What is going on with MB??
10-18-2023, 11:29 AM
#226
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2024 GLS450
I specifically called out your 2012 C250 because it was better built back then and more reliable (you had already mentioned you got rid of it in '21).
My Mercedes history reposted for your benefit:
All of the above were brand new w/the exception of the CPO 2016 GL450. I have had a pretty good look at the evolution of Mercedes over the years whereas you only have the experience of the "fine wine" 2012 era.
My Mercedes history reposted for your benefit:
All of the above were brand new w/the exception of the CPO 2016 GL450. I have had a pretty good look at the evolution of Mercedes over the years whereas you only have the experience of the "fine wine" 2012 era.
1981 380SE
1985 380SE
1987 420SEL
1992 300SE
1996 S420
2001 S430
2004 S550
The W204 was hardly fine wine, it was a solid platform, but they had their fair share of issues (my own included). You also have no concept of what living with a W220 can be like. Your "evolutional" look at Mercedes is over a 11 year window across 3 platforms, 2 of which are arguably very similar (W204 and W212).
Seems to me you joined up here after being browbeaten into a 2023 and now you just want to complain.
Last edited by MDMercedesGuy; 10-18-2023 at 11:31 AM.
10-18-2023, 11:44 AM
#227
Funny, considering the following passed through our garage.
1981 380SE
1985 380SE
1987 420SEL
1992 300SE
1996 S420
2001 S430
2004 S550
The W204 was hardly fine wine, it was a solid platform, but they had their fair share of issues (my own included). You also have no concept of what living with a W220 can be like. Your "evolutional" look at Mercedes is over a 11 year window across 3 platforms, 2 of which are arguably very similar (W204 and W212).
Seems to me you joined up here after being browbeaten into a 2023 and now you just want to complain.
1981 380SE
1985 380SE
1987 420SEL
1992 300SE
1996 S420
2001 S430
2004 S550
The W204 was hardly fine wine, it was a solid platform, but they had their fair share of issues (my own included). You also have no concept of what living with a W220 can be like. Your "evolutional" look at Mercedes is over a 11 year window across 3 platforms, 2 of which are arguably very similar (W204 and W212).
Seems to me you joined up here after being browbeaten into a 2023 and now you just want to complain.
I'm in the demographic that Mercedes can least afford to lose since there's more of us!
When you get your car and something's not right, remember that you have a much longer drive to deal w/the selling dealer. I do hope that your purchase goes smoothly because the forum could use a bit of good news.
10-18-2023, 11:47 AM
#228
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2024 GLS450
That's great and I'm happy for you! I didn't grow up with a "Silver Spoon" and I certainly don't count myself amongst the 1%.
I'm in the demographic that Mercedes can least afford to lose since there's more of us!
When you get your car and something's not right, remember that you have a much longer drive to deal w/the selling dealer. I do hope that your purchase goes smoothly because the forum could use a bit of good news.
I'm in the demographic that Mercedes can least afford to lose since there's more of us!
When you get your car and something's not right, remember that you have a much longer drive to deal w/the selling dealer. I do hope that your purchase goes smoothly because the forum could use a bit of good news.
Why would I return to the selling dealer when I have a good service department 5 minutes away?...
Last edited by MDMercedesGuy; 10-18-2023 at 11:50 AM.
10-18-2023, 11:59 AM
#229
That's a rich response... my point being that I have literally been with the brand since day 1. There is no "silver spoon", you asked where my loyalty came from and then made a false assumption that my 2012 began my experience with the brand and were corrected.
Why would I return to the selling dealer when I have a good service department 5 minutes away?...
Why would I return to the selling dealer when I have a good service department 5 minutes away?...
Life's too short for nonsense that won't add to anyone's day.
I've read too many stories where folks buy way out of town to save a couple of bucks and then experienced issues (issues that only the selling dealer should deal with since your local dealer won't pay a dime for something that didn't leave their lot and is not warranty-related).
10-18-2023, 12:16 PM
#230
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2024 GLS450
I've read too many stories where folks buy way out of town to save a couple of bucks and then experienced issues (issues that only the selling dealer should deal with since your local dealer won't pay a dime for something that didn't leave their lot and is not warranty-related).
Aside from their ADM funny business on the new sales side, I've had a great service relationship with Euromotorcars and don't see that changing any time soon.
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10-18-2023, 05:25 PM
#231
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2020 S560 4Matic
I can tell you guys from reading and posting on many forums "they just aren't built like the old ones" is a common theme in EVERY forum. BMW, Mercedes, Lexus, Acura, Audi...every one.
