Teckno

Thanks,
Can we get some feedback on these tyres please. Not avail yet in Oz.
What are your impressions, re ride, noise, handling, fuel usage, etc, etc. Oh and any crabbing ? when turning right, U-turns or reversing on lock ?
Any info would be appreciated from Quatrac 5 owners.

ramzez

Not rally an expert. I didn't have any issues with Pirelli and also was quite happy that they RFT. Those seem to be a bit softer and not RFT, although Mercedes gave a tirefit kit its only good for one tire problem. There is a review on autoexpress site about the tires which is very good.

gobiman

Just walked past my local Mercedes dealer here in London and the GLC in the window (with 20s) is fitted with Vredestein Quatrac 5 all-season tyres.

Teckno

Goodyear are expecting commercial delivery of the new tyres (20") I have had fitted around 24 Sept, They will them start moving them to retail outlets, based on demand.

Hope this helps.

Found this following article on UK MB site. See below......

http://www.glcforums.com/forum/322-g...g-lock-75.html

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Melbourne View Post
Glc43 crabbing melboune my story... happy ending i hope. The blokes at MB Melbourne were onto my crabbing problem from day 2. Took delivery of my car in the rain on 28 June 2017. It was crabbing/ skipping at every turn. I was so dissapointed. The next day I complained and they order me new continental 21" XL fronts did a wheel alignment. They took about 6.5 weeks to arrive. So far so good, its been 1 day and im starting to get confidence back. I will update again next time it rains. Fingers crossed. Thank you to the guys on this forum, without you i wouldnt know what to complain about and how to explain my situation. Good luck.
Mercedes Melbourne also resolved the issue on our GLC43 with 255/40/21YXL Contiseal (star rated BMW OE) tyres which they replaced under warranty. I've had the new tyres not for around 3 months and 5000km. No aggressive wear, where the OE Conti's were worn to the bars at 10,000km. I've also not had an instance of any crabbing during that time and can happily zip around inner suburban roundabouts. Also, the car rides much smoother and compliant on bumps than before.

Some of my opinion and notes that I've made (GTIspeeder
Junior Member):

1. The issue was caused by the OE (orig. equip.) tyre tread flexing in an opposing direction to the track of the car with high steering camber on tight turns. This pulls the sidewalls sideways and the thumping is the tread slipping back under stress. In warmer weather, the crabbing is replaced by severe lateral stress, literally grinding the tread down instead of slipping. My opinion is that the OE Conti tyres were just poorly constructed and the 21" wheels amplified the issue.

2. Mercedes can't go public with the fix because the YXL tyres provided are BMW OE tyres (STAR rated) and they'll have to wait for a MO stamped tyre of the same construction to be produced. There's obviously some commercial OE supplier contract with Continental to resolve this issue.

3. Try fitting Michellin Pilots next time. In Australia they offer a 30 day money back guarantee, so if you have them fitted and the crabbing occurs, ask for your money back. Merc are sticking with Conti as my point above.

4. You can make a warranty claim at any dealership. If the muppets on the front desk in service tell you it's not an issue and a "characteristic of the car", ensure they escalate the issue to Mercedes HQ and get the ticket number as proof. If they're no help or refuse, go to another dealership.

tiger_x

Great news Teckno!

Did the crabbing occur only on full lock? Or was it whenever you were turning a corner?

I get slight crabbing but only on full lock. Only noticeable if i have to park in a tight spot and give the steering full lock at low speed. Otherwise i dont notice anything whilst driving around. I wondered if i should take it in for that, it seems to be minute compared to what others have described on here.

Teckno

Crabbing on 20" occurred in reverse, with 3/4 to full lock , backing out of driveway (concrete) onto asphalt. Wet cold days turning right in forward motion, worse in 3/4 and full lock, U-Turns, especially over wet tram lines, scary ! Also occurred with going around round-a bouts, turning right at slow to medium speeds. Mainly wet and cold days, with roads wet and cold too.
So basically when cold and wet, in slow time, not pushing car as well as under more speed.

New Goodyear, Eagle Sport, All Seasons, with around 550km on them are so far proving to be excellent. They may be less fuel efficient, time will tell.
I may refill them with Nitrogen gas for summer use to try and minimise heat build up. Realise Nitrogen is virtually same as air from Servo hose, but maybe worth considering - used in past and they keep pressure longer and have minimal expansion or contraction with PSI and weather.

bips

While this seems plausible, it doesn't explain why it's only a RHD phenomenon, with perhaps a few very rare LHD exceptions. It has to be more than just the tyres.

I have no doubt that certain tyres avoid the problem, but I'm interested to hear about the long-term wear of these replacement tyres. I still think that here was something not quite right in the RHD conversion and in a number of cases the steering geometry is causing odd stresses. These tyres may be disguising these stresses, so that there's no crabbing, but are these hidden stresses causing uneven tyre wear? Although couldn't be as bad as the worst of the crabbing.

