Turbo][

I guess the first thing iis....you will never get it installed from an authorized Kleemann dealer at higher than .5 bar.

So warranty wouldn't be an issue.

But for those of us that is always trying to get a little more HPs will always resort to finding some way to make more HPs.

Only if I had $15k lying around...I can start on this project. And get my friends to manufacture a larger pulley

someone wanna spare me $15k...I promise I'll pay you back

JamE55

I'm really thinking hard about this one. Here's my situation. My car still is under warranty and only has about 2300 miles and change. I've already talked to several MB dealer and they all tell me that my warranty will be voided if i do the supercharger. But on the other hand if i do get this i'll have anywhere from 550 to 600hp at the fly which around here you don't see any at all! HHmmmm decisions decisions decisions??

Turbo][

I would do it. IMHO. I obvious don't have any more warranty, and if I had $15k laying around I would do it.

I just don't understand why it's $15k, when a turbocharge system from Drag turbo for Hondas are like $4k.

This better be made of gold!

jswedberg

Go for it!

(Of course, I've always been good at spending other people's money)

See - I'd have to figure out a way to drop in a 5.5L V8 into my C32, and then the supercharger ... it'd be truly expensive for me - but for you, it's cheap! You already have the engine! You're almost there already!

dj-po

As this has been answered many times, it is easy for me to take a little time to lay it out for you.


There are many fold as many Hondas on the market, this spreads the r&d cost over a much broader area (pennies per kit), and it is easy to build such a kit (mass-produced turbos, bent tubing, etc. the only real custom job is the manifold).


The Kleemann kit has specially manufactured Kompressor groups, and custom cast/machined housings for the V6 and V8 engines. This alone would bring the price up, but add to it that there are MAYBE 10% as many MB's as there are Hondas ................ The R&D is going to be more per unit comparitively.


John.

Turbo][

I know how this whole industry works. I have friends in the industry that are doing manufacturing for aftermarket parts. Yes, the amount of Hondas sold compare to Mercedes are enormous. My persceptive of this is that the only thing that cost most is the initial tooling and testing of the product. Since US labor, or European labor is much higher than in the Far East, the cost is also carries over. But the material is all the same(to a certain degree, and even than the cost is fraction compared to the actual dollar amount being sold in the market).

For example, all these foam filter in the market, are the foam really that much of a difference to associate the cost from one to the other at over 300-400%?

Mufflers, yes there are lot of different material, but the cost of that material doesn't cost over 300-400%

One might even argue that the "craftmanship" is better..but for that extra 1-2 hours does it really cost that extra 300% in price?

To my point, I can truly understand why Kleemann would charge $15k for a kit. That is to cover their initial investment in R&D, and tooling and marketting, and everything that was put in. However, I believe the true value of this kit, taken aside of all the above, it's only worth maybe $2-$3k (material cost, assembly, etc...)

Of course this is my personal view on this subject matter, but if the kit was even half of the retail price, I would imagine a lot more people purchasing the unit. I for one, would give serious thought in to it. Right now, it just doesn't make sense.

Of course this would totally cut in to their profit margin, and it would take a lot longer for them to recover the all the cost on the kit.

Last note: Isn't it selling more better than selling nothing?

Brandon @ Kleemann

JamE55-

Your cut to the chase answer is this: The systems are sold at .5 bar because it will run at that boost with crap gas for an eternity. If you are willing to forsake any warranty liabilty there are things that can be done. We have spent millions of dollars and thousands of hours with durability testing, prototyping, FEA, and real world milage to arrive at the system you can buy today. 607hp compared to 550hp just means you can ruin tires that much faster. I will not simply hand out kompressor systems that will have durability issues- you step up to the plate and build the engine to SAFELY tolerate this kind of power on pump gas and we can talk.

Turbo][-

Whereas I can understand your explination of what you think to be true about the industry- its just not the case. R&D, marketing and tooling etc are VERY costly. Certainly the idea is to recoup the investment before the useful life of the product expires. Tell me that the foam air cleaner R&D dept spent 10,000 man hours desinging the housing and I would call you a liar. 10,000 plus manhours went into desinging the manifold housing assembly alone on our system. The end result is a system more efficient, quiet, and compact than even MBZ can produce. Example: SL55AMG- Our HP/TQ per liter displaced is 8% higher than AMG at 60 % LESS boost.

