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Ok, I've bought E12 wrench, but bolt is stripped, so it doesn't come on. Strange, but E14 socket still grips, so I'll buy that size wrench tomorrow, and make a last try. I believe next is pulling the engine, if I'll not be able to undo that bolt?
How do You lift the engine? What has to be disconnected? And how high You are able to lift it?
Loosen motor mount bolts and jack it up from oil pan. You really only need a tiny bit, if your engine mounts are low you can jack it up from oil pan and get an extra inch of room. Try a flex head 10mm ratchet wrench from the bottom and you should be able to get it
Loosen motor mount bolts and jack it up from oil pan. You really only need a tiny bit, if your engine mounts are low you can jack it up from oil pan and get an extra inch of room. Try a flex head 10mm ratchet wrench from the bottom and you should be able to get it
Today I've been able to undo the bold with E14 torx wrench without lifting engine. So it is good. Removed tensioner and guide rail. Tomorrow might be able to roll in the new chain.
Now questions by pictures:
Is it possible to say if tensioner was changed, or is it still original?
Guide rail seems ok for me. What do You think?
What bothers me is condition of cam and head cover bearings. What do You think? Should I try to polish it, if so, how?
P.S.: I believe I see sprocket, and it has teeth! I will be able to see more, once I remove the other camshaft. Will make a picture.
I have rolled in new chain, and following the part2 in video checked timing at 305 degrees. Looking at drivers side bank thru cam sensor hole it doesn't align. Take a look at the photos. I've done everything precisely by instruction, so I don't understand how chain could have slipped?
Let wait opinion from Benz because he is a master on this, for me If all holes (doesn't alight) then perhaps something wrong during installation, if only one or two doesn't align then I afraid something wrong with camshafts gear: in side the gear there is a lock pin, this pin lock usually open only when oil pressure pump in controled by Camshaft solenoid but it wear and open even without oil pressure This gear have the hole with good shape, other camshafts gear have wear out on this area.
Let wait opinion from Benz because he is a master on this, for me If all holes (doesn't alight) then perhaps something wrong during installation, if only one or two doesn't align then I afraid something wrong with camshafts gear: in side the gear there is a lock pin, this pin lock usually open only when oil pressure pump in controled by Camshaft solenoid but it wear and open even without oil pressure This gear have the hole with good shape, other camshafts gear have wear out on this area.
With old chain it was fine, so I don't see any reason why that should have happened.
Waiting for knowbenz comment.
With old chain it was fine, so I don't see any reason why that should have happened.
Waiting for knowbenz comment.
That looks about a tooth off. Pulling that cover off would help line everything up but you can try turning it a tooth and it should line up better. Ideally you would have both of those front covers off to verify everything.
That looks about a tooth off. Pulling that cover off would help line everything up but you can try turning it a tooth and it should line up better. Ideally you would have both of those front covers off to verify everything.
I've watched a video again, and noticed, that they pulling chain quite hard (imitating chain tensioner). I've tried it, and when pulling hard, it seems timing is ok. Only when I release chain, it goes off. So I think, I have to put in cam, cam gear, rail, tensioner and only then check how it really looks.
That video unfortunately is showing only some torque specs, but not all.
Do You know other torques like cam gear, valve cover, etc.
Also they show cam itself torques at 8nm. Seems a bit too loose, as my torque wrench starts at 28nm. ?
Also what is not showed in the video, is how put on the chain on cam gear. I have somehow to put it on the right teeth, but how to do it, without seeing what's happening on the other side?
I've watched a video again, and noticed, that they pulling chain quite hard (imitating chain tensioner). I've tried it, and when pulling hard, it seems timing is ok. Only when I release chain, it goes off. So I think, I have to put in cam, cam gear, rail, tensioner and only then check how it really looks.
That video unfortunately is showing only some torque specs, but not all.
Do You know other torques like cam gear, valve cover, etc.
Also they show cam itself torques at 8nm. Seems a bit too loose, as my torque wrench starts at 28nm. ?
If that picture is without all the other components then I wouldn't expect it to be accurate. I'd have to dig up torque specs, I believe the cam covers are 8nm then 90 degrees and cam gear is somewhere around 135nm
If that picture is without all the other components then I wouldn't expect it to be accurate. I'd have to dig up torque specs, I believe the cam covers are 8nm then 90 degrees and cam gear is somewhere around 135nm
Yes, it is without other components, as they have showed in the video.
