robfolland

I've experienced the same as what Nanook has said. would like to think Mercedes would want to have a "fix" for this transmission issue, which seamed only to be a problem for the 2012-2014 models, the GLE with the same transmission was "fixed" this issue has been discussed in other threads
https://mbworld.org/forums/ml63-amg-...eally-bad.html
be nice if someone developed a "fix" for this.
lost faith in Mercedes for developing a transmission in this decade that preforms like this and not "fixing it"
also lost faith in the motoring journalists who tested this car and raved about it without mentioning the "lag/ flat spot/ lazy tranny/ transmission issue"

visanic

I took my 400 into MB service and they said no issues whatsoever. I believe them because they loaned me an AMG43 that actually shifted worse than my car. It's definitely an annoyance, and I am trying to not think about it because I love so many other things about the car.

That said, for my next purchase or lease, I am definitely asking for an overnight test drive as I would have noticed this after driving a few hours.

Note; I don't notice the issue in the morning as much as the afternoon when things heat up (I'm in NC, so every day in the Summer is +90 degrees). Just an observation...curious to see if others have seen this.....

visanic

tune?

robfolland

Hi Visanic
Re the tune, do you refer to an aftermarket increase in power (chip/ remap). I suggest its not a motor issue as below 6Km/h (about 4 M/h) there is no delay at all, and there is plenty of power all the time. Issue is slowing down, then throttling on to join/merge traffic and the huge delay in the transmission deciding what its going to do is the scary bit, the problem still exists when in "sport" mode although not as bad.
I took my car back under warranty and Mercedes did an "adaption" for the "flare" when the transmission is cold, from second to third, but didnt resolve the flat spot/ delay, which only lasted 6 months and still "flares" when its cold. So I took it back and they did another adaption and updated the engine computer with no resolve, replaced the throttle pedal, with no resolve, I took it back again and after hanging onto my car for 3.5 weeks, they gave it back with an extra 157Km on the clock and fuel tank to match and said "its just a characteristic of the model, drive in sport mode, have a nice day."
There clearly is something that kicks in at 6Km/h (about 4 M/h) which I was hoping someone will work out what the issue is and have an update to rectify the problem (sad that Mercedes just waited for the warranty to run out and then wipe there hands of the problem) also sad that motoring journalists never mentioned the problem when testing the car.
I still keep looking on line hoping someone will have a solution to the "delay, flat spot, lazy transmission". the 7G Tronic Plus Transmission is used in the 2015 model and no problem in that model.

and this is very funny (false advertising)
https://www.mercedes-benz.com.au/van...7g-tronic-plus

chassis

Accelerator pedal velocity is a strong influencer in the engine+transmission control map. I would avoid resetting the transmission, because it takes time to adapt to your style of driving. After a few months without a transmission reset, train yourself to manipulate accelerator pedal velocity and position to achieve the engine torque and transmission shift behavior you desire. Also get familiar with the paddle shifters. Modern vehicles are pretty different in this regard, particularly German ones.

It took me a while to learn a 2010 VW Touareg throttle-shift map. My wife hated driving the Touareg because of the very electronic-feeling accelerator logic.

The latest BMW X3 3.0i has a very direct and responsive throttle/engine/transmission combination. Benz has a different take on this.

robfolland

thanks for your input Chassis, I note you drive a 2018 GLE, the problem is solved in the 2015 onward. If you get the opportunity, get in a 2012-2014 ML63, then as you slow down for an intersection, without stopping ,pull out into traffic, see how quick the throttle response is and see how much you panic, as did the Mercedes technician when he took the car for a drive. certainly takes some getting used to and as some others have said just get used to it because there is not "fix" at the moment.

threeMBs

I still have '15 ML63 and had '14 ML550 before it. In both cars, throttle delay, was significantly reduced (if not totally eliminated) by installing Sprint Booster.

I also have '19 GLE43 and do not agree that with GLE "problem was solved". I would say (at least in my car) it is even worse (exacerbated by less power that those V8s) - driving in S on freeway, with transmission is in 9th gear (instead of 7th in ML), immediate and quick passing is next to impossible with it at this time (yes I'm still just under 1K miles). I also agree with above statement that learning how to properly press (non 63) GLE pedal will make this (non 63) 9G transmission downshift faster hence providing the response desired quicker than otherwise. I did not try S+ yet (due to milage), but will soon. In any event, I just ordered Sprint Booster for my GLE. In my experience with this device on four different MB model lines, it does the job.

chassis

Try this experiment:

In Comfort mode while driving 30mph with constant throttle, flick the accelerator pedal rapidly but for a small displacement. The transmission should kick down to a lower gear nearly immediately. Training your foot to do this might take a few tries. I did this today and the performance is predictable and repeatable. The key concept is accelerator pedal velocity has a large influence on shifting.

