more concerned with confounds the issue. Typical. I don't do burnouts in my Mercedes, btw.
I do however occasionally punch the gas to get out of the way of what seems like a dangerous situation. If I have more traction at my drive tires in the rear, it would help keep the traction/stability control from nannying me into staying in place for perhaps a bit too long while another car is about to hit me.
The you failed to see the sarcasm in my post. You obviously haven't read a single thing I've said while here, otherwise your inane comments about preventing burnouts in your oh so overpowered MBZ would have been left on the shelf where they belong.
Where do I say it's ONLY for looks? Haven't read much about understeer and oversteer have you? Put your head back in the sand, believe what you want to, the Earth is still flat.
09-22-2012, 11:21 PM
#52
My guess is looks (I like it anyway) - however staggered or not the car will under steer since it's naturally much easier to recover from. The car is rotationally stable unlike an over steer situation where you've got the back of the car swinging out like a pendulum. Do not confuse this with power induced over steer which is what drift cars do. Rallye cars are setup (even with front or 4wd) to oversteer as it helps to point the nose of the car more quickly and sharply..
Remove your head from your *** and read what I wrote. Like where I wrote I don't do burnouts and more traction would be important in accident avoidance? You assume wider rear tires either have or don't have purpose relevant to performance/handling. Even assuming what you say about wider rear tires not having much of an effect on under/oversteer is true, wider rear tires serve more of a purpose than just looks, and its a concept that's surprisingly lost on you, what with all your experience and 500hp cars.
Maybe the problem isn't with everyone who disagrees with you, but instead you coming on here and straight off the bat going off about how much more you know or have experienced than everyone else and talking down to people. You don't teach anymore because of students' attitudes? It's always them and not you isn't it?
Last edited by brauhaus313; 09-22-2012 at 11:32 PM.
09-23-2012, 06:44 AM
#54
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I only got the 305's in the rear for looks
but it's funny: NO one has 305 on they're car around here!!
thats one thing I always look at during car shows for some reason....
but it's funny: NO one has 305 on they're car around here!!
thats one thing I always look at during car shows for some reason....
09-23-2012, 08:47 AM
#55
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Rather harsh words from someone who doesn't have an oversized ego and doesn't get offended easily.
Remove your head from your *** and read what I wrote. Like where I wrote I don't do burnouts and more traction would be important in accident avoidance? You assume wider rear tires either have or don't have purpose relevant to performance/handling. Even assuming what you say about wider rear tires not having much of an effect on under/oversteer is true, wider rear tires serve more of a purpose than just looks, and its a concept that's surprisingly lost on you, what with all your experience and 500hp cars.
Maybe the problem isn't with everyone who disagrees with you, but instead you coming on here and straight off the bat going off about how much more you know or have experienced than everyone else and talking down to people. You don't teach anymore because of students' attitudes? It's always them and not you isn't it?
Remove your head from your *** and read what I wrote. Like where I wrote I don't do burnouts and more traction would be important in accident avoidance? You assume wider rear tires either have or don't have purpose relevant to performance/handling. Even assuming what you say about wider rear tires not having much of an effect on under/oversteer is true, wider rear tires serve more of a purpose than just looks, and its a concept that's surprisingly lost on you, what with all your experience and 500hp cars.
Maybe the problem isn't with everyone who disagrees with you, but instead you coming on here and straight off the bat going off about how much more you know or have experienced than everyone else and talking down to people. You don't teach anymore because of students' attitudes? It's always them and not you isn't it?
whining, I hear whining, what could it be?
I don't teach because I want to stay alive.. people like you don't understand even the slightest fundamentals of HP driving and refuse to listen to those that do. Every year I see guys like you backwards into a wall complaining of this or that when it is THEM.
So I will implement the ignore button same as I do when I hear, my car did this and my car did that, your car didn't do anything you hadn't asked it to, garbage input garbage output...
09-23-2012, 05:26 PM
#56
Haha, okay. After all that technical knowledge you spewed, its now down to calling me a whiner. Funny how you haven't said anything to me except saying I do burnouts in my Benz and know nothing about anything, but you don't have anything to say about more rear wheel traction helping real drivers in the real world avoid accidents.
Sure, it's "guys like me" and not you.
Sure, it's "guys like me" and not you.
09-24-2012, 06:18 AM
#57
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Gad I love the ignore feature... did anyone hear anything? A little buzzing perhaps? Maybe it's because bauhaus13's head is so far under the sand it's muffled? Oh no it's the squeal of spinning tires...
