My last few cars I found it convenient and cheaper to prepay maintenance. It is a negotiable item when purchasing the vehicle. Less so afterwards.
- my 2024 GLE 450e i purchased 4 years
- my 2023 Z4 i purchased 6 years
- my 2017 Q5 came with 4 years free (from the manufacturer), then I purchased more 4 years later, and most recently I extended my prepaid maintenance out 2029 ... it is a seasonally used vehicle. This Audi is the only vehicle that I purchased additional prepaid maintenance subsequent to the initial purchase, just because I plan to keep it so long.

With Audi they have list price for each year service (different by which service is due) and offer a substantial discount when purchasing multi years. On top of that, when service is prepurchased you avoid price increases.

Prepurchased maintenance, because it is purchased from the manufacturer, can be used at any dealer.

 

Definitely an option. I don't do it because I use my independent.

 

Indies don’t do it as much as dealerships, the unannounced increase in labor charges. That is somewhat of a saving grace of prepaid maintenance plans.

 

True, at least historically. Although I saw a recent post that mentioned higher prices for a 50,000 mile service/plug/filter change than my dealer charges.

If Indys are going to compete on the most recent cars, their costs will increase as their diagnostic equipment and Technician certification is updated.

I expect their rates to increase as well.
Then it will depend on expertise, not prices.
My Dealer is at $275/hr now.

 

Everybodys rates increase, but the delta between independent labor rates and dealer rates remains huge.

 

What does your guy charge?
Mine is $275, and Colorado has become among the highest half dozen states for cost of living.

 

The mechanics are lucky to get 10% of that. That’s the crazy part.

 

I think they get about 60%, depending on the job.
Dealer provides job-specific special tools, diagnostic equipment, superfast broadband for software updates etc.

 

60% of 270 is $162/hr. No way does a mechanic earn that much. That’s $337,000.00 per year. That puts a car mechanic well into the top 5-7% of wage earners. And that’s based on a 40 hour work week.
I know the top certified mechanics can make good money, but no way do they make that much.

 

You're right - I was back at my time in dealer shops.
Now a top tech can make about $150k, less than half of what I posted. But they'll bill more than 40hrs per week, partly because they invest so much on tools for their specialty, allowing them to be really efficient and virtually eliminating comebacks.
If they're good - but they won't be there for a decade if they aren't.

 

I don't know what his labor rate is specifically, but the the two MB dealers here are $240/hr

 

I just checked in with my Dealer.
Techs make $49 to $100 per billable hour, depending on their certifications. Out of the $275 shop rate.

Some here think I'm a dealer fanboy. Well, I am, but only of the dealers with superior service.
I buy my cars based on the service departments. I'm not "brand loyal' - I'm "Maintenance loyal."

I wouldn't buy a car unless I can get good service.
Having been an Indy myself, I know the limitations of current Indy's because of the necessary diagnostic equipment.

Unfortunately that's the case, even with the Right to Repair rules spreading through industries.
I've had a few (very few) Indy's that I've trusted to work on my cars. But only on selected jobs.

So I build my relationship with my Dealer.
I'm moving out of the area soon, so I may be in another Brand for my next car. In one that's got a good dealer reputation, low turnover, long-term Master techs, fully staffed because there's a line ready to fill any tech vacancies.

These new cars are pretty complicated.

 

The fallacy with this argument is you don’t need diagnostic equipment to perform maintenance on these or any other vehicles. You also don’t need it to perform most strictly mechanical repairs. Of course you need it to diagnose electrical issues or many drivability issues in these complex vehicles.

Those of us who are advocating for finding good independent mechanics are talking about people who will change oil and replace filters and do brake jobs and replace spark plugs and worn suspension components etc. These things do not require MB’s diagnostic equipment. With that said many independent specialists DO have that equipment, mine included. Good shops will tell you when you should take the car to the dealer, mine will even take it there for me.

We don’t see the point of paying $275 an hour for someone to do those tasks. The master techs at the dealer don’t even do that work, they have oil change techs etc that are much less trained and skilled that do oil changes etc. *I* can do those tasks with zero training. At my independent mechanic the techs do those jobs too, there aren’t oil change techs. So I’m getting higher skill techs doing jobs they are way over qualified to do for less money per hour. How is that bad?

If I can do it in my driveway after watching a YouTube video I don’t need the “expertise” of an MB trained tech at $275 an hour.

 

Great, that's what I wanted to hear. Almost $300 per hour... Taking mine to Loveland next month for some diagnosing that I've hit a wall with. I did tell the SA I'm only allotting up two hours for diag, though. If the tech can't figure it out in two hours, shut it down and tell me what the tech tried.

 

Some places will charge more for diagnostic work, than standard operations. They often use what is called a "multiplier."
You might verify their diagnostic charges. Also ask if they give credit for the diagnostic work, towards any repairs needed.

That's the reason that I've preferred to develop a relationship with my dealer's service department instead of only using them for things that confound an Indy.

They'll also Drive 250 mi to pick up my car and exchange a loaner. They also know that I won't abuse that.

They haven't ever charged me for diagnostics. They believe that Service implies results. Relationships still matter in some organizations.
That's how I choose my shops, and by inference, the brand I drive.

Good luck with your investigations.

 

No dealer anywhere has ever tried to collect a diagnostic fee from me. I guarantee if I call and ask for them to pick up and deliver my car, they would...with zero relationship. In any event for the cost difference I could pay someone to drive the car there and pick it up and rent an awesome car and STILL have saved money.