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10-18-2023, 07:19 PM
#232
10-18-2023, 07:53 PM
#233
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10-18-2023, 11:16 PM
#234
10-19-2023, 07:50 AM
#236
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End of the day, MB is no different than the rest. They used to be, and is one of the aspects of the 212 that many loyalists love about it when compared to its rivals of Audi A6 and BMW 5 series. It was built to be a “benz”, not a competitor to those two who both drive far more engagingly than the 212. Those days are gone for all but the flagship S class, for a while, but I doubt forever. But the 48v meltdowns and still splitting mbtex is just inexcusable from any brand. I’d be saying this if these were Chevy Cruise too.
so perhaps I should re-title the thread to “whats going on with the car world instead!
now if you’ll excuse me, I need to finish my AARP application (not even kidding).
10-19-2023, 08:09 AM
#237
Even their recent performance Type S variants are stuck on performance from like 15 years ago!
Acura will always be the ugly stepchild that Honda allows to hang around as long as they don't set the house on fire!
10-19-2023, 10:55 AM
#238
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So my S560 is in for service and I have a new C Class.
I gotta say, I think its pretty darn solid. Lots of cheap plastic inside, but its an entry level C Class, if you look at anything else in the category its the same way. Everything feels solid though, no creaks when you push on stuff, the doors are super heavy and close with a great thud. Rides good, reasonably quiet, very classy looking inside and out... I think this C is an improvement from the outgoing C for sure...
Yet their fans still complain that they don't make them like they used to!
I gotta say, I think its pretty darn solid. Lots of cheap plastic inside, but its an entry level C Class, if you look at anything else in the category its the same way. Everything feels solid though, no creaks when you push on stuff, the doors are super heavy and close with a great thud. Rides good, reasonably quiet, very classy looking inside and out... I think this C is an improvement from the outgoing C for sure...
Not entirely true. Acura is still very much stuck in the early 2000's. If they made more liberal use of aluminum and lighter weight material, they'd have fuel economy numbers that would meet or exceed EPA estimates!
Even their recent performance Type S variants are stuck on performance from like 15 years ago!
Acura will always be the ugly stepchild that Honda allows to hang around as long as they don't set the house on fire!
Even their recent performance Type S variants are stuck on performance from like 15 years ago!
Acura will always be the ugly stepchild that Honda allows to hang around as long as they don't set the house on fire!
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10-19-2023, 11:06 AM
#239
So my S560 is in for service and I have a new C Class.
I gotta say, I think its pretty darn solid. Lots of cheap plastic inside, but its an entry level C Class, if you look at anything else in the category its the same way. Everything feels solid though, no creaks when you push on stuff, the doors are super heavy and close with a great thud. Rides good, reasonably quiet, very classy looking inside and out... I think this C is an improvement from the outgoing C for sure...
Yet their fans still complain that they don't make them like they used to!
I gotta say, I think its pretty darn solid. Lots of cheap plastic inside, but its an entry level C Class, if you look at anything else in the category its the same way. Everything feels solid though, no creaks when you push on stuff, the doors are super heavy and close with a great thud. Rides good, reasonably quiet, very classy looking inside and out... I think this C is an improvement from the outgoing C for sure...
Yet their fans still complain that they don't make them like they used to!
Only negative are the standard run flat tires but everyone's doing this now.
10-19-2023, 09:26 PM
#240
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Week 4 of loaners, for just two seat covers…. Lovely… the 3rd loaner has 12,000 miles on it, and believe I hear a front bearing starting to go out… 2022 GLC.
had a nice conversation with my friend who is a high-end car fan. $150k on a car is nothing. Has a friend who works as a salesman for MB, long time. Apparently even he is not impressed with the quality of their new offerings, noting squeaks and issues with materials, and the fake plastic wood, all the way up to the maybach level on the new EQ’s.
MB, if one of you is actually reading this stuff during your lunch break (and I am willing to bet you are)… we’re noticing it, and we do not like it…
but even if there weren’t these “issues”, the hassle for something as simple as a seat cover, is enough for me to pull the plug. 6 years of bad and frustrating service. I never really considered the dealership network before when buying a car until I came into MB. I am now though, for sure. Sucks, because I don’t think all of thise frustrations are entirely on the dealerships themselves, and I really did want to be a MB “lifer”..
had a nice conversation with my friend who is a high-end car fan. $150k on a car is nothing. Has a friend who works as a salesman for MB, long time. Apparently even he is not impressed with the quality of their new offerings, noting squeaks and issues with materials, and the fake plastic wood, all the way up to the maybach level on the new EQ’s.
MB, if one of you is actually reading this stuff during your lunch break (and I am willing to bet you are)… we’re noticing it, and we do not like it…
but even if there weren’t these “issues”, the hassle for something as simple as a seat cover, is enough for me to pull the plug. 6 years of bad and frustrating service. I never really considered the dealership network before when buying a car until I came into MB. I am now though, for sure. Sucks, because I don’t think all of thise frustrations are entirely on the dealerships themselves, and I really did want to be a MB “lifer”..
