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Good lease or bad?

 
Old 08-21-2018, 08:13 PM
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The DOG (Dealer ordering guide) has been posted in several other threads in this forum. It gives the MSRP of all options.

You can configure the car with the MSRP, take off 12.5%, and use the lease calculator guide that I previously posted to ascertain your lease payments.
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Old 08-21-2018, 09:35 PM
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Originally Posted by JTK44 View Post
I do not have access to a MB corporate employee control number. What is that?

12.25% off of MSRP is excellent!

If you can get 12.25% off of either a 2018 E400 or a 2019 E450 and there are no other incentives, the residuals on the 2019 will be much higher and offset any increase in price between the 2018 E400 and the 2019 E450, so yes the 2019 should lease cheaper than a 2018.

I have looked over the DOG for 2019 and the prices for a 2018 E400 and 2019 E450 with the same equipment are within $500. Even if the 2019 cost $500 more and the residuals are the same, which of course they are not, the residuals on the 2019 are higher, a one year newer car is worth more than $500 on resale!

Dealers order cars for stock and for customers: As I said sometimes the deals on an ordered car, because it is a "sale" are even better than on an in stock car and of course sometimes the opposite!
I'm not sure where you're getting the E400 and E450 are within $500 of each other. The E400 base price is $58,900. The E450 base price will start at $59,950. My calculator puts that at a difference of $1050.

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Old 08-21-2018, 10:10 PM
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I think he was talking about when you are adding different options since with the 2019 there are more stand alone options... I did this also when I specíd out all the features I wanted that are must have for me in 2018 car and then when I did the same with the 2019 it was a lot closer in price.
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Old 08-21-2018, 10:17 PM
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Originally Posted by BigDeeLA View Post
I think he was talking about when you are adding different options since with the 2019 there are more stand alone options... I did this also when I specíd out all the features I wanted that are must have for me in 2018 car and then when I did the same with the 2019 it was a lot closer in price.
OK......thanks for the clarification.
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Old 08-21-2018, 10:39 PM
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If you go to my post I said with the same equipment - not base price. When I configured the car I wanted the prices were within $500.

If you check out the DOG for the 2019 E450, many options that were in packages are now stand alone. The DOG for the 2019 E450 gives you more flexibility (and saves you money) in configuring a car as compared to a 2018 E400.

Remember that Russmna29 is getting 12.25% off either a 2018 E400 or 2019 E450. As Russmna29 is leasing it does not make sense for him to lease a 2018 E400 vs a 2019 E450 as there is no additional savings to him in leasing a 2018 E400 as the residuals on the 2019 will be higher than on the 2018. (Russmna29 said no further incentives other than the employee discount)

Further in a few years when you go to sell or trade in your 2018 E400, it will be one year older than a 2019 E450. As you know, a 2019 model vs. a 2018 model will be worth substantially more than the $1050 difference in base price.

That is why I said that a 2019 model is worth more than $500 as compared to a 2018 model.
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Old 08-21-2018, 10:40 PM
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Originally Posted by JTK44 View Post
The DOG (Dealer ordering guide) has been posted in several other threads in this forum. It gives the MSRP of all options.

You can configure the car with the MSRP, take off 12.5%, and use the lease calculator guide that I previously posted to ascertain your lease payments.
All I found is the DOG for the wagon, where is the sedan? Where do we think the RV/MF may land? Educated guesses..
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Old 08-21-2018, 10:49 PM
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Originally Posted by JTK44 View Post
If you go to my post I said with the same equipment - not base price. When I configured the car I wanted the prices were within $500.

If you check out the DOG for the 2019 E450, many options that were in packages are now stand alone. The DOG for the 2019 E450 gives you more flexibility (and saves you money) in configuring a car as compared to a 2018 E400.

Remember that Russmna29 is getting 12.25% off either a 2018 E400 or 2019 E450. As Russmna29 is leasing it does not make sense for him to lease a 2018 E400 vs a 2019 E450 as there is no additional savings to him in leasing a 2018 E400 as the residuals on the 2019 will be higher than on the 2018. (Russmna29 said no further incentives other than the employee discount)

Further in a few years when you go to sell or trade in your 2018 E400, it will be one year older than a 2019 E450. As you know, a 2019 model vs. a 2018 model will be worth substantially more than the $1050 difference in base price.

That is why I said that a 2019 model is worth more than $500 as compared to a 2018 model.
I get it. I'm not sure if it matters whether one is worth more than the other when it's a leased vehicle. By virtue of a lease, when the lease is over, you turn it in, rinse and repeat. In my case, I know buying a 2018 likely reduces my trade value down the road, but I'm hoping I can hold onto this one for long enough and I won't be smitten with the new car bug as quickly as I typically am. I will be able to retire in about 3 years and won't have the income after I retire to keep buying more and more expensive cars.