"Relationships" anymore are overrated. As I put it to the guy who sold me my S580, which is where I bought my S560 when he tried to sell me on the benefit of having a relationship with him...literally everybody involved in the purchase of my S560 from them 3 years prior was gone. Salesman gone. Sales Manager gone, General Manager gone, service consultant gone. Service manager gone. So...,."relationship" has zero benefit. This is how its been over the years for all the cars I have owned, you find a good service guy at a dealer and he's there a couple years and moves on. My independent mechanics I have found are much more stable and valuable because they own their businesses and aren't just employees moving from employer to employer.

 

Agreed. Most of the time it's not about building "relationships", or being treated like "family". It's all bullshiite. It's a business, and its' job is to maximize profits. If you come back to them, great. If not, there's a"sucker" born every minute. sure, they may throw you a "bone" like say, free diags, but you'll still pay for it by returning or overbilling on the work.

 

I'm in sales and I sure wish relationships still meant something, but they really don't ahymore.

 

The most successful businesses focus on customer relationships. It's always more profitable to retain a customer than to replace a customer.

Dealerships are small businesses working for a large business. Not all dealership owners are good business people.

Mercedes on the other hand wants to protect their brand. I have had more luck convincing Mercedes that keeping me satisfied is in their best interest than I have had success with some dealers.

With dealers you have two options. Find a good one or file a complaint about the bad one with Mercedes and / or online. Mercedes does not have a lot of patience with dealers who tarnish their brand.

With Mercedes corporate it's trickier. You need to get past the front line CS drones and get the ear of an executive.

 

Thanks to Obama, my industry is directly effected, for the far worse. Thanks to Obama care the "Family Practice" provider is a thing of the past. Primary care is a joke.

For me, when I was a kid (I just got done yelling at clouds)...my doctor was my cousins doctor and my second cousins doctor. He knew my parents, grand parents, aunts, uncles and on and on. He knew of the allergies (a brother and two cousins with Penicillin) and had privileges to have input into our care if and when we ended up in the hospital. Now, god forbid you get sick....you can have had a PCP for 40 years and their word means NOTHING in the hospital. Heath Care like every other product is now a commodity and relationships are based on an icon...or, factually like the one we have with each other here, on a random website where the only thing we have in common is a hood ornament.

 

Well, as a patient sorry but the ACA has improved care, provided avenues for many more people to get coverage. Doing away with preexisting conditions alone is worth the price of entry. My mother owns a firm that does medical claims processing for doctors, and managed care companies were dramatically reducing payouts to providers anyways...

We have a family doctor who is our primary care doctor. Our kids have a great pediatrics practice. We're doing fine.

 

The problem is providing great care to a customer doesn't retain that customer anymore. Most people don't see value in a relationship with a service provider, so all the hoops a provider goes through to try and retain customers don't earn them anything from the customer, the customer just buys from whomever is expedient or cheapest next time. So, dealers stop taking losses to satisfy customers and stop going above and beyond because it doesn't do them much good and you can't really blame them.

 

My dealer's service department develops strong relationships with customers, and has clients from several adjoining States.
It was an important contribution to maintaining overall profitability during the COVID / supply chain crisis in 2020. Sales and F&I plummeted during those years.

They have 22 bays and they are all full in the daytime, plus half of them overnight. 29 tech's.
They do not have a constant turnover. Their least-tenured tech has been there four years. They make $49 to $100/hour (of the current $275 shop rate). They are loyal, proud to work there. Loyal.

The shop doesn't suffer from what's called "spring migration" in the industry, where a quarter of the tech's move to Greener Pastures annually - wash, rinse and repeat. It's common enough that Spring Migration is an accepted phenomenon.

My Porsche store is significantly smaller, but they have customers from across the US. I don't know the tech's as well (haven't owned one since '18), but the Service Manager, lead service writer and parts manager have been there for at least a decade.

Those are the qualities I look for in a Dealership.
The first place I visit, when seriously shopping, is the Shop. Not the sales floor.

In those examples, their focus on relationships has served them well.

However, I agree that many "Dealer Groups" have a different focus. I avoid those With A Passion. One I'm familiar with had 400 salespeople in their several stores, but hired 120 per month to keep slots filled,😲

In many cases it started with the NADA's "20 Group" in the late 60's, which was an expensive membership that "guaranteed" a fatter bottom line. In essence it was a way to pay employees less without increasing sales or service throughput. (AKA lower employee loyalty.)

To go further, this coincided with the "Third Generation" of dealers - the first gen being the Post War entrepreneurs. The third generation were "silver spoon" kids who never set foot in the store other than picking up their free Demo, who then inherited the place and dropped every ball possible. So they joined the 20 Group (the association), their bottom lines improved, and were able to sell to a Dealer Group and buy a yacht.

Sad story. Reason for shoddy outcomes. The reason they're called "stealerships."

There are good ones. Hopefully I find them, and they're the reason I choose the brands I own.

 

ACA, aka Obamacare, made a whole series of promises, that Obama, and all the hacks pushing it, knew were lies from the start. How do we know? Because we interviewed Professor Jonathan Gruber, who was hired to consult with Obama to get widespread support for the bill.
After taking a good long look at the bill, Gruber concluded, that the only way to garner any support would be to lie to the American public, because as Gruber commented, they are stupid anyway.
So what we got was a large steaming pile. Of what? I will leave that to your imagination.
I know OM&HC knows all this, but some other posters don’t seem to.

 

Ain't it the truth.
Unfortunately with cars, the complexity of new stuff with the emphasis on Infotainment (by this gen of buyers), Indy's can't afford to stay current. Even with Right to Repair.
I wonder if this will lead tto a Franchise model. Wouldn't be surprised.
I've still been able to find stellar dealership shops, more easily than independents in a hundred mile radius. But I don't know how long that will last.
I still have to go to the dealer to get the brakes on my 95 Chevy pickup bled.