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Why would someone rate something that they don't know? And if they do, the same goes the opposite. No? People usually go out of their way to voice when they have a negative experience. But if they don't, why would they make their way to voice their "experience"? Is it because they want to bring the particular product down so their favorite one can go up? Lol
Well Journalists typically don’t own a car long enough to complain about issues. However, us owners do, and CR is a conduit for those owners that MB should pay attention to way more than what Car Driver might say after driving the car for a few days.
I don’t think it’s a hypothetical. It’s happening. It’s not just here you read about “bad quality,” it’s on social media and elsewhere.
Well Journalists typically don’t own a car long enough to complain about issues. However, us owners do, and CR is a conduit for those owners that MB should pay attention to way more than what Car Driver might say after driving the car for a few days.
I don’t think it’s a hypothetical. It’s happening. It’s not just here you read about “bad quality,” it’s on social media and elsewhere.
The reasoning of your prior post seems based on assumptions of how some perceived reliability issues may create a stigma about the model in the minds of some people which may potentially affect the future resale value. That does sound hypothetical to me as there is no statistical underpinning. Same as reading something about bad quality on social media or elsewhere.
The automotive press usually lists known problems about cars along with model, brand or feature-specific dislikes. This has nothing to do with the time they use those cars.
These forums also serve as a good sample as the most educated group of owners and enthusiasts provide feedback, good or bad. With about 200,000 posts for ML & GLE models (over 44,000 posts for the V167) this is by far the largest collection of information and data anywhere.
Have had my 167 since July of this year and it's the best car I've ever owned. I love this car and have driven 5,600 flawless miles already. Only issue was a seat cover when delivered that got replaced in the first two weeks.
To be fair, thats exactly what makes it the best source for so many people out there
Its kinda like how Apple computers are always recommended over PCs because they're more reliable and easier to use.
I prefer my PCs and have never had a problem I can't fix myself. But I get that the vast majority of the population is probably better off with a Mac.
People who aren't engineers can't do a proper evaluation of various vehicles because they don't really know what to look for to make such a technical determination. Ease of use is a very different determination from the actual technical configuration of a vehicle. This is why I have an issue with the CR surveys. It's also another dirty little secret that with a very few exceptions, most automotive journalists aren't engineers either so I take most of their reviews with a grain of salt as well.
People who aren't engineers can't do a proper evaluation of various vehicles because they don't really know what to look for to make such a technical determination. Ease of use is a very different determination from the actual technical configuration of a vehicle. This is why I have an issue with the CR surveys. It's also another dirty little secret that with a very few exceptions, most automotive journalists aren't engineers either so I take most of their reviews with a grain of salt as well.
I dont think someone needs to be an engineer to review a car for a consumer
People who aren't engineers can't do a proper evaluation of various vehicles because they don't really know what to look for to make such a technical determination. Ease of use is a very different determination from the actual technical configuration of a vehicle. This is why I have an issue with the CR surveys. It's also another dirty little secret that with a very few exceptions, most automotive journalists aren't engineers either so I take most of their reviews with a grain of salt as well.
CR really just boils down to "are you happy with this car or not?" anyone can answer that.
My issue with CR isnt the skill of its respondents, but rather the inconsistent sample sizes across the different brands.
I dont think someone needs to be an engineer to review a car for a consumer
In order to properly assess the car's technology, durability and the build quality, auto engineers best understand these issues rather than consumers with no such experience.
In order to properly assess the car's technology, durability and the build quality, auto engineers best understand these issues rather than consumers with no such experience.
Are you saying we can’t complain about car issues unless we’re an auto engineer? That’s the dumbest thing I heard.
Does that mean I can’t complain about a malfunctioning TV unless I’m an electrical engineer?
I’m sure there are a lot of licensed engineers here that will agree with me: you don’t need to be an engineer to complain about a broken product. We don’t care how it is built. We only care that it works.
In order to properly assess the car's technology, durability and the build quality, auto engineers best understand these issues rather than consumers with no such experience.
But the consumers are the one who are buying and using the car. If the design of a car is so over the consumer's head that they need to be an engineer to comprehend it, then it has failed.
A man is flying in a hot air balloon and realizes that he is lost. He reduces height and spots a man down below. He lowers the balloon further and shouts, "Excuse me. Can you help me? I promised a friend I would meet him half an hour ago, but I don't know where I am."
The man below says, "Yes. You are in a hot air balloon, hovering approximately 30 feet above this field. You are between 40 and 42 degrees north latitude, and between 58 and 60 degrees west longitude.
"You must be an engineer" says the balloonist.
"I am", replies the man. "How did you know?"
"Well..." says the balloonist. "Everything you told me was technically correct, but I have no idea what to make of your information and the fact is I am still lost."
The man below says, "You must be a Manager"
"I am", replies the balloonist. "How did you know?"
"Well..." says the man. "You don't know where you are, or where you are going. You made a promise which you have no idea how to keep, and you expect me to solve your problem. The fact is you are in the exact same position you were in before we met but now it is somehow
my fault."
I think I have had enough recent interactions with MBUSA, my local service department, and a lying general manager to justify my opinion. Here goes another inquiry to add to this and what the original thread was about.
I needed a service appointment and I was across the street from the dealership so I stopped in to also talk about a headlight that keeps filling with condensation. I wanted to ask them to order it ahead of time so both the service and headlight replacement could be done at the same time. Well according to the service manager at Carlton Mercedes in Greenville SC this is normal for the headlights on a high end SUV to do this. There is a service bulletin about it supposedly on these “non sealed” headlight as he called the . Again, over all I think most MB cars are pretty good (absolutely love our E63s) but the stuff coming out of the Alabama is a different story.
