Minute amounts of water or rust presented in the longer term are hard to detect. The cleaning mechanisms have their limits. That applies to everything.

 

Possibly the contamination is other than water and that is why the sensor didn't detect it and wasn't separated. Also the fuel tankers don't have dedicated compartments for diesel. Could there have been some ethanol gasoline left in the compartment when filled with diesel? I doubt the plastic parts are compatible with alcohol.

 

This is an internal Shell document to retailers regarding this issue. I think it is a good read for any of us that use diesel:

http://www.shellsource.com/NR/rdonly...onDocFINAL.pdf

What I took away from this is that if the dispenser is pumping slowly, that is a huge red flag to stop pumping. Also note, the retailers are not instructed to clean their tanks until they measure 1 inch of water at the bottom of the tank.

 

Frightening stuff, sounds like this San Francisco station didn't do the proper tank maintenance.

 

This is really scary and I wish you luck.

 

Do you know what was the error code that switch the CEL ON?
it is important to know what the computer recognized.

Dealer wants to do the whole deal because good money to replace all and no problem from you coming back to them in near future. They should have emptied tank and replace filter ASAP and put new fuel and see if it there is still CEL or no.


Car evidently detected something wrong = CEL ON.
Car was driven for a long time in LIMP mode = more bad stuff got closer to the engine or into it more fuel lines clogged with the more bad stuff spread everywhere.

The longer the bad stuff stays in the car fuel system the worst the situation will be.
If they found it in both ends that must have been some massive amount of bad stuff in your tank.

If cleaned properly new fuel filter inserted will it still show CEL?

Too many questions still no aswers for 15000 USD nonsense job.

 

If this is covered by insurance then this is a non issue but if it isn't a credit card statement might lead you to the fill up location that occurred just prior to the light coming on. Even if covered by insurance it would be good to figure out who has the corrosion in their tank. A friendly conversation with a clerk or two about tank maintenance or other complaints might help point the finger.

 

What if, and go with me here, that after they replace every single part, the vehicle remains in limp home mode (original complaint), because the technician made a diagnostic mistake and the problem was say ECU related? (Cam sensor etc.)
Remember they are only saying fuel because they saw "rusty water". They haven't pinpointed the REASON for the condition as yet. For all we know the water seen is in all of our diesels and could be an acceptable amount, thus the no water in fuel light etc. Other people must have bought from the station the OP bought from. Are they also rebuilding??

 

Soooo...what happened?

 

Guys,

Sorry for picking up an old thread, but what was the outcome? Did you have to pay for the rebuild or did you manage to get someone to share the tab?

 

Figure she must have ditched the Benz and thus the forum...

 

Well, first off apologies for not closing the loop on this. By the time everything was finished I just wanted to stop thinking about it!

It was definitely a good news/bad news resolution, with a rather unsatisfying lack of a clear answer or explanation....

In the end the dealership did replace the entire fuel line at a cost of approx. $17K. The reason why I had it done was that my auto insurance company, Chubb, was awesome and agreed to cover the claim. I did have a $1K deductible that was out of pocket - MBUSA said they would reimburse me for it but I never received anything. My service advisor always said he would followup but never did. Frankly, I was sick of dealing with everything and talking with MBUSA just made me cranky so I didn't follow up in a serious way. But now as I'm typing this I realize I should at least make another attempt. I will have exceedingly low expectations....

MBUSA maintained that replacing the entire fuel system was the safest, most sure thing, highest standard blah blah blah and what they would do themselves IF the problem were covered under warranty (which of course it wasn't). My insurance company was terrific and accepted the claim on the grounds that I had not done anything wrong yet I had a damaged car (this was a gray area and they decided to err on my side. Other insurance companies may determine differently).

Chubb did send out an adjustor as well as an inspector because of the size of the claim. They examined the car at the dealership and ran tests on the fuel that remained in the system. The inspector did agree that there was rust/contamination from the tank all the way to the injectors. But unfortunately I did not get a lot of detail on what they found, nor am I sure how much they actually tested parts, etc. Since they were paying for the repair I really couldn't make them do additional testing. They did what they needed to do to allow the claim and that was that - of course I have absolutely no complaints on that front, but neither did it add to my understanding of why this happened. My sense was that they were not inspecting to get to the root cause, but rather just making sure that the problem was as described by the dealer.

