ccww

After washing and waxing my Obsidian Black Metallic E250 BT for the first time I noticed that the paint is not perfectly glassy. Rather reflections in the paint have a consistent distortion like minor orange peel or inconsistency in the clear coat. Rather than a mirror-like surface reflection there are small circular distortions in the reflections in a consistent pattern across the paint. It makes reflections look dimpled. It is not present everywhere. The roof and unibody rails by the roof seem perfect as does the trunk lid. But it is very evident on the doors. When I first noticed this I wondered if the car had been repainted or the paint had been treated poorly in the past.

However, I was just at my local MB dealer picking up parts for my retrofit of the acoustic laminated windows (839) option and took a look at the paint on a new S450 and a new E450, both black. They had exactly the same paint texture as my car! My Laser Blue 2010 VW Jetta TDI Cup Edition has far smoother paint than a brand new S-class?

Is this non-smooth paint texture just the norm for MB? Why is it worse on some panels than others? Is it an issue of painting steel vs aluminum or something like that?

LILBENZ230

I don't see orange peel on my W212 in designo Cardinal Red.. I'll look closer. I don't think, though, that I've ever had a car that didn't have some of it. I'll have to look closer at the Macan as well as it doesn't appear to have it either.

pierrejoliat

Likely from a bad buffing during a detail, my son had a 2015 in Obsidian, his looked the same, as I was trying to explain in a different post, sometimes the new style ceramic and synthetic waxes exacerbate this, try waxing with an old school carnauba wax with no synthetics, worked for my son's car. also my buddy with a Cayenne [Yes I thought it was a Macan] has darker blue paint and when he waxes with a synthetic you can't see the silver sparkles in the paint, when he uses old school Turtle Wax, you can see the sparkles.

I have an E in Cavensite Blue, when I use synthetics it looks all streaky and the purple that comes out in the sun goes away. I just waxed it yesterday with Turtle wax and the purple is way more pronounced. I have not used Turtle Wax in 25 years and have tried lots of expensive waxes, both synthetic, ceramic and 1oo dollar carnaubas. I can't believe how great this ten dollar wax works, we'll see how long it lasts, but Consumer Reports says it #1 and they rate New Finish as the best synthetic.

MnRiverman

Paint correction with a clay bar would probably help.

ccww

I also thought that it was likely from bad paint treatment in the past. I have also been using a synthetic paste wax but irrespective of this issue I’m missing the depth of Carnauba and will pick up some soon. Taking suggestions if anybody has favorites.

However, past detailing or different paint treatments doesn’t explain why the brand new S450 and E450 were exactly the same. And I didn’t look at a bunch of cars and only find it on those two. They were the only two I looked closely at and they both had it. Maybe I need to expand my sample size but I think it’s pretty indicative.

I really am not trying to be hyperbolic, but my 2010 Jetta TDI Cup Edition with 155k miles in bright metallic blue has none of this effect at all. Of course it has some imperfections in the paint commensurate with its mileage, but nothing ubiquitous like on the Mercedes. Freshly waxed reflections are mirror smooth.

ccww

I am planning on claying the car. Unfortunately I only have use of one arm at the moment from a motorcycle accident and the thought of claying one-handed is a little too daunting. Waxing is hard enough this way. But soon I’ll be out of my sling and will definitely be doing a clay treatment.

Still mystified as to why the brand new S450 and E450 have it...

pierrejoliat

Maybe the same detailer did the new and used cars? My other son bought a new Lexus RX350L in Jersey, The dealer said all the cars get "detailed when they arrive" They did this to his car and he saw others on the lot with the same issue.
He had it fixed at his regular detailer. Just saying it's possible!

Also I like Butter Wet Wax, P21S and Mother's California Gold best and in that order, but they only last a month or so, I just bought a 10 dollar can of Turtle Wax like I mentioned previously, I was shocked at the results. I also use Maguires ultimate paste and liquid, they work really easy and well on light colors, but streak badly on dark colors,

ccww

I have been using the Maguire’s Ultimate Paste Wax. Looks amazing on the bright blue VW, but is hard to buff by hand without some streaks as you say on black. Thanks for the recommendations.

My car was from another state than this dealer, they’ve never touched it. And they’re by far the biggest and in my opinion the best Benz dealer in the state, I doubt they have an incompetent detailer ruining their S Classes. I really hope not at least...

bmwpowere36m3

I'd say most cars have orange peel, just to different extents... bottom-line I think it comes down to economics and customer expectations. As in, mostly customers don't notice, so why expend more resources and $ to achieve a "perfect" finish. In addition, over the years the finishing materials have changed, lower-VOC, electrostatic application, water based (vs. solvent), etc...

*edit* blame the manufacturer for orange peel, nothing to do with detailers or detailing.... the clearcoat layer is physically like an orange peel (with peaks and valleys), not just visually.

