Timing Belt/Waterpump Change on W212
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 102
Likes: 1
From: Toronto, ON
2010 E550 4Matic, P1, P2
Timing Belt/Waterpump Change on W212
Hi all,
I have about 93,000KM on my 2010 E550, had it in for service "A" a few weeks ago and was told the spark plugs needed to be replaced. I went ahead and had the dealer do that for about 350 bucks. (Less then I thought) but it got me thinking. What is the suggestion time for the water pump and timing belt?
I have about 93,000KM on my 2010 E550, had it in for service "A" a few weeks ago and was told the spark plugs needed to be replaced. I went ahead and had the dealer do that for about 350 bucks. (Less then I thought) but it got me thinking. What is the suggestion time for the water pump and timing belt?
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 102
Likes: 1
From: Toronto, ON
2010 E550 4Matic, P1, P2
Super Member
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 703
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From: Boston Area
2021 Mojave Silver E450, 2024 Black on Black Jaguar F-pace P400, 2011 335d (RIP), 2010 E350 (sold)
Please don't take this the wrong way Sean, this is not a dig but a situation that I simply don't understand...
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 431
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From: Portsmouth, VA
2010 E350, Sold 1998 C230
Waterpumps can last 70-100k miles or lots longer. The reason they are changed out with a timing belt is that the cost of the pump is relatively cheap compared to the labor involved to do it and since its already opened up, most people will do it and not worry about it.
Generally when they start to fail you will see a telltale stream of drips of coolant or smell it. On my older c230, I started to smell it when she had around 80k on her, but she was 16 years old too. Besides the serpentine belt, the pump unbolts from the front of the engine. Nothing all that involved compared to a timing belt job.
Generally when they start to fail you will see a telltale stream of drips of coolant or smell it. On my older c230, I started to smell it when she had around 80k on her, but she was 16 years old too. Besides the serpentine belt, the pump unbolts from the front of the engine. Nothing all that involved compared to a timing belt job.
Senior Member
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 255
Likes: 36
From: Las Vegas
2012 E350 sedan
This is the right answer
Waterpumps can last 70-100k miles or lots longer. The reason they are changed out with a timing belt is that the cost of the pump is relatively cheap compared to the labor involved to do it and since its already opened up, most people will do it and not worry about it.
Generally when they start to fail you will see a telltale stream of drips of coolant or smell it. On my older c230, I started to smell it when she had around 80k on her, but she was 16 years old too. Besides the serpentine belt, the pump unbolts from the front of the engine. Nothing all that involved compared to a timing belt job.
Generally when they start to fail you will see a telltale stream of drips of coolant or smell it. On my older c230, I started to smell it when she had around 80k on her, but she was 16 years old too. Besides the serpentine belt, the pump unbolts from the front of the engine. Nothing all that involved compared to a timing belt job.
I have never owned any brand of car that had a replacement interval specified for the water pump
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Joined: Apr 2013
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From: Sidney, BC
2009 SLK55 AMG. & 2022 GLA250 4Matic
I have never changed a water pump on any of my 7 MB cars.
The youngest and lowest mileage car is the current 2011 E350. The oldest is the current 2001 SLK320 and the one I drove the furthest was a W124 E320 DOHC inline 6 to 300,000 km.
The youngest and lowest mileage car is the current 2011 E350. The oldest is the current 2001 SLK320 and the one I drove the furthest was a W124 E320 DOHC inline 6 to 300,000 km.
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Joined: Mar 2015
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w212
Here it goes.... Are M272, M273, M276, and M278 (engine designations i.e. your engines in the W212) do not have timing belts, they have chains which are only serviced when damage occurs. This is usually rare.
