Lucky 777

No, I think some of the posters here need to not take it personally that not everyone is having a problem. Saying I'm not having a problem with my car in no way implies your problem is invalid unless you take it that way.

SW20S

I can tell you when you post about problems and are frustrated, people posting like he and you (especially you) have posted here absolutely comes across like you are trying to tamp down or explain away one's problems. If you can ask others to avoid feeling a certain way about certain posts, why can't you do the same thing? If you don't have anything to say that helps someone who is having problems, why even respond in their thread? (this thread is a little different).

I can tell you with 100% confidence that if you had problems you would feel the same way they do. I know that because I've posted on a forum as someone who loved their car and was irritated with people who were constantly complaining, until I started having problems and then I understood where they were coming from and became one of those other people. When you have a car that you otherwise enjoy that is just constantly broken in some way you get bitter quick.

You never answer my question "when someone is sick do you tell them "Well, I feel great"". You don't answer because the answer is obviously no, such an answer would be callous and rude. Well, telling someone who is having problems with their car "My car is great" and then continually pointing out "most people don't have problems" is callous and rude.

chassis

This is a description of a strawman argument which is common on the internet, this site and in this thread.

chassis

Yes another illustration of the strawman argument.

Lucky 777

You started the overall hostility and theme of this whole thread simply because you got a little butthurt. I'm sorry you're not enjoying the car as much as you should and sincerely hope it gets sorted out.

SW20S

I'm not "butthurt" at all, I don't own a GLE, and I have not created any hostility or this thread in any way. I'm just trying to help you see that you have a role in what has happened to your forum as well, and you can make changes in how you post and it will improve the forum for your own enjoyment. If you only want to talk about positive stuff about your car, then just ignore the negative posts. Chiming into threads where people have problems and telling them your car is great doesn't help anybody.

This thread was about people who have problems with their cars and how the OP felt sorry for them. You felt the need to make it an "us vs them" by interjecting that "you and 99% of people have no problems" when you should have just ignored it because it wasn't about you. The tone and hostility of this thread is on you, not me.

If both sides don't start doing this, theyre going to have no choice but to start banning people, and both people with problems and people without problems are going to get banned.

Lucky 777

Then please explain why your comments about the car are even relevant? THIS is what happens a lot on this forum. People who don't own a GLE come on here and tell those of us who do how terrible the car is. Then you get butthurt when I don't validate your unfounded comments.

SW20S

I haven't told anybody anything about the car, I'm still considering buying the car. My comments are not about the car, my comments are about the forum. Honestly the hostility of this forum is as big a reason why I would pass on the car as any reliability problems.

Like it or not though, problems are real. This model clearly has some issues, that doesn't mean everybody has issues but I read a lot of forums and its pretty clear.

chassis

ad hominem argument

If a roofer tells a homeowner the homeowner’s roof is leaking, but the roofer himself has no leaky roof and has never in his lifetime personally experienced his own leaky roof, is the leaky roof statement invalid?

PandaSPUR

If the homeowner is saying "EVERY ROOF MADE BY ____ IS A LEAKY POS" then yes it would still be an invalid statement.

SW20S

If there is evidence that there are common experiences with roofs made by ___ leaking, then saying that is not an invalid statement. It also would be completely normal for a frustrated homeowner to be angry that his roof is leaking and to make a charged statement like "this company makes a POS roof".

There is ample evidence that the V167 GLE has some reliability issues that affect some owners, some of those owners are very angry and frustrated that they are saddled with such a vehicle. Just have a little compassion.

mb2be

For the folks that want to back the idea of this car is a great build, since many of you have technical background, don't you remember what they taught you in math? To prove something right, you need to prove it's right for every single one. To prove something wrong, you just need one. No? No one remembers this?
You really don't need everyone having issues to conclude this car has issues. Sure there are happy/ issue free owners, but for something at this level with that number of reported build/quality issues, it's beyond significant.

PandaSPUR

Yea I can understand the anger and frustration, and why someone would make statements like that.

I'm just saying that technically it would indeed be an invalid statement, unless of course literally all roofs made by X were reported to leak.

Also, compassion runs thin after a certain point...

Right, by that same logic, you only need to show one GLE without issues to prove that "all GLEs are poorly built" is a false statement.

I get the frustrations though, I really do, but after a certain point it just becomes annoying.

mikapen

QED.
Immediate negative response for liking your car. The usual suspect(s).
@chassis comment about ad hominem responses is certainly true.
It's a recent change, over the last few months. The cars have been out for three years now. Something else changed.

Let's talk about the cars, please.

SW20S

Its not a negative response, its simply that a comment about him liking his car including a snide remark about how "99% of people do" has no place in a thread that is about people with problems with their cars. If you will note in the other thread I just called somebody out for the same thing on the other side.

Be the change you want to see.

mikapen

Yes, I am, than k you. Read all my posts and see how it's done. Follow my example. You can do it.
Quit policing everybody's responses. Two is too many for any thread.

If you're looking for answers to questions you have, as you say, don't challenge their language or motives.
Just participate with an open mind.

SW20S

I have read all your posts lol.

chassis

To clarify whether the scenario above is a strawman argument or not, can you kindly please give a tangible example where a comment on this thread fulfills the conditions you gave?

You conditioned your statement with the word “if”. Has your condition been met in this thread?

mikapen

Thanks for not judging my most recent one. See, I was right - you can do it.

SW20S

Keep posting with that condescending attitude and see how it benefits the forum.

PandaSPUR

Sorry, no one in this thread has commented on any leaky roofs.

mikapen

Guess I was wrong.

Maybe just skip every other post, and we'll start returning to civility. It's a start.
Here's your next chance.
___________

Frenetic

Mikapen, you spend a lot of time talking about other posters. You have a history of attacking, insulting and harassing people, especially if they have anything negative to say. We can all disagree, but no one should be insulted for sharing their opinions, good or bad. I think some people here misjudge you because a lot of your posts gets quickly deleted after they are reported. On any other enthusiast forum, you probably would have been banned a long time ago.

mikapen

Incorrect.