gforaker

I currently have a van and it definitely is not one of those. Too tall for a wagon? OK, you win, it is a funeral hearse with seats.

AsianR350

And it is a nice one too.

fireman_mike

I resemble that remark!

Well, except for the soccer mom bit

I think it looks ok. It's not pretty like a CL, but it looks ok.

It's 1/3 SUV (damn few all wheel drive minivans), 1/3 wagon (but a bit higher and bigger) and 1/3 minivan (yeah three full rows).

I wouldn't chose anything else for our 'big' family car.

It's a tank. It drives like a car, not a minivan, but it's still a bloody great tank. I've said before that MB should accept and embrace its tank-like nature, and offer a larger stretched version... maybe 4" wider, for easier access through the rear, and 12"-18" longer, with adjustable 3rd row seats, so you can chose between huge legroom and huge cargo space.

Oh and make the seats easily removable while you're about it - sometimes I might want really big loads, or to sleep in the damn thing. If it's going to be so big, make it flexible, ok?

Mike (Westchester soccer dad)

TINMan22

I agree 100%. I autocrossed mine from summer 2007 when new until Summer 2010 when I bought the Volvo. I was competitive with other MB V-8s and was running on all-season tires. S-Class Station Wagon Yes!!

I also agree the reason it hasn't sold well is that MB didn't market it well. Their loss, IMO.

JR

pacoman

Well, I waited 6 months of ownership (2008 model) to chime in but the R-Class has proven to a fantastic car for us. We purchased a Thule luggage carrier kit and drove across country with 6 people (and all their luggage) in absolute comfort. Here's why I think it didn't catch on. If choosing between the R and the GL, most will choose the GL for it's more conventional styling. IMHO, the GL is cannibalizing sales of the R. Arguably, the R is a better choice (more car) for your money but the GL simply "looks" more deserving of shelling out 50K plus for to the average Mercedes car buyer.

erichen

Proud owner of an 09 R350, got it when my family outgrew my SL and wife find it hard to get kid in and out of her E550. We needed a car for us, the nanny, and the visiting grannies, and luggage. Looked for a car that:
1. seats at least 6, preferably 7,
2. 3rd row had to be able to seat adults comfortably without, not Hobbits. 3. And being used to the handling of European cars, we had to have some level of performance.

What were my choices:
Toyota Sienna/Honda Odyssey
Buick Enclave/GMC Acadia
Toyota Highlander hybrid/Venza
MB GL, R, ML
Audi Q7
VW Toureg
Lexus LX

Here is what I found:
-Lexus LX, overpriced Toyota, stupid folding 3rd row seat design
-VW Toureg... cheap looking, crappy engine
-Audi Q7, with all the options, this would have been it had the price been better and the 3rd row roomier
-Buick Enclave/GMC Acadia: better than what I thought, beautiful interior and roomy cept the 3rd row, but the deal breaker was the crummy transmission... POS felt like a lumbering school bus
-Toyota Higlander/Venza: too small... hobbit sized 3rd row for Highlander.. no 3rd row for Venza, overpriced Camry
-Toyota Sienna: most useful interior, spacious cavernous interior, drives like an ox cart, and AWD only comes in the limited edition, close to $50,000
-Honda Oddyssey, drives better than Sienna, interior equal to Sienna, Dealbreaker: NO 4WD
-MB GL, way more expensive than R, limited 3rd row seats, wheel wells crowd in on the 3rd row seats, very cramped, and drives pretty high too
-MB ML: no 3rd row seats option
What's left... the R350: drives better than all 3 row seat cars (more power and better handling), beautiful interior, useful cargo space even with 3rd row up, good price for all the options (we got P2, pano, parktronic,...etc. sticker was over $57000 and got it for $49,000, leased it)

In the end, the R represented the best compromise of all the choices I had with the qualities I looked for. Since we've had it, it's been a faithful, reliable, and actually fun car to drive for family trips and daily commutes with the family. We got it for family outings, I have a Prius for commuting. Wife has her E63. and I have my SL for fun. The R does what it is designed for, a well handling family auto that fits 6-7 and their luggage. The R is perfect for those of us not wanting to drive a "minivan" and don't want to overspend for less utility (ie GL and Q7).
I agree with one of the previous posters, the R63 would have been my dream familymobile... definitely would not have bought it new as it was over $90,000... but it's a fantasy.. reality is, I would not want to jeopardize my family with all that HP's... the R350's got enough power to pass people going uphill, and handling to get ou of tough jams and corners. I love it... can't believe people think it's a hearse... Mine looks like a big wedge with tinted rear lights and windows! sorry, just had to type all this to express my appreciation for our car. btw, will be buying it at the end of the lease since we love it so much!

coladin

I wish they re-introduced the R63 with the 5.5TT...I would get it in a hearbeat!

