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This is not true. Experience with an EV and simple laws of Physics will quickly prove that this is not true. To get a feel for this, imagine a very inefficient resistive electric heater of 1kW or 2kW: it would heat the inside of a car in very, very cold conditions. This is <2% of the battery capacity. Most EVs have heat pumps that are much more efficient than resistive heaters. The largest effect of temperature is the extra energy required to heat the batteries. Actual measurements have shown a maximum decrease at very low temperatures of ~30% (measured in Norway on the EQS and others). On an Audi Etron there is published data (and observed by me) - a decrease of 15% between 25C and -5C. Compared to this decrease, the inside heating is almost negligible.
Not sure about EQS but many current Mercedes PHEV:s have a 6 kW resistive heater and that is not enough at -20 degrees Celsius or so. The initial heating power needed for a very cold cabin is huge. Later on on a long trip the average consumption for cabin heating may not be very high, specifically with heat pumps like on an EQS.
Norwegian reports like from teslabjorn tend to cover long journeys while on short trips cabin heating takes relatively more battery capacity. Then again, on short trips it does not matter as much as range is still sufficient.
The AC should run all the time it keeps the humidity under control regardless if the heat is running or not. Of course when its actually cooling it will draw more energy.
Only in the winter does the A/C actually cycle. In warmer weather MB has a very difficult time keeping the cabin 25°F cooler than the outside temperatures so the compressor runs 100% of the time and does not cycle.
I haven't run the numbers, but in general very cold or very hot operation carries a penalty of around 30%.
I don't think that is entirely true. I don't have an EQS, but all my previous EVs (3 Tesla's and a Taycan) have the best consumption in hot weather - around 30-35C / 85-95F. That is despite the use of AC . The biggest toll on usage is outside temp, but not because heating / cooling the interior but rather due to less efficient battery and increased friction in denser cold air. The only situation when really hot weather will have any meaningful impact on the usage is if you are stuck in a traffic jam - AC becomes the dominant energy expenditure.
See my P85D vs Taycan 4S usage vs. temp - all at 73 mph on highway, around 200 mile trips.
Only in the winter does the A/C actually cycle. In warmer weather MB has a very difficult time keeping the cabin 25°F cooler than the outside temperatures so the compressor runs 100% of the time and does not cycle.
Makes no difference to the ongoing discussion but Mercedes AC-compressors have been continuously running, variable volume models for a long time. Recently changed to be electrically driven, obviously so for all EVs. Even more easy to provide the necessary cooling power by adapting the electrically driven compressor for a given refrigerant flow. No RPM hiccups at idle. Anyway, for the cars discussed here, a cycled compressor equals to a continuously running compressor operating at a specific partial refrigerant flow.
See my P85D vs Taycan 4S usage vs. temp - all at 73 mph on highway, around 200 mile trips.
Very Interesting and useful. Thanks. I am surprised at the low R^2 for the Tesla data. Why so much worse than Taycan? (I'm sure you have thought about this.)
I assume you did all the measurements.
I don't think that is entirely true. I don't have an EQS, but all my previous EVs (3 Tesla's and a Taycan) have the best consumption in hot weather - around 30-35C / 85-95F. That is despite the use of AC . The biggest toll on usage is outside temp, but not because heating / cooling the interior but rather due to less efficient battery and increased friction in denser cold air. The only situation when really hot weather will have any meaningful impact on the usage is if you are stuck in a traffic jam - AC becomes the dominant energy expenditure.
See my P85D vs Taycan 4S usage vs. temp - all at 73 mph on highway, around 200 mile trips.
I don't think that is entirely true. I don't have an EQS, but all my previous EVs (3 Tesla's and a Taycan) have the best consumption in hot weather - around 30-35C / 85-95F. That is despite the use of AC . The biggest toll on usage is outside temp, but not because heating / cooling the interior but rather due to less efficient battery and increased friction in denser cold air. The only situation when really hot weather will have any meaningful impact on the usage is if you are stuck in a traffic jam - AC becomes the dominant energy expenditure.
See my P85D vs Taycan 4S usage vs. temp - all at 73 mph on highway, around 200 mile trips.
Seems completely correct. The only thing missing is very high temps (over 100F) my guess that would make the graph look a little more like a smile. In winter if the car is sitting in the cold you can prewarm it (or precool in summer), like any other Merc, using the Mercedes Me app. All new Mercedes 48V mild hybrids (like my GLS) run electric compressors, they have zero issues with very hot weather.
Very Interesting and useful. Thanks. I am surprised at the low R^2 for the Tesla data. Why so much worse than Taycan? (I'm sure you have thought about this.)
I assume you did all the measurements.
Correlation is better with the Taycan because of fewer trips at low temps - less scatter. We had an unusually warm winter in Minnesota last year - or I got older and less enthusiastic about driving...