As an aside, I did contact every municipality where I had bought diesel in the prior months and none of them had any record of other complaints of tainted fuel.

So unfortunately I really don't have a good explanation for what happened. I still have a belief that it must have been some freak coincidental combination of slightly-tainted fuel, defective filter system and of course my local incompetent MB dealer where I went to first. (A big bulletin board call out of Mercedes Benz of San Francisco - RUN AWAY from them as fast as you can!!!! I do think there should have been some followup from the corporate level but somehow I doubt there were any consequences - all I can do is publicly highlight their total incompetence and hope it lives in perpetuity on the internet. They will never touch any car of mine again, ever).

I still have the car and just hit 26K today. I have had no subsequent problems with the fuel system at all. I've got a few squeaks in the front end that have started and a minor electrical glitch with the stereo, but nothing major. I continue to love driving this car - it is comfortable, handles well, has all the seating/storage I need and the diesel gets (relatively) excellent fuel economy.

While my car was at the dealer for it's month-long ordeal I did head over to the Audi dealership to look at a Q7 diesel. But I just like the GL better. I decided that I would keep my GL after repair, but if anything similar happened again I would ditch it for good. So far that has not happened.

I do watch the pump at the gas station and if it runs too slowly I stop pumping immediately and go somewhere else. Of course this might not be practical if you were somewhere with long distances between stations. But I try not to get too low anyway to give me flexibility.

Also, if my insurance company had denied my claim and left the repair to me, I would have never replaced the whole line. I would have spent a couple thousand at my independent mechanic to drain and flush the system. Of course I don't know if that would have been enough to solve the problem, but I have yet to tell this story to any mechanic who thought that replacing the entire fuel system was a necessity. But I guess we'll never know....

I do continue to enjoy driving my GL and I would even buy another one if the diesel fuel 7-seat SUV options remained what they are. But I must say that MBUSA's conduct during this whole ordeal absolutely killed any general brand loyalty I have to Mercedes. They were evasive and unapologetic and still owe me my $1,000 deductible! (I suspect that the only reason I got the response from them that I did was because of the existence of public forums like this one that make them wary of completely pissing off customers. Of course they did that anyway - it's almost like they can't help themselves....). It is possible I would buy another Mercedes, but only after I had exhausted all other options.

As for the dealer, they are not all created equal. In fact total incompetents can remain in business. One would think that MBUSA would want to hold dealers to high standards but clearly they are not able/willing to do that. MB of San Francisco is not fit to service cars. RAB Motors in Marin is much better and were dedicated to really getting the car running right (they also gave me a loaner GL for over a month while this all was happening). But even they were beholden to what MBUSA was recommending. As I mentioned above, if I had paid on my own and done a fuel flush I would have had it done at my independent mechanic.

And of course my insurance carrier, Chubb, deserves a huge shout-out for really stepping up and taking care of this. They were awesome and I felt like they absolutely had my back. Even though the full repair might have been overkill, at least I knew I had their expertise to keep the bull---- in check.

Hope this is helpful and answers at least a few questions!

 

I'm glad to hear that Chubb was brave enough to stand up for you. I'm glad your financial impact was relatively minor. But i'm sure the frustration was quite disheartening. As a new GL350 owner I hope this was a fluke.

Thanks for the update and enjoy your GL!

 

Mercedes actions regarding your issue leaves me disgusted. As a very happy owner of a 4 year old '08 320 CDI, it truly gives me pause re: replacing it with another MB diesel product. How could MBUSA NOT warranty this for you?

1: there is a high probablility that the issue was markedly exacerbated by the incompetence of the first MB authourised dealership you went to who told you the vehicle was safe to continue driving; and
2: if bad fuel can cause $17K worth of damage to the fuel system, why isn't the filtering system robust enough to protect the vehicle when MB knows that an owner could at any time obtain 'bad' fuel without any fault of the owner.

