Transmission Fluid is brown (I took photos of it)
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 22
Likes: 2
From: Los Angeles, CA
w163
Transmission Fluid is brown (I took photos of it)
I know the ATF is supposed to be a lifetime fluid, but has this fluid reached the end of its life?
I placed the sampled fluid onto a facial tissue. Shouldn't it be red in color?
I inserted a clean flexible cable into the "MB workshop only" dipstick tube. I wanted to see the quality of the ATF and I am not pleased.
The shift quality feels OK, nothing apparently wrong. Sometimes it will stay in a gear for an extended period of time, but nothing too outrageous. I would just ease off the accelerator to let it upshift.
I need advice. Should I be looking to drain and re-fill the transmission fluid or is this just normal?
I placed the sampled fluid onto a facial tissue. Shouldn't it be red in color?
I inserted a clean flexible cable into the "MB workshop only" dipstick tube. I wanted to see the quality of the ATF and I am not pleased.
The shift quality feels OK, nothing apparently wrong. Sometimes it will stay in a gear for an extended period of time, but nothing too outrageous. I would just ease off the accelerator to let it upshift.
I need advice. Should I be looking to drain and re-fill the transmission fluid or is this just normal?
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 22
Likes: 2
From: Los Angeles, CA
w163
OK Thanks Guys.
I am confident that I can do the change and drop the pan.
The only thing I am not good on is how to accurately check the temperature when I go to refill the thing.
What is the easiest way to obtain a good reading? Can I use an existing sensor in the transmission?
I have absolutely no scanning equipment except for a DVOM.
I am confident that I can do the change and drop the pan.
The only thing I am not good on is how to accurately check the temperature when I go to refill the thing.
What is the easiest way to obtain a good reading? Can I use an existing sensor in the transmission?
I have absolutely no scanning equipment except for a DVOM.
Last edited by paperplane94; Jun 26, 2013 at 03:18 AM.
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 282
Likes: 5
From: Brisbane, Australia
2002 ML320, 2003 A160
I advise you to thoroughly research this task before embarking, to avoid the problems this member on another forum had.
If you are only going to empty the pan and refill, then the original fluid in your system is ATF 3403 from MB sheet 236.10. Since then, that specification has been superseded by a newer fluid called ATF 134 (from sheet 236.14). It might be OK to mix them, but it's better to flush the old fluid out using 14 L of ATF 134. The old spec ATF is still available.
P.S You don't need to replace the conductor plate. Yours is working just fine.
If you are only going to empty the pan and refill, then the original fluid in your system is ATF 3403 from MB sheet 236.10. Since then, that specification has been superseded by a newer fluid called ATF 134 (from sheet 236.14). It might be OK to mix them, but it's better to flush the old fluid out using 14 L of ATF 134. The old spec ATF is still available.
P.S You don't need to replace the conductor plate. Yours is working just fine.
Last edited by DrX; Jun 26, 2013 at 03:57 AM.
Member
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 239
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From: Overhere
w210 e55
Use an OEM filter. I had an issue with an aftermarket german made filter popping off the valve body after a few months. It is a press in type filter and I found that they all don't fit as snugly as they should (either tube or o ring diameter was off).
My INDI that checked it out after I thought I had a blown tranny said he found it on the bottom of the pan. He only uses MB filters because the clearances are specific and tight.
Worth a few bucks not to have an issue like mine.
Change is pretty straight forward if you are DIY.
My INDI that checked it out after I thought I had a blown tranny said he found it on the bottom of the pan. He only uses MB filters because the clearances are specific and tight.
Worth a few bucks not to have an issue like mine.
Change is pretty straight forward if you are DIY.
Member
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 239
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From: Overhere
w210 e55
If you have a later model like my 03ML350 you do not have a converter drain plug. The only way to replace all the fluid is by dilution method of 4-5qt change driving and repeating or by opening a return line and starting the car draining x amount and filling x amount until you reach amount you want to flush. This is a pain and dilution will be simpler.
Also I remember reading MB uses graphite clutches and this causes the fluid to get more of a grey color. I always thought brown=bad for t fluid. In any case time for a service.
PS also you probably want to change the electrical connector while you are at it. This is a know problem leak point for our trannys. Connector is cheap.
Also I remember reading MB uses graphite clutches and this causes the fluid to get more of a grey color. I always thought brown=bad for t fluid. In any case time for a service.
PS also you probably want to change the electrical connector while you are at it. This is a know problem leak point for our trannys. Connector is cheap.
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Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 22
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From: Los Angeles, CA
w163
Thank you guys, but I just went to the dealer and the service advisor gave me the old myth about "if you change the fluid, your transmission might fail prematurely shortly after." He was saying how clutch residue is suspended in the fluid and is helping it shift and that if it is changed, it will start slipping. He also said that since the transmission was made to be a sealed unit, the fluid should not be changed.
So now it is should I listen to him or not...
The car has 107,000 miles on it and the age of the fluid is unknown.
Do you guys think that the clutches have worn down and are now suspended in the fluid preventing it from slipping?
