Buellwinkle

What's laughable is that that they can claim that it's within 1% of producing accurate power numbers when you don't even have that sort of consistancy between dynos of the same brand let alone going from one brand of dyno to another. Then add in all the adjustments and tweaking that you can do on a dyno to give you results that easily vary several percentage points. Then consider that running several back to back dynos will give you different results. Then add in the accuracy factor on the car's sensors and any obd2 polling lag. So Ben, if you got within 1% of your Dynojet then I would call that luck. I'm not saying it's a bad product, just saying it's being oversold.

If a G-tech is a toy then this is just a toy to compare mods you do and get instantaneous reading to see if the mod helped or not. A great tool for that and you can get similar results with a G-tech, AC-22 and the Vericom, more toys. The serious people like the car magazines use the Racelogic Vbox that uses GPS. But these units can easily cost several thousands but that's the cost of getting the accuracy you speak of.

otoupalik

So you have used it? Sure sounds like it from the 'expert' commentary here! Why don't you acutally use one before you post your THOUGHTS? Facts are always much more helpful to the group then your personal beliefs.

Thanks

brad

PS - no one said the G-Tech was a toy, it is actually pretty handy for certain things. However we did say the carchip was one.

Buellwinkle

OK Brad, just for grins, take someone's car on the forum, anyones as long as it's not in anyway related to Evosport or Nology or a car that either of you have dynoed before, doesn't even have to be German or an SHO and do a dyno on your dynojet. At the same exact time, have your Dyno PDA plugged in and show us all the numbers. The proof is in the results. That way wind, tire resistance, road conditions/grade, or other environmental factors don't even matter. I'm skeptical after doing so many dynos and getting such varied results so if you can convince me, the rest of the forum is easy!

JAYCL600

I would be interested in this test.....

SiLvaC32

me 2!! you guys can use my car to test it!

Jerry

otoupalik

Jerry, come on in!

As we have ALREADY done this test on 2 cars (they were evosport cars though - so that totally invalidates the results to Carl), I am pretty confident! But wait, Jerry has bought something from us in the past, does that mean we cannot use his car either Carl? (yes, if you cannot tell, I resent the implication in Carl's post that it has to be a non-evosport car as we are undoubtedly going to skew facts to make the $50 we do on each of these things!! LOL)

Thanks

Brad

Buellwinkle

Your telling me that you dynoed 2 cars on the big dyno and the results, HP and Torque were within 1% of the results on the little dyno. This I have to see to believe! Are these just peak numbers or the whole graph?

Vadim @ evosport

Yes, Carl the whole graph. They both match, but you are not going to believe us, so we will not even going to post the results. After all, no matter what we say or do you seem to know more.

Nevermind that from 8 am to 8 pm pretty much every day we build, test, dyno and race cars. Nevermind that this is something we have done for a living for the past ten years - after all you know more.

You the GREAT one!!!!!!!

Mach430

Nology offers a 30-day money back guarantee. If for any reason you are not satisfied with the Nology PDA-Dyno™ / OBD II Scan Tool, you can return it to Nology or to the original place of purchase for a refund less shipping charges. The scan tool must be undamaged and contain all original packing, supplied materials, and the original receipt or packing slip. No refunds after 30-days. Email or write Nology for a RMA before returning. Returns received without an RMA number will be refused.

Thanks,
Ben

mdp c230k

Dont you guys at Evosports know that Carl knows everything? Please let his rants go unanswered as they are not worthy of your time. He has a little knowledge and that is dangerous.

Buellwinkle

Vadim, sorry, just can't believe that 2 different dynos (PDA, full size or anything in between) can yield numbers within 1% of each other unless you spend a lot of time tweaking one of them to match the other. How do I know? I know because I've dynoed my car on 3 different dynos and got 3 different results. I've dynoed my car on the same dyno on different days and got different results, all more than 1%, or in my case more than 2 HP difference. Since you only have 1 dyno then you may not know. So if this gizmo is within 1% of your dynojet then it can't be within 1% of any other dyno I've used. So if you want to hide behind your clever remarks rather than provide proof then so be it. Doesn't mean I don't respect your work or dislike you in anyway, anyone that tunes Fords is OK. When I get my '05 Mustang I hope you'll have a turbo or s/c waiting for it!

Mach430

Carl,

You really ought to pursue a career in the entertainment industry, your insight and humor would provide laughs to many. You have been given proof by Vadim, somone known for his honesty and knowledge. AND there is a 30-day money back guarantee on the product. Wouldn't that give everyone the chance to prove the functinality of the product to themselves?

I think mdp c230k must be right. Perhaps, we should all stop what we are doing, declare you to be the smartest man alive, and sit back and let you do all the tuning and testing of products for the Mercedes community. Evosport, MKB, Kleemann, Carlsson, Brabus and Renntech could all learn valuable information from a respected tuner as youserlf. After all, it doesn't matter how many facts we provide you with, once you make a statement, you stick by it forever; no matter how uninformed or incorrect it may be.

For those who are interested in testing a worthwhile product, the Nology PDA-Dyno is available. Perhaps even Carl will test one BEFORE making his assumptions.

