560SEL

Nobody has mentioned brakes. Isn't there a documented issue with the brakes on 13' GLs? I read that online and in the long term wrap up in motor trend (I believe). Maybethe rotors arent properly machined and out of round? I have a bad vibration in the floorboards at 100. Dealer is road force rebalancing. We'll see how it goes. I also have run flats

milfordbill

I've read some other comments that mention brakes, but it doesn't seem to solve the problem. Most issues with vibrations seem to go back to the tires and the lack of a proper balance using road force system. Pirelli is usually the culprit as well. I'm told by a dealership the soft rubber in the Pirelli's make them more subseptible to going out of round when sitting overnight. Mich and Cont. tires don't seem to have the same number of problems on the X166.

560SEL

I got my GL back from the dealer last night. The techs notes mention front passenger tire was out of round and they roadforce balanced it moving the tire on the rim to reduce vibration etc. It worked in the sense that there is no more vibration at any speeds under 100. But at 100+, there is still a small sound/vibration and its not the tires. If i shift down to 6th, the noise goes away - completely ?? So now I'm thinking its not the transmission but rather the exhaust maybe? Like a drone frequency? I had a dinan exhaust on a bmw years back that caused a vibration at a specific engine speed. But if it is the engine/exhaust wouldnt it produce the same vibration in the other gears at the corresponding engine rpm?

DRP

gsobol

Just to clarify .... again:

NOT the tires,
NOT the brakes (already replace pads and rotors)
NOT the rims (tried different set)
NOT the A/C compressor - same vibration on or off


Exactly !!! As I was saying, the vibration occurs at specific RPM RANGE in any gear - most felt between 1,600 - 1,800 (this range also corresponds to 68MPH in 7th). However, it's felt more pronounced at load (climbing), or speed (wind resistance load). Once you felt it, it's impossible to ignore. It's definitely more felt when you are going over the mountains, like Catskills, Appalachians, Blue Ridge or Rocky Mountains. Steep inclines when you spent some time in one gear at the same RPM range are a perfect places to test this. And yes, it appears to be exhaust related. I'm just wandering if the turbos are not exacerbating the problem. Even at idle there is no vibration coming off the engine block (take a long metal rod and touch the block), but touch the turbo, exhaust or the air inlet tube (connected to the turbos) and you feel exactly the type of vibration I have been describing. The MB engineer stated that due to the length of the exhaust on GL, it has been tuned to produce a certain tone in order to reduce possible vibration. Whatever that means.......

560SEL

BTW, I'm digging tgis thread. Its wonderful when owners collaborate.

So assuming its an engine/drivetrain vibration. The first question is - do 14' 450s do it as well? Modern luxury manufacturers change parts at will to address issues they dont wait for a new model year. My 450 was delivered at the

560SEL

To continue:
My gl was an early model delivered in 2012.

I will be looking up part numbers (turbos & exhaust) and researching tech. Bulletins to see if this issue is known or has been addressed.

You can't have a vibration in mercedes S class suv...

gsobol

Mine has been put together in March 2013

SFML320

Not sure if anyone has got any luck resolving this. Originally I was also told by a tire center that the wheels were not balanced and the (new set) Pirellis were "out of round". Got a replacement set and still the same. Changed over to Michelins LTX but still same vibrations.

So like "gsobol" has been saying, it's not the tires. Unfortunately the tires were the easiest to laid blame on.

I don't recall feeling the vibration prior to changing out the OEM tires - that was the only thing that changed before I started to feel the vibration.

For now - the GL is still awesome to drive around town (under 45 mph) but now I dread going on freeways.

My GL450 is on 275/50/20 and MY2013

slaydemon

Hey just wanted to add my story in. I posted this in the GL550 section too, but posting it here, just in case it could help any GL450 owners.

Benz: 2013 GL550 CPO --> purchased 01/15 at 12k miles. Currently 20k miles. Issues first started at ~15k miles (around 05/15). They have the stock 21" rims & Pirelli's from the original purchase 2 years ago.

Issue: I first experienced the vibration in May 2015. I got into my benz in the morning, drove onto the highway, started to reach 50mph, when all of the sudden vibration starts. You know those speed bump indentations on the side of the highway, built into the shoulder? Thats what it felt like. It felt like I was constantly driving on a never-ending strip of that. Entire car and steering wheel shaking.

Vibration Service Trips to MB Manhattan :
1. June 2015 - They balanced the tires and aligned the wheels.
2. July 2015 - Changed the two rear tires to brand new Pirellis.
3. September 2015 (Car at dealer right now) - Finally acknowledged that they felt the vibration (they didn't feel it on the 1st 2 visits), and changed the remaining 2 tires. Now I have 4 brand new Pirellis. They road-tested it, and still felt the vibration. Service manager calls me, says that its a "feature of the vehicle". I got "upset", and told him I refuse to pickup the car unless he provides me in writing that this vibration is a "feature" of my car, after which I will most likely Lemon the vehicle, maybe even sue them for not disclosing this feature in any manual when I purchased the car. He said he will get back to me, and hung up. I do not think he knows what to do, either he has to fix the problem or give it to me in writing, neither of which I think he wants to do.