Ok I'm done
Ok I'm done
Last edited by norcal_cyclist; 09-24-2012 at 07:43 AM.
09-24-2012, 02:45 PM
#58
Hahaha, so infantile. It all makes sense now. All the internet bragging, sensitive ego, incohesive arguments, and resulting personal attacks. Dollars to donuts "Vtec yo!" has been part of your vocabulary.
Immaturity usually is why people assume they're better than others. Hope you are done, but I doubt it. Seems like you just can't help yourself.
Immaturity usually is why people assume they're better than others. Hope you are done, but I doubt it. Seems like you just can't help yourself.
09-25-2012, 12:38 AM
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2012 W212 E350 Bluetec
All else being equal, widening the rear tires is going to increase a car's propensity to understeer. That's simply physics.
OP, when mass-produced street cars have staggered setups, it is usually for looks, and yes all our cars have some understeer built in.
OP, when mass-produced street cars have staggered setups, it is usually for looks, and yes all our cars have some understeer built in.
09-25-2012, 04:20 AM
#61
All things considered, looks would be pretty far down the line of reasons why car companies would put wider rear tires on mass produced cars. They're more expensive, affect fuel economy, and reduce tire life.
09-25-2012, 04:40 AM
#62
09-25-2012, 08:22 AM
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dear mods. CLOSE IT!!
09-25-2012, 03:46 PM
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2013 E350 Wagon; 2009 328 xi
09-25-2012, 04:10 PM
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09-25-2012, 06:39 PM
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they never listen to me anyway......unless I offend one, THEN they listen
09-25-2012, 08:46 PM
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'10 E350, '03 Excursion 7.3 PSD
Well now I guess I'll set the record straight.
1)The stagered wheel setup is primaily a cosmetic feature added to most of the sport package cars. The wider tires will add some degree of traction but nothing of significance to the average driver.
2)All M-B's are designed with neutral to light understeer from the factory because it's safer for all but the very best drivers.
3) The parking brake shoes & drum are very small and do not have the capacity to effective while driving the vehlice...they will overheat, burn & fade away very quickly.
This is all based on 12 years of M-B technical training as a dealership master tech.
1)The stagered wheel setup is primaily a cosmetic feature added to most of the sport package cars. The wider tires will add some degree of traction but nothing of significance to the average driver.
2)All M-B's are designed with neutral to light understeer from the factory because it's safer for all but the very best drivers.
3) The parking brake shoes & drum are very small and do not have the capacity to effective while driving the vehlice...they will overheat, burn & fade away very quickly.
This is all based on 12 years of M-B technical training as a dealership master tech.
09-25-2012, 09:39 PM
#69
MBWorld Fanatic!
Well now I guess I'll set the record straight.
1)The stagered wheel setup is primaily a cosmetic feature added to most of the sport package cars. The wider tires will add some degree of traction but nothing of significance to the average driver.
2)All M-B's are designed with neutral to light understeer from the factory because it's safer for all but the very best drivers.
3) The parking brake shoes & drum are very small and do not have the capacity to effective while driving the vehlice...they will overheat, burn & fade away very quickly.
This is all based on 12 years of M-B technical training as a dealership master tech.
1)The stagered wheel setup is primaily a cosmetic feature added to most of the sport package cars. The wider tires will add some degree of traction but nothing of significance to the average driver.
2)All M-B's are designed with neutral to light understeer from the factory because it's safer for all but the very best drivers.
3) The parking brake shoes & drum are very small and do not have the capacity to effective while driving the vehlice...they will overheat, burn & fade away very quickly.
This is all based on 12 years of M-B technical training as a dealership master tech.
Wide tire serves two main purposes on a track race car. It improves handling as the wider tire leans less at turns providing more precise steering. The other is it gives better mileage before tire change.
For the friction force between the two surfaces the formula simply includes the friction coefficient and the force between the two surfaces. This is the force and NOT the pressure between them. If the friction coefficient is the same regardless of the pressure then the friction force is the same regardless of the tire width as long as the force is the same.
In a true race car wider tire makes the tire last a lot longer as it allows tire to operate in lower temp but what comes to our Benzes running about 80-90 mph max the wider rear tire does not mean rat's *** other than looks.
Last edited by Arrie; 09-25-2012 at 09:47 PM.
09-25-2012, 10:02 PM
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09-26-2012, 09:14 PM
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LOL, and an insult to Donkey Kong