So I’ll ask the MBWorld people, is this normal quality? This is just after a wash. When it rains, it’s worse.
People who aren't engineers can't do a proper evaluation of various vehicles because they don't really know what to look for to make such a technical determination. Ease of use is a very different determination from the actual technical configuration of a vehicle. This is why I have an issue with the CR surveys. It's also another dirty little secret that with a very few exceptions, most automotive journalists aren't engineers either so I take most of their reviews with a grain of salt as well.
I was once an electrical engineer, worked for a top company, from production to R/D and I approve the below message.
Originally Posted by SW20S
I dont think someone needs to be an engineer to review a car for a consumer
No, you don't need to be an engineer to say the wipers don't work as ...engineered. Lol After all this is a consumer product.
I think I have had enough recent interactions with MBUSA, my local service department, and a lying general manager to justify my opinion. Here goes another inquiry to add to this and what the original thread was about.
I needed a service appointment and I was across the street from the dealership so I stopped in to also talk about a headlight that keeps filling with condensation. I wanted to ask them to order it ahead of time so both the service and headlight replacement could be done at the same time. Well according to the service manager at Carlton Mercedes in Greenville SC this is normal for the headlights on a high end SUV to do this. There is a service bulletin about it supposedly on these “non sealed” headlight as he called the . Again, over all I think most MB cars are pretty good (absolutely love our E63s) but the stuff coming out of the Alabama is a different story.
So I’ll ask the MBWorld people, is this normal quality? This is just after a wash. When it rains, it’s worse.
1. I don’t accept that argument—isn’t it a LED headlamp? Are the LEDs replaceable? Recommend you take it to another dealer for a second opinion.
2. Who makes the headlight assembly? The Alabama assembly plant is just that, they integrate subcontractor supplied parts into a final product. They don’t build the headlights there, a supplier who specializes in headlights does it for them. If the sub can’t build to spec, that is a contractual problem. Mercedes has very tight/precise specs, can the supplier’s manufacturing process meet the specs for the cost in the contract…does the supplier use a 6-sigma manufacturing process that meets the tolerances given to them by Mercedes, or are they just meeting schedule and price points—as long as they do that Mercedes doesn’t care as long as the supplier warranties the assembly? The causes can be many and are contract specific…blaming the issue on the Alabama assembly plant, an easy target, is likely off the mark.
I think I have had enough recent interactions with MBUSA, my local service department, and a lying general manager to justify my opinion. Here goes another inquiry to add to this and what the original thread was about.
I needed a service appointment and I was across the street from the dealership so I stopped in to also talk about a headlight that keeps filling with condensation. I wanted to ask them to order it ahead of time so both the service and headlight replacement could be done at the same time. Well according to the service manager at Carlton Mercedes in Greenville SC this is normal for the headlights on a high end SUV to do this. There is a service bulletin about it supposedly on these “non sealed” headlight as he called the . Again, over all I think most MB cars are pretty good (absolutely love our E63s) but the stuff coming out of the Alabama is a different story.
So I’ll ask the MBWorld people, is this normal quality? This is just after a wash. When it rains, it’s worse.
I'd call bull**** on that. Can they produce the actual bulletin that claims this is normal behavior?
I think I have had enough recent interactions with MBUSA, my local service department, and a lying general manager to justify my opinion. Here goes another inquiry to add to this and what the original thread was about.
I needed a service appointment and I was across the street from the dealership so I stopped in to also talk about a headlight that keeps filling with condensation. I wanted to ask them to order it ahead of time so both the service and headlight replacement could be done at the same time. Well according to the service manager at Carlton Mercedes in Greenville SC this is normal for the headlights on a high end SUV to do this. There is a service bulletin about it supposedly on these “non sealed” headlight as he called the . Again, over all I think most MB cars are pretty good (absolutely love our E63s) but the stuff coming out of the Alabama is a different story.
So I’ll ask the MBWorld people, is this normal quality? This is just after a wash. When it rains, it’s worse.
It’s not normal. MB is fully responsible for design choices that they and their suppliers make, and for manufacturing, logistics and other snafus that they and their suppliers make. There is no escaping culpability for MB in this scenario. It’s on them. And it’s normal, sadly. Read the EQS section, too bad for the brand and the owners.
blaming the issue on the Alabama assembly plant, an easy target, is likely off the mark.
I agree he is probably full of crap and I’m going to research a little more.
But in my eyes, letting the Alabama plant off the hook is like continuing to buy shirts from the department store that the buttons always fall off and then trying to find, blame, and return it to the sweat shop in another country. They packaged and shipped it out to sale, they need better quality control.
Oh, the dealership and MB over all are too blame too. I just don’t have much problems with MB cars from other plants.
Now, what SUVs have second row Captain chairs this time?
Aren’t these headlights like $2k+ “sealed” units with a watertight or at least water-resistant connecting plugs? I’ve never had condensation in any of my headlights and I wouldn’t consider it normal. I don’t see how Mercedes can call this normal. If they do it’s just a lame excuse. It’s like them saying cosuming a quart of oil a month is normal. Baloney.
Aren’t these headlights like $2k+ “sealed” units with a watertight or at least water-resistant connecting plugs? I’ve never had condensation in any of my headlights and I wouldn’t consider it normal. I don’t see how Mercedes can call this normal. If they do it’s just a lame excuse. It’s like them saying cosuming a quart of oil a month is normal. Baloney.
MB is an example of a manufacturer that does not stand behind its products.
Mercedes SLR McLaren 722 S Is Extremely Rare Example Modified by McLaren
Slideshow: A one-of-one U.S.-spec Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren Roadster became even rarer after a factory-backed transformation at McLaren's headquarters.