E250_92101

bmwpowere36m3 is absolutely right. All production cars have an orange peel pattern from the factory paint process. When I say "all," I'm excluding some brands like Rolls-Royce etc that may wet sand the car at the factory to remove the orange peel pattern. People also perceive orange peel differently. You may claim that your brand X has no orange peel, but when a trained eye looks at it, they will probably immediately see the orange peel.

Orange peel may be more noticeable if you look at the reflection on Mercedes clear coat surfaces because Mercedes has one of the best (most durable and reflective) clear coats. Orange peel may become less noticeable as the gloss value of the paint surface goes down (there are actually gloss meters for determining automotive paint gloss values). Also, some colors show orange peel more than others.

If a particular car has more orange peel on one or more panels that could be a sign that part of the car has been repainted. A poorly repainted surface won't match the original orange peel. That could be fixed to some extent by certain machine polishing techniques. It's also possible that a repainted panel has no orange peel if the painter had to sand the panel to remove imperfections after the repaint.

Should you go to your detailer and ask them to get rid of orange peel on your original paint? If you have a show car, then maybe yes... If you are talking about your daily driver, then absolutely not. Leveling orange peel will significantly reduce the thickness of your clear coat. Clear coat is usually only 1.5 to 2.5 mils thick (not millimeters, but mils!). That's about as thick as copy paper so you don't want to remove any clear coat unless you absolutely need to. There are different clear coat sanding techniques. Some flatten orange peel (shouldn't be used on daily drivers) and some preserve the orange pattern but just remove some heavy scratching from clear coat (could be used to recondition badly damaged clear coat surfaces).

Even with some slight orange peel, I'd never trade the factory Mercedes clear coat for a clear coat surface from any other manufacturer (especially from a Japanese car)...

95Sinned420

Completely normal. Some colors more obvious than others, also the lighting and angle you look at it. Try in the sun at an angle and you will see it easier. Mercedes isn’t the best with orange peel.. I too have noticed cars on the showroom floor having this. Funny, a Genesis has less orange peel than a Benz. Anyway, if it bothers you enough (99% of population won’t notice or be bothered by it), you can wet sand it with 2000 grit and then buff to shine with a compound and polish. That will give you the glass surface you’re seeking. Ignorance is bliss, I wish I didn’t see orange peels and now it’s something that bothers me so much too.
I highly recommend Pinnacle Souveran paste wax if you want that deep carnauba wax. It’s expensive but it’s for those who are very nitpicky when it comes to car paint. You get what you pay for.

ccww

Thanks to all for the detailed responses. I've definitely been looking more carefully and now seeing orange peel on pretty much all vehicles. The MB is a little worse than some as mentioned above, maybe that is because of the thickness of their clear coat and I'm sure the Obsidian Black doesn't help.

I don't think that I want to tackle wet sanding myself or pay however much it would cost. While I would love a smoother look I don't think that it would be worth it on a daily driver that sees a lot of miles. Knowing that it is normal and the same on brand new S-Classes is some solace.

Dingo L

You guys talking about this? Personally l quite like this look.
Not knowing other countries but in Hong Kong, if we are looking for a good 2nd Mercedes, the orange peel is a strong evidence of original paint work.

ccww

Yep, that’s exactly it. That consistent distortion in reflections. Almost a bokeh like effect.

decorily

It seems to be more common now. I think it is more prevalent with the modern water based paints..

MBNUT1

I was wandering around the local dealership one Sunday a couple of months ago and was struck by the amount of orange peel I saw in the paint on some expensive Mercedes (GT63S's and the like)

MBNUT1

Orange peel vs a glass like smoothness used to be viewed as a poor quality paint job, though given the gloss of your finish your paint looks good.

Dingo L

Yes the paint work is amazing. It's a 2011 E250, bought it last year, no wax or other surface treatment done, just regular wash, still 'outshines' my neighbours' Toyotas and Nissans....

MBNUT1

Looks great!

ccww

Looks gorgeous, Dingo L! Is that Black or Obsidian Black?

With how amazing that paint looks without any treatment I can't help but think what a nice coat of sealant or wax would do!

Dingo L

It's Obsidian Black.
Yes I'm also thinking of making it more shiny but here in Hong Kong, raining 3 to 4 times a week, makes me wonder if it worths dong that.

ccww

It would probably help it stay cleaner as the dirty water from the road would sheet off.

pierrejoliat

A regular Carnauba wax makes the sparkles in the Obsidian really stand out, my son has that color and when he uses meguires ultimate which is a synthetic you can't see the sparkle, same with New Finish, but it lasts for 4-5 months instead of two months.

Dingo L

Thanks for the tips and advice, will give it a go with Carnauba wax....

Alandf

I purchased my E-350 from a used car dealer and knew none of its' history. I was OK with that because it still had two years left on the factory warranty. The first time I took it to an M-B dealer , the service writer takes on look and says 'this hood has been repainted' . I ask, how can you tell, The answer he gives me is that there is no orange peel, and all M-B's have orange peel.
Weird - Never heard of such a thing. Also, there is no evidence of any repainting. Not color,over-spray or paint on fasteners.