Derek69football

I have a 97 s420 and it's been sitting for about a yr and I just received a new key got it and tried to start it and it wount start it will only start if I use starting fluid or gas through the throttle body.. I pressed the valve thing on the fuel rail and gas just sputtered out as if it has low fuel pressure.. What would be causing this??

MB-Dude

Probably contaminated fuel. Try this...

1) Drain the fuel tank. Refill with ~5 gallons fresh premium-grade gasoline.

2) Connect a hose to the fuel rail to help purge out whatever is on the pressure side of the fuel pump.

3) Crank the engine in short bursts (2-3 seconds) to purge out the delivery line. Do this at least a dozen times. USE CAUTION HERE - YOU'RE WORKING WITH SOMETHING FLAMMABLE! Under no circumstances allow the engine to run with the tubing in place. If the engine starts - great - but immediately turn it off. Heat and gasoline vapor are not compatible with continued human existence in a garage space.

4) Remove tubing and properly close off the fuel rail.

5) Crank the engine until it sputters and starts. May get only a couple cylinders at first, but eventually they should all begin to fire.

6) Check to ensure the fuel rail is properly sealed and that there are no drips.

The procedure is really quite simple but since you inquired as you did, I'm assuming you aren't sure. Safety first! No drips, no puddles, please. Good luck.

Cheers,
Jeff

Derek69football

It sat for a abt a yr with a 1/4 tank.. Is it hard to drop the tank?? And to put a hose on the fuel rail do you mean where the can push that valve and fuel sprays out?

MB-Dude

Yeah, the fuel in the tank is probably bad/contaminated. You don't need to drop the fuel tank, just remove the fuel line and let gravity do it's thing. Remember - safety first! Lots of ventilation, keep spillage to a minimum and no smoking/sparks nearby. I'd also change the fuel filter while under the car. As for the fuel rail, there should be a fitting toward the front (passenger side, if memory serves) where a simple adapter and hose can be connected. If you are unsure of this stuff, seek some help. Even old/contaminated fuel is highly volatile.
Cheers,
Jeff

Derek69football

The is a fitting at the front if the fuel rail can't I just push the button and crank the car that would do the same thing as the hose correct?

MB-Dude

Derek - I have no idea what 'button' you are referring to. There is a fitting on the front of the fuel rail that is used for testing fuel delivery pressure. It's a fitting with a tight fitting cap; passenger side, if memory serves. If you simply take the cap off, fuel will flow onto the engine when the fuel pump activates. When the engine starts, the spilled fuel has the potential to ignite. Therefore, you must flow the fuel into a steel container, keeping it away from the engine. At this point, i must state that if you are not familiar with this concept I strongly recommend you seek professional advice locally. Gasoline is highly flammable, and it takes very little to ignite it.
Cheers,
Jeff

Derek69football

Your talking about the same cap as I I'm and I'm familiar with the concept I've worked on cars my whole life so I'm pretty familiar

MB-Dude

Then, 'Mechanic, go forth and heal thy chariot.'

Derek69football

Well I just drained and replaced fuel filter it's not getting fuel pressure to were it reaches the windshield but yet it still isn't running I used starting fluid and it starts but runs like crap and has a loud like knock? Any help

MB-Dude

You say it's not getting fuel pressure (at the windshield (?)). Have you used a gauge to measure the pressure; not just seeing it spurting out? Normally, a "loud like knock" is not a good thing. But when using starting fluid, knocking does occur. No way for us to tell if the knock is a cause of the starting spray, or whether the knock is causing a timing issue. Do you hear the knocking with just the starter activated and no starting fluid? If so, you have something mechanical inside the engine and all bets are off.

Derek69football

Whoops sorry ment it is getting pressure. The knock only happens when you use the starting fluid, I can not use the starting fluid and crank the engine over and it just cranks doesn't fire and their isn't a knock

Derek69football

But when it does fire with the starting fluid is runs like complete crap like it's hardly running..

Derek69football

Could it be bad coil packs? And that it isn't sparking all cylinders? How would you go about testing the plugs and coils for this car? I know for cars I'm use to I can just pull the plug install it in boot and ground it and crank engine

Derek69football

??

MB-Dude

Hmmm... If starting fluid gets a response, albeit a poor one, that would suggest the plugs are firing. Thus, the coil packs are probably OK. At least most of them. BTW, you can test spark at the plugs same as old-school distributor systems, you just have to man-handle the coil packs during the test. Awkward, but do-able.

Assuming you have good fuel and good pressure, and reasonable spark, then the injectors aren't firing. This can be caused by ECU failure or a bad Crankcase Position Sensor. Having the car sit for an extended period shouldn't cause CPS failure, but stranger things have been known to happen.

Cheers,
Jeff

Derek69football

I thought maybe because it ran like complete crap with starting fluid that maybe not all cylinders where firing figured if ask.. As for the cps how would you go with testing that? Could you hook it up to a obdII and check it or somthing else

Derek69football

Or is their a way to see if the injectors are firing

MB-Dude

The CPS controls the fuel pump/flow. Theoretically, if you KNOW you have proper fuel pressure (i.e.: with a gauge), then that alone would rule out the CPS. But stranger things have been known to happen. You're beginning to get into the realm of more advanced diagnostic techniques. A simple OBDII tester is not going to show injector firing. If you are electronically inclined, you could remove one injector electrical plug, and using a volt meter, monitor the voltage/signal while someone engages the starter. The voltage will be quite strange as the signal is not DC. Repeat the process for all injectors. But if starting fluid gets a response, albeit crappy, your issue is more than likely not electrical. With starting fluid, I would expect the engine to run weird for a second or two - the fluid is not evenly distributed amongst the cylinders. One cylinder fires good, while the other is rich or lean. It just sounds as if you are not getting the right fuel mix injected into the engine - either too little fuel (low fuel pressure) or too much fuel (bad fuel pressure regulation). If starting fluid has an effect, I keep coming back to low/no fuel past the injectors.
Cheers,
Jeff

Derek69football

I'm almost certain it has the right fuel pressure. I can get a gauge to verify. What's the pressure suppose to be for this car? Also with a volt meter how would I know what prong is pos and neg and the volts it's suppose to get?

Derek69football

Well this weekend I'm gonna run a pressure test on fuel rail if that passes then I'm gonna check spark in all cylinders and then if that passes then I'm gonna use a noid light on the injector harness and if it's getting power then I'm gonna use a screw driver and see if the injectors are pulsing.. If they are pulsing would that indicate their bad? Do u have another way to check injectors instead of touch it with a screw drive and sticking my ear to the handle?

steve.marshal01

My factory fuel pump went out on my 1996 Nissan 200sx SE-R 2.0L

I purchased a Bosch Fuel pump, but it is larger than the original one. Will this pump work on my car? How do I hook it up? Any suggestions would be great.

Bosch 0 580 453 310 part # for the Fuel pump I bought.
Additional Details
I have already removed the factory pump, but this new pump is larger in size than the factory pump. Can I make it fit somehow in the compartment that holds the pump?

MB-Dude

LOLx2 Awesome, dude... whoever you are.
Cheers,
Jeff

MB-Dude

OMG... I just read this thread, start to finish. I have the patience of Job! LOL And thanks 'Steve' for bringing me back to reality... I was on the precipice and you drew me back to the rationale side!
Cheers to all,
Jeff
[and I'm done here!]