W203Ramos

my wife and I love the R!!! (3y.o. twins and a 4 mo. old) can't wait to trade in our '08 for the 2012 model (I couldn't live with the bug eye looking front end of the '08 )
but all I can say is once you own an R then you'll understand why it's the best family hauler out there IMO

sabbadoo32

And I'm OK with that. I get the crossover, wagon, etc arguments. But the size convinces me that it's a van.

If you've got to drive a van, it's good to drive a Mercedes. I know I'm preaching to the choir, but it's comfy to drive, rock steady at 80-90 mph, and the paddle shifters make it easy to pass the morons that think I'm a piddly old minivan. Its built like a tank, and the fact that it's a Mercedes tank makes it a no-brainer to put my year-old son inside.

Kneel before the "R" *****es....

pedra

You either love or hate the R Series. I have a 2006 R500 with about 50,000 miles. A fantastic vehicle for distance touring, and city driving if you own shares in Texaco or BP. You have to get used to niggling problems such as plugged reed valve causing $3K worth of electronic component failures. (I now know that it is a 5 minute service check but MB don't let you know about the possibility). Error messages about the rear tail lights (I fixed the problem by adding supplementary wiring from the bulb holder to the rear light assembly. The dealer added rear central DVD player is dead, but I can't locate the wiring diagram. Now the navigation screen has failed (most of the time). Blank screen - sometimes the MB logo appears then it either fades away or starts working.
This is a complex vehicle that is is OK to own with a full factory warranty. I don't have this on my R500, but then I have a top class ride for about $25,000 with a spec that would cost 3 times that new. Like a big dog - you have to live with it
What is in a name - suugest that it is re-named an überqueren.

TPAbnz

Here you go, a hearse:

http://piercecoachbuilders.com/page8.htm

aggst1

Cool!!! I guess it's safe to assume it doesn't come with RES (rear entert system) ... :-)

AsianR350

.


So Dodge, Ford, Lexus(LS300, LS460) and VW also can be a Hearse too.

OldMBGuy

Sprinter = Mercedes van
Vaneo = Mercedes minivan
Gelandewagen = Mercedes SUV
GL & ML = Mercedes poser SUVs for the American Fake Utility Vehicle market

MB vans are starting to pop up all over the US these days, and those who've been to Europe know what an MB minivan is. While the Mercedes minivan is not a bad way to haul 5 or 6 people around Switzerland and France fairly economically, it's nothing like the R-class. Like all minivans, it's much less luxurious and much less car like.

Clearly the R-class is not an SUV, though it can make its way around VT during a typical winter or mud season pretty well (especially with Airmatic).

It's a giant, family oriented, S-class station wagon, and all the better for it.

The R-class could have been the most sensible family car ever made (especially the diesel) except for two things:

1. It lacks sliding rear doors - Who cares if the perception would have leaned towards minvan, they make more sense than the giant swingers in a family car.

2. A total lack of engineering and build quality for long term-ownership - Let's face it, this thing is a reliability disaster on the whole and the mechanics hate working on it because it's difficult to fix, and rarely stays fixed.

MB should have been sensitive enough to it's modern track record of horrendous build quality / lack of reliability, and worried enough about finally banishing it's association with Chrysler (Pacifica anyone?) so as to MAKE SURE that this thing was a tribute to the build quality and reliability of the old Mercedes-Benz.

It's not. What a shame.

PGT

I drove one two weeks ago....R350. Terrible. Floaty suspension, ponderous handling and terrible visibility.

coladin

We've had one for 3 years and it has been perfect. I know the eariler models were not reliable but post 2008 MB have made strides with the R and when my lease is done I will be getting another one. I can't agree on your assessment with rehards to "total lack of engineering and build quality". That has not been my experience although Mercedes-Benz, as a whole, are not considered to be well built and reliable. I knew that going into ownership, eye wide open so to speak and my experience with the R certainly did not sway me at all , in fact it reassured me when i acquired the C63 this year. No issues there either.

I don't want sliding doors. I am comfortable with the doors and have adjusted to it. Sliding doors = minivan and I don't roll that way. My kids have been good at swinging the doors, although it is usually myself or my wife that gets them out, they are under 10 , the three of them.

coladin

What were you expecting?

You are coming from a car according to your sig that has a semi-firm suspension...don't know what to say but it is not meant for aggressive driving. It is a family transport shuttle. It is over 5000lbs, did you want it to handle like a Mini? It is one of the longest vehicles on the market were you expecting ashoulder check would go along the lines of a Smart car?

