Another EQS review
05-26-2022, 09:12 PM
#27
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I actually found their points objective and valid. I also have a lot of respect for their opinion and subscribe to the Savage Geese channel. Maybe they are an acquired taste? I know I am.
I too disliked the EQS once upon a time and didn't see its value. No soft-close doors? No rear window shades? Who the heck designed these uncomfortable rear seats? But I still bought one anyway after selling my S550e. It's a sickness for sure.
After living with it for awhile now, two things jump out at me. The cheapness of the door armrests (feel and sound loose) and the somewhat stiff ride (compared to my previous S class vehicles anyway). I've gotten used to the brakes/brake pedal feel and love the technology, efficiency, range, quietness, practicality of the lift back (I found out this weekend that it perfectly fits a Sony 65" OLED TV in the box from Costco), and voice prompts. Yea, even the shape is growing on me.
I justified buying the car despite not being able to get my desired equipment because I said this is just a proof of concept and the next car I buy will be the real deal. A vehicle I buy without the compromises I had to accept with this car (some compromises due to the chip shortage and not a design/engineering fault). The new BMW i7 is proof positive that electricified luxury cars don't have to sacrifice comfort and luxury for the sake of electrification. Maybe MB will come out with a true electric S-class. If so, I'll be the first in line.
I think, taken as a whole, there is a lot more to like about this vehicle than hate. After all, I could have bought a new S-Class if I wanted all the traditional trappings that I was looking for. But there is no perfect car, at any price point.
IMHO
I too disliked the EQS once upon a time and didn't see its value. No soft-close doors? No rear window shades? Who the heck designed these uncomfortable rear seats? But I still bought one anyway after selling my S550e. It's a sickness for sure.
After living with it for awhile now, two things jump out at me. The cheapness of the door armrests (feel and sound loose) and the somewhat stiff ride (compared to my previous S class vehicles anyway). I've gotten used to the brakes/brake pedal feel and love the technology, efficiency, range, quietness, practicality of the lift back (I found out this weekend that it perfectly fits a Sony 65" OLED TV in the box from Costco), and voice prompts. Yea, even the shape is growing on me.
I justified buying the car despite not being able to get my desired equipment because I said this is just a proof of concept and the next car I buy will be the real deal. A vehicle I buy without the compromises I had to accept with this car (some compromises due to the chip shortage and not a design/engineering fault). The new BMW i7 is proof positive that electricified luxury cars don't have to sacrifice comfort and luxury for the sake of electrification. Maybe MB will come out with a true electric S-class. If so, I'll be the first in line.
I think, taken as a whole, there is a lot more to like about this vehicle than hate. After all, I could have bought a new S-Class if I wanted all the traditional trappings that I was looking for. But there is no perfect car, at any price point.
IMHO
Savage Geese's attitude towards cars tends to be related to the amount of joy the car brings them to drive, for example a recent review of a Ferrari 360 where they both were giggling like school girls due to the sound it made while acknowledging that it wasn't that great of a car. I think that Mark found the tech in this car painful to experience hence his negativity "You have to swipe ****in everything in this pile" and nothing joyful about it.
I am surprised by their criticism of the handling because my impression was that the EQS is a better handling car than the S class due to it's low CG.
Last edited by MBNUT1; 05-26-2022 at 09:51 PM.
05-27-2022, 12:16 PM
#29
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Excellent objective assessment. The vastly superior efficiency of EV's compared to ICE powered cars renders the latter a relic, though some of those relics were nicer cars. For example the seats (at least in a base 450+) don't seem as nice as the ICE S Class seats front or back. The class leading drag coefficient results in a shape that some (myself included) find unappealing, I guess that is the price of progress.
For instance I think the Lucid Air is much better looking than the EQS, and the cD is basically the same.
As for the differences in the interior quality, etc...thats a function of cost. Developing the all new EV platform and delivering it at a similar to S Class cost means corners are cut somewhere, they will get tat figured out too. This platform will be EXTENSIVELY used by Mercedes, and that will drive the cost of its development per unit way down and they will be able to make better and better cars off of it.
The point is, this car is a first gen effort, more appealing cars will come. I think you already see that with the EQS SUV which has a more normal shape and the dash isn't as tall. The "skateboard" platform works better in a crossover than a sedan.
I am surprised by their criticism of the handling because my impression was that the EQS is a better handling car than the S class due to it's low CG.
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05-27-2022, 02:17 PM
#30
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EQS's Cd is the best in the world right now. It is a true example of the principal of form following function.
