Recuperation vs Range
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Junior Member
Joined: Mar 2022
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From: Bluffton SC / AC NJ
EQS 450+
Recuperation vs Range
I think we all agree that the range estimate is an estimate. However I performed an "experiment" yesterday (that I plan to repeat) that implies that range estimates are somewhat related to the recuperation strength. I use strong recuperation all the time and was driving some friends to the airport (a 60 mile drive) on the expressway at approximately 70-75 mph. When I have done this in the past, the range estimate at the end of the drive was significantly less than it mathematically should have been - i.e the range estimate at the beginning was 280 and the drive was 60 miles, the range estimate should have been 220 at the end but it was 190. I have noticed that when I switch from normal recuperation to strong recuperation a feeling that the motor is "grabbed." (My friend who has a EQE SUV has felt the same thing.) I decided to drive back in normal recuperation on the highway and interestingly the range at the end of the drive was exactly what the estimated range should have been (range at start minus driving distance). In summary, I believe that the motor when shifted to strong recuperation and operates as a generator recharging the battery requires more energy to drive on a highway and using strong recuperation is contraindicated.
Has anyone else seen this behavior? Comments?
Has anyone else seen this behavior? Comments?
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From: NM
2023 AMG EQS
Range estimate is based on recent driving history… it’s not complicated… And has nothing to do with regen mode.
The reason why the range estimate worked on your return trip (on the highway) was because your recent driving history was the drive you took to the airport (on the highway)
Your recent driving history prior to driving to the airport was likely not highway driving.
OMG No! Who would design a car this way?
Driving 70-75mph is what requires more energy than your previous driving history which was likely 30-50mph around town…
The reason why the range estimate worked on your return trip (on the highway) was because your recent driving history was the drive you took to the airport (on the highway)
Your recent driving history prior to driving to the airport was likely not highway driving.
Driving 70-75mph is what requires more energy than your previous driving history which was likely 30-50mph around town…
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I think we all agree that the range estimate is an estimate. However I performed an "experiment" yesterday (that I plan to repeat) that implies that range estimates are somewhat related to the recuperation strength. I use strong recuperation all the time and was driving some friends to the airport (a 60 mile drive) on the expressway at approximately 70-75 mph. When I have done this in the past, the range estimate at the end of the drive was significantly less than it mathematically should have been - i.e the range estimate at the beginning was 280 and the drive was 60 miles, the range estimate should have been 220 at the end but it was 190. I have noticed that when I switch from normal recuperation to strong recuperation a feeling that the motor is "grabbed." (My friend who has a EQE SUV has felt the same thing.) I decided to drive back in normal recuperation on the highway and interestingly the range at the end of the drive was exactly what the estimated range should have been (range at start minus driving distance). In summary, I believe that the motor when shifted to strong recuperation and operates as a generator recharging the battery requires more energy to drive on a highway and using strong recuperation is contraindicated.
Has anyone else seen this behavior? Comments?
Has anyone else seen this behavior? Comments?
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From: Occupied Palestine
2025 Maserati Grecale Folgore and 2024 Jaguar F-PACE SVR
It'll be interesting to see how the improve the braking because in my EQE 500 anyways I really can't stand using strong regen. Not only does the brake peddle move way too much but it's just plain too aggressive for highway driving if you ask me. The ONLY time I use it is in stop-and-go traffic. Brake-gas-gas-brake, brake-gas-gas-brake, brake-gas-gas-brake... minus paddle stops the insanity! LOL
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maybe the road is slightly going uphill to airport. wind direction, ac power.
all above need to be taking account.
basic on my experience, in freeway, it will be better to use no recuperation (with or without intelligence). if not traffic. in local or during traffic, normal or strong is better.
all above need to be taking account.
basic on my experience, in freeway, it will be better to use no recuperation (with or without intelligence). if not traffic. in local or during traffic, normal or strong is better.
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maybe the road is slightly going uphill to airport. wind direction, ac power.
all above need to be taking account.
basic on my experience, in freeway, it will be better to use no recuperation (with or without intelligence). if not traffic. in local or during traffic, normal or strong is better.
all above need to be taking account.
basic on my experience, in freeway, it will be better to use no recuperation (with or without intelligence). if not traffic. in local or during traffic, normal or strong is better.
