nc211

today's drive home, and zero seat issues.

nc211

Darel, did the frame arrive? Have any updates on how it’s going for you too? I’m very happy with how mine has come out. Super comfortable still, to the point of not really wanting to get out of it when I arrive at my destination anymore. Hoping for the same results for you too!

Darel

It came in but I've been away with the reserves last 2 weekends. Saturday morning I plan on digging into it.

I am thinking about getting soft foam for that extra 1.5" buildup in the center section, and a small amount of the ultra-high-density stuff for the very back part of the seat instead of the towels. Thoughts?

nc211

First off, thank you for serving! Thought Veteran was for being a Veteran on here, didn’t realize Military! I’m the son of a retired USAF Colonel (B52’s), and thank you for all that you do!

Secondly, I think you’re going to find that perfect arrangement for your seats with whatever you decide to do! I think the 1.5 inches under the cover itself might be a little too much though. Maybe an inch or 3/4ths. It’ll all be up to you when you get in there to check it out. The shop who did mine focused on just the rear section to add the padding, but also looked like they might’ve scraped some of the existing foam off to make the 1 inch piece fit better. Might not have needed it since knowing what I know now. I think focus on the underside of the foam padding first to see if you can find that perfect amount of added lift/support to bring up the middle section. Then go from there to see if you want to add the extra for directly under the seat cover. Once you realize how easy it is to get that seat bottom out, you mind doing it a couple of times to get it just the way you like it.

In in my opinion for the area under the seat foam and against the springs, I think the firmer the extra support you can put there, the better, and just rely on the foam itself for the softness factor. In mine, the towels ended up to be the perfect magic trick.

Also, gently bending the entire seat foam itself upward to flatten out that wire was a real blessing to this too.

Its been spot on perfect for me for me ever since. Just made the car so enjoyable to be in and cruise around in it. I’ve not touched my GTI ever since. . I’m positive you’ll find that sweet spot on yours now too!

Extra springs, added material in the back under the foam and against the springs, and gently bending the center area upward, appear to be the true fix here. beyond that, it’s fine tuning it to the way you like it.

Looking forward to hearing about your results!

Darel

Done and done!

Added the second set of springs, added 2" of high density foam in the back-center, and bent down the outer wires inside the foam. Drove the car around for 1.5-2 hours today WITH MY WALLET IN MY POCKET (which is a huge thing for me) and NO pain whatsoever. What a difference.

I also noticed where previously, anywhere I set the lumbar made me think, "why is this even here?", now I have effective lumbar support. The additional height in the center cushion now put the lumbar support in my actual lumbar region.

Thank you so much for being the guinea pig in all this!

Darel

nc211

Excellent!!! Glad it worked out for you too, and if it's like mine, it'll get more comfortable in the coming weeks as it settles into your sitting preference. Hope that others may come on here in the future looking for ideas on how to fix this and see this too. Really not a hard fix after all. I LOVE mine now, and very glad I bought this car. Was about ready to chalk it up as a learning experience and be a very short-term mercedes benz owner there for a little bit. But glad I reconsidered and decided to just default to my usual philosophy of "if you want it done right the first time, do it yourself".

I noticed the same with the lumbar on mine as well. It's now able to be in the perfect spot for my back as well. This fix totally changed it's usefulness and influence on the seat.

Happy motoring to you for many more miles and years!

nc211

I’ve got the car at the dealership today for a vibration noise issue. Loaner is a new E350 with the dynamics seats. Honestly, after fixing my seat, I prefer it over the new seat in general, with the exception of the massage feature of the new one (which is outstandingly awesome!) But I like the wider, flatter seat of mine far more than the snuggness of the new seat in the new E series.

Honestly, I like my W212 better in general. I like it’s looks better, the spacious cabin, and feels more like a “Mercedes Benz” to me than the new one, which feels like it’s trying to align more to its competitors (A6, 5 Series) than being a Benz. More sport, less cruiser. Not saying it’s bad, but not a car I would gravitate towards like I have to the 212. I will be happy when I get back into my 2014.

