carboncow

I'm new to the MB world and considering a used R class. I've own dozen of european cars and always buy used, never CPO. I'm a solid DIY but prefer not to drop a transmission or crack an engine open. Most anything else mechanical, hydraulic or electric is fair game with me. Lots of experience with Vw and Saab a few Porsche (expensive Vws!) as well as a few Volvos and BMWs. Never a Mercedes, yet.

The wife and baby need a good vehicle and she doesn't like my Suburban so I'm considering a 2006 R-class since they fit my budget.

I'm curious to hear from those who know MB well, especially newer technology and the ability of a good DIYer to feel comfortable with standard things that OBD2 can handle. I'm not affraid to go to a dealer but I don't want to buy something that also costs $1000 every time I drive near a dealer...I could have experienced that with my Porsches but thank goodness they were easier to fix then most of the VW and the internet/forum support is amazing.

My experience if that most European car enthusiasts are leaps and bounds ahead of Asian and American car enthusiasts on understanding their vehicles and supporting them. It appears this forum is rock solid but I also learned that sometimes high ends car forums are full of buyers who talk about trim, carbonfiber and how to change rims...and that is all.

Is there enough support and input out there on a model that is only 5-6 years old?
How easy are these new MB to wrench on? I know the R class engine bay looks tight compared to an E class wagon.
Any other useful comments experienced people can add to my inquiry?

If you don't wrench then please don't tell me it's an expensive car to fix. All cars are expensive to fix if you are an ill informed consumer! IMHO my Porsche was cheaper to maintain then my Passat Tdi!

I'm going to read this forum in detail to get a feel for common concerns on R class vehicles. I'm open for any solid opinions. I understand that air suspensions and such toys fail and are expensive...but sometimes easy and cheap via 3rd party suppliers. Help educate the new guy on the MB world and support community. I should add for example that owning a used Suburban was a nightmare on many levels including the poor support in forums. Most are full of guys talking about lift kits, tires and stereos...I'm hoping the MB world is full of typical European automotive expertise on the interstices that make the MB name legendary.

Thanks in advance. -Newbie

Yang1815

Welcome to MB World. Not sure about the R-class forum as I am new here myself as well.

From what I have gathered though, there are a few DIYers on here but in general, there is not that much activity.

I know what you mean with the Suburban forums as I have a Tahoe myself haha...

pedra

I have a 2006 R500 with 45,000 miles. Stupid problems like a plugged reed valve that cost me $3000 and sun roof jammed open. Despite the class action last year concerning other MB models with plugged reed valves their customer service told me that I should appreciate the cause.
Personally I would not go near a used MB again. Too complicated, too much to go wrong and too expensive.
Don't like to say it but suggest you look at Honda.

TINMan22

IMHO, if you buy ANY MB that is out of warranty, purchase an extended warranty. The money will be well spent.

Absent a fully equipped tool kit (with all the appropriate MB-specific tools) and a garage with a lift, I wouldn't attempt to do any repairs beyond replacing bulbs and swapping out tires from one season to another.

JR

rosswell

as always - what's your time worth? Most MB owners I'd venture a guess just want their car fixed and back soon without getting hands dirty. #1 piece of advice for you is to order the Service Manual on DVD. It's been great for a D-I-Y-er like myself, or just to give an extra level of comfort around what's necessary at the dealer for service (ie. the trans. service after 70,000 kms) and the brake fluid change. They're dead easy to change the oil on if you have the proper tools and parts. Who wants to work on a dodge neon? Alot nicer working on quality equipment.

By the way if you plan on installing any Factory optional equipment, the dealers won't for you as a rule - but do that yourself and they'll activate it after the fact (tell the computer that the hardware is now present). Pretty sophisticated machines and I've had good luck with my 2006 R350. Like anything, they do have a few foibles - the panorama roof sometimes, the tail lights, but it's a hugely practical vehicle that I love the styling on.

pedra

I agree with Rosswell's comments about the features of the R series. That is why I bought one. Regarding maintenance, I have owned a number of other makes, US, European and Japanese, and in general had no serious issues.
The main difference is when the MB Factory warranty is expired you need a good experienced local shop, or the time and enthusiasm to DIY. In my case DIY maintenance is OK, but I don’t have the time and enthusiasm for other issues.
Japanese vehicles don’t need much attention other than scheduled. My problem is that I live in SW Ontario where US brands are well catered for. As you would expect, MB dealerships are focused on new business and warranty work.

smokersteve

I am a huge DIYer but there is limited info as you have stated. Most of my DIY is on maintenance. But I have others in my sig.

avlis

Carboncow,

You and I are on the same page. My wife bought a used '06 R350. Prior to that I had a '02 C230K bought new and put over 100k miles on it. I do all the maintenance and most repairs using online help. Our two MBs have been easier to DIY than the Hondas & Fords we've had before. They are designed to be fixed, assembled and disassembled. The other cars had a more disposable design approach. I do think my old '02 C-Class was a bit better designed then the R.

Don't let the previous posts scare you. These are cars, not rocket science. If something breaks, you do some research, price out the parts, figure out if it's DIY-able and go from there. I had to disassemble the entire dash on my C230K to replace a $2 power steering coupling. It took hours, but it was amazing how easy it was and how well designed the parts were (none of those busted trim clips or plastic tabs like on other makes). It would have cost $700+ for a dealer fix. Also see my post about the power steering leak on our R-Class that I fixed for $50 with genuine MB parts sourced from Amazon.com.