NY lemon law states acceptable grounds for filing a claim (I think my vehicle falls under the "new" category since it had less than 18k miles at time of purchase): Defect must have tried to been repaired at least 4 times, or the vehicle was with the dealership for more than 30 calendar days in total.

At this point, I'm pretty sure he's had my car for 30 days, has been over a week for each visit. If it doesn't get fixed after this 3rd time, I am most likely filing a claim.

And just to add to this, another issue: The driver and passenger seat move during turns/cornering, with about a 1cm wobble room to the left. Every time I turn, I get this big kick as the seat moves and then abruptly stops after moving that 1cm. This is also the 3rd time attempting to fix this issue. They "fixed" it the first 2 times by adding padded rubber felt underneath the seats. I did not buy a CPO benz so that the dealer can do some patch work and add padded felt. I bought a CPO because I assumed it was supposed to almost be like Factory-new. This doesn't seem like it. Am I wrong? Thanks for reading guys. Feels good to vent.

560SEL

Good for you.

I would describe the vibration in my car as driving in the shoulder over the mini bumps as well. But my issue (13' GL450) has nothing to do with the tires - which I know because all 4 were replaced with different brand OEM tires.

I admire your approach which is effectively an ultimatum. I know a lot about cars and its almost a drawback in these situations because I sympathize with the technicians.

Lets face it, if these vibrations are due to engine or drivetrain issues, you're looking at a buyback.

I'm an attorney and although I don't deal with lemon law claims, I think your approach is very sound. Please keep us posted as to what happens.

Good luck,
DRP

slaydemon

Thanks for the input drpesq! Mind me asking what the final resolution was for your vibration issue?

gsobol

No resolution to the issue. Dealer effectively said there is nothing they can do. As slaydemon indicated: "feature" of the car. It is definitely something to do with exhaust and turbos. Engine block does not vibrate at all, but the air tubes to the turbos are vibrating EXACTLY like the vibration I can feel under the floor boards. Dealer unwilling to replace turbos. Circus continues.

slaydemon

woaahh its been 9 months since your original post and still no resolution?? Have you considered lemon law? I can't even drive the car above 50mph on the highway at times. I move all the way to the right lane and go at 40-50mph.

I still have not heard back from my dealer since Wednesday... I wonder what they're trying.

milfordbill

Stop the back and forth with your dealer and have them install Contis or Mechelin tires AND have the tires balance with a road force machine. Insist the machine has been calibrated and the operator is well trained.
That should solve your vibration problem.
Good luck...

SFML320

Check my earlier post - I never experienced the vibrations until changing out the original set of Scorpion tires. I had two new sets of Scorpions before changing them to Michelins but still have the vibrations. I had the dealer perform balancing and road force measurements.

slaydemon

Don't really want to force them to change anything, b/c if they change the tires and the vibration still happens, they'll charge me for the tire change. I can only suggest to them so much. I'm just letting them do their thing, I mean they are the experts, not me. If Benz's flagship mechanics can't figure out whats going on, I don't think I have much say. And I have had their loaner (C300) since 9/8/15, and I'm enjoying myself with it.

560SEL

Your turbo theory is the most persuasive I've heard. Its not tires. And the old v8 GL had no such issue. I'm curious if the part numbers are the same for the turbos and related plumbing etc.. For the 14' GL450. I've never heard complaints about the 14s. I pondered a driveshaft issue as an explanation - flex discs that connect driveshaft pieces can crack/deteriorate. Also, brakes are a problem on the 13' 450s. The rotors are crap. What if an out of round rotor is the culprit? Unfortunately without examining any of these issues our dealers tell us its a feature of the car. As if thats the company line...?

slaydemon

I forgot to mention! I live on top of some mountains, so whenever I come home, I drive from 0-25ft elevation to 450ft elevation in a matter of 0.5 miles. When starting the climb, the vibration is EXTREME, and does not go away until flattening out. I don't understand cars too much, just the basics like changing belts and oil changes, but this seems to support your theory.

Also, I called the dealer yesterday about 6-7 times throughout the day, my advisor was unavailable until around 6pm. At 6pm, he told me he is going to have a meeting with his manager in a few minutes to discuss my car and what to do. No reply today so far... will keep you guys updated.

EDIT:
I called the service advisor... he changed his tune, now he's telling me they barely feel the vibration, only occurs 1-2 min (he told me 15 min last week), and its normal for the car. He does not want to provide this "normal feature" in writing. I asked him, with so many GL450/GL550s in your lot right now, you are telling me they all have vibration at highway speeds? He said no. I told him this is unacceptable, and I am not picking up the car until he fixes it then. He said he's going to give the car to his manager to drive. I dont know what problem that will solve, since he already admitted to there being vibration, maybe the manager has a special skill set to identify the cause? No idea. I just want my car to stop vibrating.

slaydemon

Just an update:

Picked up the car on 9/29 (exactly 3 weeks after I dropped it) from Mercedes-Benz of Manhattan. Their final resolution was putting on a brand new set of Continental Crosscontact UHP tires. Drove it yesterday, still felt the same vibration at 50+ mph. Plus my seat still moves. This is all after they have had my car for 3 weeks, and 5-6 weeks in total just for these 2 defects.