Darel

I'll be honest I'm still not a fan. While significantly improved, I just can't get comfortable in this seat. Too hard, bottom cushion is too short. After doing all the work it is SO MUCH better, but still I can't tolerate this seat for more than 2-3 hours. Now, before that was 15 minutes or less, so the work was definitely worth it. But I think in the end this seat is just not a fit for me.

Maymin

Doubt they are faulty. Not the quality of older MBs. Cost cutting. I use a seat cushion. Sucks but it helps. Light weight by built. No idea why MB would do this for US market. Most driving is long and sedate type.

nc211

Yeah, no argument they’re a bit short and certainly firm, which are two aspects that no matter of tinkering with can fix.

I will say, MB clearly recognized the poor seat choice in the W212 and addressed it in the new one. That seat will extend lengthwise several inches, and it had a softer feel to it. I will honestly admit that the massaging feature, is like nothing I have ever seen before. I drove home in it yesterday while getting a heated massage. It was outstanding!!

VAG still has them beat on the transmission smoothness though, by a long shot, with their perfected double clutch gear box. This new one has 9 gears. I could easily feel some harshness to it still. The car has 5,000 miles on it. I suspect in another 10,000 miles, some complaints would be made by a few owners. Still kicking in the 2-5 gear range.

Overall, the new E series just doesn’t feel as refined to me. Sure, a LOT more tech in it, but the overall feel and certain materials used, feels like a shift more towards the Asian car makers side than the Germans. The exterior design is boring as snot to me. Not enough angles, just a smoothed over piece of sheet medal.

Tump43

Agreed.

nc211

Darel

Agreed, these seat mods have changed the whole driving experience of the car.

I really do believe the biggest improvement was simply bending those thigh bolster rods out.

Eddot

How would this all work with my '14 Coupe C207 ventilated seats? Posted this question on C207 site but not getting a lot of response.

nc211

wmkizer

I did happen upon this recently. A different option rather than purchasing a pan and cannibalizing the springs from it. Here is a spring kit!

Lower Front Seat Spring Sag Repair and Restoration Kit

https://mercedessource.com/store/low...estoration-kit

swhme

NC211– hopefully you’re still around, thanks for the awesome write up here, I just bought a W212 and am running into this same issue, so hoping to determine that it can be resolved before my “buyers remorse” return window is up.

In looking at the seat schematics and the bolster wire you found, I’m wondering if I could just double up the springs and replace the cushion and would then end up with a properly shaped support wire and a stronger seat base that won’t allow the wire to re-deform and dig in.

Thoughts?

swhme

Also, to be clear, 204-910-01-22 is the part I need for donor springs, right?

Darel

Honestly just take the seat apart and bend the outer wires like described above. I went through all that, adding cushioning, adding the springs, and really the whole issue came down to the two outer springs digging into my hips. Just bend those out before you spend any money. Posts #67-72 for that discussion.

swhme

will try that out today, thanks!

nc211

Yep I’m still here... I agree with Darel - start with those two wire areas first to bend them outward more. I hit mine with a hammer and also stomped on them with boots on.

while mine has been absolute perfect ever since this tweak - hindsight 20/20 - I think you can probably get close to the same effect with a few strategically place microfiber rags for some added support under the rear center area, along the very back where your tailbone sits, and maybe inside the cushion itself on the thigh bolster around the wire there too. Buy a $20 bag of microfibers from Costco and go at it until you hit the sweet spot for you.

