When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
well the first link I find seems to agree with me? (we are on discs and not just pads aren't we ?) all the road tests in UK mags I've read on all brands moan about noise and not being able to drive aggressively enough to keep them working correctly - in fact never read a review where they rated them - I'm convinced the unsprung weight benefit should play dividends on ride and handling - but NEVER even seen a review in Car or Autocar saying they could tell that difference
Performance: Steel brakes provide excellent stopping power and offer a progressive pedal feel, allowing for precise modulation and control. They are well-suited for spirited driving on both the street and occasional track use.
Cost: Steel brakes are generally more affordable compared to carbon ceramic brakes. They are the standard option and come as standard equipment on most Porsche 911 models, making them a cost-effective choice for most enthusiasts.
Maintenance: Steel brakes are relatively easier to maintain, with lower replacement costs for brake pads and rotors. They are also more resistant to wear during everyday driving conditions and offer good durability.
Brake Dust: Steel brakes can produce a noticeable amount of brake dust, which can accumulate on the wheels and require frequent cleaning to maintain their appearance. However, advancements in brake pad technology have helped reduce brake dust production compared to older designs.
Carbon Ceramic (PCCB)
Performance: Carbon ceramic brakes excel in high-performance driving scenarios, such as aggressive track use. They provide exceptional stopping power, fade resistance, and reduced unsprung weight, resulting in improved handling and overall performance.
Heat Dissipation: Carbon ceramic brakes have superior heat dissipation properties compared to steel brakes. They can withstand higher temperatures, reducing the chances of brake fade during demanding driving situations.
Weight Reduction: Carbon ceramic brakes are significantly lighter than their steel counterparts, reducing unsprung weight and contributing to improved handling, acceleration, and fuel efficiency.
Cost and Maintenance: Carbon ceramic brakes are more expensive to purchase and replace compared to steel brakes. Replacement costs for brake pads and rotors can be substantially higher. Additionally, they require specific maintenance procedures and may not be suitable for everyday driving due to their operating temperature requirements.
Brake Dust: One significant advantage of carbon ceramic brakes is their minimal brake dust production. Compared to steel brakes, carbon ceramic brakes generate significantly less brake dust, which means less frequent cleaning and a cleaner appearance for your wheels.
Closing thoughts
Choosing between steel and carbon ceramic brakes for your new Porsche 911 depends on your driving style, intended usage, and budget. If you plan to use your Porsche primarily for everyday driving with occasional spirited driving, steel brakes offer excellent performance, cost-effectiveness, and ease of maintenance. On the other hand, if you are a dedicated track enthusiast or demand the utmost in braking performance, carbon ceramic brakes can provide exceptional stopping power, reduced weight, and enhanced heat dissipation.
Consider your driving priorities, consult with Porsche experts or enthusiasts, and test drive models equipped with both brake systems to make an informed decision. Regardless of your choice, both steel and carbon ceramic brakes have their merits and will ensure your Porsche 911 delivers an exhilarating and safe driving experience that matches the iconic reputation of this legendary sports car.
Botus.... Quoting someone’s prose about Porsche brakes doesn’t really fit here. Re-read what he speaks of about iron brakes wearing longer then CCB. At the very best.... factually inaccurate. My car has 126,000 on it with original rotors with zero wear to the rotors. Pads have been replaced once. Rotors weigh 3-4 pounds each. Really. When I worked at a VW Porsche dealer the Pork guys were replacing large heavy Iron rotors every 15-20k miles. Only time I saw them replace a CCB rotor was one that clicked on the pins for the hat. The Porsche guys were commenting on how horrendously expensive that rotor was. Never did learn how many dollars it went for. I was busy installing frost kits in VAG products (updated charge cooler). Hated that junk.
At some point.... Drive an S65 with CCB.
Clowns writing stories for car magazines are not living with them day in day out for years on end are they. I have and continue to drive and enjoy my junk. My experience of iron rotors in the 221 car being they were ****e. Constant issues, fast wear, forever warped. Didn’t matter what flavor of pads.... didn’t matter when front rotors were on hats.... I put over 100,000 hard miles on that car. I would have saved a lot of money if it had brakes similar to what my 222 car has. Assuming they were as well sorted as what MB managed for the 222. Large assumption that would be. Somehow I didn’t have near as many issues with brakes in the E-55. Though brake by wire made for zero feel. Smaller wheels on a smaller car with smaller brakes that I well and truly beat the hell out of and they didn’t make the same pain as experienced in the 221 car.
I recall that Porsche CCB are noisy. Bet a nickel Porsche is using a pad compound that is more sporting then that MB gave my car.
most owners don't need the aggro - did you see the complaints bit I added into post #26, a response for BM owners - meaning they had to make a video to explaining what to expect if they bought that option..
can't drive slow, can't drive fast, can't drive in the rain, can't wash the car, can't stop at traffic lights - and a god awful racket all the time when cruising between 60 to 120mph - not so wonderful for road use... and just to check its not just BMs sporty focus , the guy parking his Merc has the same racket parking his car slowly in the dry
most owners don't need the aggro - did you see the complaints bit I added into post #26, a response for BM owners - meaning they had to make a video to explaining what to expect if they bought that option..
can't drive slow, can't drive fast, can't drive in the rain, can't wash the car, can't stop at traffic lights - and a god awful racket all the time when cruising between 60 to 120mph - not so wonderful for road use... and just to check its not just BMs sporty focus , the guy parking his Merc has the same racket parking his car slowly in the dry
My Mercedes doesn’t do any of the awful things described except for brake squeal when pads are filthy. That is easily remedied. I got to do the same with iron brakes when they would squeal.
Botus Why do you have such a strong opinion about something you have not experienced yourself?