Looking at Teslabjorn's videos on Youtube (with the 580), I would guess the consumption adjusted to temp is very similar to the Taycan 4S/P85. This is remarkable given it weighs over 1000 lb more.
I love the 4S in terms of comfort / fit and finish, but getting in and out of the car gets more challenging as I get younger. I am ready for a more comfortable ride. Also my experience with the remote access Porsche app has been less than perfect, which negates one of the most important advantages of going electric - the effective remote cabin conditioning. I had an E-coupe before, MercedesMe seemed more robust.
I am going to order an EQS - can't wait to populate the graph with a third car...
You are probably right. Would be curious how much of a hit.
I also hope the EQS has a "preferred departure" setting with optimized battery and cabin temperature - much like Tesla and Taycan. It is astonishing how much of a difference the battery temperature makes in terms of consumption. You can get the battery temp displayed in the Taycan, and I tested once on consecutive days the consumption starting cold-soaked vs. preheated battery. It was around 400 Wh/mi with battery at 68F vs 490 Wh/mi with battery at 50F - both at 35F or so. This was not due to cabin pre-heating - I did that on both occasions.
The Mercedes me on my E 43 is a little flaky. I think its cell network issues. The new version, "Me Connect" on our GLS is flawless. In fact, the Me Connect just got updated for EQS purposes.
The Mercedes me on my E 43 is a little flaky. I think its cell network issues. The new version, "Me Connect" on our GLS is flawless. In fact, the Me Connect just got updated for EQS purposes.
Any idea how long it takes to activate? We've had the car for almost two weeks now and it is still not activated.
Call using the car. Not the SOS, the other button near the sunroof control. Thats your direct connection to MB services. You will be activated within a few hours.
Last edited by c4004matic; Jan 3, 2022 at 10:23 PM.
The dealer has always activated Mercedes Me for us but you should be able to activate it yourself from the Mercedes Me app on the phone. The app reads a QR code from the car if I remember right. Not sure if all of this is the same in the US.
OP. any feedback on what kind of range you're getting with the cold temps?
Been getting between 230W/mi (146mpge) to 500W/mi (67mpge) for the last few days on trips over 10 miles. This translates to a range of 470 to 216 miles for the 107.8kwh battery. Temperature was 20F to 40F. Surprisingly, the consumption doesn’t seem to be directly correlated to the temperature or speed. For example, the best consumption of low 200 W/mi was during a 40-50 mph cruise at 25F in max eco mode, but the worst was 500W/mi during a local trip averaging 20mph at about 40F. There are lots of variables between the runs like number of passengers, eco options, heater, throttle pedal application, and likely some battery heating as the first few minutes of each trip always shows 600+W/mi. Nonetheless, the huge difference is still a surprise. For comparison, the Tesla Y has been getting a lot more predictable consumption proportional to speed and temperature of 220W/mi to 300W/mi with a lifetime average of 257w/mi (131mpge) over 6000+ miles.
It might be too soon to reach any conclusions for the EQS; all data so far seems to point to it being able to exceed 500 miles in more moderate temperatures if there’s an egg on the throttle pedal. It’s equally easy to drain the battery in 200 miles if driven enthusiastically in wintery conditions.
Been getting between 230W/mi (146mpge) to 500W/mi (67mpge) for the last few days on trips over 10 miles. This translates to a range of 470 to 216 miles for the 107.8kwh battery. Temperature was 20F to 40F. Surprisingly, the consumption doesn’t seem to be directly correlated to the temperature or speed. For example, the best consumption of low 200 W/mi was during a 40-50 mph cruise at 25F in max eco mode, but the worst was 500W/mi during a local trip averaging 20mph at about 40F. There are lots of variables between the runs like number of passengers, eco options, heater, throttle pedal application, and likely some battery heating as the first few minutes of each trip always shows 600+W/mi. Nonetheless, the huge difference is still a surprise. For comparison, the Tesla Y has been getting a lot more predictable consumption proportional to speed and temperature of 220W/mi to 300W/mi with a lifetime average of 257w/mi (131mpge) over 6000+ miles.
It might be too soon to reach any conclusions for the EQS; all data so far seems to point to it being able to exceed 500 miles in more moderate temperatures if there’s an egg on the throttle pedal. It’s equally easy to drain the battery in 200 miles if driven enthusiastically in wintery conditions.
Call using the car. Not the SOS, the other button near the sunroof control. Thats your direct connection to MB services. You will be activated within a few hours.
Took your advice and tried that. Unfortunately, they gave me the "we sent your complaint to the technical team, wait a few days, maybe it will work". Hopefully something will change.
Should I remove my account and then call MB services and ask them to activate the car on my behalf? Because whenever I try the QR code, my phone crashes during the setup.
Last edited by alexzz123; Jan 4, 2022 at 04:49 PM.
Took your advice and tried that. Unfortunately, they gave me the "we sent your complaint to the technical team, wait a few days, maybe it will work". Hopefully something will change.