Now lets use a subaru for example here, however, there are others that also use a timing belt rather then chain. Now, on a subaru the belt is serviced ever 91k miles i believe. This is to prevent it from breaking. A rubber belt is worn over time, stretches, the auto tensioner maxes out, and thus will eventually break. If this happens to an interference motor the pistons will contact the valves and cause a lot of damage usually remedied by motor replacement as the most cost effective repair. But that's another thread. Our motors are interference motors by the way so timing is critical and this is why the chain is always a better option for engineers. So... the confusion here is based on this logic. On a subaru (and some others) the timing belt drives the water pump. It is recommended to replace the water pump while servicing the timing belt solely because it is cost effective in the long run- not because the water pump is upon a service interval. Its just a smart move because most of the labor is done to get at the pump- may as well replace it while you're in there. Also, if the pump fails down the road it could very well take out your new belt and destroy your motor.
Our water pumps are pretty good, rarely fail, and are driven by the serpentine belt (poly v-belt). This belt is replaced when it looks worn. Your dealer will recommend it when its ready or just ask to have it checked for piece of mind.
Now lets use a subaru for example here, however, there are others that also use a timing belt rather then chain. Now, on a subaru the belt is serviced ever 91k miles i believe. This is to prevent it from breaking. A rubber belt is worn over time, stretches, the auto tensioner maxes out, and thus will eventually break. If this happens to an interference motor the pistons will contact the valves and cause a lot of damage usually remedied by motor replacement as the most cost effective repair. But that's another thread. Our motors are interference motors by the way so timing is critical and this is why the chain is always a better option for engineers. So... the confusion here is based on this logic. On a subaru (and some others) the timing belt drives the water pump. It is recommended to replace the water pump while servicing the timing belt solely because it is cost effective in the long run- not because the water pump is upon a service interval. Its just a smart move because most of the labor is done to get at the pump- may as well replace it while you're in there. Also, if the pump fails down the road it could very well take out your new belt and destroy your motor.
Our water pumps are pretty good, rarely fail, and are driven by the serpentine belt (poly v-belt). This belt is replaced when it looks worn. Your dealer will recommend it when its ready or just ask to have it checked for piece of mind.
Senior Member
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 255
Likes: 36
From: Las Vegas
2012 E350 sedan
Agree. There are a few cars where the pump will likely fail before the timing belt
The Mk I Audi TT (I owned 2, an 01 and an 04) was notorious for its OEM plastic impeller on the water pump failing and destroying the timing belt. The tensioner was not a 100K part either. As a result, owners were advised to replace everything every 5 years or 60K. Audi went to a metal impeller and timing chain on later Mk 2 models. (I now own a 2011).
Here it goes.... Are M272, M273, M276, and M278 (engine designations i.e. your engines in the W212) do not have timing belts, they have chains which are only serviced when damage occurs. This is usually rare.
Now lets use a subaru for example here, however, there are others that also use a timing belt rather then chain. Now, on a subaru the belt is serviced ever 91k miles i believe. This is to prevent it from breaking. A rubber belt is worn over time, stretches, the auto tensioner maxes out, and thus will eventually break. If this happens to an interference motor the pistons will contact the valves and cause a lot of damage usually remedied by motor replacement as the most cost effective repair. But that's another thread. Our motors are interference motors by the way so timing is critical and this is why the chain is always a better option for engineers. So... the confusion here is based on this logic. On a subaru (and some others) the timing belt drives the water pump. It is recommended to replace the water pump while servicing the timing belt solely because it is cost effective in the long run- not because the water pump is upon a service interval. Its just a smart move because most of the labor is done to get at the pump- may as well replace it while you're in there. Also, if the pump fails down the road it could very well take out your new belt and destroy your motor.
Our water pumps are pretty good, rarely fail, and are driven by the serpentine belt (poly v-belt). This belt is replaced when it looks worn. Your dealer will recommend it when its ready or just ask to have it checked for piece of mind.