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Old 08-21-2018, 11:07 PM
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Dear RBYLAW:

Keep in mind that in leasing a 2019 the residuals will be substantially higher than with a year old 2018 model. To get the same monthly lease payment, the 2018 will have to be substantially discounted more than a 2018, which hardly ever is the case.

Also if the lease rates are similar, I would always want to be in a new model year. For the same price, why drive a one year old car?

My experience is that once bitten by the new car bug, always bitten.
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Old 08-21-2018, 11:16 PM
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Originally Posted by JTK44 View Post
Dear RBYLAW:

Keep in mind that in leasing a 2019 the residuals will be substantially higher than with a year old 2018 model. To get the same monthly lease payment, the 2018 will have to be substantially discounted more than a 2018, which hardly ever is the case.

Also if the lease rates are similar, I would always want to be in a new model year. For the same price, why drive a one year old car?

My experience is that once bitten by the new car bug, always bitten.
Of course. If there's really no financial incentive to drive a 2018, get the 2019. But if an amazing deal can be be had with a 2018, there's really nothing significantly different between a 2018 and 2019 E Class car. Sadly, you are right about the new car bug. I need to find a cure for that though. That's one reason I bought an extended warranty yesterday for my new 2018 E400. I hope it encourages me to keep it longer. But I do get my money back from the extended warranty if the bug hits sooner. Why don't they make a pill for people like me? Huh? Why?? I'm a car dealerships dream customer. I walk in, lay down and let them take my wallet. It's called being a wallet billed mattress pad!
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Old 08-22-2018, 06:58 AM
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At the top, in the box "Search Forums" type in "2019 E450" and then hit enter.

After you do this, a list of threads will be propagated: There are several that discus the DOG for the E450.
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Old 08-22-2018, 10:34 AM
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Spoke to my sales guy, the E400 he was working on... had a residual value of 55%! Seems really low!!
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Old 08-22-2018, 01:13 PM
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Seems about right as in 2 to 3 weeks the 2018's with the arrival of the 2019 will be one year old.

That is why I said that for you with a flat 12.25% discount that leasing a 2019 will be cheaper than leasing a 2018.
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Old 08-22-2018, 01:15 PM
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Just my guess:

Residuals on the 2019 E450 will be between 61% and 62% and the interest between .9% and 1%.
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Old 08-22-2018, 02:55 PM
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I leased a 2018 e-300 p-3 about a year ago. This was my method and it worked out rather well.

The lease payment is based on the price of the car, the factor and the residual value. The factor and the residual value are set by MB Financial and they are not negotiable. The only negotiable part of the lease is the price. I built my car online and then sent it to 5 different dealers. I told them to give me their best shot at the price. The dealer who came in at the lowest price would get the order. Four prices came back. The highest was 5% off the MSRP, but the lowest was 11% of the MSRP. I emailed the other three thanking them for their time and I would be back in three years. One of the losing dealers actually wanted to know if they could submit a revised offer. I said no because it would not be fair to the winning dealer. Your best shot just means that ... your best shot.

I wan't concerned about the monthly lease payment because, as I said, the only variable was price. Also it was a custom built car, so the dealers were pricing the same car.
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Old 08-22-2018, 03:13 PM
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Originally Posted by JTK44 View Post
Just my guess:

Residuals on the 2019 E450 will be between 61% and 62% and the interest between .9% and 1%.
With 3 years and 15k miles/year... I'd love to see RV's in the 60's! If I use any of the auto lease calcs and play with those numbers... how would you represent the interest rates as money factors? Right now, this month... MB is at .00237 MF on the E400

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Old 08-22-2018, 03:18 PM
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Interest Rate = 2400 * Money Factor

Money Factor = Interest Rate / 2400
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Old 08-22-2018, 05:09 PM
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I believe you may have the money factor wrong: a money factor of .00237 would equal an interest rate of 5.68%. This I believe is way too high.

MF of .000237 would be .568%. This would be extraordinarily low, but possible.

Using a MSRP of $74,000 a selling price (including bank fee) of $68,000 and a residual of 60%, 36 months and a MF of .00237 the monthly payment without tax would be $922. Using a MF of .000237, $684 per month.

Suggest you double check with your dealer to get the money factor.

I also believe that a residual of 60% or higher will limit the mileage to 10,000 per year for 3 years. If you want 15,000 per year expect the residuals to be below 60%.