I can understand your being pissy pants about crap-tastic old junk you are getting to try and keep on the road... I feel for you getting to deal with the tin-worm and all that goes along with that.
Should the opportunity present itsself.... partake of a 222 car with MBC and CCB. You may just want to trade off that PITA 221 you are forever wailing about. My 222 car has required much less babysitting then the 221 did. Whole lot nicer to drive, Intelligent Lighting, more ratios in the box, better fuel economy even.
I think ceramic brakes are fantastic in many ways - but after around 15 years of std fit road car use, we still don't have ones that are acceptable / are hopeless for normal road use
and - when steel/iron brakes make noises, just wash off the brake dust in the caliper with a hose pipe - that's it, all done for another 2000 miles
bloke at one shop has Merc ceramic OEM on his ugly monster truck - but only on one axle... unless u lived at the top of stelvio pass and had to be at work on time at the bottom, yet always get up 10 mins late - what is the point ? you'd get better bang for your buck spending the money on better tyres for different times of the year ?
Hey all, as promised, here is the Blackstone Oil Report for an M278-powered 2012 MB S550. Took about 5 weeks to get it but it looks perfect, as determined by my visual inspection of both the oil and the used filter.
Inspected the camshaft position sensors and found 2 out of 4 to be leaking oil... again. I have changed 8 of these sensors under my short ownership so far. Because it was easier to work with the airboxes out, I decided to change my air filters too. It's been 14k miles since I last changed them. To be on the same page on air filters, I changed the cabin ones as well. Mileage is at 56k and running better and better.
Then i took those and cut the cables and soldered them back together. At this point there is no more capillary action going on and there will be no chance of any oil from these 4 sensors in the future. I am still hunting for the same cables to use on the cam magnets.
Then i took those and cut the cables and soldered them back together. At this point there is no more capillary action going on and there will be no chance of any oil from these 4 sensors in the future. I am still hunting for the same cables to use on the cam magnets.
Good Luck.
This is great, thanks! Just purchased a set, I looked for something like this before but couldn't find it so I gave up. Funny thing is, I know of the same part but for the cam magnets: https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/mer...des-2711500156
My cam magnets have not leaked at all so I don't need this sacrificial harness... yet.
Have you any driveshaft vibration under deceleration or cruising?
Mine is in need of the center support bearing assembly. I'm vibrating at about 80 under cruise and deceleration.
Nice work on the car. Looks great. Mine is diamond white and just turned 50k mi. I just did a 5k mi oil change. I lift from and drain from underneath. This will be the second oil change since I purchased it in 2022. I've only put 6k mi on it in two years. Any pics of yours?
Funny that you ask that because i have exactly the same issue and am about to order the center support assembly. I have had the issue for a while but since the exhaust has to come partially out for this i have waited and i am not looking forward to this (No lift available, so i have to do it on ramps/jack stands)
But the issue is getting pretty bad so i have to do it soon.
Have you any driveshaft vibration under deceleration or cruising?
Mine is in need of the center support bearing assembly. I'm vibrating at about 80 under cruise and deceleration.
Nice work on the car. Looks great. Mine is diamond white and just turned 50k mi. I just did a 5k mi oil change. I lift from and drain from underneath. This will be the second oil change since I purchased it in 2022. I've only put 6k mi on it in two years. Any pics of yours?
It doesn't have any driveshaft vibration, is this a common issue?
Thanks, this is such a great car to drive. I got it in Oct 2022 and put almost 20k miles since. Got it to keep the miles off my other car due to my new commute, so she's seeing a lot of miles and a lot of maintenance I've posted some pics in the W221 Official Picture Thread. Post some of yours too. Here's a few:
Yeah, there's a cover underneath that needs to be removed... 8 screws. 8mm? socket and my little 12v Hitachi make short work of them.
But you should hand start them, when putting them back on.
I always had my doubts about top sucking the oil, but I don't think either is better for a DIYer.
Have you any driveshaft vibration under deceleration or cruising?
Mine is in need of the center support bearing assembly. I'm vibrating at about 80 under cruise and deceleration.
Nice work on the car. Looks great. Mine is diamond white and just turned 50k mi. I just did a 5k mi oil change. I lift from and drain from underneath. This will be the second oil change since I purchased it in 2022. I've only put 6k mi on it in two years. Any pics of yours?
Can you expand on the center support bearing assembly sound, or post a video if possible? I've got a sounding coming from the front under deceleration that is sort of a fast metallic rattle sound. I've just finished a ton of projects, and was driving it yesterday thinking this was the next issue to tackle. Could be this, perhaps.
Can you expand on the center support bearing assembly sound, or post a video if possible? I've got a sounding coming from the front under deceleration that is sort of a fast metallic rattle sound. I've just finished a ton of projects, and was driving it yesterday thinking this was the next issue to tackle. Could be this, perhaps.
Center support bearing itself sits n a rubber “ring” that sags over time. This creates an angle in the shaft snd under changes in torque in the shaft the bearing moves radially as the bearing is right next to the U-joint. The sound you hear is likely from the U-joint knuckles hitting the aluminum shield around the shaft. This happened to my car after the dealer changed out the flex disks. I was able to pull the shield down and noise stopped.
Center support bearing itself sits n a rubber “ring” that sags over time. This creates an angle in the shaft snd under changes in torque in the shaft the bearing moves radially as the bearing is right next to the U-joint. The sound you hear is likely from the U-joint knuckles hitting the aluminum shield around the shaft. This happened to my car after the dealer changed out the flex disks. I was able to pull the shield down and noise stopped.
Thanks for this detail...sounds very plausible that this could be the issue. I will check it out.
12-10-2023, 11:34 AM
I've posted some pics in the W221 Official Picture Thread. Post some of yours too. Here's a few:
