I have looked and looked on the web and 3 forums and cannot come across any info on this. I must be using bad key word searches. Please help.

My w220 will go immediately into a crank when I turn the key to position 2. If its the 1st attempt, it will crank, start and run for about 5 - 10 seconds before seemingly running out of fuel, and die. While running you can shift out of gear and drive etc. for a few seconds. You can press the accelerator and it responds etc, until you seemingly run out of gas, and the engine starts sputtering and the accelerator pedal becomes none responsive and it dies. Then it seems the computer will send another signal to the starter to try and start the car again. From here it will either start back up and die, or the starter sounds like its getting hit over and over but cant seem to turn over the flywheel. If the car has been sitting for 30 minutes, you get these results. If you keep trying it, its like its out of fuel and nothing happens but the starter getting the many pulses.

But why is the car starting automatically in position 2. I am assuming some thing in the ignition switch has gone bad, or some other switch?
It behaves ok after you start it for the 1st few seconds but after that is feels like its running out of gas. So not all is well once it does start after this scenario. And then it get bad when it tries to die and the starter starts going crazy like its gone bad too. Not enough power or something.

Just to be clear you do not have to push the key all the way into the spring loaded position 3 at all.

You can, and it will crank there also. But you dont have to.

Its as if the fuel pump pressures up, but after the car is started no more fuel pressure? I put 2 gallons of fuel into it just to be sure that was not the case and the results were the same. Unfortunately my gas gauge always reads full when on. ( Another issue )

If you continue to try and crank it will sort of try and start and just diesel out so bad you will want to just shut off the key.

I have checked all fuses and they are ok in 3 main fuse compartments -

front left engine
front right engine
rear seat passenger foot well.

I have replaced the starter relay ( Relay L - green color ) Siemens with a Hella. Results were the same so I don't believe there is anything wrong with relay.

I did have to replace a 60 amp littel fuse in the fuse block at the foot of the passenger front. ( under the carpet and metal shield )

I believe I blew this fuse during the testing of the original Siemens starter relay.
The starter relay in Position L is a 5 pin , and in order to test with another 5 pin, I pulled the N relay to check it. It was a 4 pin. When I went to return it into position N, I instead put it in the wrong directing into position M. I did not notice anything at the time I did it, but later on my next crank test I got nothing. No power to nearly anything In the car. Only headlights, and interior lights. No windows, trunk, ac etc. I replaced that 60 amp littelfuse and all was back to pre- M relay mistake.

But perhaps I did some more damage in that move. I am not sure.

All issues are still present.

I have read on EIS and I don't think that is my issue.

Prior to any of these issues the car sat for 30 days with maybe 1 start through the rain and snow.

I feel I'm having an electrical issue and really nothing is wrong with fuel pressure accept some computer is not doing its job etc.
I am not sure if the starter itself could have an issue but all things point to the key issue first.

I have a check engine light on now, and scanned it and the codes were manufacture specific and my scanner could tell me it was

- something to do with the airmatic or pneumatic pump
and another that said "accelerator pedal" something or other

I was ever able to revive the codes as I lost communication with vehicle when car dies because I have to shut off the key when the starter starts going crazy.
Also then it starts to throw up many more codes as its stalls out, but I have to turn key to position 1 or it will try and keep cranking the car.

So there you have it.

Sorry so long, any help appreciated.

 

So no problem prior to the rain/snow? I bet it's water damage

 

What would be your 1st suggestion that I check to identify if its water damage. Have u ever seen or heard about this auto cranking at key position 2? Thanks.

 

Have you looked at the fuel pump?

 

Check fuel rail pressure. If that's good then the injectors are not getting the voltage to open for longer. Air/fuel mixture. Auto start on position 2 sounds like a bad eis, however, after it dies, i never heard of it auto restarting. It shouldn't be O2 sensors, since they usually fail with open circuit, making it run full rich. It sure could be water damage.

 

Can someone help me drill down on the possibility of the auto crank on position 2 being an EIS. I am not familiar with EIS at all. Until I have the car starting in the normal position 3 all else seems less crucial and dependent on that issue. Not to mention it all came together as 1 problem. So fix the one, I am feeling sure the other issues are going to get resolved. If the car is starting in position 2, I am certain that many other systems will be out of whack. From what I have read it seems that if the key will turn in the ignition, and the car will actually start, that the EIS is functioning. I thought is was primarily a security device. Is this not correct? Can a bad EIS cause this auto crank in position 2? Thanks

 

I dont think i that the computer will even allow the starter to engage when the engine is running. I think your eis is skipping the ON lights check and going straight to crank. When you turn the key to position 2, does it do a light check at all? If you want, you can pull the starter relay and try it so the engine doesnt keep cranking. The starter relay is on the passenger side and it should be green.