Finally I agree with 704set and in fact for the past four cars I have leased, 2 BMW's, 1 Ford Edge and my present MB, this is exactly what I did: The first time in the dealer was to pick up the car.

One thing you might consider: If you local dealer is "competitive" then you might give them the opportunity to either match or beat your lowest quote - there being value in dealing with a local dealer. On the other hand, doing exactly what 704set suggested, I leased my present MB from one dealer and have had it serviced by my local dealer, without any difficulty: the local dealer even giving me a loaner. So dealing with a local has very limited monetary value, at least to me.
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Old 08-22-2018, 06:33 PM
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Originally Posted by JTK44 View Post
I believe you may have the money factor wrong: a money factor of .00237 would equal an interest rate of 5.68%. This I believe is way too high.

MF of .000237 would be .568%. This would be extraordinarily low, but possible.

Using a MSRP of $74,000 a selling price (including bank fee) of $68,000 and a residual of 60%, 36 months and a MF of .00237 the monthly payment without tax would be $922. Using a MF of .000237, $684 per month.

Suggest you double check with your dealer to get the money factor.

I also believe that a residual of 60% or higher will limit the mileage to 10,000 per year for 3 years. If you want 15,000 per year expect the residuals to be below 60%.

Finally I agree with 704set and in fact for the past four cars I have leased, 2 BMW's, 1 Ford Edge and my present MB, this is exactly what I did: The first time in the dealer was to pick up the car.

One thing you might consider: If you local dealer is "competitive" then you might give them the opportunity to either match or beat your lowest quote - there being value in dealing with a local dealer. On the other hand, doing exactly what 704set suggested, I leased my present MB from one dealer and have had it serviced by my local dealer, without any difficulty: the local dealer even giving me a loaner. So dealing with a local has very limited monetary value, at least to me.
I agree with your assessments on numbers. I researched the August 2018 E400 sedan and found it to be .00237 (5.68%) That seems quite high, too. I also think a 15k/year lease will yield a RV in the 50's, somewhere between 56-58% im guessing. The big unknown is the money factor. Can anyone confirm the MF for August with the E400? The site I gleaned that .00237 from also had the E300 4matic at .00167 (4.008%). I need to ask the dealer, he told me the residual was 55%, he should be able to tell me the MF

In my case, putting dealers against each other won't impact my deal (shouldn't) because with the corporate control number I have, its a flat 12.25% off MSRP, no negotiation, no haggle. With MBFS setting RV's and MF's... each dealer with the same car should be identical.

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Old 08-22-2018, 07:00 PM
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You are correct: with your 12.25% discount, go to your local dealer.

For everyone else do what 704set recommends!

The MF you are listing: are you sure they are money factors: maybe it is interest rates for finance.

I have gone over my records: In April for a 2018 BMW 540i, 10,000 miles, 36 months, residual was 61% and money factor was .00156 or 3.74%: However the dealer said interest rate was .374%: As I had decided not to go ahead with the BMW, I did not question him further as to whether the money factor of .00156 was correct.

However when I put the figures in my lease calculator the MF of .00156 or 3.74% was correct.

FYI, the 2018 BMW 540i xDrive I wanted had an MRSP of $70,035, residual of $42,721 (61%) and monthly payment of $852 which included NYS sales tax and bank fee: At lease inception I would have had to pay $949. first months ($852) plus NYS registration of $97.
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Old 08-22-2018, 07:18 PM
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According to MBFS, the money factor they quote for the 2018 E400 is .00237 and the RV of 55%. My dealer confirmed the 55% but I was neglectful in not asking him about the MF
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Old 08-22-2018, 07:34 PM
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Here is the DOG for 2019 E Class
Attached Files
File Type: pdf
W213 2019.1 (3).pdf (3.26 MB, 28 views)
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Old 08-22-2018, 07:38 PM
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Originally Posted by JTK44 View Post
Here is the DOG for 2019 E Class
I canít thank you enough!!!
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Old 08-22-2018, 07:45 PM
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Now if we can help RBYLAW post the updated DOG as of July, 2018 we will be set!
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Old 08-22-2018, 07:50 PM
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Originally Posted by JTK44 View Post


Now if we can help RBYLAW post the updated DOG as of July, 2018 we will be set!
I think anyone who wants one just needs to send me a PM with their email address. I've been sending to people this way for a few weeks now.
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Old 08-22-2018, 08:51 PM
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Here is the DOG for the E300 and E450 with revisions through July 3, 2018.

We need to thank rbrylaw for supplying this DOG!
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