Compare the above experiment to the result achieved with Sport mode. I prefer Comfort mode, with user training for pedal actuation. In Sport mode, 7th gear is avoided and shifts happen too late for my liking from a fuel economy point of view, with daily driving.

For me the ideal situation would be a sport mode with more sensitive throttle pedal and shift schedule, but without the delayed upshift and avoidance of upper gears. On my standard GLE350, I do not have Sport+, and I am not aware of any ability to user configure the pedal sensitivity and shift points.

robfolland

OMG three MBs not good MB still ave the lazy tranny issue in some cars, truth is i didnt test anything less than the GLE63, which at the time preformed quite well, but reading associated threads seams that model had problems as well

https://mbworld.org/forums/w212-amg/...ct-e63s-3.html

also threads suggest the Sprint booster is no help for the "lazy tranny" (I'd be pleased if it was the "fix")

https://mbworld.org/forums/w212-amg/...-mct-e63s.html

very disappointing MB still make a car that cant preform in a dangerous situation. (turning into traffic).

In reply to Chassis post, I'm able to press the throttle pedal to the floor after decelerating and then release it, and the car will upshift yes but no change to RPM (now thats some delay), one expects that in an AMG the moment the throttle is pressed the engine comes to life. (this is far from the truth), as previously stated the motoring journalists who test drove this car should be ashamed of themselves for not reporting this dangerous fault.

threeMBs

Disagree. For every thread against there's (or could be) one for (there are always more complaining threads than complementing ones).

Since threads related to W212 were posted to dispute SB's effectiveness: I had W212 facelift 2014 E550 since new (and while waiting for it, 2014 E350 for several months). W212 Es 2014-on, had zero throttle delay (no I did not drive E63, but the models I drove had none). I also had W213 2019 E450 for 6 months before buying '19 GLE43 - zero throttle delay in W213 E (had many E300 loaners too - no delay, cars are "effected" by low power outputs, but it has nothing to do with throttle delay - available power was readily available as soon as throttle was pressed, but as with all MB only in S and above).

Back to W166, MLs and (as I stated in my post above) non 63 GLEs, still have significant throttle delay (which is "characteristics" of the car, per dealers). In my '14 ML550 and '15 ML63 it was/is significantly reduced with Spring Booster. Once I'll install SB in GLE43 this weekend, I'll post results in this thread (I expect the same significant improvement).

robfolland

Thanks for your input three MBs, i guess you disagreeing with my comment "also threads suggest the Sprint booster is no help for the "lazy tranny" (I'd be pleased if it was the "fix")"
quite right , there are just as many on the forums, for as against, including pedal box.
and i would expect there would be an improvement if there was a throttle delay, which it seams a lot of MB's seam to have the issue

I would happily spend the coin to " fix " the transmission delay on the W166 ML63, if I had someone definitively tell me SB or peddle box will "fix" it.
I suggest the SB or peddle box will sharpen up throttle response, but it the lazy tranny prohibits the throttle from working , no amount of sharpening will rectify the issue. (I'd be very happy if i was wrong).

I'm a little surprised that MB still ave not rectified throttle response in late model MBs such as your GLE43
I do look forward to your outcome of the install of your SB on the weekend.

threeMBs

Well as I've already posted, in my experience SB has significantly reduced (even if not totally eliminated) throttle delay in '15 ML63 (same SB was in '14 ML550 prior to it and both cars, especially the later, were very "difficult" to drive without SB). How much or if at all SB helps in GLE43 (with very different short geared 9g tranny, which I do not like) is irrelevant, since you have ML63 and in IMHO it is the best (under) $300 one can spend on a W166 ML.

robfolland

Ok thanks, Ill go get the SB and just to confirm , this will rectify or reduce the delay when slowing down to not less than 6Km/h (about 4 M/h) then accelerating? and will the pedal box work equally as well? Just the pedal box is a readily available on the Australian market.

threeMBs

While I have no personal experience with pedal box, those who tried both say that pedal box allows for more precise fine-tuning adjustments to the throttle "fix" compared to even gen.3 SB. So yes, I suppose pedal box is at least as good as SB and probably is better, but I prefer SB for ease of installation and a smaller size. SB I use in red with C or green with S.

robfolland

Thanks for the info threesMBs, I'll keep you posted on the outcome.

threeMBs

SB installed. Result is exactly as I have expected and experienced in many other MBs I have installed this device into. Now I can enjoy acceleration as much as handling of this mini "AMG" and be confident that car will "hit" the gap in traffic exactly when I want to. I even enjoyed driving it in C (instead of S I normally use) with SB in red, but S combined with SB in red is even more rewarding. Can not wait to see what S+ program can do with SB. Hands down the best useable "mod" under $300!

robfolland

Awesome , I have purchased pedalbox to suit my car,(as it was readily available in AUS) will let you know how it goes when i have installed it.

robfolland

I PURCHASED AND INSTALLED THE PEDALBOX in my 2014 W166 ML63 a week ago.

