Creative ways to overhaul in situ
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: Apr 2023
Posts: 3
Likes: 2
2008 S65
Creative ways to overhaul in situ
First post here.
I have no prior mechanical experience, but educated myself on the theory and practice and spent quite a bit of time on watching and reading everything m275 related. From Tasos to Legitcars to everything in between on all areas of the engine and W221 in general.
Bought an S65 two months ago, and decided that the best way to gain practical skill to the max is to tackle this engine, with a mindset that there will not be anything really more difficult in the future, that I would not be able to take on.
Not planning to become a professional, but this is more of a self-educational journey and building a skill set.
Car is high mileage with extensive records and a lot of labor and parts already done by the previous owner. I have all records going back to dealer service intervals. Compression tested a year back with no issues. No mention of cylinder wall scuffing, but will boroscope myself after plug removal.
Already did complete front suspension control arms and the ABC pump replacement.
Now attacking the engine work. There is an immediate oil leak upon starting, which leaks a small puddle and stops after oil pressure builds up. It leaks slowly while running at very small pace. There are NO leaks from the car standing for however long.
Diagnosed the main leak to the PCV valve, as it makes sense logically. The valve covers are all leaking as well, but they can't throw this much initial oil on start. Currently done with undressing the engine, about to open up valve covers, found some vacuum line cracks, intake manifold is black from oil via the faulty breather pipe from PCV. Will be doing as much RR on the rubber and plastic as possible, replacing vacuum lines, etc. Taking care of everything I can.
Have a C4 and Xentry. No misfiring, no codes on the car, no ABC trouble. No smoke from tailpipe. I have the WIS and know the official procedures, but seeing many creative ways from others, I am looking for some answers.
Making a list of questions that I would love to hear advice on from the knowledgeable members here(whose posts I have read and re-read multiple times here and they have helped immensely).
1. Minimal oil in the spark plug wells. Best option to clean the area before pulling the plugs is spray in with carb cleaner and then work with pressured air? Saw another member doing exactly that. Feel free to chime in.
2. Remove the belt, all pulleys and rubber, cover extensively...my plan was to clean the engine as much as possible prior to opening up. Idea is not perfection, but removing the layered crud and prevent contamination. Any advice on soft de-greasers that are not very aggressive please. I work on the car in my office warehouse, so don't want to have a flood of grimy water by extensive washing right now.
I bought a steamer, would that be the best option in my case then?
3. Chain guides can only be replace from front timing cover, after removing it, am I correct?
4. Front timing cover cannot be removed without taking the cylinder heads off officially per WIS. One of the only posted I have seen after searching the net, states specifically that the cylinder head fronts rest on top of the main front timing cover. Is it at all viable to un-torque the cylinder head bolts per WIS sequence with the only intent of make it loose enough to be able to remove the front timing cover to get access to internals. Will this immediately have the effect of ruining the original head gasket, that will leak even if I replace the cylinder head bolts one by one with the new ones and re-torque the head back to spec?
5. Has anyone ever contemplated on removing the cylinder head in situ, working magic with tilting the engine and body away from each other, so that the additional clearance near the firewall is available to lift the cylinder heads straight up? Maybe an additional side tilt will be needed to pull heads one by one. Perhaps I am saying something stupid, but it looks like there is just a couple of inches that are needed to clear in the back. Tilting the engine at a small angle towards the front and maybe to the side, with/without transmission after unbolting everything, supporting and undoing the subframe, then jacking up the body in the front to gain an opposite tilt, is what I am theoretically saying.
6. Advise on products to update vacuum lines with silicone, and heat shielding hoses, wires, tubes, that is effective and not very costly?
The only reason I am asking all this, is I have no lift, and really want to replace all gaskets on the front end timing cover, oil cooler, as well as the chain guides and oil pump tensioner WITHOUT taking off the actual heads if at all possible. I have no problem taking the heads off as well, but I don't have the hands or the equipment to do a full engine out service right now. I was looking at QuickJacks and scissor lifts, which will still not clear enough height to remove heads, as I will be right up against the car underside with no leverage. The low turbo seals and other bottom work will no doubt be much easier. These lifts also move in a lateral direction while lifting, instead of a regular 2 post.
I apologize if anything that I said is obvious BS to an experienced mechanic and I am making obvious mistakes in reasoning, but after seeing multiple "engine out" jobs in situ by creative thinkers, I am trying to close this subject for myself. I know the level of difficulty will be much different from when engine is dropped, but I am ready for that. Otherwise I will do what i can from up top and wait for the future opportunity for an engine out.
Since this is a hobby, my time is immaterial. No one will let me work on my engine at a facility that will drop my engine at a fixed labor cost, and I am not prepared to pay their labor cost if the whole point is DIY and gain as much experience and satisfaction as possible. No friends with shops.
I am grateful to all the members who have shared immense useful info here and elsewhere.
I have no prior mechanical experience, but educated myself on the theory and practice and spent quite a bit of time on watching and reading everything m275 related. From Tasos to Legitcars to everything in between on all areas of the engine and W221 in general.
Bought an S65 two months ago, and decided that the best way to gain practical skill to the max is to tackle this engine, with a mindset that there will not be anything really more difficult in the future, that I would not be able to take on.
