Auto-lights sometimes erratic...
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Sep 2011
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From: East Texas
2004 Volvo XC70; 2012 GLK 350 4matic
I'm guessing you haven't read follow up posts in this thread. It's not as basic as the "auto" light feature.
Do you have the DRL LED option during on???Setting this option seems to trigger the malfunction.
Is this a life threatening issue. Obviously not. Yet, this is not an problem with BMW, Hyundai, some other MB models and other makes, and it shouldn't be an issue with ours.
I laid down $60k+ cash for this vehicle and to have something like this malfunction is uncalled for, especially since other brands have no problem getting it right. It is not bleeding edge technology. And, MB doesn't seem to be able to understand the unique facts of this problem (i.e., the blue sky effect nonsense).
Do you have the DRL LED option during on???Setting this option seems to trigger the malfunction.
Is this a life threatening issue. Obviously not. Yet, this is not an problem with BMW, Hyundai, some other MB models and other makes, and it shouldn't be an issue with ours.
I laid down $60k+ cash for this vehicle and to have something like this malfunction is uncalled for, especially since other brands have no problem getting it right. It is not bleeding edge technology. And, MB doesn't seem to be able to understand the unique facts of this problem (i.e., the blue sky effect nonsense).
Wayne
Senior Member
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 313
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From: SoCal
'03 A4 2.0 Stroker, '14 E63 S AMG, '10 E550, '10 S550, '03 C240
This has nothing to do with programming, this is solely a sensor fault. The sensors are non-adjustable pieces of straight crap.
They massively cheaped out on the W164 when it came to the details. If someone was to exchange the sensor with one off a GLK for example, this issue would not be occurring.
They massively cheaped out on the W164 when it came to the details. If someone was to exchange the sensor with one off a GLK for example, this issue would not be occurring.
Member
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 205
Likes: 3
From: Denver / southern AZ
'11 ML350
What DRL LED option is SUPPOSED to do is turn it on ONLY the LEDs during daylight hours, i.e., headlights are NOT on. I'm sure you've seen Audis, BMWs, and other MBs cruisin' during the day with only the LEDs on.
When I turn on the LED option, only my LEDs will come on (as expected)...for a while. Then erratically the headlights will then also turn on/off. During these occurrences when the headlights/LEDs are on, there is NO WAY to turn the lights off. Moving the rotary switch to off has no affect. The only way to turnoff the headlights in this situation is to park the car and turn off the ignition.
Is this clearer?
Member
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 205
Likes: 3
From: Denver / southern AZ
'11 ML350
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,522
Likes: 3
From: East Texas
2004 Volvo XC70; 2012 GLK 350 4matic
I read all of your complaints. The photo is merely confirming the presence of full time LED running lights and no interferrance with the operation of the headlights under ALL enviornmental conditions. Band together and assault MBUSA. Aren't these MLs still under warranty?
I remember my dad getting really upset once. He told the offending shop owner that if they didn't correct the problem, that he would drive through their front door and return the product. The problem went away. I think it is way past time for y'all to get their attention. Good luck.
Wayne
I remember my dad getting really upset once. He told the offending shop owner that if they didn't correct the problem, that he would drive through their front door and return the product. The problem went away. I think it is way past time for y'all to get their attention. Good luck.
Wayne
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 388
Likes: 1
From: Austria
Mercedes
If you go to the "Lightning Submenu" in your multifunction display (MFD), can you access the menu for your daytime running lamps (DRL)? If so, go to that menu and select "Lamp Circuit Headlamp" (LCH). If LCH is set to "constant", you cannot turn off your headlamps. They will remain on, even if your rotary switch is set to "0" (off).
If you set LCH to "manual", you can manually select if you want your DLRs and/or headlights to be off or in AUTO-mode, by using your rotary switch.
There are two conditions where the whole light system is controlled automatically by the brightness sensors:
A) LCH is set to "constant"
B) LCH is set to "manual", but rotary switch is set to "AUTO"
And yes, the sensor and the automatic handling of the light is NOT flawless. Headlamps sometimes come on erratically (especially in VERY bright environments). It doesn't have anything to do with the actual equipment of your car (LED DRLs, Xenons, H7 bulbs, foglights ...whatever. It really doesn't matter).
IF you have DRL-LEDs and your sensor decides to turn on your headlamps (because it senses that the light emitted by the DRL-LEDs is insufficient), it should also dim down the brightness of the DRL-LEDs a little. I.e. the LEDs will remain on, but less bright when the headlamps come on.