PGT

I was looking for an "upgrade" for the wife's FX. This isn't it. The FX with Sport Pkg can be pretty choppy....it's also cramped inside for its 4600lb girth. Perhaps an R63 would be the "upgrade" we're looking for. Or, I'll just have to convince the wife that the E63 Estate is "cool" (I think it is but she doesn't want a wagon or minivan).

The FX has horrible visibility too but has some pretty nifty tools for helping out.

coladin

Aw, well geez guy, why didn't you say so? FX with a Sport Package is a seriously athletic vehicle...this ain't a match for you lol!

We came from an XC90 which made me nauseous when I turned that thing. It was a fantastic family car, with three children who were younger than now, all the seats moved, the rear seats were decent sized, a nice highway ride but don't push that thing. Loved the interior, seats as Volvos are noted for that as well as killer Dynaudio sound.

The R for us has been a transition as far as actually cutting down on the roly poly effect we had i the XC90 and perviously a Ford Explorer. It was nice to get back into a "car" so to speak. What it does, for the fam, is a tremendous highway ride and excellent fuel economy with the Bluetec in the city that nets consistent 380miles per tank in 100% city driving.

I have my C63 to get my jollies and the only other vehicle I considered was a GL. My bro has one and the ride is stiff, he has the 21" wheels and the whole damn thing jiggles. It is not as versatile either as the R. You can only get in the back from one side, the seats are not as mobile either.

I would consider the new ML which looks nice in person. The X5 is real nice too. I know for us there is no other vehilce that can do it all for the family than the R. I am hoping the 2013 will get the stronger diesel motor.

PGT

its right there in my sig

I think the FX50S with adaptive suspension might be the "fix"....stiff when you want it to be or compliant when you need. I love the adjustable shocks in my E550C. It's just a LOT more scrilla and I'm not keen on that without jumping to a German marque. OTD price on our well-optioned FX35 was $45k ($10k off MSRP). The FX50 was $10k more and the "S" model was another $7k beyond, putting into the 60's.

coladin

doh...missed the sig! It's Monday...

OldMBGuy

I had said "total lack of engineering and build quality for long term ownership."

This pig was half (but only half) decent on the reliability front right up until it went out of warranty and then some timer went off and EVERYTHING started failing. And half of what failed wouldn't stay fixed for long. It was ridiculous.

For some context though, as my name implies I'm an old tyme Mercedes guy. I've owned 9, and the parents and siblings have owned another 4 or 5 as well, mostly E's and their predecessors, but also the odd 190 & S class. We're used to buying bulletproof cars, keeping them well maintained and in return getting a trustworthy tank that we can put put a zillion miles on and then give away to the next owners for the second zillion. That's why we always paid up for Benzes.

This thing was as fragile as a glass slipper. And I'm not buying the "MB has improved" line; that's why we bought the R after a hiatus from MB to Audi and Porsche during the grim DCX years. Supposedly, they had improved quality and were "going back to the old engineering standards."

Boy were we wrong.

Seriously, talk to a good indie mechanic, say "R-class" and watch him run away. If you can catch him, offer to buy him a 6-pack for even mentioning the car and listen to what he has to say about how it's engineered to fail early (for an MB) and often and then be horrendously expensive to fix.

I was recently reminiscing with my family about an old Milton Bradley board game called Trust Me, in which one would make investment decisions and turn over a briefcase to check the outcome. The stinger was the briefcase which declared "You've been had!"

Yeah, I've been had.

Good luck with the C63. I used to own it's great-great granddaddy, the 190E 2.3-16v and it was great fun. One of the best cars I've had the pleasure of owning. I can honestly say that I enjoyed the handling on that car almost as much as the Porsche Cayman, which is a handling god.

coladin

You may be right about long term ownership, what year was your R? I know the forst few years were pretty bad. From what I have heard and read the 08 fixed a lot of things. I know that the mechanics at my MB have said that things improved a lot but MB definitely didn't launch that model as prpared as it should have been. I am a leaser so my sample size is kinda baseless when it comes to long term ownership!