Not planning to become a professional, but this is more of a self-educational journey and building a skill set.
Car is high mileage with extensive records and a lot of labor and parts already done by the previous owner. I have all records going back to dealer service intervals. Compression tested a year back with no issues. No mention of cylinder wall scuffing, but will boroscope myself after plug removal.
Already did complete front suspension control arms and the ABC pump replacement.
Now attacking the engine work. There is an immediate oil leak upon starting, which leaks a small puddle and stops after oil pressure builds up. It leaks slowly while running at very small pace. There are NO leaks from the car standing for however long.
Diagnosed the main leak to the PCV valve, as it makes sense logically. The valve covers are all leaking as well, but they can't throw this much initial oil on start. Currently done with undressing the engine, about to open up valve covers, found some vacuum line cracks, intake manifold is black from oil via the faulty breather pipe from PCV. Will be doing as much RR on the rubber and plastic as possible, replacing vacuum lines, etc. Taking care of everything I can.
Have a C4 and Xentry. No misfiring, no codes on the car, no ABC trouble. No smoke from tailpipe. I have the WIS and know the official procedures, but seeing many creative ways from others, I am looking for some answers.
Making a list of questions that I would love to hear advice on from the knowledgeable members here(whose posts I have read and re-read multiple times here and they have helped immensely).
1. Minimal oil in the spark plug wells. Best option to clean the area before pulling the plugs is spray in with carb cleaner and then work with pressured air? Saw another member doing exactly that. Feel free to chime in.
2. Remove the belt, all pulleys and rubber, cover extensively...my plan was to clean the engine as much as possible prior to opening up. Idea is not perfection, but removing the layered crud and prevent contamination. Any advice on soft de-greasers that are not very aggressive please. I work on the car in my office warehouse, so don't want to have a flood of grimy water by extensive washing right now.
I bought a steamer, would that be the best option in my case then?
3. Chain guides can only be replace from front timing cover, after removing it, am I correct?
4. Front timing cover cannot be removed without taking the cylinder heads off officially per WIS. One of the only posted I have seen after searching the net, states specifically that the cylinder head fronts rest on top of the main front timing cover. Is it at all viable to un-torque the cylinder head bolts per WIS sequence with the only intent of make it loose enough to be able to remove the front timing cover to get access to internals. Will this immediately have the effect of ruining the original head gasket, that will leak even if I replace the cylinder head bolts one by one with the new ones and re-torque the head back to spec?
5. Has anyone ever contemplated on removing the cylinder head in situ, working magic with tilting the engine and body away from each other, so that the additional clearance near the firewall is available to lift the cylinder heads straight up? Maybe an additional side tilt will be needed to pull heads one by one. Perhaps I am saying something stupid, but it looks like there is just a couple of inches that are needed to clear in the back. Tilting the engine at a small angle towards the front and maybe to the side, with/without transmission after unbolting everything, supporting and undoing the subframe, then jacking up the body in the front to gain an opposite tilt, is what I am theoretically saying.
6. Advise on products to update vacuum lines with silicone, and heat shielding hoses, wires, tubes, that is effective and not very costly?
The only reason I am asking all this, is I have no lift, and really want to replace all gaskets on the front end timing cover, oil cooler, as well as the chain guides and oil pump tensioner WITHOUT taking off the actual heads if at all possible. I have no problem taking the heads off as well, but I don't have the hands or the equipment to do a full engine out service right now. I was looking at QuickJacks and scissor lifts, which will still not clear enough height to remove heads, as I will be right up against the car underside with no leverage. The low turbo seals and other bottom work will no doubt be much easier. These lifts also move in a lateral direction while lifting, instead of a regular 2 post.
I apologize if anything that I said is obvious BS to an experienced mechanic and I am making obvious mistakes in reasoning, but after seeing multiple "engine out" jobs in situ by creative thinkers, I am trying to close this subject for myself. I know the level of difficulty will be much different from when engine is dropped, but I am ready for that. Otherwise I will do what i can from up top and wait for the future opportunity for an engine out.
Since this is a hobby, my time is immaterial. No one will let me work on my engine at a facility that will drop my engine at a fixed labor cost, and I am not prepared to pay their labor cost if the whole point is DIY and gain as much experience and satisfaction as possible. No friends with shops.
I am grateful to all the members who have shared immense useful info here and elsewhere.
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: Apr 2023
Posts: 3
Likes: 2
2008 S65
I have refrained from doing everything planned to the car, as my work schedule changed and lost interest in the project once couldn't work on it. Car was occasionally started up and kept on a garage only insurance policy. I will put it up for sale shortly including all the work done.
So no, it didn't get parted out, but actually helped me get average mechanical auto skills, kind of like starting skiing on a double diamond slope.
Side effect, is that every time I see anything 4 or 6 cylinder in an engine bay with empty space to put an arm through, I giggle.
Learned a lot and enjoyed the experience.
So no, it didn't get parted out, but actually helped me get average mechanical auto skills, kind of like starting skiing on a double diamond slope.
Side effect, is that every time I see anything 4 or 6 cylinder in an engine bay with empty space to put an arm through, I giggle.
Learned a lot and enjoyed the experience.