If everything on your ML works as described above, then everything works as intended by design... with the slight flaw that the sensor sucks.
If you cannot access the daytime running lamps menu at all, your car runs on Canadian (or some Skandinavian Country) settings (where it is not allowed to turn off the light during daytime). For Canada the LCH is set to "constant" and cannot be changed by the driver.
If you set LCH to "manual", you can manually select if you want your DLRs and/or headlights to be off or in AUTO-mode, by using your rotary switch.
There are two conditions where the whole light system is controlled automatically by the brightness sensors:
A) LCH is set to "constant"
B) LCH is set to "manual", but rotary switch is set to "AUTO"
And yes, the sensor and the automatic handling of the light is NOT flawless. Headlamps sometimes come on erratically (especially in VERY bright environments). It doesn't have anything to do with the actual equipment of your car (LED DRLs, Xenons, H7 bulbs, foglights ...whatever. It really doesn't matter).
IF you have DRL-LEDs and your sensor decides to turn on your headlamps (because it senses that the light emitted by the DRL-LEDs is insufficient), it should also dim down the brightness of the DRL-LEDs a little. I.e. the LEDs will remain on, but less bright when the headlamps come on.
If everything on your ML works as described above, then everything works as intended by design... with the slight flaw that the sensor sucks.
If you cannot access the daytime running lamps menu at all, your car runs on Canadian (or some Skandinavian Country) settings (where it is not allowed to turn off the light during daytime). For Canada the LCH is set to "constant" and cannot be changed by the driver.
Last edited by Sharkster; Mar 8, 2012 at 09:36 PM.
Member
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 205
Likes: 3
From: Denver / southern AZ
'11 ML350
If you go to the "Lightning Submenu" in your multifunction display (MFD), can you access the menu for your daytime running lamps (DRL)? If so, go to that menu and select "Lamp Circuit Headlamp" (LCH). If LCH is set to "constant", you cannot turn off your headlamps. They will remain on, even if your rotary switch is set to "0" (off).
I can access the lighting menu, which contains about 4 options (like delayed off, etc.) including DRL. But for DRL it only offers options of ON - OFF. I don't see, or don't know how to get to a lighting submenu containing "lamp circuit headlamp". Is this perhaps dealer only access?
The current function is working like: if I set DRL to on, then LCH is automatically set to "constant". If DRL is set to off then LCH is automatically set to "manual".
If I can get to this submenu perhaps my DRL issue will be solved. The other problem seems to be because of a crappy light sensor.
Last edited by eeferber; Mar 8, 2012 at 10:56 PM.
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 388
Likes: 1
From: Austria
Mercedes
What happens if you set DRL to off and then switch the rotary knob to "AUTO"? Will your DRL LEDs come on automatically or are they simply turned off entirely?
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Member
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 205
Likes: 3
From: Denver / southern AZ
'11 ML350
I have not yet experienced MB's "blue sky effect".
edit: oops. just to keep the record accurate...I did have the headlights come on yesterday @ mid-afternoon (DRL is off, rotary switch to auto). Clear blue sky. Guess I got hit with the blue sky effect after all.
Last edited by eeferber; Mar 11, 2012 at 02:32 PM.
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 388
Likes: 1
From: Austria
Mercedes
We all are. You just didn't notice it before. 
Anyway... what I said above is pretty much all of my wisdom. However, I have to add that the information is based on pre 2009 models. If the LCH menu was removed from the MFD on post 2009 models, then I don't know what to throw in else... Sorry.
Anyway... what I said above is pretty much all of my wisdom. However, I have to add that the information is based on pre 2009 models. If the LCH menu was removed from the MFD on post 2009 models, then I don't know what to throw in else... Sorry.
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 357
Likes: 2
From: Toronto, Canada
2013 E350 BlueTec, 2011 VW Jetta TDI
My guess is since it's not a safety issue, nothing will be done to fix this.
If it involves brakes or can cause an electrical fire you can bet a solution will be found.
IMO, the following needs to be changed to fix the auto-lighting issue:
1. Replace the switch with one which allows you to turn off the headlights when you set it to the "0" position.
2. Redesign the sensor to detect blue skies as bright daylight. Or buy the sensor that works from other manufacturers.
3. Reprogrammed the ECU if necessary.
Right now the attitude it put up with it. This is as designed.
If the GLK and W166 does not have this issue shouldn't MB use the same parts or settings in the ECU to fix our W164?
If it involves brakes or can cause an electrical fire you can bet a solution will be found.
IMO, the following needs to be changed to fix the auto-lighting issue:
1. Replace the switch with one which allows you to turn off the headlights when you set it to the "0" position.
2. Redesign the sensor to detect blue skies as bright daylight. Or buy the sensor that works from other manufacturers.
3. Reprogrammed the ECU if necessary.
Right now the attitude it put up with it. This is as designed.
If the GLK and W166 does not have this issue shouldn't MB use the same parts or settings in the ECU to fix our W164?
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 357
Likes: 2
From: Toronto, Canada
2013 E350 BlueTec, 2011 VW Jetta TDI
Toay it's dull and foggy with poor visibility and yet the auto-light does not switch on the headlights while other vehicles on the highway have their headlights on.
I had to manually turn on the headlights.
So go figure... what kind of German engineering that cannot get the auto-lighting to function properly when it needs to and we are told to accept the Blue Sky Effect for when the headlights comes on in bright sunshine.
Now if we complain about the headlights not activating in foggy conditions we will be told it's not the Foggy Sky Effect!
I had to manually turn on the headlights.
So go figure... what kind of German engineering that cannot get the auto-lighting to function properly when it needs to and we are told to accept the Blue Sky Effect for when the headlights comes on in bright sunshine.
Now if we complain about the headlights not activating in foggy conditions we will be told it's not the Foggy Sky Effect!
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 388
Likes: 1
From: Austria
Mercedes
Member
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 131
Likes: 0
From: Lake Tahoe
w164 (ml 500)
Toay it's dull and foggy with poor visibility and yet the auto-light does not switch on the headlights while other vehicles on the highway have their headlights on.
I had to manually turn on the headlights.
So go figure... what kind of German engineering that cannot get the auto-lighting to function properly when it needs to and we are told to accept the Blue Sky Effect for when the headlights comes on in bright sunshine.
Now if we complain about the headlights not activating in foggy conditions we will be told it's not the Foggy Sky Effect!
I had to manually turn on the headlights.
So go figure... what kind of German engineering that cannot get the auto-lighting to function properly when it needs to and we are told to accept the Blue Sky Effect for when the headlights comes on in bright sunshine.
Now if we complain about the headlights not activating in foggy conditions we will be told it's not the Foggy Sky Effect!
You know I think that our Audi (after resent update) now turns on head lights anytime the wipers are on.
It's such a pain to lean forward to flip the switch, it's more of a pain to remember to turn them off.
Mark.
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 388
Likes: 1
From: Austria
Mercedes
I just read on a German forum that the W166 is affected by the same issues. Anyway, I think it's somewhat strange that my R230 doesn't have any light sensor issues at all. Although it's 3 yrs older than my W164.
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 357
Likes: 2
From: Toronto, Canada
2013 E350 BlueTec, 2011 VW Jetta TDI
It's probably the use of the same sensors and/or the computer programming software.
Guess I won't be looking for a W166 next, since it also has the hesitation/buckling issues on cold start on the bluetecs.
Newbie
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
2011 ML350
I apologize by reviving this thread, but I too have a problem with all of my lights burning during broad daylight in Auto and 0 mode.
Here's what I know… If I set my DRL function on in the menu, my ML350's HIDs, proximity, parking, and LED DRLs all burn in the Auto and 0 settings using the front dial MOST of the time no matter how bright or dark it is outside. If my DRL function is off, all of my lights burn only in the Auto mode. At least in the 0 setting on the dial, the lights do shut off.
I believe it's a faulty sensor. Why? Because I notice that the view screen on the MB Command displays night mode even in the middle of a clear sunny day. I hardly ever see the daylight mode.
I find this to be 100% unacceptable. My wife's current A5, my previous Touareg and Pathfinder all had automatic headlights which quickly transitioned from either the dark garage at home or under my office building to daylight within a very short period of time.
This past Saturday, I drove 120 miles in the middle of the day with clear skis and my headlamps ran the entire time in the Auto or 0 selection because I had the DLR function on. Sure, I could shut off the DRL function and manually set light position to the 0 setting, but what's the point? Why have an Auto setting if it doesn't work? Besides, I would very much like to run the LED DRLs for safety. While running all the lights add more visibility, it's a waste of resources. I'd much rather replace a warn out LED light than a full HID low beam.
Here's what I know… If I set my DRL function on in the menu, my ML350's HIDs, proximity, parking, and LED DRLs all burn in the Auto and 0 settings using the front dial MOST of the time no matter how bright or dark it is outside. If my DRL function is off, all of my lights burn only in the Auto mode. At least in the 0 setting on the dial, the lights do shut off.