Thank God your insurance company stepped up to the plate for you here. If I were their adjuster, I'd be filing a claim against MB or at the least the 1st dealer you went to to get the money back. Think about the many owners who could not have afforded to get their vehicle fixed if their insurance wasn't so accomodating as yours.

Bish

 

Wow Jen, wow.

Can't blame you for not wanting to think about it again but thank you for responding. It was like watching a thriller and the DVR stops recording 1 minute before the end!

I am due for my 1st service next week and I am printing this out for my SA just to let him know we are all comparing notes.

Thanks again and I wish you many happy trouble free miles in your GL...

Cheers, Kurtis

 

Well I'm now in this situation with my R-class Bluetec. Dealer is quoting me $12k. Lovely.

 

Well, congratulations. At least you got off relatively lightly, thanks to the wonderful people at Chubb! Hats off to them.

Just one piece of information for all of you Diesel lovers out there: I am the happy driver of a GLK 220 Diesel and so far (touch wood), no issues. However, in France, where I live, about 80% of all cars are Diesels nowadays, and the sort of problem you had happens occasionally regardless of make of car. It's all down to sloppy maintenance of fuel stations.

I spoke to the guy at MB and asked him if he saw many cars screwed up by contaminated fuel. He told me it does indeed happen, occasionally. He gave me this advice: if you see a tanker truck delivering fuel at a station, stay away for at least a couple of hours before filling up your Diesel. He told me that the pick-up piping in the underground tank pumps fuel from the surface, because in that manner there is less risk of pumping water, which is heavier and falls to the bottom, where it should be caught in a separator. However, when fuel oil is delivered, and if the separator is less than perfectly clean, the turbulence created in the underground tank is enough to momentarily contaminate the entire content until the water resettles at the bottom.

I can't confirm for sure that he is right, but I can tell you that I now always drive by gas stations when I see that truck! So far, so good.

 

We have the same issues, however our insurance, so far, is not willing to do anything - we are looking at about $11,000 in repairs - this seems to be a defect in the filtering system of the car. Looking for advise.

 

Take it to a real diesel shop (most MB dealers are code readers at best). Get it fixed (probably something much simpler and cheaper than the dealer stated).

Finally, sell the truck.

To All: This is how ALL of the MB dealers are instructed to behave (i.e. blame diesel fuel, blame maintenance, read codes only without actual proper diagnosis, no physical inspections).

MBUSA: Could give a crap less about you after the money is taken. Worst support I have ever seen from a manufacturer. MB needs to be exposed for what they really are. Overpriced underengineered status symbols.

 

Correct. Now what do you propose mb does when you pour inferior quality diesel fuel in your diesel direct injection modern vehicle?

It is not a design issue because I have seen hundreds of diesel gls and none of them had fuel system rust issues. So when it happens it is because of specifics, not because of inferior mb product.

Just a few random thoughts and observations.

 

I'll bet good money it's not a "corrosion" issue. Sounds like what I went through where the dealer is making a conclusion based on a lack of actual evidence.

Did the dealer SHOW you the evidence (i.e. so called rust)?? If that was stated then I apologize as I don't see that in any of the postings.

When I work on cars I don't "fix" them by guessing. I find (read: VIEW) the problem then take appropriate action. MB apparently listens and guesses. Honestly, IF someone could repair vehicle competently without actual physical inspection for diagnosis they would be quite wealthy. Unfortunately real world mechanics don't agree.

As for diesel quality, if the trucks are that sensitive to fuel then I would say the US does not have an adequate infrastructure to support passenger diesel vehicles.

Where I live it's ALL bio-diesel yet MB sells the cars a plenty here. On the same front they tell you to avoid bio-diesel. Interesting dilemma. Sell a car, have no "correct" fuel to run it.

 

Did anyone besides the dealer "see" said rust? What did the lab results show?

I bet I know this answer.