Anyway, I will assemble everything, and then we'll see how it looks.
I only need torque specs for that, new torque wrench and idea how to put chain on the right spot.
If that picture is without all the other components then I wouldn't expect it to be accurate. I'd have to dig up torque specs, I believe the cam covers are 8nm then 90 degrees and cam gear is somewhere around 135nm
Could You please check specs for me? I believe it makes huge difference to torque it right, as cover has bearings. Also cam holders, pulse wheels, etc. Everything is very important. I believe it should be on one page for all of that in WIS.
Thank You. And how about cam holders? In video it says 8nm.?
You mean cam auxiliary bearing? It also 8Nm however as you replace the timing chain by pulling the chain then you don't need to take camshafts out then removal auxiliary bearing is not required?
You mean cam auxiliary bearing? It also 8Nm however as you replace the timing chain by pulling the chain then you don't need to take camshafts out then removal auxiliary bearing is not required?
Maybe it is called auxiliary bearing. Video shows 8nm, so should be correct.
On top valve cover I don't have m6 or m7, I have e10 (torx) bolts. All the same.
On front cover as well.
Could You make a screenshot of torque specs list?
I have WIS myself, but I'm unable to instal it, as I never used windows in 10 years, and only have old laptop, which doesn't run installation at all.
Hi @knowbenz, my friend changed balance shaft with proper balance shaft kit from MB, after balance shaft replace we still encountered error in Stored state P0015&P0025 on exhaust camshafts. Perhaps this problem happens during cold start and error are gone when engine warm up therefore error code often in stored when we check.
Camshaft magnet are included in the kit and have replaced during ballance shaft replacement. I check camshafts position on 305o and all of them are lined up. Since I don't have scope for proper diag yet then what is suspected for this problem: timing chain, exhaust camshafts gear or tensioner?
Hi @knowbenz, my friend changed balance shaft with proper balance shaft kit from MB, after balance shaft replace we still encountered error in Stored state P0015&P0025 on exhaust camshafts. Perhaps this problem happens during cold start and error are gone when engine warm up therefore error code often in stored when we check.
Camshaft magnet are included in the kit and have replaced during ballance shaft replacement. I check camshafts position on 305o and all of them are lined up. Since I don't have scope for proper diag yet then what is suspected for this problem: timing chain, exhaust camshafts gear or tensioner?
Usually see that code with bad adjuster. You can put a torx in the back of cam and see if there is any play in it
I'm trying to assemble it back, and there's a question, how I should put chain on cam sprocket? If I put it on the same spot, where it was with old chain, it looks as it was- one teeth off (no tensioner installed). If I move chain one teeth further, it is not aligned again. I attach pictures here. I don't know which way tensioner will work, so not sure.
For me the correct one is 2nd picture, one the video clip it also mention about this symptom from 17min00sec
I thought the same, seems like logical side for tensioner to pull chain.
BUT, if my old chain never skipped a teeth, why should I not put back timing, where it was?
What's the most frustrating, is that I have to put silicone on head covers, and release tensioner, just to check if everything is correct.
And if it is not, at that point I have to discard tensioner, and clean head and cover again, which took, around 4 hours.
I suggest you can renew old tensioner and reuse it foe checking purpose, mount valve cover without silicone, release timing chain tensioner and check camshafts alignment at 305o. If all it good then you can re-install valve cover with silicone and new timing chain tensioner.
I suggest you can renew old tensioner and reuse it foe checking purpose, mount valve cover without silicone, release timing chain tensioner and check camshafts alignment at 305o. If all it good then you can re-install valve cover with silicone and new timing chain tensioner.
I thought about it as well. Just I thought, should I tighten cover by specs? In my mind silicone is giving some resistance, therefore lack of it, will change torque wrench click point. Or shouldn't I worry, and just tighten it a bit?
I thought about it as well. Just I thought, should I tighten cover by specs? In my mind silicone is giving some resistance, therefore lack of it, will change torque wrench click point. Or shouldn't I worry, and just tighten it a bit?
You shouldn't worry about it, just tighten it a bit. The main purpose of tensioner must be installed after valve cover installation to ensure that camshafts are in fixed position because only auxiliary camshafts bearing will not enough to keep camshafts in fixed position.
01-09-2020, 12:20 AM