I believe it's a faulty sensor. Why? Because I notice that the view screen on the MB Command displays night mode even in the middle of a clear sunny day. I hardly ever see the daylight mode.
I find this to be 100% unacceptable. My wife's current A5, my previous Touareg and Pathfinder all had automatic headlights which quickly transitioned from either the dark garage at home or under my office building to daylight within a very short period of time.
This past Saturday, I drove 120 miles in the middle of the day with clear skis and my headlamps ran the entire time in the Auto or 0 selection because I had the DLR function on. Sure, I could shut off the DRL function and manually set light position to the 0 setting, but what's the point? Why have an Auto setting if it doesn't work? Besides, I would very much like to run the LED DRLs for safety. While running all the lights add more visibility, it's a waste of resources. I'd much rather replace a warn out LED light than a full HID low beam.
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 357
Likes: 2
From: Toronto, Canada
2013 E350 BlueTec, 2011 VW Jetta TDI
No need to apologize.
The W164 is a discontinued model so M-B is not going to waste resources to fix this issue since it's not a safety issue.
I have since last year gotten rid of my 2011 ML and bought a 2013 E250BT.
The E doesn't suffer from this lighting issue even though it has the LED DRL. M-B must have redesigned the lighting circuit or sensors?
Unfortunately for the W164 it (Blue Sky Effect) is performing as designed.
The W164 is a discontinued model so M-B is not going to waste resources to fix this issue since it's not a safety issue.
I have since last year gotten rid of my 2011 ML and bought a 2013 E250BT.
The E doesn't suffer from this lighting issue even though it has the LED DRL. M-B must have redesigned the lighting circuit or sensors?
Unfortunately for the W164 it (Blue Sky Effect) is performing as designed.
Member
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 205
Likes: 3
From: Denver / southern AZ
'11 ML350
No need to apologize.
The W164 is a discontinued model so M-B is not going to waste resources to fix this issue since it's not a safety issue.
I have since last year gotten rid of my 2011 ML and bought a 2013 E250BT.
The E doesn't suffer from this lighting issue even though it has the LED DRL. M-B must have redesigned the lighting circuit or sensors?
Unfortunately for the W164 it (Blue Sky Effect) is performing as designed.
The W164 is a discontinued model so M-B is not going to waste resources to fix this issue since it's not a safety issue.
I have since last year gotten rid of my 2011 ML and bought a 2013 E250BT.
The E doesn't suffer from this lighting issue even though it has the LED DRL. M-B must have redesigned the lighting circuit or sensors?
Unfortunately for the W164 it (Blue Sky Effect) is performing as designed.
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 431
Likes: 0
From: NYC / LI
2013 CTS-V, 2017 Audi Q7 / Past MB's: 2011 ML350 & 2012 ML350
No need to apologize.
The W164 is a discontinued model so M-B is not going to waste resources to fix this issue since it's not a safety issue.
I have since last year gotten rid of my 2011 ML and bought a 2013 E250BT.
The E doesn't suffer from this lighting issue even though it has the LED DRL. M-B must have redesigned the lighting circuit or sensors?
Unfortunately for the W164 it (Blue Sky Effect) is performing as designed.
The W164 is a discontinued model so M-B is not going to waste resources to fix this issue since it's not a safety issue.
I have since last year gotten rid of my 2011 ML and bought a 2013 E250BT.
The E doesn't suffer from this lighting issue even though it has the LED DRL. M-B must have redesigned the lighting circuit or sensors?
Unfortunately for the W164 it (Blue Sky Effect) is performing as designed.
MB put me in a 2012 ML which does not have the erratic headlight issue the 2011 had so I think you're correct. MB must have redesigned the sensor or circuit on the newer models.
R Doug - good luck trying to get MB to fix this for you. Every time I asked the dealer to look at this I was told that there was nothing wrong, "it's operating as designed". Or they would turn off the DRL's in the main menu..
The first time I complained to the dealer about the headlights was the day after I picked it up. Took delivery on a Friday and Saturday morning (with only 60 miles on it) I was in the service dept being given the runaround.
The shop foreman and sales person witnessed the headlights set to auto, and the ML sitting in sunlight with the headlights on. The shop foreman turned off he DRL's and told me to enjoy my new truck. Being new to MB at the time I realized later what he had done to "fix" the problem.
I'm not trying to be a jerk but learn to live with it because MB is not going to correct this.
Last edited by Cyber GS; Feb 25, 2014 at 01:49 PM.