And unfortunately, it didn’t “fix” the delay which is “characteristic” (the excuse Mercedes used) for this model when accelerating after slowing down. (it’s a transmission issue), after decelerating I can still literally push the accelerator to the floor and back quickly and nothing happens, accept the gearbox upshifting sometimes.

BUT it did mask it somewhat, Prior to purchase I lacked faith in what the PedalBox was going to achieve, but the change was enough to make it worthwhile.

I certainly don’t regret the purchase of the PedalBox, as it made the driving of the vehicle a lot different, certainly sharpens up the acceleration and do feel like I’m driving some race bred vehicle. I do expect my fuel economy to suffer a little but who buys a big car to worry about fuel economy.

For anyone with a W166 ML63 2012-2015 I would recommend fitting one and I use the “Sport plus” with no red or green led lights.

Personally, from what I have read about MB and their flat spots, I would recommend fitting the PedalBox or Sprint booster or equivalent, as it’s a small expense well worth the expenditure and very easy to install. (yes, I’m a convert, so thanks threeMB’s)(this too is my third MB but the other two did not have a problem with acceleration delay).

threeMBs

+1. I would just add that above applies to GLE as well ML and across the whole line (not just AMGs).

nvsocr7

This is a known "issue" for mercedes; I have it on my 16 GLE 350. It has everything to do with their transmission and tuning. I've tried everything short of tuning it but this is how MB designs their cars. Sport mode with aggressive heavy throttle helps but passengers/wife hate it. No delay with the AMG versions. If you are an aggressive driver, this is likely to annoy you and you will start to hate this vehicle. It's also dangerous when you try to hit the gas to merge in stop/go traffic and there's a 1-2 second delay before the car does anything, and when it finally does it lurches forward causing you to almost hit the vehicle in front of you ( think chicago driving). Im at my wits end and have placed an order for a BMW x5 M50i, my GLE is getting repurposed to the parents. Even the base model x5 far out performs mercedes in the performance department, their transmission is butter smooth and very linear. My interpretation may be over the top, but for this amount of money I expect some level of performance which is the exact opposite of my experience (especially when it can be had in lesser or equivalent models).

chassis

I have been thinking about this and experimenting with pedal velocity. The transmission+engine map is very responsive to pedal velocity, and far less sensitive to pedal position. The exact opposite of a mechanical pedal-to-throttle connection to a "dumb" throttle position sensor from the 1980s-1990s.

Practice flicking the accelerator pedal a short distance but with high-ish velocity. You will be able to command a transmission downshift repeatably and achieve better drivability in comfort mode. It takes some getting used to, to drive this powertrain, compared with other vehicles.

mrmotoguzzi00

Was the same on ml '12 ml63... still there in the '16 gle63s but not nearly as bad... in the city i have been putting it in sport mode, makes it much better.... when i get up on the highway i just twist it to C .....

took a friend for a quick spin the other day in the city, never got above 40... but boy did we have some fun sprinting out of intersections in Sport + LOL

robfolland

Thanks for comments, i would be furious if I had purchased as 2016 GLE 63 and it still had the problem, MB knowing the fault was there in previous models. I did try driving in sport in the city, didnt "fix" the delay but helped slightly. PeddleBox has been the best solution so far, until someone comes up with an upgrade to remove the problem (probably a different transmission or control modal will be the solution) mrmotoguzzi00 having had a 2012 ML63 will know the dangerous delay when pulling into traffic, I presume the other ML W166 are just as bad but dont know.

Spence43

I'm attempting to install a BMS pedal tuner but cant see how to get to the wiring harness. Does anyone know how to remove the gas pedal on the 19 GLE43, I do not see any bolts or screws to get to the harness?

threeMBs

On these SUVs (ML/GLE) there is no need to remove the pedal, to install SB or the likes. All you have to do it push UP or IN (NOT down/out) the plastic cover in the area of the pedal until you can see the harness which is at the top of the pedal. It takes a little effort to push up enough, but once you see harness just secure the plastic cover in the Up position with some kind of stick so there is room for hands to install.