TV550

This was helpful to me since I never owned a diesel and did not know much about it. Thought maybe some lurkers would find it interesting.

http://www.automobilemag.com/feature...ure/index.html

Comfy_Couch

Interesting article, thanks!

BJ021

Great article - it'll be interesting to see in 3 years what our 320dci's will be selling for. I've noticed that when dealers have them used they disappear pretty quick.

scottybdiving

I agree with their claims about the re-sale on larger trucks. My experience has been about $4-5K over a comparable gas pickup.

I disagree about their durability only being equal to a gas engine. Diesel engines are built heavier duty and achieve their performance with 30% less RPM's. It has always been common knowledge that they will outlast their gas counterparts. Why do you think they are used commercially?

StevethePilot

+1000 on that point, Scotty! Diesels are also about 50% simpler than the equivalent gas engine, even the new ULSD/CDI/Bluetec models. Fewer parts to fall off and go wrong.

BTW, re-watched "Shockwave" again yesterday. Whose crowbar was that out at Firebird? I love the fact you guys carry one. "Okay, got the tank and octopus, good mask, fins, you've got the defib and first aid kits, and ... oh, yeah, a big honkin' crowbar to beat the crap out of something should we need it. Ready!"

scottybdiving

That crowbar was pretty ineffective against the F-16 windshield. The guy swinging it said he had no feeling in his right hand, for weeks. The new toy for this year is a battery operated Holmatro. (Jaws)

StevethePilot

Okay, so I finally got around to actually reading the article and guys, if Toyota does bring its big diesel to the US and they offer it in the Land Cruiser (not slated), I might well not be a Mercedes owner anymore.

Oh, that's bull-hockey. I'll make my wife get the Land Cruiser and I'll keep my GL! Ha!

StevethePilot

Do they let you "play" with it? Open a bag of Doritos, or juice an orange, stuff like that? Hold some guy down and turn his nipples into coasters?

Oh, this is so !

lkchris

You've got your logic backward.

Engines are "built heavier duty" when their intent is commercial use.

Old GMC and International Harvester trucks came with heavy duty gasoline engines that were good for 400K miles, same as a diesel.

Diesel took over in trucks due to better economy and less maintenance.

There are indeed--see VW--diesel engines built specifically for car use and they aren't necessarily any longer-lived than gasoline engines built for car use.

I'd suspect our Mercedes V6 diesels to be as good as the gas V6s--which is pretty good.

scottybdiving

So your saying that an engine built for 16.5:1 compression is built the same as one for 10.7:1? You think the crank shaft, bearings, pistons, and rods are the same for an engine that achieves 398 ft/lb @ 1600 rpm vs 339 or 391 @ 2800 rpm's?

wmhjr

No (except for the old '80s gm conversion diesels) they aren't. The engines with 16.5:1 compression are built for 16.5:1 and the engines with 10.7:1 are built for 10.7:1.

But the engines with a longer stroke and higher compression ALSO actually HAVE that extra force. Commercial diesels are overbuilt. Consumer diesels may not be. Remember the VW Diesel Rabbits? They had tons and tons of blown head gaskets for example.

lkchris

Yes, as I said commercial engines are overbuilt.

A 1960s GMC V6 bare engine block weighs 800 lb.

scottybdiving

Diesels are able to have a longer stroke because the fuel burns slower and has more energy than gas. Longer stroke gas engines achieve more torque but reqire a lot more fuel, since gas burns quicker and has less energy. They also compromise RPM's, rate of acceleration, and horsepower.

The problems with the VW's were similar to problems the 70' - 80's GM diesels had. Underbuilt, which I don't think applies to today's modern diesels.

wmhjr

Look, the diesels are great. I'm thinking about an E320, though I'm forced to look for a 2007 because I can't buy an '08 here legally.

But, you're making a correlation where there isn't one. There is no factual data to suggest that a MB diesel engine in the E, ML or GL is "overbuilt" such that it will last significantly longer than an MB gas engine. Maybe it will - maybe it won't. Forget about the combustion differences. The fact is that the longer stroke (which is required in order for the diesel to generate its torque advantage) presents more force on the crankshaft and main bearings - diesel or gas powered. Similarly, the higher compression creates valvetrain and headgasket requirements. So MB does a nice job and engineering for it.

That does NOT mean that they "overengineer" the same way that for example a Detroit Diesel is so that it can be expected to run for 800k miles. There have also been commercial gas engines which were so designed. The fact that they are diesel or gas is secondary. "Underbuilt", "well built" and "over-built" are three completely different descriptions.

The only way we'll know for sure is when we get a whole heck of a lot more historical data about them. For now, all we can say is that they seem well designed.

Danno4x4

http://www.thinkcuv.com/index.asp = Commercial

scottybdiving

On the contrary, the correlation was made long ago (25 years) when Ford decided to make a diesel engine available in a consumer grade pickup. Toyota and Isuzu had great success with their engines in the early 80's but due to consumer attitudes created by GM's folly, they were not marketable. However, they would run forever and since most people could not sell them they had to keep them forever.

"Over-built" could be considered synonomous with inefficient like the heavy cast iron, naturally asperated versions. They were replaced by technology and superior perfomance in the 90's and they have proven to far outlast the comparable gas equivalents in their class.

My Duramax is just a much larger version of the 3.0L MB, physically and technologically.