Smooth ride is always more efficient, ICE or electric. An electric car loses less energy from braking (acceleration always precedes braking) because of recuperation but recuperation efficiency is not 100%.
If there is a need to brake, I cannot see why efficiency would be different with strong recuperation versus using the brake pedal as long as deceleration is the same. Both end up braking with recuperation anyway.
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What is the theory behind this?
Smooth ride is always more efficient, ICE or electric. An electric car loses less energy from braking (acceleration always precedes braking) because of recuperation but recuperation efficiency is not 100%.
If there is a need to brake, I cannot see why efficiency would be different with strong recuperation versus using the brake pedal as long as deceleration is the same. Both end up braking with recuperation anyway.
Smooth ride is always more efficient, ICE or electric. An electric car loses less energy from braking (acceleration always precedes braking) because of recuperation but recuperation efficiency is not 100%.
If there is a need to brake, I cannot see why efficiency would be different with strong recuperation versus using the brake pedal as long as deceleration is the same. Both end up braking with recuperation anyway.
it is much easier using strong recuperation to control the speed during stop and go traffic without extra braking or accelerate (at least for me).
extra braking or acceleration uses more energy especially during traffic, this applies to both ice or ev.
I do recommend to use strong recuperation during traffic to eliminate extra energy lost.
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223.168 & 213.012 & 906.633 & 214.005
you are correct. but my theory is actually nothing to do with EV, it is more about our body react/control the gas pedal.
it is much easier using strong recuperation to control the speed during stop and go traffic without extra braking or accelerate (at least for me).
extra braking or acceleration uses more energy especially during traffic, this applies to both ice or ev.
I do recommend to use strong recuperation during traffic to eliminate extra energy lost.
it is much easier using strong recuperation to control the speed during stop and go traffic without extra braking or accelerate (at least for me).
extra braking or acceleration uses more energy especially during traffic, this applies to both ice or ev.
I do recommend to use strong recuperation during traffic to eliminate extra energy lost.
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2022 Taycan GTS, 2023 EQS580 SUV, 2023 EQS580 sedan
Sorry but I'm a bit lost. Recuperation concerns EVs and hybrids. My point anyway was that recuperation works equally from strong recuperation settings (one pedal driving) as well as using the brake pedal (decelerating equally fast). Perhaps your point was that one or the other driving style leads to different type of braking/acceleration. I was assuming the same style for both cases.
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Sorry but I'm a bit lost. Recuperation concerns EVs and hybrids. My point anyway was that recuperation works equally from strong recuperation settings (one pedal driving) as well as using the brake pedal (decelerating equally fast). Perhaps your point was that one or the other driving style leads to different type of braking/acceleration. I was assuming the same style for both cases.
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Joined: May 2024
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2023 EQS450
I agree strong recuperation kills highway range
I think we all agree that the range estimate is an estimate. However I performed an "experiment" yesterday (that I plan to repeat) that implies that range estimates are somewhat related to the recuperation strength. I use strong recuperation all the time and was driving some friends to the airport (a 60 mile drive) on the expressway at approximately 70-75 mph. When I have done this in the past, the range estimate at the end of the drive was significantly less than it mathematically should have been - i.e the range estimate at the beginning was 280 and the drive was 60 miles, the range estimate should have been 220 at the end but it was 190. I have noticed that when I switch from normal recuperation to strong recuperation a feeling that the motor is "grabbed." (My friend who has a EQE SUV has felt the same thing.) I decided to drive back in normal recuperation on the highway and interestingly the range at the end of the drive was exactly what the estimated range should have been (range at start minus driving distance). In summary, I believe that the motor when shifted to strong recuperation and operates as a generator recharging the battery requires more energy to drive on a highway and using strong recuperation is contraindicated.
Has anyone else seen this behavior? Comments?
Has anyone else seen this behavior? Comments?