Last edited by nc211; 10-19-2023 at 09:31 PM.
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chassis (10-20-2023)
10-19-2023, 09:56 PM
#241
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I truly thought I would be a Lexus "lifer" too lol, I think life is too long a time to assume any one brand of anything will suit you well for all of it.
Every brand of anything I have ever really loved has changed and not appealed to me any longer. I used to buy pretty much all Ralph Lauren clothes, now I don't like any of them when I try them on...etc
Every brand of anything I have ever really loved has changed and not appealed to me any longer. I used to buy pretty much all Ralph Lauren clothes, now I don't like any of them when I try them on...etc
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chassis (10-20-2023)
10-19-2023, 11:12 PM
#243
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I think it's a combination of both, with a heavier influence being the economy and current interest rate environment. But no doubt that as more of these types of stories creep out into the market about some death glitch in the MB 48v hyper tech setups, the less appealing they will become for the average buyer. Even those with the ability to spend $150,000 in cash on a car should give some pause to the idea of the amount of time and frustration their car may bring to them in general because of stuff like this. Nobody wants to buy a $150,000 S class, only to be stuck in a C class loaner for weeks on end.
We'll keep the GLS until my wife says she no longer feels like she can trust it. Once she says that, it's gone. Honestly, we're likely to just move on from the German brands in general, maybe give VW/Audi another look (always been good us), but won't be going over to BMW. And doubt Toyota again (or Lexus). I actually road in a Grand Cherokee L a few weeks ago and was quite impressed by it. Very comfortable, nice ride, excellent wood trim accents, etc. The long 3-row version. Coworker has one, her 4th Jeep in a row, replaced her 2011 Grand Cherokee with this new one recently. We're starting to feel like we've "done that" on the high end flashy cars now. Struggling to see the need to spend so much for them when we're not really seeing the return on the cost other than a bit of the ego stroke for having a "Mercedes Benz". Ego only lasts for so long, thankfully.
This whole debacle reminds me of Jaguar about 20 years ago when they had some fuel system issue. The car would just shut off as you were driving. I remember a story about someone in the FL Keys getting killed by it.
We'll keep the GLS until my wife says she no longer feels like she can trust it. Once she says that, it's gone. Honestly, we're likely to just move on from the German brands in general, maybe give VW/Audi another look (always been good us), but won't be going over to BMW. And doubt Toyota again (or Lexus). I actually road in a Grand Cherokee L a few weeks ago and was quite impressed by it. Very comfortable, nice ride, excellent wood trim accents, etc. The long 3-row version. Coworker has one, her 4th Jeep in a row, replaced her 2011 Grand Cherokee with this new one recently. We're starting to feel like we've "done that" on the high end flashy cars now. Struggling to see the need to spend so much for them when we're not really seeing the return on the cost other than a bit of the ego stroke for having a "Mercedes Benz". Ego only lasts for so long, thankfully.
This whole debacle reminds me of Jaguar about 20 years ago when they had some fuel system issue. The car would just shut off as you were driving. I remember a story about someone in the FL Keys getting killed by it.
10-20-2023, 01:32 AM
#244
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Week 4 of loaners, for just two seat covers…. Lovely… the 3rd loaner has 12,000 miles on it, and believe I hear a front bearing starting to go out… 2022 GLC.
had a nice conversation with my friend who is a high-end car fan. $150k on a car is nothing. Has a friend who works as a salesman for MB, long time. Apparently even he is not impressed with the quality of their new offerings, noting squeaks and issues with materials, and the fake plastic wood, all the way up to the maybach level on the new EQ’s.
MB, if one of you is actually reading this stuff during your lunch break (and I am willing to bet you are)… we’re noticing it, and we do not like it…
but even if there weren’t these “issues”, the hassle for something as simple as a seat cover, is enough for me to pull the plug. 6 years of bad and frustrating service. I never really considered the dealership network before when buying a car until I came into MB. I am now though, for sure. Sucks, because I don’t think all of thise frustrations are entirely on the dealerships themselves, and I really did want to be a MB “lifer”..
had a nice conversation with my friend who is a high-end car fan. $150k on a car is nothing. Has a friend who works as a salesman for MB, long time. Apparently even he is not impressed with the quality of their new offerings, noting squeaks and issues with materials, and the fake plastic wood, all the way up to the maybach level on the new EQ’s.