The SA was adamant, but do you think 107k miles is "too late" for a fluid change? it shifts normally with nothing extremely out of the ordinary.
Is my best bet to drain a quart or so from the drain bolt and examine the fluid and go from there replacing the lost quart with the ATF 134?
Please sway me as i am skeptical after what that Service Advisor told me.
So now it is should I listen to him or not...
The car has 107,000 miles on it and the age of the fluid is unknown.
Do you guys think that the clutches have worn down and are now suspended in the fluid preventing it from slipping?
The SA was adamant, but do you think 107k miles is "too late" for a fluid change? it shifts normally with nothing extremely out of the ordinary.
Is my best bet to drain a quart or so from the drain bolt and examine the fluid and go from there replacing the lost quart with the ATF 134?
Please sway me as i am skeptical after what that Service Advisor told me.
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Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 282
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From: Brisbane, Australia
2002 ML320, 2003 A160
Have a read of this to help you decide.
http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w163...ml#post5550132
What did the SA advise you to do? Spend thousands on a new tranny?
The "if you change your fluid, your tranny might fail soon after" idea is very popular, but has little basis in fact. I suspect that they get old, and fluid gets changed, and they inevitably fail. But just because event A preceded event B, doesn't mean that A caused B.
To answer your original question, the fluid is red because of a pigment. Eventually, pigments decompose over time.
http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w163...ml#post5550132
What did the SA advise you to do? Spend thousands on a new tranny?
The "if you change your fluid, your tranny might fail soon after" idea is very popular, but has little basis in fact. I suspect that they get old, and fluid gets changed, and they inevitably fail. But just because event A preceded event B, doesn't mean that A caused B.
To answer your original question, the fluid is red because of a pigment. Eventually, pigments decompose over time.
Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 37
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ML430 E320 S500
BTW if you don't change the oil sooner or later the check engine light will kick in for faulty trany..the residue collects around the conductor plate because it's heavier than the oil and mess up the communication which results in long shifting etc...
Last edited by yourbenztech; Jun 27, 2013 at 12:59 AM.
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Joined: Jun 2013
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ML430 E320 S500
I have to disagree with the Benz tech! If what holds the transmission together is bad oil than you might as well change the transmission!! The oil travel through many little tunnels throughout the transmission and there are many different valves, the purpose of the filter in the transmission is to collect this debris so you have a cleaner and smoother shift and have the transmission functioning acording to its optimum condition, the reason for the system being close is to prevent from most people changing oil on the transmission themselves because, not like motor oil, it is quite easy to blow a gasket on transmission if you over fill it or so....with that being said the wear of transmission oil is not as frequent as motor oil since it does not work on same temperatures however, transmission needs maintenance!!!!like any other machine, and I would recommend replacing the oil/filter/conductor plate/13pin transmission connector/gasket, and if the transmission is in good shape, you will get many more miles on it. Cost of oem parts is about $300 with about 2.5 hours labor.
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 22
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From: Los Angeles, CA
w163
So did Mercedes Benz put out a Technical Service Bulletin on changing the transmission fluid?
Because it says in the owners manual that the transmission is filled for life.
If any of you have the bulletin I would like to see it to see what they had to say about the "Lifetime Fill" Fluid.
Because it says in the owners manual that the transmission is filled for life.
If any of you have the bulletin I would like to see it to see what they had to say about the "Lifetime Fill" Fluid.
Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2013
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ML430 E320 S500
First, take everything with a grain of salt, even if Mercedes says "don't" they may make mistakes too....they had recalls, right?? Second don't forget that MB is a "for profit" cooperation" third we are not talking about the life of the transmission, we are talking about extending the life....and if your transmission is at the point of reaching the end of its cycle, there are things you can do to extend it that may be against the profit intentions of the manufacturer...capish??
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 22
Likes: 2
From: Los Angeles, CA
w163
OK Guys, Thank you very much.
I have thought it over and I have decided to perform the ATF change using the info already here on the forum.
I do plan on keeping the car for an extended period of time and it would be nice if it had the original engine and transmission too. So I think this is necessary for mainteneance.
I have thought it over and I have decided to perform the ATF change using the info already here on the forum.
I do plan on keeping the car for an extended period of time and it would be nice if it had the original engine and transmission too. So I think this is necessary for mainteneance.
Newbie
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 8
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ML 320 2002
Hello Guys,
I did my tranny flush a week ago, replaced with Marcon V. Works great ! Put it 4 quartz of tranny fluid. I drove 500 miles after my flush, and my fluid is now back to brown color. Probably needed a complete overhaul replacing filter and gaskets and connectors.
Thanks to forum, I had the courage to DYI this time on my tranny.
I did my tranny flush a week ago, replaced with Marcon V. Works great ! Put it 4 quartz of tranny fluid. I drove 500 miles after my flush, and my fluid is now back to brown color. Probably needed a complete overhaul replacing filter and gaskets and connectors.
Thanks to forum, I had the courage to DYI this time on my tranny.