Do I think the second set of support springs help? Yes, but I would save the money and try laying a few of those rages across the top of the existing springs first. Enough to push the entire cushion upward off the springs. You being taller than I (I’m 5’10), my spring tweak might push you up too high in the seat. Mine is firm, flat all across, and no hard parts. Focus on the hard parts first - that wire, and then mess with it with the rags to get it right. You having the luxury seats, be mindful on the rags to not block the vent fans. The heater element is on the top of the cushion, so should be fine. If you mess with the rags on the bottom, I’d focus on the very back area where your tailbone rides.

oddly enough, I now have another MB to compare this to - wife’s new 2020 GLS. While not nearly as bad as my 212 - I squirm a bit in that one too and it’s brand spanking new. $90k and a $15 bag of rags will likely be needed as well.

but yes - it can be fixed. Just takes a little patience. Mine is truly excellent for me, I can log 10 hours straight of seat time with zero issues. If mine can do that for me, then yours certainly can as well. Once you get into the process, you’ll see the areas where you can mess with it, and realize it’s really not all that complicated of a setup.

swhme

Thank you! That’s interesting about the GLS, my wife is waffling between that and the X7 right now, and I’m trying to decide whether I should keep the 350 (which is gorgeous) or return it and get a 640i GT (which is a bit quirky, but I like it, and it has a lot more rear seat room)

my thighs and back are voting BMW, but my heart is voting Mercedes

nc211

I know that debate very well between the X7 and GLS, and it’s a tough one! For us it came down to two main elements: (1) ease of driving in suburbia living, (2) dependability. At nearly $90k, it’s going to have to live with us for 10 years or so. BMW’s seem to have more plastic under the hood than MB’s and engine heat makes them brittle after about 5 years. MB’s seem to be a bit more hefty in that regard. Driving ease (coming out of a 2013 Highlander) was an easy pick for the GLS. Effortless. Then it came down to interior feel, and the MB felt more relaxing and “chill”, while the bmw felt more aggressive and “drive me”. Wife liked the MB, and she likes the seats a lot, so think it’s just me on that one. Exterior styling is all subjective. But in my opinion a 5 year old MB looks better than a 5 year old BMW.

On your debate between keeping the 212 or the 640GT - it’s really totally up to you as the two are really totally different cars. BMW is turbo, MB is not. MB is a sport-ish cruiser that is heavy yet poised under just about any situation. Not a screamer, but moves faster than you’d expect or realize. BMW scoots for sure. The seats can be fixed on the MB, but BMW probably won’t need to be messed with. It’s really a personal choice on that one. If didn’t have a mk7 GTI as my zippy toy as well, I don’t know if I’d of gone with my w212. It was a +1 addition to the garage, not a replacement of a daily driver. Having both allows me to keep the commuter mileage down and therefore me out of the dealerships for several years after payoff. Also allows me to scratch that wild hair itch every now and then, one I drive, one drives me. I’ve grown tired of buying cars every few years and want to buy and keep for 10+ years on each now, even if that means a few grand in repairs along the way. I told my wife when we were shopping for the Highlander replacement that she could have whatever she wanted, but pick the one you’ll be fine with on a $3k repair bill once or twice down the road, instead of getting rid of it for a different car and therefore resetting the clock. Given our experience with the 212 this far, that led her to the GLS over the BMW and even a Range Rover (which would’ve had to be a CPO instead of new).

swhme

Totally hear you there, although the E350 is my “fun to drive” alternative daily driver to my ‘19 F150. Then I have summer fun in my Saab 9-3, but summer in Maine is fleeting...

nc211

Is the 350 4-Matic? If so, I think you’ll enjoy it in the winter. Mine amazes me everything I get in a rain storm or on snowy roads at just how well it handles it all. Truly like a German tank and I’m on the OE Continental all-season tires, nothing magical there. 80mph in a downpour while on I95 between DC and NC (which we do often) is an incredible feeling. It’s a fixed system, no torque vectoring stuff that in my opinion confuses the driver on just what the car is doing. I love it. And on a cold and snowy winter day - there is just nothing like sliding into a Mercedes Benz for a nice drive with the heated seats on and that heavy German tank feeling. I love mine, and plan to keep it for at least another 5 years. Even the new E series doesn’t compare to the 212 in that old-school Mercedes Benz vibe. They’re nice, but they’ve lost that tank feeling in my opinion.