Last edited by MBNUT1; 05-27-2022 at 02:21 PM.
05-27-2022, 02:56 PM
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05-27-2022, 05:36 PM
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2022 EQS 450
"Savage Geese" versus Top Gear or MercBenzKing says it all. These are two bubba's who have no credentials to review a car of this caliber. They have been driving Honda Civics their whole life and they dress and the talk in that vernacular.
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05-27-2022, 05:44 PM
#33
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They've driven a wide variety of cars, Mercedes included, and have many positive things to say about them. They also spend a lot of time driving on racetracks and interviewing engineers who work on said vehicles. This is statement is so far from the truth.
05-27-2022, 06:13 PM
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2022 EQS 450
While I don't want to get into a delusional conversation, my point was the savage geese most likely have never owned a car of this caliber nor have you based on your comments. Driving a car for a few days as a loaner from the manufacturer is NOT the same as owning a marque over a long term as most of the posters in this forum have achieved. I have owned and done European delivery on MB Porsche and BMW for 50 years including owning a dealership for several years.
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05-27-2022, 06:19 PM
#35
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While I don't want to get into a delusional conversation, my point was the savage geese most likely have never owned a car of this caliber nor have you based on your comments. Driving a car for a few days as a loaner from the manufacturer is NOT the same as owning a marque over a long term as most of the posters in this forum have achieved. I have owned and done European delivery on MB Porsche and BMW for 50 years including owning a dealership for several years.
05-27-2022, 07:03 PM
#36
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Condescension comes in many forms, and is often not recognized by the condescender, the savage geese not excluded. Bottom line is that no one is going to be successful on a forum full of owners and lovers of a particular vehicle, no matter what it is, if all they can do is disrespect said vehicle. Especially when said vehicle is viewed by the owners as visionary and paradigm changing. Only those in a different paradigm would persist in this delusional endeavor, and would do well to not waste their self-perceived talents. Sorry if that sounds condescending. In the words of Steven Stills...."I grow weary of the torment, can there be no peace?"
05-27-2022, 07:12 PM
#37
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While I don't want to get into a delusional conversation, my point was the savage geese most likely have never owned a car of this caliber nor have you based on your comments. Driving a car for a few days as a loaner from the manufacturer is NOT the same as owning a marque over a long term as most of the posters in this forum have achieved. I have owned and done European delivery on MB Porsche and BMW for 50 years including owning a dealership for several years.
Don't be so poopy pants that he doesn't like your car. If you like it, who cares?
Originally Posted by hlothery
if all they can do is disrespect said vehicle. Especially when said vehicle is viewed by the owners as visionary and paradigm changing.
I drove Lexus cars for years and reviewers constantly put down my vehicles, I couldn't care less...because I knew I was driving a vehicle I enjoy. Its almost like you actually agree with a lot of what was said and you have to belittle those who express those opinions to validate your purchase or something...
Like I said there was literally nothing anybody in here could say to me that would bother me. I could not possibly care less what anybody thinks about my cars...many of you clearly care a great deal what others think. Why? Like the guy who tried to make fun of my wife's minivan. Do you think I think her minivan is awesome or something? I hate it lol, its for hauling the kids and the dog around.
Last edited by SW20S; 05-27-2022 at 07:24 PM.
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05-27-2022, 08:47 PM
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Don't know what to tell you, but these things have been mentioned in the vast majority of reviews, the ride quality, noise isolation, weird brake pedal behavior and feel etc. Nonbiased reviews disagree with you about the comparison between the two. The interior differences are immediately apparent when you sit in both cars, and I'm talking cars of the same price point. Like I have said before, the EQS is a lot more like an E Class than an S Class. Look at the post right above mine from another owner.
As for this reviewer, watch his S Class review. He hates it too, so its not like he's an S Class fan.
I'm glad you like your EQS, I would never buy one over an S Class, I just really dislike it. But...thats why they make different models.
What I would love to see is an S Class with the EQS' EV powertrain. THAT I would buy.
As for this reviewer, watch his S Class review. He hates it too, so its not like he's an S Class fan.
I'm glad you like your EQS, I would never buy one over an S Class, I just really dislike it. But...thats why they make different models.
What I would love to see is an S Class with the EQS' EV powertrain. THAT I would buy.
You may want to refrain from quoting “other” reviews to justify a personal opinion that is not based on personal knowledge or feedback.
Just makes it less relevant
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TH22 (05-27-2022)
05-27-2022, 08:52 PM
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Cleaned up the thread a bit. No need to get personal.