The great grand daddy for sure lol! I loved that car, even in comparison tp the M3 of its era. When you think of it, those two vehicles were so groundbreaking and trend setting, to see two Bavarian marks go "racing" so to speak. I really enjoyed Top Gear when they compared those two with I think it was Ford Sierra Cosworth of that era, all three great trendsetters!

houseofdiesel

The biggest the reason the R is NOT a minivan, the engine is longitudinal, all minivans whether all wheel drive or front drive have stupid transverse engine layout, meaning unsafe understeer handling and really difficult servicing on the rear bank of cylinders. Same goes for SUV's, no real suv has a transverse engine layout, it is not truck like at all nor a reliable long term setup.
I cross shopped a used R class with new Subaru Forester (which is taller!), Mazda 5 and CX7, Chev Traverse, all minivans, BMW X5, VW Touareg, and many used vehicles aswell. The mercedes handles, and it is servicable. All the vehicles I drove that were transverse felt unsafe, they spin out the tires under aggressive throttle, badly understeer, swerve if you drop onto the shoulder of the highway. I bought a used R320 because it is safe to drive, I can get around any idiot driver on the shoulder if need be, it has the power I will ever require and fuel economy is fabulous.
Why can't they sell new R's? Cause they don't want to! I walked into 12 different Mercedes dealers accross eastern Ontario and most of Quebec, I saw 2 new ones on the lot in the space of 8 months looking, and neither dealer was willing to negotiate on price. I walk into any other car dealer in these times and yes, you can talk price, sometime ten of thousands. The rest were willing to order, but same deal no price talking. They make 10% plus options, I had a very honest chat with one salesman and yet not even $1000 discount was possible. That is why they cannot sell them, they are stuck in the past. They are made in the USA just like domestics that are offering 20-30% discount, they need to wake up if they want to sell some.
They are not unrelaible vehicles in the greater sense, complaints about how the transmission shifts is not a valid fault, it is it a chev, I love how mine slows down without needing to brake and you feel each downshift so you know exactly what gear your in, it is drivers kind of thing.
Dealers not able to fix the car is a bigger problem, don't fault the vehicle for poor techs. There is a reason they claim the auto industry is short on mechanics, cause that $100 labour rate does not reflect the wage and the working conditions are getting worse not better due to poor managment/unrealistic expectations/no soul.
People are not seeing the real reason they are called lemons...Touaregs and Q7's are lemons, changing diff and transmissions, control arms/balljoints, airbags, fittings rusting out for air suspension, those are lemons. They usually have three or four warning lights on the dash before the warranty is up (christmas tree?). I see mostly minor things that are unresolved bringing the ratings of the R class down, not major systems.

houseofdiesel

The biggest the reason the R is NOT a minivan, the engine is longitudinal, all minivans whether all wheel drive or front drive have stupid transverse engine layout, meaning unsafe understeer handling and really difficult servicing on the rear bank of cylinders. Same goes for SUV's, no real suv has a transverse engine layout, it is not truck like at all nor a reliable long term setup.
I think the Chyrsler Pacifica was the first to take this shape, but it has nothing in common with the R unlike what most people think, it is just a minivan in disguise.
I cross shopped a used R class with new Subaru Forester (which is taller!), Mazda 5 and CX7, Chev Traverse, all minivans, BMW X5, VW Touareg, and many used vehicles aswell. The mercedes handles, and it is servicable. All the vehicles I drove that were transverse felt unsafe, they spin out the tires under aggressive throttle, badly understeer, swerve if you drop onto the shoulder of the highway. I bought a used R320 because it is safe to drive, I can get around any idiot driver on the shoulder if need be, it has the power I will ever require and fuel economy is fabulous.
Why can't they sell new R's? Cause they don't want to! I walked into 12 different Mercedes dealers accross eastern Ontario and most of Quebec, I saw 2 new ones on the lot in the space of 8 months looking, and neither dealer was willing to negotiate on price. I walk into any other car dealer in these times and yes, you can talk price, sometime ten of thousands. The rest were willing to order, but same deal no price talking. They make 10% plus options, I had a very honest chat with one salesman and yet not even $1000 discount was possible. That is why they cannot sell them, they are stuck in the past. They are made in the USA just like domestics that are offering 20-30% discount, they need to wake up if they want to sell some.
They are not unrelaible vehicles in the greater sense, complaints about how the transmission shifts is not a valid fault, it is it a chev, I love how mine slows down without needing to brake and you feel each downshift so you know exactly what gear your in, it is drivers kind of thing.
Dealers not able to fix the car is a bigger problem, don't fault the vehicle for poor techs. There is a reason they claim the auto industry is short on mechanics, cause that $100 labour rate does not reflect the wage and the working conditions are getting worse not better due to poor managment/unrealistic expectations/no soul.
People are not seeing the real reason they are called lemons...Touaregs and Q7's are lemons, changing diff and transmissions, control arms/balljoints, airbags, fittings rusting out for air suspension, those are lemons. They usually have three or four warning lights on the dash before the warranty is up (christmas tree?). I see mostly minor things that are unresolved bringing the ratings of the R class down, not major systems.