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2019 E 450 4 Matic T-model, 2014 Jag F-Type vert, 2004 Volvo V70R
Wagons constitute a small percentage of the market in the United States, but half of the E class sales in Germany are wagons and an even higher percentage of C class. I don’t see the Europeans moving to SUVs. Wagons are still the logical choice. The only reason they sell so well in the United States is that the distaff side likes the command driving position. .
2019 E 450, 2016 E350 4matic (retired), 2018 Ford Edge Sport, 2008 Porsche Boxster
Originally Posted by Hundens
Wagons constitute a small percentage of the market in the United States, but half of the E class sales in Germany are wagons and an even higher percentage of C class. I don’t see the Europeans moving to SUVs. Wagons are still the logical choice. The only reason they sell so well in the United States is that the distaff side likes the command driving position. .
That was true in 2016. I wonder if it is still true today - 5 1/2 years later?
2019 E 450, 2016 E350 4matic (retired), 2018 Ford Edge Sport, 2008 Porsche Boxster
Originally Posted by thenothingblack
I understand that wagons are a pretty small market now and a company cant keep producing something that only a few people buy every year, but this is still a shame to hear. I may be biased, but I really do think wagons are a better option than SUVs for the average person (assuming price is not an option since most newer German wagons are fairly expensive, but then again so are new SUVs). Most wagons have more cargo space than SUVs and get better gas mileage, in addition to better handling. SUVs definitely have their use cases and I understand that lots of people just flat out prefer them now, but I think a lot of people (especially in America) are sleeping on the wagons true usability.
I do not disagree with most of what you say: I have a 2019 E450 sedan and tested the Mercedes GLE450 which for an SUV was OK, but it certainly did not handle like my car.
In my opinion, the nearly $6,000 premium for a MB wagon vs. either the 450 sedan of the GLE450 is the biggest problem. I just counted the number of times per year I would need the extra space of the wagon vs. 450E sedan and I could not justify the extra cost.
I love the E-Wagon, but among customers one complaint I often hear is about the rear seat space in comparison to MB SUV's. All MB SUV's (even GLA and GLB) offer larger rear legroom. I have seen a few posts across various forums/sites, as well Youtubers like Hoovies Garage say they went for an SUV for those reasons. In the case of Hoovie, he could not comfortably sit in the passenger seat (I believe he is six foot) and have a rear child facing seat behind him.
I doubt a larger backseat would sway many, but it is likely one reason at least. I simply think most Americans do not want wagons however. Like Minivans they are incredibly useful and practical with many benefits, however they both suffer an image issue in the states.
I don't think it is still true hence why MB announced no more production of wagons after 2029 model year. They mentioned wagons sales dipping even in Europe which has been one of the largest wagon markets globally. I remember watching a Top Gear episode back in 2007 or 2008 and they said at that time, the UK buys more wagons than anyone else.
I love the E-Wagon, but among customers one complaint I often hear is about the rear seat space in comparison to MB SUV's. All MB SUV's (even GLA and GLB) offer larger rear legroom. I have seen a few posts across various forums/sites, as well Youtubers like Hoovies Garage say they went for an SUV for those reasons. In the case of Hoovie, he could not comfortably sit in the passenger seat (I believe he is six foot) and have a rear child facing seat behind him.
I doubt a larger backseat would sway many, but it is likely one reason at least. I simply think most Americans do not want wagons however. Like Minivans they are incredibly useful and practical with many benefits, however they both suffer an image issue in the states.
The rear seat room on the E class is problematic. I experienced the car seat issue as well. My W212 was worse than my S213’s in that regard, though. Fortunately my wife is short enough we could put the car seat behind her. One time we were on vacation and had a Chrysler 300 rental car and the family (emphatically) pointed out how much more room the rear seat had. IIRC, that car shared a lot with the W211. We just need a wagon version of the S class .
The rear seat room on the E class is problematic. I experienced the car seat issue as well. My W212 was worse than my S213’s in that regard, though. Fortunately my wife is short enough we could put the car seat behind her. One time we were on vacation and had a Chrysler 300 rental car and the family (emphatically) pointed out how much more room the rear seat had. IIRC, that car shared a lot with the W211. We just need a wagon version of the S class .
A wagon version of the S class would be even more niche than the wagon version of the E class!
2019 E 450, 2016 E350 4matic (retired), 2018 Ford Edge Sport, 2008 Porsche Boxster
Originally Posted by madtrader
The rear seat room on the E class is problematic. I experienced the car seat issue as well. My W212 was worse than my S213’s in that regard, though. Fortunately my wife is short enough we could put the car seat behind her. One time we were on vacation and had a Chrysler 300 rental car and the family (emphatically) pointed out how much more room the rear seat had. IIRC, that car shared a lot with the W211. We just need a wagon version of the S class .
Speaking of S-Class wagons, the Sultan of Brunei had one, among numerous other rare and one off vehicles, with his 456 GT Venice (another one off wagon) being my personal favorite. He also owned the first ever Bentley SUV (no not the Bentayga )
I do not disagree with most of what you say: I have a 2019 E450 sedan and tested the Mercedes GLE450 which for an SUV was OK, but it certainly did not handle like my car.
In my opinion, the nearly $6,000 premium for a MB wagon vs. either the 450 sedan of the GLE450 is the biggest problem. I just counted the number of times per year I would need the extra space of the wagon vs. 450E sedan and I could not justify the extra cost.