What i think is happening is that the crank and ON contacts are somehow bridged.

 

Ok I am following you about the possible bridge.

can you explain what an ON light check is or what it looks like?
Is it a lights on the dash type indicator?

I have pulled the starter relay a few times so I know where to go there.
I had to pull it to scan the car. If I did not, it would just keep cranking, and if I turned back to position 1 , i cannot scan there.

My scan came back with only the p1453 air relay module ( k17 ) which I think is the 2nd air pump for the smog pump system correct?

other code was p0450 Evaporative emission system pressure sensor / switch - i think that was from how many times its stalling out etc.

and p1542 Pedal Value Sensor ( b37 ) - i think this is from me trying to rev the engine while its dieing, and then the pedal goes unresponsive.

So the scan was no help.

Would a star scanner definitively identify if yes or no EIS or still a crap shoot with parts replacement?


If there was a possible bridge are you thinking like a wire or contact that is serviceable or inside the EIS like a trace in a circuit board.

Had a lot of rain and snow the last month, and it was just sitting, others have suggested this water issue. Is there a place I would investigate for water intrusion as it relates to EIS?

Thank you so much for your help and time.

Kumar

 

On a normal S class. When the key is turned to position 2 (ON). Every light on the dashboard should light up, that is the ON light check. It helps prevent people from selling cars with a check engine light on but the bulb damaged.

Yes the secondary air pump for emissions should not make the car auto crank. It would turn on a check engine light though.

SDS (Star diagnostic system) would definitely be able to find the problem, as it can perform many tests. However, you do need a knowledge base in order to troubleshoot, or it would just be you and a computer gui with a whole bunch of tabs and soft buttons. If you can get access to a SDS unit, then that would be perfect. I myself have not used one, but i'm sure someone here would be able to help.

Like you said there was a lot of snow and rainfall this month, so a damaged EIS board could be the culprit. There are so many places to get the bridge since the EIS circuit board is so complicated. http://s1362.photobucket.com/user/ba...gzpow.jpg.html

Since this is a 2000 model S class, the water intrusion problems have not been rolled out yet, so water intrusion is also a great possibility, thus leading to electrical failures.

 

Thank you so much for your help. You dont know how much I appreciate it. Its a lonely world with a man and no other posts that discuss this issue. Not a single other post I have read yet discusses auto on in position 2.

ok so i do get the all lights on when I turn key to position 2.

What would that tell you or not tell you about EIS functionality?

If there was water intrusion that would damage the EIS where would you investigate it.

I seem to have my water issues in the rear trunk. But I have opened those little plugs to let the water pass through. If I do not , it will really start to puddle down in the wells. But I have removed all the elecronics - mostly radio from that area as I did not care for it. All other important stuff is bundled and lifted out of the way.

Where might one get water to damage the EIS?

Thanks,

 

Sorry I haven't been able to reply, had a few troubles with my S class. Oh the joy of owning a Chrysler Era Mercedes.

The EIS is mounted right behind the interior dashboard, the only water that will get there is condensation, or if the whole car fell into a lake. (I doubt that).

It's good news that the light check function works, so the EIS is registering position 2. However, when the car automatically starts, what happens?

Water in the trunk is not a good sign, instead of moving electronics out of the way of the puddle, you should fix the place where the water enters, I don't have a 99-02 S class so I'm not sure where it is leaking from, but if you search around the forums, you should be able to find one.

 

I have see EIS units do this but it usually after someone has worked on the unit with poor knowledge. What's most likely happened in your case you have water ingress in your front fuse box. I had an S the other day in my shop where it would start normal but you could not switch it off. What happened was the car stood for some weeks and water got into the left front fuse box and corrosion set in. I managed to strip and repair the fuse box but the SAM was too far gone and needed to be replaced. I doubt very much that your EIS is at fault here. Good luck

 

If you have comprehensive coverage on your auto insurance it covers water damage

File a claim and let them spend the thousands needed to repair your electrical system