I will say that I'm glad I stayed away from the air suspension. That's an expensive option to fix (even DIY) and doesn't provide much benefit. Ours does have the pano-roof and power hatch though and they worry me.

rajdude

We bought a 07 R320 CDI a month back. I too am a 100% DIYer….no job too big type of guy…but probably won’t want to drop the tranny or replace an engine!

I used to have an e320 wagon…did a lot of repairs on it. Ran it until 16k and then sold it. Repairs are not too bad if you have the WIS / manual. The parts are competitively priced [online]. Usually no special tools required. However time is the main thing.

My take is this:
I paid less than 50% of what a new R320 costs. Sure it is 3 years old so if I have to spend money OR to spend time to keep it running…IMHO it is worth it.

BTW, I have already got my hands dirty on my R. When I bought it, I looked at the underbelly and noticed an oil leak. Looked like a hose was leaking. The used car dealer promised to replace it [he did]. I got it home and after a few days noticed that it was leaking again. Since it was an as-is purchase….I looked under it myself. Sure enough it was a botched repair. The guy had forgotten to clamp both ends of the hose! Only one side was clamped! A $2 hose clamp and voila! … problem fixed. If I took it to a dealership…I bet I’d have to pay big bucks!

So here is the advantage of DIY + knowledge.

I used to suggest my friends/family to buy used cars. I do NOT do that anymore.

Most of them know nothing about cars. Used cars are not new! They WILL need repairs…and of course if you do not do the repairs yourself it is going to be expensive. Plus 8 times out of 10 the mechanic / [steal]dealer will take you for a $$$ expensive ride because you do not know what they are talking about. You are at their mercy.

The other thing you could do is to find a good honest mechanic. Someone who specializes in Mercedes. I know one…he has saved my bacon more than once. However I won’t trust him 100% blindly.

Good luck with the R. I don’t think it should be any worse than other cars you have had. I know… I have owned BMWs, Volvos, Toyotas, Volkswagens.

Working on my BMWs was about the same as MB. I hated their service reset procedure. My Volvo had more space around the engine. The VW is very cheaply made, needs parts all the time. Rusts like crazy.

Again, good luck!
PS: I do worry a little more since it is US made. Flame suit on! Ha ha !

lkchris

All the discussion about "types of people" is silly.

What's even more silly is attempting ANYTHING without reference to official Mercedes procedures ... which are readily available by either purchasing a service DVD or by subscribing to Startekinfo long enough to download what you need.

See http://www.startekinfo.com/StarTek/o...tedDocId=11498
and http://www.startekinfo.com/StarTek/

Also, as the car you own gets newer and newer, don't be surprised if some things you're sure you can do you can't.

For example, on a Mercedes V6 diesel, you (effectively) cannot change the air filter yourself, because this requires computer reset.

You (effectively) cannot change the fluid in a 7-speed Mercedes transmission, as the fill and drain occur the same place and special pumps and adapters are required.

On a current BMW, you cannot replace the battery yourself, as this requires computer reset by a dealer (or independent that owns the equipment).

dewdaltz

Something that requires computer hook up after the DIY ... I will not do it. All other stuff like leaks, replace, ...I do it. Save a lot money.

lkchris

Good plan.

Brakes maintenance IMHO is the most effective DIY, as dealer charges are lots higher than buying OE parts and doing it yourself. Just be careful and, again, do it following WIS procedures and replace what is says must be replaced and not reused.

rajdude

I read somewhere that there was some software/hardware thingy which can do the same thing as mercedes' computer they use in the dealership.

I wonder what was that.

and oh... I hope this passes the "silly test"

smokersteve

They have a trans program update. I just got it.

rajdude

What is it supposed to fix? Does it make any difference to you?

How much did they charge? I assume you went to the dealer.

smokersteve

Think the main thing it was suppose to fix is the 2 -> 1 shift. (not 1->2). This is the reason why I took it in.

Yes I went to the dealer, It was free because I have the extended warranty. It definitely made a difference but did not "fix" the problem.

Another thing I noticed. The "C" setting use to red line at 5,000rpm(with out using the paddle shifters). Now It shifts at 6,000rpm just like "S" does. So far That is all I have noticed.


Does the trans program have its own unit, or is it in the ECM/ECU?

rajdude

in my car the 2>1 shift's jerk is pretty minor. It sure is noticable......when coming to a red light......but is not annoying.

I wonder how bad it is in other cars.
Or maybe it is supposed to be butter smooth??

My old e320 also never shifted butter smooth like my other automatic cars [BMWs, Volvos, VWs, Toyotas]

The R320 CDI shifts pretty smoothly.......even better in the C mode. But I like to keep it in the S mode

smokersteve

Its not supposed to jerk or be like butter since 1 is such a low ratio gear. You should feel the change in the gear, but not the actual shift process. My issue was the shift process itself being too rough.

Correction. C dose still shift at 5,000rpm, I checked it again last night when I floored it.

Can some one confirm that the trans computer is separate from the engines computer?

lkchris

Pretty hard to define "separate."

They certainly talk to each other, and technician hooks up STAR DIAGNOSTIC the same place for both (for anything).

smokersteve

Are they separate as in in hardware, the computer unit them selves?