Now lets use a subaru for example here, however, there are others that also use a timing belt rather then chain. Now, on a subaru the belt is serviced ever 91k miles i believe. This is to prevent it from breaking. A rubber belt is worn over time, stretches, the auto tensioner maxes out, and thus will eventually break. If this happens to an interference motor the pistons will contact the valves and cause a lot of damage usually remedied by motor replacement as the most cost effective repair. But that's another thread. Our motors are interference motors by the way so timing is critical and this is why the chain is always a better option for engineers. So... the confusion here is based on this logic. On a subaru (and some others) the timing belt drives the water pump. It is recommended to replace the water pump while servicing the timing belt solely because it is cost effective in the long run- not because the water pump is upon a service interval. Its just a smart move because most of the labor is done to get at the pump- may as well replace it while you're in there. Also, if the pump fails down the road it could very well take out your new belt and destroy your motor.
Our water pumps are pretty good, rarely fail, and are driven by the serpentine belt (poly v-belt). This belt is replaced when it looks worn. Your dealer will recommend it when its ready or just ask to have it checked for piece of mind.
Junior Member
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 51
Likes: 1
w212
ok... Sounds like someone screwed up on the R&D over at audi. Benz has always been know to produce torque monsters and usually live up to that standard on most all their motors. Thats exactly why, for years, Benz has always used a double linked chain. Known to be quite bullet proof. Recent motors have been equipped with a single link. Maybe the recent material used is stronger, not sure. I know the chains have been stretching on some of the diesel engines. Enough to cause a rattle and Ive seen the timing out almost 30 degrees on some. In that case, benz has advised owners to replace the chain if the rattle (chain slap) is heard.
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 102
Likes: 1
From: Toronto, ON
2010 E550 4Matic, P1, P2
Here it goes.... Are M272, M273, M276, and M278 (engine designations i.e. your engines in the W212) do not have timing belts, they have chains which are only serviced when damage occurs. This is usually rare.
Now lets use a subaru for example here, however, there are others that also use a timing belt rather then chain. Now, on a subaru the belt is serviced ever 91k miles i believe. This is to prevent it from breaking. A rubber belt is worn over time, stretches, the auto tensioner maxes out, and thus will eventually break. If this happens to an interference motor the pistons will contact the valves and cause a lot of damage usually remedied by motor replacement as the most cost effective repair. But that's another thread. Our motors are interference motors by the way so timing is critical and this is why the chain is always a better option for engineers. So... the confusion here is based on this logic. On a subaru (and some others) the timing belt drives the water pump. It is recommended to replace the water pump while servicing the timing belt solely because it is cost effective in the long run- not because the water pump is upon a service interval. Its just a smart move because most of the labor is done to get at the pump- may as well replace it while you're in there. Also, if the pump fails down the road it could very well take out your new belt and destroy your motor.
Our water pumps are pretty good, rarely fail, and are driven by the serpentine belt (poly v-belt). This belt is replaced when it looks worn. Your dealer will recommend it when its ready or just ask to have it checked for piece of mind.
Now lets use a subaru for example here, however, there are others that also use a timing belt rather then chain. Now, on a subaru the belt is serviced ever 91k miles i believe. This is to prevent it from breaking. A rubber belt is worn over time, stretches, the auto tensioner maxes out, and thus will eventually break. If this happens to an interference motor the pistons will contact the valves and cause a lot of damage usually remedied by motor replacement as the most cost effective repair. But that's another thread. Our motors are interference motors by the way so timing is critical and this is why the chain is always a better option for engineers. So... the confusion here is based on this logic. On a subaru (and some others) the timing belt drives the water pump. It is recommended to replace the water pump while servicing the timing belt solely because it is cost effective in the long run- not because the water pump is upon a service interval. Its just a smart move because most of the labor is done to get at the pump- may as well replace it while you're in there. Also, if the pump fails down the road it could very well take out your new belt and destroy your motor.
Our water pumps are pretty good, rarely fail, and are driven by the serpentine belt (poly v-belt). This belt is replaced when it looks worn. Your dealer will recommend it when its ready or just ask to have it checked for piece of mind.