Thanks
Thanks
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js_cls (05-27-2022)
05-27-2022, 09:10 PM
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I will add my subjective opinion about savage geese. I have seen a number of reviews and found that they have a good technical understanding of cars in general and I thought their approach of assessing certain aspects of the cars proper (engine,suspension, drivetrain, etc.).
The same with the EQS. They discussed a number of options in good detail but then came to wrong conclusions because they are not the core customer those features, specs or options are designed for.
Their personal opinion is often downright moronic as everything is viewed in comparison of their personal taste.
Those guys go for American muscle and metal, some Porsches or other sports cars.
They understand the tech but have trouble understanding why customers would want that or want luxury, why anyone would want to spend money for features they find irrelevant or why anyone would bother with EV for the next 5 years or ever.
As such, I find many of their conclusions forgettable or outright annoying.
The same with the EQS. They discussed a number of options in good detail but then came to wrong conclusions because they are not the core customer those features, specs or options are designed for.
Their personal opinion is often downright moronic as everything is viewed in comparison of their personal taste.
Those guys go for American muscle and metal, some Porsches or other sports cars.
They understand the tech but have trouble understanding why customers would want that or want luxury, why anyone would want to spend money for features they find irrelevant or why anyone would bother with EV for the next 5 years or ever.
As such, I find many of their conclusions forgettable or outright annoying.
Last edited by Wolfman; 05-27-2022 at 09:12 PM.
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05-27-2022, 09:18 PM
#41
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I will add my subjective opinion about savage geese. I have seen a number of reviews and found that they have a good technical understanding of cars in general and I thought their approach of assessing certain aspects of the cars proper (engine,suspension, drivetrain, etc.).
The same with the EQS. They discussed a number of options in good detail but then came to wrong conclusions because they are not the core customer an lot of these options are designed for.
Their personal opinion is often downright moronic as everything is viewed in comparison of their personal taste.
Those guys go for American muscle and metal, some Porsches or other sports cars.
They understand the tech but have trouble understanding why customers would want that or want luxury, why anyone would want to spend money for features they find irrelevant or why anyone would bother with EV for the next 5 years or ever.
As such, I find many of their conclusions forgettable or outright annoying.
The same with the EQS. They discussed a number of options in good detail but then came to wrong conclusions because they are not the core customer an lot of these options are designed for.
Their personal opinion is often downright moronic as everything is viewed in comparison of their personal taste.
Those guys go for American muscle and metal, some Porsches or other sports cars.
They understand the tech but have trouble understanding why customers would want that or want luxury, why anyone would want to spend money for features they find irrelevant or why anyone would bother with EV for the next 5 years or ever.
As such, I find many of their conclusions forgettable or outright annoying.
05-27-2022, 11:54 PM
#42
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It isn't, there are PLENTY of extremely attractive EVs, both currently on the market and coming. Mercedes chose to use this "computer mouse" shape to make an EV statement, and it backfires IMO. They will develop a new styling language that incorporates more aerodynamics into more traditional Mercedes shapes, and improvement of EV range will make aerodynamics less important.
For instance I think the Lucid Air is much better looking than the EQS, and the cD is basically the same.
As for the differences in the interior quality, etc...thats a function of cost. Developing the all new EV platform and delivering it at a similar to S Class cost means corners are cut somewhere, they will get tat figured out too. This platform will be EXTENSIVELY used by Mercedes, and that will drive the cost of its development per unit way down and they will be able to make better and better cars off of it.
The point is, this car is a first gen effort, more appealing cars will come. I think you already see that with the EQS SUV which has a more normal shape and the dash isn't as tall. The "skateboard" platform works better in a crossover than a sedan.
Weight is weight, its hard to have a 6,000 lb car that handles well.
For instance I think the Lucid Air is much better looking than the EQS, and the cD is basically the same.
As for the differences in the interior quality, etc...thats a function of cost. Developing the all new EV platform and delivering it at a similar to S Class cost means corners are cut somewhere, they will get tat figured out too. This platform will be EXTENSIVELY used by Mercedes, and that will drive the cost of its development per unit way down and they will be able to make better and better cars off of it.
The point is, this car is a first gen effort, more appealing cars will come. I think you already see that with the EQS SUV which has a more normal shape and the dash isn't as tall. The "skateboard" platform works better in a crossover than a sedan.
Weight is weight, its hard to have a 6,000 lb car that handles well.