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2022
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I noticed the same thing. If I drive on the highway with strong recuperation on -- I lose about 30% of my range. If I go with intelligent recuperation or normal -- I get a lot more range. I liked the strong recuperation mode to get the shorter brake action -- but not at this kind of cost in highway range.
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I've changed my driving style since I made that post above. I now use strong regen on a daily basis in lieu of hard braking. After I come to a stop or make the turn I paddle back into normal regen. Not only does the car stop/slow faster but that solves the brake "feel" problem for me too. If I hit the brakes in strong regen I'm actually using the brakes. In normal regen hitting the brakes just regens more at first. So the paddles work kind of like a "blending function override" for me.
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I still haven't deciphered the unintelligible hieroglyphics "intelligent" regen uses. It's just too unpredictable for me, like the automatic unnecessary lane changes and sudden speed changes my EQE SUV was doing on the highway. I've turned all that off and am much happier now.
Last edited by GreasedFolgore; May 15, 2024 at 09:43 PM.
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EQE350 SUV 4MATIC
Its great that there are options to suit each persons driving style. For me Strong regen leaving home to the exit of our driveway then Intelligent regen while in traffic or DISTRONIC, and back to Strong when approaching a stop sign or traffic light with no vehicles ahead. Highway is usually with DISTRONIC. The next level of advancement will be for traffic light and stop sign recognition tied into Intelligent and DISTRONIC.
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I have traded transmission shifting to regeneration modulation. In short, intelligent regen should not be used with spirited driving but works great in slow moving freeway traffic Strong regen is good for city driving with frequent or street light stops. Normal regen is retro petro driving. No regen is for highway driving. You can do spirited driving in all modes except intelligent, but make sure to have your left foot over the brake pedal for no surprises.
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On the highway the most efficient mode is no regen. The car saves more energy by coasting. In the city regen provides more savings since you have a lot more episodes of regen and very few coasting oportunities. That is why auto regen is the overall thriftiest mode, it blends both with the least effort from the driver. I don't particularly like auto in city driving (Id rather just leave in strong regen) since I cant predict the amount of regen the car is in and how the brake sytem will react in in any particular situation.Looking for the green sign is an extra step that is not "natural" when driving in busy traffic.The main issue is an obvious one, the system is reactive, not predictive so its always a step behind when traffic is busy and complicated. Its a good system but again its a mediocre replacement for doing it yourself.
Last edited by c4004matic; May 17, 2024 at 09:55 PM.
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BTW that's why MB full self driving system has so many caveats, its a slow speed highway system. An oxymoron, but the reason is also obvious, there is a finite amount of "variables" on the highway plus its reaction time is not very swift. People always woder why we have planes that can fly themselves but cars cant, the reaso is quite simple, a plane simple has to think about its own system, it doesnt have 20 different cars five feet around it with pedestrians animals curbs and another million possible things happening many of them unpredictable. Given the sate of the art in computer heuristics and sensor technology not to mention its integration real self driving is still a pipe dream add lawyers to the formula abd its a virtual impossibility.
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The only exception is Tesla. They just threw out a totally unsafe and not yet ready system as "beta" for anyone to download it and use it.
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If you don't trust distronic, then you won't use intelligent regen.
For me, I use distronic as much as possible, and then use intelligent regen when distronic is not active.
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I noticed the same thing. If I drive on the highway with strong recuperation on -- I lose about 30% of my range. If I go with intelligent recuperation or normal -- I get a lot more range. I liked the strong recuperation mode to get the shorter brake action -- but not at this kind of cost in highway range.
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@gxprice Yes "creep" must be turned off for OPD. I have not tested but the emergency braking system should prevent crashing into the vehicle ahead. Maybe it just reduces the impact.
DISTRONIC functions are totally independent of regen mode, as in it does not matter what regen is set to when DISTRONIC is in use.
There are reports that Strong regen with highway driving could result in a 30% drop in range but I think is way off, and is more likely just the typical loss of range with highway driving vs city driving.
DISTRONIC functions are totally independent of regen mode, as in it does not matter what regen is set to when DISTRONIC is in use.
There are reports that Strong regen with highway driving could result in a 30% drop in range but I think is way off, and is more likely just the typical loss of range with highway driving vs city driving.