Called my service advisor at Mercedes-Benz of Manhattan, he tried denying the issue saying they never felt it, but then I asked him if his foreman had felt it and he said yes. I'm also upset they never told me that they switched from all-season (the old pirelli) to these summer tires. Plus, there is a huge chunk of rubber missing from one of the tires, they said they will replace it. Also, they scratched up all 4 of my rims when putting the tires on. I took pictures and sent it to them, but they are denying the damage on the rims.

At the end of the phone call, he said you can bring it back and we'll check the seat and vibration again, or you can take it to another dealer, but there is "nothing we can do" and "you can do what you have to do". I hung up, and called a lemon lawyer and left a message. I also called MB USA, they said they'll get back to me on Monday.

Fed up with this car and Mercedes-Benz of Manhattan. I advise never buying a car from there, or taking it for service. When I initially bought the car from them, they had to replace a few parts in the interior due to major scuffs and scratches from the previous owner. In the process of replacing these parts, their service ship damaged the entire inner wall of the trunk. I told them to replace that as well. Their service shop doesn't know what they're doing, and will damage cars more in the process of their "repairs".

Will provide an update when I talk to the lawyer and MB USA.

560SEL

So in Connecticut a prerequisite to invoke the the lemon law requires three trips to the dealer for the same problem. I imagine your case would only be strengthened if other dealers confront the issue with the same dead end response.

Based on my experience your experience and other things I read on the forums, there is clearly an engineering issue with the 2013 450s causing some unpleasant/unacceptable vibrations.

All car companies rigorously test their vehicles and extract feedback from customers and dealers to rectify shortcomings & mistakes. You see it all the time. BMW retrofitting high-pressure fuel pumps that were failing on their 6 cyl. turbo engines etc. The thing about this vibration issue is that it isn't a wear or durability defect - like the airbags on the gen 1 GLs giving out at very low mileage. A mechanic can't fix an engine vibration inherent to the design (if thats what it is). And - here's the essence of my response - only MB germany knows what causes this vibration. They likely diagnosed it and fixed it for the 14 model year (or maybe even later production 13s?).

Only a percentage of owners of the presumably affected cars will notice it, and of them fewer will formally complain.

I notice it. It affects my "regular" use of the vehicle. Let me know if you're going to pursue this as a lemon law case. If you pursue under federal law, i'd be happy to join in the suit as long as our issues really are similar. There's power in numbers, some other forum members might qualify to join as well. Feel free to pm me.

Drp

gsobol

Now, on top of original problem I have a "helicopter" noise coming from somewhere in the front. The truck was sitting for a week while I was away. No clue what's this about. I wonder if the '15 V6 has these problems.

les2015

Lately Mercedes Benz service sucks....Even MBUSA will not help you at all.

Every time I drop a car for service or repair I take pics of the car's condition right on the spot ,Ex. If I know they will rotate, balance or change tires, I will take take pics of every wheel and let the adviser know that I just did that.

About vibration problem, on my GL550 I had front rotors changed at just 1000 miles after that no more issues (I have Continentals UHP) but I had a CLS63 which was at the dealership for weeks because they could not find why the car vibrates a highway speeds, after 3 weeks they found that one front wheel caused the problem, it was bend or out of specs.

gsobol

Guys (and Gals), thanks for the suggestions regarding wheels and rotors. I just want to reiterate again - that's not the problem.

The vibration is DEFINITELY power train driven.

If I sit in the truck, not moving, in gear, for 10 min at idle with my foot on the brake, the vibrations coming from the brake pedal are almost numbing my foot. This is a kind of vibration that takes time to get to you - like hours of driving at highway speeds. That's why it's so hard to explain and troubleshoot. I don't expect dealer to drive for 6 hours just to confirm the condition, but I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one feeling it. There may be a few of us in between that take the truck on a long road trip through varying terrain, hence not enough negative feedback. But, believe me, non-stop 1,200 miles for 20 hours will result in painful tingling sensation lasting 3-4 hours. Not fun. Crazy thing though, my 2010 GL NEVER did that.

Dealer claims idle vibration to be normal (?), does not acknowledge vibration during road test (10 min). Dealer did not detect vibration from tires or brake rotors (replaced under warranty at 3K BTW) - on that we both agree.

I still believe the vibration is caused by the turbos, but dealer refuses to replace.

evansw220

Engine mounts may be at fault from the heat of the turbos...

gsobol

Mounts already replaced. First thing that was done .... no go.

If that's a feature of the car, than the next one is NOT going to be a benz ....