Getting to the 100km mark and I plan on keeping the car for another 2 years so I want to get an idea of whats upcoming.
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Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 5,851
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From: Huntington Beach, Ca.
'17 Jaguar XF
Aside from leaking fluid the most common sign of a water pump going in a modern MB is noise. As the shaft wears it starts to wobble and make a distinct noise. When it wears real bad it will start leaking. Not real loud but something different coming out of your engine bay. You can grab the water pump pulley and see if there's any play. Back off the idler pulley to remove tension on the serpentine belt first to make it easier to feel any play. These serpentine belts are very strong and the only ones I've heard about breaking are when something else breaks or seizes first. Also with the aluminum block engines and radiators and lack of rust in the coolant the water pumps last longer. The last one I replaced for noise was at 100K miles and the coolant was still clean.
Member
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 187
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2013 E350 Sport
The water pump is only done with the timing belt because you're already right there when you replace the belt. Changing the belt is a lot of work. If you just change the belt, then soon after the water pump fails, then you have to basically do the entire timing belt job again. So it's just done as preventative maintenance.
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 290
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From: Florida
2013 ML350, 2019 S560
I agree the E550 has a timing chain not a belt. Never need to change, unless more than about 250 k would consider. I change my serpentine belt at 60 k intervals based on past experience with belts in other cars. The coolant is now 150 k non silicate type and with all aluminum engine, the water pumps last a lot longer than they used to. My E550 has no issues at 83 k and last 5 MBs never had any up to 155 k.
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Joined: May 2014
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From: SO FLORIDA
2010 E350 SPORT SEDAN, 2006 C280 4MATIC- SOLD 2009 FORD F-250, 2015 KIA OPTIMA HYBRID, 2013 MB E550
WATER PUMP CHANGE AT 85K...SHOULD I...
Aside from leaking fluid the most common sign of a water pump going in a modern MB is noise. As the shaft wears it starts to wobble and make a distinct noise. When it wears real bad it will start leaking. Not real loud but something different coming out of your engine bay. You can grab the water pump pulley and see if there's any play. Back off the idler pulley to remove tension on the serpentine belt first to make it easier to feel any play. These serpentine belts are very strong and the only ones I've heard about breaking are when something else breaks or seizes first. Also with the aluminum block engines and radiators and lack of rust in the coolant the water pumps last longer. The last one I replaced for noise was at 100K miles and the coolant was still clean.
I HAVE A 2010 E350 RWD THATS AT 85K. I WANT CHANGE THE ROLLERS AND BELT BUT AM NOT SURE IF TO CHANGE THE WATER PUMP. THERE'S NO LEAKING AND I DON'T THINK IT'S MAKING NOISE. TEMPS AND ALL IS OK TOO.
-WOULD YOU CHANGE IT AND WHY NOT WAIT. THANKS
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From: Huntington Beach, Ca.
'17 Jaguar XF
Junior Member
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 22
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2011 e350
I think w212 has a timing chain , no belt. You don't really need to replace the pump on any schedule. You usually will know when the pump is failing, and most of the time it is the seal fails first and by then you just replace the pump with new seals.
Newbie
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 13
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2012 E350 Coupe
The Mk I Audi TT (I owned 2, an 01 and an 04) was notorious for its OEM plastic impeller on the water pump failing and destroying the timing belt. The tensioner was not a 100K part either. As a result, owners were advised to replace everything every 5 years or 60K. Audi went to a metal impeller and timing chain on later Mk 2 models. (I now own a 2011).
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Joined: Oct 2011
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From: Athens, GA USA
2011 E63, 2011 Hyundai Genesis 4.6 v8, 2013 GMC Denali XL, 1965 Ford Mustang, 2005 Merc. E500
Water pumps can last many years and many miles. My 2011 Hyundai Genesis that I purchased new has just over 200,000 miles on it and the water pump is fine and its the original. My son's 2005 Mercedes E500 has over 160,000 miles on it and the water pump is the original and it works like new.