 

I have a 2012 GL350 I purchased new. I had the first service at 6700 miles to change the oil and filter and the Service "A" at 12,000 miles. I recently had a service message for Service "C" required and yesterday I had my vehicle serviced. At 19,000 miles, the dealership completed a Service "B" including a cabin air filter instead of the Service "C" and stated on my next service the brake fluid needs to be serviced. The maintenance service manual states the diesel fuel filter and brake fluid should be replaced at 20,000 miles and I am wondering what type of warranty and mechanical issues I could be facing by extending the Service "C"? Thanks

 

My 2010 GL350 BTC CPO with 29K was the coolest vehicle I had ever owned, with great power and unrivaled fuel economy in an SUV, but now it is a nightmare. Within the first 4 months of ownership, it wouldn't start. Towing it back to the dealer, they found algae and water. Because of the algae in the filters, I have used a biocide since the first filter replacement along with SeaFoam to reduce the water.

Vehicle ran fine for 19,000 mi, this time when the CEL and fuel filter warning light came on briefly, it went out. 2 days later, no start. Towed it to the dealer and service advisor claims "metal shards" was found throughout the system. Asks me: 1. if I mistakenly put AdBlu in the fuel, crystals can ruin the injectors, common rail, HPFP and secondary pump, 2. If I had been using Biodiesel, using biodiesel greater than 5% voids the warranty and ruins the fuel pump, 3. if I used any additives that put metal particles into the fuel system.

To all questions, I said NO. I did however admit to using SeaFoam to prevent water contamination. I ask the advisor how is it possible with a filter between the tank and the high pressure fuel pump? Dealer then says the fuel pump may have seized from bad fuel causing metal particles to spread throughout the entire system. I call him out on his "theory/explanation" saying fuel filter should have protected the high side system. He uses the coffee filter analogy saying no filter can filter the very small particles out in your coffee. Then dealer says it "MBUSA policy" to replace entire system if ANY contamination is present. Advisor says his certified mechanic, along with MBUSA policy asserts that I replace the entire fuel system.

I called MBUSA and they deferred to the individual dealerships as far as “policy” regarding repairs, they only make recommendations. They were no help. I have to pay for the entire bill. I called my insurance and the comprehensive coverage paid for it. Insurance adjuster said there were NO metal particles, but extensive algae buildup. Researching the internet, I find most Euro diesels can't handle the low sulfur here in the states and the HPFP is the main component to fail. It is a common problem for all diesels to attract water condensation and occasionally an algae/sludge build up. That's the reason for a water separator in all Commercial diesel trucks, yet you don’t see big rig truckers replacing their entire fuel systems. This is a big scam and I filed a complaint with NHTSA and the FTC regarding MB fuel pump failure and the Ultra-Low Sulfur Diesel fuel here in the USA. Water and algae/sludge is the nature of the diesel beast and it is ripping off the consumer to replace the entire system.

My advice to all potential diesel vehicle buyers become aware of this policy recommendation from MBUSA, that if your fuel system becomes contaminated, you have to replace the entire system, regardless of Factory Warranty or Extended Warranty, AT YOUR COST.

I bought a Racor 2 micron filter/water separator, but hadn't hooked it up when the fuel system failed. But with a completely new system, it's going to be the first thing I do plus I'm going to de-water my diesel with anhydrous silica. Looking at all of the posts here and at other TDI forums, it seems water is a big problem here in the West Coast.

 

Honestly, the "first thing" you should do is sell the damn truck after it's "fixed". Your experience is identical in so many aspects to my own (false information from dealer "experts", ridiculous explanations) that it makes you terrified to even own the damn thing. What's next? The block gets a crack in it from turning on the headlights? Yeah....amazing how poor the quality and lack of brand backing by MB truly is.

FYI: Ask yourself how much you are willing to bleed money wise in the near future to enjoy such a "cool" ride. My advice is to consider other brands with much better reliability and frankly more power (do you REALLY care about mpg in a 3 ton truck designed for 7 passengers? At what point do you lose out when the repairs are greater than the mpg savings?).