I don't mean to rain on anyone's parade or new tyres, but it can't be just the tyres, can it?

Teckno

Update on Goodyear 20" M&S All Season RFT. Diesel 250d.
Around 500km now, just ran around 220km , highway driving on cruise control, mix 80, 100 and 110kph, ave around 94kph.
Fuel usage sat on 6.0l/100 and at around 180km dropped to 5.7l/100.
Car boot fully loaded and doz bottles red on back seat.
Ride was good, no crabbing at night, temps around 9.c
==============================================
My gut feel is that Goodyears are less fuel efficient, due to M&S, All Weather design. Maybe around 1l/100 less efficient, over 40,000km that coulfd be a few dollars and cents !!
Did do some cross country work on 4x4 track, very stable, on steep decent and across mud flats.
I still apperciate the Goodyears and their improved performance.
==============================================
Same highway run tonight in the Coupe, with non RFT, Michelin Latitude 3 type, 250d. No TPMS on that yet.
Results are in !!!!!!!!!!
My gut feeling was wrong.....
Just ran around 220km , highway driving on cruise control, mix 80, 100 and 110kph, ave around 89kph.
Fuel usage sat on 6.0l/100 and at around 180km dropped to 5.8l/100. We stopped for 5 min en-route which most probably accounts for slight variation.
Car boot partly loaded and NO bottles red on back seat, sad face.....
Night temps around 13.c.
==============================================
So the results of the two test runs, one with RFT, Goodyear and the other with normal Michelin Latitude 3 are that they have same economy returns.
Ride around same, road noise from asphalt about same. Very wet in morning with Michelin and some slight spin/aquaplane on ruts in highway, quickly corrected by 4Matic, have not tested Goodyears in same heavy rain, but were ok in lighter downpours.....
So time will tell, but it looks like Goodyears are winning and may give greater Km life, based on Treadwear 560 figure (US standard I think) (Pirelli Scorpion treadwear was 400 from memory – higher better), Our asphalt might vary wear results.
Cheers

Teckno

Re new Goodyear Eagle Sport All Season ROF, MO tyres for 20" rims.
Link to USA site with tyre info..
https://www.goodyear.com/en-US/tires...all-season-rof
Product code for Oz dealer to search should be 109 101 395.
$299 USA with extra discounts, also 80,000km tyre warranty.
Goodyear Dunlop Tyres HQ in Oz is in Richmond, Vic, 03 8416 7200.
Customer service and warehouse in Truganina, Vic, (largest tyre dist centre in Oz). No phone no for that loc as yet.
Scott Bennett is Dir Retail Ops, and Tina Hu, Dir Supply Chain for Goodyear Oz.
Retail outlets include Dunlop Super Dealers, Goodyear Auto care and Beaurepaires outlets, all part of HQ organisation. prices may vary ?
I have not checked product code for UK/Europe, it should be the same.
Hope this helps those of you who cannot source these tyres. Going to the source oftern helps.
Cheers

DPelletier

New to the forum. I bought a 2017 GLC43 AMG with the optional 21" wheels and MO stamped Continental summer sport tires. This car is a LEFT
HAND DRIVE for the Canadian market and has exhibited the scrubbing/crabbing in the following conditions; full lock (or close) forward or reverse on wet and wet/cold pavement (the first time it did it, it was starting to snow). I have a set of aftermarket 19" rims and Nokian R2 winters coming next week so I'll be able to see if they help. I first noticed this issue the second day of ownership and we brought it to the selling dealerships attention on the Tuesday following the Friday delivery.

I just wanted to clarify that this issue is not limited to RHD cars (though they may well exhibit worse symptoms).

Cheers,
Dave

bips

Despite the word "only", I effectively conceded as much when I said in my previous post "While this seems plausible, it doesn't explain why it's only a RHD phenomenon, with perhaps a few very rare LHD exceptions. It has to be more than just the tyres." I've also heard reports of it in 2WD cars, but rarely. I've concluded that it's a symptom of some degree of steering / drive train misalignment, which tyre selection can either emphasise or disguise. It's probably more common in AWD vehicles. The fact that RHD GLCs have it quite often implies to me that there was some problem with the conversion to RHD. I've been told that some other recent MB 4matic models are also affected, which supports my suspicions. If I had it in a LHD vehicle I'd want to know why.

DPelletier

Other than a difference in geometry (which I would THINK would be minor) I can't see why it would be a RHD only issue.....and it isn't, obviously. With 500 posts in this thread, I didn't read all of them but the readers digest version seems to suggest that it's a geometry issue and the symptoms are made worse in conditions that promote tire slippage; low profile tires, summer compounds, cold and/or wet conditions.

I suppose if the issue doesn't cause mechanical failure/breakage and can be eliminated or at least significantly mitigated by tire selection, I'll simply replace the Conti's with something else when they've worn out. Not exactly something I want to deal with on a week old $75,000.00 vehicle, but I'm not going to lose a bunch of sleep over it.