Rolex- my favorite analogy- would sell countless more watches if they were $100 each- but then you wouldnt be getting a Rolex would you ? Material spec would go to plastic, self winding would go to battery, the crystal would be come plastic- next thing you know you have another 2 year POS watch available at the WalMart nearest you- just what your $70K plus car decerves- no?

Where is the discussion about the $30k plus displacement eninge that gets you 60hp over stock?? Their cost on that must be $1500.

Turbo][

sounds like a challenge...with the limit parts and very expensive components. it will be costly to make the engine to work with the extra boost. To this day, I haven't heard of low compression ratio piston for a E55/E430....

Gonna need alot of stuff...oil cooler, possibly a larger intercooler core, hi-flow water pump. depending how much boost, you will need larger fuel injectors, than that mean larger fuel pump if our stock can't keep up...sound like a lot of fun, if PRICE wasn't so high for mercedes

Oh well....

awiner

Guys, the simple question I have is WHY do you want more than 550 horsepower / 504 ft lbs of torque ?

I know, the more the merrier, however, at 550/504 you are already spinning the street tires melting them into molten rubber with only half throttle all the way up to 60 mph....

Why reduce reliability and have the possibilty of failure when the tradeoff will be minimal ?

Let's say you did boost the intake pressue to .6 bar, and you get 50 more ponies... What is the real difference going to be in the long run ? Not much.

With the power the Kleemann 5.5 liter units put out, you are already talking about take me to jail fast. Less than 12.5 second 1/4 miles in a Benz on street tires.

Turbo][

Two words...Bragging Rights

Have Kleemann tested wider tires or street slicks? There are always ways to get more rear tractions. The question is, has any one tried it....

JamE55

jswedberg

Thanks for the comments and suggestions. I would really have to think about this hard and weigh my options.

JamE55

Thanks Kleemann. Really appreciate your answer on this one.

JamE55

The only reason if i were to get one just in case i get along side by side with lets say a 996 TT, GT2 and Ferraris.

Turbo][

Or a turbocharged Civic Hatchback....and other raced out rice rockets

Sleestack

My 4.3liter V-8 engine might be for sale real soon, real cheap.

JamE55

sleestack

What happened? Your going to be selling your modified 430 engine with the MKB and kleemann stuff on it? Getting something with more umph!?

E55 KEV

JamE55, IMHO, I would just buy the upcoming W211 E55, change the boost, pulley or whatever and have a warranty. I would not consider the Kleemann until my warranty was expired.

This is my speculation - I believe the price of the Kleemann will drop considerably once the AMG supercharger is here. Kleemann's main market share for kompressors will mainly be W210 models which are out of warranty.

JamE55

E55 KEV

Thanks for your opinion. I'm still trying to weigh the pros and cons of this. If my car is out of warranty i might go for it but it leaves me with some serious consideration about my car still being in warranty.

Turbo][

What about that supercharger kit from aanother company that Motortrend did a short review on. has anyone look in to it? From what I remember it was like $9k

JamE55

Yes already had a discussion on that. That s/c for $9 i beleive has by HPS. And not even close to what Kleemann is offering.

Mach430

Changing the boost will affect your warranty the same way as adding a supercharger. Yes, it's much easier to notice if you have a supercharger added than a larger pulley, but either would have to be proven as what has caused the problem. Kleemann superchargers run at less boost than AMG, yet they produce more power. Which would you rather have on your engine? I wouldn't think that Kleemann would have any reason to change the price of their Kompressors when the 211 E55 comes out, the 211 E500k will have more power!

Sleestack

I'm thinking about doing a mega-project with my CLK... as in full engine, chassis, suspension, transmission, body, interior, audio/video conversion. The Kleemann and MKB parts will probably be used so my 430 engine would just be a stock 4.3 liter engine... it would sort of be a tribute to the W208, at my expense.

hmrdwn

Rape has never been considered a "tribute." At least not in American culture.

Turbo][

hahahahahah

JamE55