Just my opinion and others will disagree.
I agree with you as well. If a sedan is enough space 99% of the time then a wagon doesn’t make sense unless you just really love them. I was talking more in terms of “pound for pound” value when you compare them to SUVs. Sedan vs wagon I think is a different argument since they are intended to serve different purposes as opposed to SUV vs wagon which have similar purposes. At least in my opinion
Speaking of S-Class wagons, the Sultan of Brunei had one, among numerous other rare and one off vehicles, with his 456 GT Venice (another one off wagon) being my personal favorite. He also owned the first ever Bentley SUV (no not the Bentayga )
The Bentley Dominator looks like what you’d get if you ordered a Rolls Royce Cullinan on Wish.com
Although I think it was actually based on a Range Rover
Last edited by thenothingblack; 01-22-2022 at 12:25 AM.
In my opinion, the nearly $6,000 premium for a MB wagon vs. either the 450 sedan of the GLE450 is the biggest problem.
Not trying to talk you (or anybody else) into a wagon if the space isn’t needed, but FWIW when spec’d similarly (sedan with 19” wheels and air suspension; GLE with third row and air suspension), the AT wagon is less than $2k more than the sedan and a few hundred less than the GLE.
I agree with all on the back seat leg room on the wagon, wish it had more. But in my case in the last 20 years, I can count on my hands how many times anyone has sat in the back seat of MY car.
I am part of the diminishing population that just likes wagons. if not a wagon, then it's a convertible, but after 2 skin grafts and 4 other skin cancer surgeries my convertible days are over.
Do I need the room of the wagon, no not really, I'm retired, kids are long gone, major house projects are complete, so why a wagon?
because it's what I like, and my wife said no to a 1952 Bentley R type.
The 140 S class wagon looks nice. The Ferrari looks like something out of a sci-fi movie. The Bentley looks like a high riding hearse. S213 looks best
[QUOTE=js_cls;8497511]Speaking of S-Class wagons, the Sultan of Brunei had one, among numerous other rare and one off vehicles, with his 456 GT Venice (another one off wagon) being my personal favorite. He also owned the first ever Bentley SUV (no not the Bentayga )
Speaking of S-Class wagons, the Sultan of Brunei had one, among numerous other rare and one off vehicles, with his 456 GT Venice (another one off wagon) being my personal favorite. He also owned the first ever Bentley SUV (no not the Bentayga )
Speaking of S-Class wagons, the Sultan of Brunei had one, among numerous other rare and one off vehicles, with his 456 GT Venice (another one off wagon) being my personal favorite. He also owned the first ever Bentley SUV (no not the Bentayga )
That Bentley SUV looks like a 2000 Lincoln Navigator, it is fugly in my opinion.
That’s what they want you to think. When the family expanded I was looking at the GLS (I wanted a diesel) vs a minivan. The minivan won, but I did test drive the GLS and it didn’t feel nearly as nice as the S class.
To double-down on the wagon love, I wish MBUSA would bring in the C wagon too. While the E wagon is a touch short in the rear seat space, if I were without regular backseat passengers (particularly of the massive car seat variety), I could appreciate a well optioned C wagon.
On the S wagon wish, the Panamera has a wagon variant I knew nothing about when I was last in the purchasing mode. Porsche does seem to position the Panamera as an S class competitor with more driver engagement. Could be an interesting alternative.
That’s what they want you to think. When the family expanded I was looking at the GLS (I wanted a diesel) vs a minivan. The minivan won, but I did test drive the GLS and it didn’t feel nearly as nice as the S class.
To double-down on the wagon love, I wish MBUSA would bring in the C wagon too. While the E wagon is a touch short in the rear seat space, if I were without regular backseat passengers (particularly of the massive car seat variety), I could appreciate a well optioned C wagon.
On the S wagon wish, the Panamera has a wagon variant I knew nothing about when I was last in the purchasing mode. Porsche does seem to position the Panamera as an S class competitor with more driver engagement. Could be an interesting alternative.
They sell the C-Class wagons in Canada, a buddy in Toronto has one. I saw it in Sep when I went up there. Bit small for my needs but it has a nice interior and drives very nicely.
Checkout YT for Panamera wagon reviews. The 'wagon' part is very small, definitely smaller than our E-Class wagons. It is more practical than a regular Panamera but I don't see it as a true wagon. The Panamera wagon has 19cu ft space with second row up and only 49 cu ft space with second row lowered.
2019 E 450 4 Matic T-model, 2014 Jag F-Type vert, 2004 Volvo V70R
You guys are missing the big picture. More models mean more work for the people in Atlanta.
The CLS shooting brake is the ultimate collectible wagon (except for probably an Aston Martin DB-4).
I have always been reluctant to pay Porsche prices, but I may have to to get a Gran Turismo Sport. It may have a little less room but I can get by and not have to bear the ignominy of driving a crossover.
1967 MGB GT, 2018 S213; 2015 BMW535d; 2019 Audi Q8
We picked up a used 2017 E400 long roof last summer. With wagons having been on the endangered species list for decades, and the general shift to SUVs, I'm thinking we'll have this car a long time. Had to buy it out of town, but the perfect combination of color and a great options list made it well worth the price of an airline ticket. Couldn't be happier!
01-21-2022, 11:44 AM
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