Buellwinkle

Finally, I get the respect I deserve. Thank you but there are already too many jewish comedians. I'm not trying to be a tuner, just taking up the slack for all the people on the forums that take the tuners/vendors word for it and never dyno or verify their claims. It appears that MB owners must be the biggest saps because very few on any of these forums do dynos after a major performance mod and have no clue. Go to the Audi/BMW/VW forums and dynos are the norm, not the exception. So when I get a "tuners" product and it doesn't perform up to their advertised claims I get a little jaded. So maybe this product will at least get some people to verify their results. The ironic part is they'll pay more for this than they would if they had a few dynos done. Keep up the good work Ben....

mdp c230k

The real irony is that someone would choose a few dyno runs over the ability to continuously monitor the car. Kind of like giving someone a fish or teaching them how to fish forever. Ben, keep up the good work.

Brandon @ Kleemann

Years ago there was a product called a "Road Dyno" (it may very well be available to this day). It was a "sample box" - clamped with an iductive lead to one of the spark plug leads. You pressed a button to start sampling, accelerated in a gear, then pressed the button again to stop sampling. Then you unloaded the data into a PC and used the software to make sense of it. Gear ratio, tire diameter, etc needed to be entered. These devices are only as accurate as the data you provided- enter 1,000 more lbs for the cars mass and suddenly you were making 150 more hp etc.

This product sounds like a fantastic tool- what a great device. I ordered one from Ben already.

Even if it is "off" against a Dyno by some small margin is should be capable of excellent resolution, able to show immediately changes in power from modifications.

Buellwinkle

I think it's great to compare the results of mods on the same car, same stretch of road, same conditions, similar to what a g-tech or like devices would give you, just a comparison from run to run. Brandon, since you don't have ready access to dyno it's a great way to see if your tweaking pays off before paying for dyno time.

But for most people, I'ld give them the fish because they'll never fish on their own even if you teach them. I just got done with our neighborhood garage sale. I'ts people selling all the stuff that they bought that they couldn't live without a year ago, lots of excersise junk as seen on TV.

nukblazi

ummm err... what is the point of this debate? Buell, I think you are getting ahead of yourself speaking for most MB owners. Not sure why you feel obligated to the point of being overbearing in our names.

I'd rather learn to fish thanks. Cool product, I want one.

Brandon @ Kleemann

We use SuperFlow Dyno corp (who manufacture chassis dynos in Colorado Springs) extensively. We also use a DynoMet "5th wheel" dyno, as well as the DynoJet facility in Denver. We try to post DynoJet prints as that is what most others use. Access to dynos is not my problem-

Im thinking that this Nology gizmo is a quick and dirty way to test- esp on 4WD vehicles like the ML & G etc. Im off to Best Buy to pick up a color PDA- cant stand the m105 I have currently. Ill run a bunch of the local KLEEMANN cars with it and post the reults.

Buellwinkle

That's what I said all along, sounds fishy to me.....

bverotti

2 questions >

1. can this products also handle metric system ?
2. where does it plug into the car ?

Thx.

Brandon @ Kleemann

I downloaded the "trial" software which lets you emulate a run with a sine wave false data stream. It looks really comprehensive for your "hobby" tool. Measurements are in Metric or English. The "device" is a cord that connects your PDA to the ODBII socket in the car (by law within 3 feet of the drivers seat, usually in the kick panel, under the dash).

Ordered from Ben already- I will post results using a known KLEEMANN car when time permits.

Turbo][

Any testing, or result news on the Nology unit? I am about to get rid of my OBDII reader, and get this "all-in-one" unit.

Brandon @ Kleemann

Yes- I spent some time with it last evening. I know I said I would test with a known KLEEMANN MBZ but time has not allowed that. One of our customers has a Mitsu Lancer EVO8, it happened to be here last night, so we tested with that car.

The software is simple and intuitive- weather data is available from http://www.noaa.org. Vehicle data (in case you dont know your car like the back of your hand) is a simple google search away.

Once we got the total drive ratio dialed in we did a few runs on a level strecth of highway. The EVO is supposed to make 271 hp and 273 tq according to C&D magazine. Our tests results were different every time but within 2% of any other run. Average mean results with the PDA were 262 hp and 297 tq- a little off the published data but with no "real" dyno is difficult to fault its accuracy.

The selling point of the PDA is differntial power detection (did mod x result in anything good or bad). So we gave it a try.

We removed the air filter element from the EVO to see if the PDA could detect any change. RMR products confirmed that we should see a approximate 5hp increase. The PDA showed a 6 hp increase, over and over again (at the point which RMR suggested it would show up in the rev band). Not bad.

The datalogging, acceleration and OBDII code reading make this a super tool. I highly recommend it for the "at home viewer".

We will try and get to a KLEEMANN car soon, Ill post when its done.

Turbo][

Yup these device still exists.
http://www.ontrackdigital.com/

Turbo][

Here is another one, but uses the accelometer. They also just came out with a $399 system using GPS tracking

http://www.microsmith.co.uk/dplus/dplus.htm