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05-28-2022, 02:27 PM
#44
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2014 Mercedes E350 4matic Wagon, 2018 Fiat 124 Spyder Lusso manual, 2005 Acura TSX manual
I have a huge amount of respect for savagegeese. He’s very knowledgeable, does amazing and in depth reviews of car audio systems, and both he and his business partner are well spoken. However, he and I have very different priorities in cars. It’s not like he drives a 25 year old Civic and talks about how much he loves it’s analogue feeling; he owns a very nice XC90 with the bower and Wilkins audio, air suspension, and some other rare features, but he’s generally tech averse and not into automation, something the average EQS owner is not like. That’s not what I have an issue with though.
A good car reviewer doesn’t need to be objective. That’s impossible, and journalism is better with some subjectivity. We can read the specifications if we want objectivity. You need a car reviewer to be able to talk about more emotional things in a subjective way. HOWEVER, a good journalist presents those opinions as subjective, and talks about why some people may like certain features or emotions the far brings, and why some may not, and why theylike or don’t like said feature or provided emotion I find that savage geese and his other reviewer present these emotions and subjective things as objective, as this is how the car is bad. Which takes away a lot of creditibikty to me. Instead of saying “I’m not a fan of the layering of MBUX”, they say “MBUX is bad.” That’s what frustrates me. They’re extremely knowledgeable but they present as if their way of experoenveinf cars and their taste in cars is everyone’s, and that whatever their subjective reaction is is the correct and only reaction. If that were the case, everyone would drive the exact same car which is obviously not the case.
A good car reviewer doesn’t need to be objective. That’s impossible, and journalism is better with some subjectivity. We can read the specifications if we want objectivity. You need a car reviewer to be able to talk about more emotional things in a subjective way. HOWEVER, a good journalist presents those opinions as subjective, and talks about why some people may like certain features or emotions the far brings, and why some may not, and why theylike or don’t like said feature or provided emotion I find that savage geese and his other reviewer present these emotions and subjective things as objective, as this is how the car is bad. Which takes away a lot of creditibikty to me. Instead of saying “I’m not a fan of the layering of MBUX”, they say “MBUX is bad.” That’s what frustrates me. They’re extremely knowledgeable but they present as if their way of experoenveinf cars and their taste in cars is everyone’s, and that whatever their subjective reaction is is the correct and only reaction. If that were the case, everyone would drive the exact same car which is obviously not the case.
05-28-2022, 03:36 PM
#45
Super Member
Actually the main reviewer on Savagegeese currently owns a Lexus LC500 and has in the past owned various Audis including an S8. So...that assumption would not be accurate, he could easily own an EQS if he wanted to. In any event, does that equally discount all the reviewers who liked the car too? Because they're no different than him.
Don't be so poopy pants that he doesn't like your car. If you like it, who cares?
You need to get some perspective. Its just a car, some people will like it and some people won't. Look in the W223 forums, those guys in there put up with a TON of complaining about their car, and they take it with grace...unlike you folks in here...
.
Don't be so poopy pants that he doesn't like your car. If you like it, who cares?
You need to get some perspective. Its just a car, some people will like it and some people won't. Look in the W223 forums, those guys in there put up with a TON of complaining about their car, and they take it with grace...unlike you folks in here...
.
05-28-2022, 08:04 PM
#47
Member
They wanted to Roast MB. If you don’t like the car, the video is entertaining. A roast is far from an objective review though. A reviewer would have more respect for the manufacturer and use more restraint. Their lack of respect for a manufacturer as deserving as MB comes off as juvenile. Maybe these two can show Mercedes-AMG Petronas how it’s done on the track. Btw, I highly recommend the F1 Netflix series if you’re a fan.
05-30-2022, 09:03 AM
#48
MBWorld Fanatic!
Relentless? I’ve posted 5 times lol. I’m not “restating my opinion” I’m discussing it on a discussion forum. That’s what the forum is for. If you don’t want to read the thread anymore, just don’t read it anymore. If you don’t want to read what i have to say anymore, just ignore me.
Thats actually not my perspective at all, I’m not the only person that gets a say in what vehicles we have in our garage, let’s put it that way. Left to my own devices I would never buy a minivan. In fact, I would consider an EQS SUV to replace it, likely more than I would want to spend for that specific vehicle though, and I’m not yet ready to have an EV as our family travel vehicle.
Your perspective, for instance, is that a minivan is the best vehicle to transport kids and pets. Many of us have faced those challenges and gone in a different direction.
Last edited by SW20S; 05-30-2022 at 09:59 AM.