Should I remove my account and then call MB services and ask them to activate the car on my behalf? Because whenever I try the QR code, my phone crashes during the setup.
Teething issues🙄 Im sure early adopters will have plenty😬
Been getting between 230W/mi (146mpge) to 500W/mi (67mpge) for the last few days on trips over 10 miles. This translates to a range of 470 to 216 miles for the 107.8kwh battery. Temperature was 20F to 40F. Surprisingly, the consumption doesn’t seem to be directly correlated to the temperature or speed. For example, the best consumption of low 200 W/mi was during a 40-50 mph cruise at 25F in max eco mode, but the worst was 500W/mi during a local trip averaging 20mph at about 40F. There are lots of variables between the runs like number of passengers, eco options, heater, throttle pedal application, and likely some battery heating as the first few minutes of each trip always shows 600+W/mi. Nonetheless, the huge difference is still a surprise. For comparison, the Tesla Y has been getting a lot more predictable consumption proportional to speed and temperature of 220W/mi to 300W/mi with a lifetime average of 257w/mi (131mpge) over 6000+ miles.
It might be too soon to reach any conclusions for the EQS; all data so far seems to point to it being able to exceed 500 miles in more moderate temperatures if there’s an egg on the throttle pedal. It’s equally easy to drain the battery in 200 miles if driven enthusiastically in wintery conditions.
Thank you for posting your experience - important datapoints. The behavior you describe is typical of EVs. Much like conventional engines, efficiency depends on temperature - this time battery temperature rather than engine. When you go short trips, you start with a cold battery this time of the year, so your efficiency will be very poor. I have seen as high as 1200-1300 Wh/mi in very cold weather. Any longer distance driving will allopw the battery to heat up and will improve consumption.
When you have the chance please post your highway consumption - this is where range really matters. Thank you, and congrats for the car!
Took your advice and tried that. Unfortunately, they gave me the "we sent your complaint to the technical team, wait a few days, maybe it will work". Hopefully something will change.
Should I remove my account and then call MB services and ask them to activate the car on my behalf? Because whenever I try the QR code, my phone crashes during the setup.
Is this your first car on the Mercedes Me account? I recently had a lot of problems with the app. Everything got fixed by removing the car from the application (not Mercedes Me account). Then delete all app memory, uninstall app, reboot phone and reinstall app. The app keeps a lot of information on the phone even if just uninstalled and reinstalled. Even active login remains. One should get into the state where the app forgets everything from the past. Obviously may not help in your case but not too much work to try.
My dealer finally has an EQS450 in the showroom. First, the good news. The exterior looks very nice. As others have stated, it looks better in person.
The bad news: This may be a case of “to each his own.” I’m not at all impressed with the interior (especially the dash area). To me the driver information screen and the tablet-like screen in the middle look hideous. I didn’t realize the driver screen is not really integrated in the dash but sticks out like a sore thumb. That looks cheap. The hyper screen makes a huge difference and likely has more usable features.
I do like the cushion pillow headrests a lot. The seats are definitely comfortable and there’s plenty of headroom. I’m 6’2” and had plenty of space to spare.
I didn’t drive this car but I’m very much looking forward to the EQS580 I ordered months ago and I should have it sometime in February. It has all the options except for the executive rear seating.
I hope I don’t upset those of you that are getting the EQS450 but again everyone’s tastes are different.
Is this your first car on the Mercedes Me account? I recently had a lot of problems with the app. Everything got fixed by removing the car from the application (not Mercedes Me account). Then delete all app memory, uninstall app, reboot phone and reinstall app. The app keeps a lot of information on the phone even if just uninstalled and reinstalled. Even active login remains. One should get into the state where the app forgets everything from the past. Obviously may not help in your case but not too much work to try.
It basicly identical to the S580 dash. I don't dislike, the hyperscreen however does look better. Personally the passenger screen is overkill though. Im pretty sure that screen will always off in my car.
Is this your first car on the Mercedes Me account? I recently had a lot of problems with the app. Everything got fixed by removing the car from the application (not Mercedes Me account). Then delete all app memory, uninstall app, reboot phone and reinstall app. The app keeps a lot of information on the phone even if just uninstalled and reinstalled. Even active login remains. One should get into the state where the app forgets everything from the past. Obviously may not help in your case but not too much work to try.
It basicly identical to the S580 dash. I don't dislike, the hyperscreen however does look better. Personally the passenger screen is overkill though. Im pretty sure that screen will always off in my car.
It basicly identical to the S580 dash. I don't dislike, the hyperscreen however does look better. Personally the passenger screen is overkill though. Im pretty sure that screen will always off in my car.
I think this was suppose to be a reply to my post, right?
To me, based on what I saw in videos, the dash area with the hyperscreen on the EQS580 looks very different and MUCH nicer than what you get with the EQS450 without the hyperscreen.
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