Dave

Philamg

The reason that it is in RHD drive cars is as explained in the MB letter to dealers in Uk dated 24th February, I quote:

"Due to the positioning of the front axle differential on right hand drive cars, the steering position differs very slightly compared to left hand drive models. When the steering is on full lock this steering angle difference can result in the front tyre skipping sensation. This is more pronounced during cold weather and when larger wheels and low profile tyres are fitted."

DPelletier

I read that. I'd suggest that it may be more prevalent or have worse symptoms with RHD due to the difference in geometry described above but as I have experienced the phenomenon is NOT limited to RHD vehicles. I'd note the wording; " differs very slightly...."

Dave

bips

You can read that statement in various ways and it seems that we've all read it differently. To me it begs the question. BMW, as one example, seems to be able to produce RHD AWD SUVs that don't have this problem. By which I mean that I assume the BMW RHD SUVs are a conversion of LHD vehicles, and while crabbing can presumably occasionally occur in a vehicle due to manufacturing variation and tolerances, there's no evidence of a greater incidence of it in their RHD models. This implies to me that MB didn't get the conversion quite right. I interpreted the MBUK statement as saying this in corporate speak.

Philamg

0Agree Bips and still fightiing with MB customer services to get all weather 19 inch tyres for my GLC43, the have until Thursday to come back to me with a solution (been trying since April) or I will be going down the legal route.

gobiman

Philamg.
Let us know how you get on. My GLC43 (on 19s) is coming up for its first service next month and I am intending to raise the issue. It does crab particularly reversing on full lock.
I just checked the availability of Vredestein Quatrac 5 and it seems like the issue might be the wider rears rather than fronts.
Thanks

Philamg

Will let you know, when I spoke to customer services in April they authorised dealer to fit all weathers to my car but they haven't been able to source any. If I was you I would raise issue with customer services now as when I first raised it was told I had to do it not dealer as it wasn't a "fault", and that was after the memo admitting that there was an issue.

VET11B

Add me to the list of Left-hand drive GLCs that have scrubbing. It's minor for sure and nothing like I have seen in Phil's videos, but I have noticed it more and more backing out of drives where I am close to or at full lock and the road is slightly slick. Temperature doesn't seem to be too much of a factor, but time will tell there. Also, I'm not crazy about how the outside shoulders of the tires are wearing with such low mileage. I took delivery of my 43 with optional 21" wheels in July and am in Northern VA, so, no snow or cold weather as of yet. This seems to be a platform issue that is exasperated by RHD geo issues. Also, I have driven several Audis that skip along the same way and the original ML had the same issue and intensity as what Phil and others have experienced with MB saying "that's how it is". Tires seem like a scapegoat and or bandaid.

Philamg

Seems odd Vet but everyone who has had all weather tyres fitted say it disappears, phoned customer sevices today and they were getting back to me - didn't, starting to get annoyed now, will try again tomorrow.

VET11B

Not sure if they make All-season in my size yet. But it is not as big a deal like the issue you are/were dealing with. Very minor and short lived when it does it for me. And actually my big gripe right now is the pathetic excuse for a transmission that shoved in my car. Hoping with more mileage it won't be so "dumb" but MB really dropped the ball on the trans. Anyhow, I haven't been following along; I thought you had this resolved a long time ago?

Philamg

I also thought I had it solved a long time ago, had fitting of all weathers authorised in April but they still can't source them in 19 inch for 43, just found a mail from customer services in July thanking me for my patience - wearing thin now.

Philamg

Customer services have come back with the offer of 21 inch wheels and tyres at 50% of the cost or winter tyres at no cost.

Not too happy but have said I will accept the winter tyres if they are fitted free of charge, my summer tyres stored by the dealer and refitted next spring at no cost, I await their reply.

DPelletier

Most online tire calculators won't show a 19 for the AMG because only 20" or 21" was fitted from the factory. Despite this, the 19" wheel/tire size combo from the 300 fits fine. When we purchased the vehicle, my wife insisted on the 21's so I knew we'd be ordering a winter tire/rim setup. ......Our dealer quoted the 19's for us (235/55/19 on the 19" x 8" rims with 38mm offset) but they were $4k and I could get aftermarket wheels and a set of Nokian R2 winters in the same size for less than $2,500.00 .....they should arrive tomorrow or monday.

I realize that you are looking for a free solution from MB (and rightly so IMO) but I can't be bothered to go through all the hassle. the big difference in our situations is likely that we need winters here regardless so they were always part of the plan.

Cheers,
Dave

Philamg

For the UK market the 19 inch is the standard wheel for the 43, 20 and 21 are options, winter tyres are an overkill for the UK, especially where I live on the south coast. The main reason I am adamant that they need to do something is they have admitted the fault on RHD cars and the scrubbing wears out the tyres. I don't see why I should have to pay anything for their inability to put the car together correctly. If they try to charge me anything I will be going down the legal route using the motoring ombudsman which we have at our disposal over here.