MB, if one of you is actually reading this stuff during your lunch break (and I am willing to bet you are)… we’re noticing it, and we do not like it…
but even if there weren’t these “issues”, the hassle for something as simple as a seat cover, is enough for me to pull the plug. 6 years of bad and frustrating service. I never really considered the dealership network before when buying a car until I came into MB. I am now though, for sure. Sucks, because I don’t think all of thise frustrations are entirely on the dealerships themselves, and I really did want to be a MB “lifer”..
In one case MB has low quality design and manufacturing. This for sure is part of the story.
In the other case MB can’t navigate their way out of a (supply chain logistics) paper bag. This for sure is part of the story.
When is 168 coming? 167 is a dark chapter in MB’s history, same with M274/264/254 engines. 223 might be the same.
10-20-2023, 08:06 AM
#245
Another data point, to add to the long and growing list, that MB does not have basic control of their business. All companies in the world are navigating the same economic reality, for example regarding parts availability. Therefore the lack of seat cover availability is either because the supplier can’t keep up with demand because Mb is replacing so many of them, or MB can muster the logistics ability to get the seat covers shipped to the dealer and installed in the customer’s car.
In one case MB has low quality design and manufacturing. This for sure is part of the story.
In the other case MB can’t navigate their way out of a (supply chain logistics) paper bag. This for sure is part of the story.
When is 168 coming? 167 is a dark chapter in MB’s history, same with M274/264/254 engines. 223 might be the same.
In one case MB has low quality design and manufacturing. This for sure is part of the story.
In the other case MB can’t navigate their way out of a (supply chain logistics) paper bag. This for sure is part of the story.
When is 168 coming? 167 is a dark chapter in MB’s history, same with M274/264/254 engines. 223 might be the same.
I'm not sure which is worse: a car company trying to be a tech company (Mercedes) or a tech company masquerading as a car company (Tesla). Neither is especially appetizing right now!
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chassis (10-20-2023)
10-20-2023, 09:44 AM
#246
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2024 GLS450
168 will have to be an "all hands on deck" effort to erase the memory of 167! Hire more beta testers and UX folks!
I'm not sure which is worse: a car company trying to be a tech company (Mercedes) or a tech company masquerading as a car company (Tesla). Neither is especially appetizing right now!
I'm not sure which is worse: a car company trying to be a tech company (Mercedes) or a tech company masquerading as a car company (Tesla). Neither is especially appetizing right now!
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chassis (10-20-2023)
10-20-2023, 12:15 PM
#248
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I truly thought I would be a Lexus "lifer" too lol, I think life is too long a time to assume any one brand of anything will suit you well for all of it.
Every brand of anything I have ever really loved has changed and not appealed to me any longer. I used to buy pretty much all Ralph Lauren clothes, now I don't like any of them when I try them on...etc
Every brand of anything I have ever really loved has changed and not appealed to me any longer. I used to buy pretty much all Ralph Lauren clothes, now I don't like any of them when I try them on...etc
10-20-2023, 12:34 PM
#249
yep, true! And with that example, after a test drive this morning, I am going to make a switch next year from a Mercedes…….to a Ford! How’s that for a leap! I drove a Bronco “Outerbanks” this morning, soft top, 2.3 4 cylinder with my wife. Not one with the big tires and lifted suspension (Sasquatch), but the regular one. Lux package with all of their options. We. Loved it! I could’ve sworn it was the V6. Flipped the top open, heated seats, and just enjoyed the nice ride and cushy seats. That’s it. That is exactly what I want to replace my 212 with. Obviously no real apples to apples comparison, and MB has nothing in that category in general. But man, they are quite nice! No wood accents. Hard plastics, cheap knobs, etc. and yet, all feels exactly as it should for the type of vehicle that it is. Got it up to 70mph, and with the regular wheels and rack/pinion steering, it cruised pretty much like a normal car. Nothing like the Wrangler which scared me at that speed. It’ll be my first Ford ever, and a brand new one will be around $55k… heck of a deal if you ask me.
When a prior car was in the shop, I had a 4Runner as a loaner and I was always curious as to its appeal (it always looks like it's 10-15 years old despite being a current MY car I drove). It definitely felt like it was ready to go offroading and I was surprised by the available power (still slow). I have no doubt Toyota will sell a ton of the redesign that's coming out as it certainly has a cult following!
At this point, Mercedes only has one job: make cars that drive and don't invoke the wrath of current owners!
10-20-2023, 02:37 PM
#250
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There comes a time when you realize that you don’t own your things, they own you. I am at that point in my life and wanting to back it down a bit. I’m after simple and fun with out worrying so much if it gets scratched or dirty. No more of these overly complicated systems of anything for me. The more complex it is, the less I want it now. These Broncos are definitely scratching that itch after years of MB..
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chassis (10-21-2023)
